Feds are reportedly abducting people in portland

[Worgen]

I wonder when people will stop saying 'left wing' when what they clearly mean is 'liberal'.

Rush limbaugh made liberal and left wing synonymous in this country. Its only in the 2000s that those have started becoming their own thing again.

 

[Specter Von Baren]

I'm not really sure this is the same kinda thing but I do understand your point. If you have followed my posts at all then you know that I am a fan of the streamer Destiny and one of the things that always comes up in his debates is him trying to figure out exactly what someone means when they say something or claim to be part or so and so group. This can go a number of ways depending on the person hes talking too, sometimes they will clarify and then Destiny will ask something to try and gauge how consistent they are and they will either answer or assume hes trying to trap them, if they answer and are consistent he will usually just say "ok" if not then it goes into a circular argument for awhile. Like if someone says they are left wing what do they mean? Do they mean they are a socialist, a socdem, a progressive, a tankie, what?

If people are even working with slightly different definitions then its easy to end up talking over each other and missing each others points, naturally those that share your biases will probably be able to understand where you are coming from easier so like it or not, there will be a hangup if you have to understand someone elses definition for things. This is just a problem with our stupidly complicated language and poorly defined yet broadly used definitions we like to use.

My father always told me when I was in college that before a debate you should, "Always define your terms" because if you don't then not only will everyone be talking past each other but either side could "define" them for the other.

Or as George Shaw said, "The single biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has taken place."

 

[Buyetyen]

My father always told me when I was in college that before a debate you should, "Always define your terms" because if you don't then not only will everyone be talking past each other but either side could "define" them for the other.

Or as George Shaw said, "The single biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has taken place."

It's good advice. I would add that it's better to voluntarily engage with someone's terminology and contrast it with your own than it is to waste time arguing over which set of definitions will be the one (Und only 1!) used for the rest of the conversation. The former may require a little more typing and explanation on your part, but it beats starting the whole thing off with a headbutting contest.

 

[Trunkage]

Rush limbaugh made liberal and left wing synonymous in this country. Its only in the 2000s that those have started becoming their own thing again.

You forgot where Limguagh and people like Gingrich made both those terms synonymous with communism and evil

 

[Revnak]

ITS ABOUT ETHICS IN PROTEST JOURNALISM MOM

 

[Trunkage]

Are they actually? Or is it just less obvious because you're living it rather than observing with historical distance? Or because legacy media has been quietly consolidated into 3 or 4 television sources and ever fewer newspapers with less and less investment in actually investigating things rather than just parroting whatever AP, NYT, or WaPo said about them?

What’s the general consensus on newsreaders from the 60s to 80s?

 

[Revnak]

Assuming their summary of the article is accurate (I’m not getting a subscription to WaPo) I don’t think this is going to get better anytime soon.

 

[Worgen]

You forgot where Limguagh and people like Gingrich made both those terms synonymous with communism and evil

Communism was already synonymous with.

 

[tstorm823]

I wonder when people will stop saying 'left wing' when what they clearly mean is 'liberal'.

I didn't mean liberal. I meant left-wing.

 

[Revnak]

Gethsemani got it right earlier. Police do have practices to help protect us... but we do take responsibility when we cover events like protests or riots. And something he mentioned, the part about making sure we are identifiable as press, is something I'll admit we in general don't do very well. I'm not often called out for my credentials (I'm a studio/tech guy and newsroom editor) but in situations were I have to... all I have is a laminated card and a larger laminated lanyard with ID. For the most part we are out there in street cloths as well. On the other hand, the thing about protesters or criminals claiming they are the press... that doesn't happen. Cue all the "link report here" press haters out there, but on a larger scale it just doesn't happen. Reports of actual press getting harassed because police THINK they are lying are far more common than reports of people actually pretending to be the press.

HEY HEY GUYS, REMEMBER THIS POST RIGHT HERE! REMEMBER THIS BIT OF IT! HEY HEY GUESS WHAT! GUESS WHAT THE DEFINITELY STILL IN PORTLAND FEDS WANNA DO!

Citing impostors, feds urge lifting of court order protecting journalists amid Portland protests

Justice Department lawyers leveled the claims of misconduct by purported journalists in filings submitted Thursday.

www.politico.com

Edit - Every fucking time I read one of these articles point out how a dude had a handgun, just, concealed carry is legal in Oregon! A man legally had a gun at a protest! Oh no!

 

[Seanchaidh]

I didn't mean liberal. I meant left-wing.

Then you're just wrong.

 

[Neuromancer]

From the Start, Federal Agents Demanded a Role in Suppressing Anti-Racism Protests (Published 2020)

Twin government memos show how a gung-ho federal law enforcement response to anti-racism protests may have been driven by a shaky understanding of the demonstrations’ roots.

www.nytimes.com

 

[XsjadoBlayde]

Lol wot? Are we to believe they never once were exposed to any news? News that spread very quickly throughout the world? I assumed keeping up on current events is kind of expected as part of your job in law enforcement, but perhaps I was wrong.

 

[Revnak]

From the Start, Federal Agents Demanded a Role in Suppressing Anti-Racism Protests (Published 2020)

Twin government memos show how a gung-ho federal law enforcement response to anti-racism protests may have been driven by a shaky understanding of the demonstrations’ roots.

www.nytimes.com

View attachment 422

It’d be funny if it wasn’t sad. I honestly do believe this, the whole problem with having the insane volume of data the DHS has is that it means you can find evidence of anything you’ve decided is true after the fact, but it doesn’t make it easier to see the obvious facts in front of your face, particularly if your job relies on you not seeing that.

 

[Aegix Drakan]

Edit - Every fucking time I read one of these articles point out how a dude had a handgun, just, concealed carry is legal in Oregon! A man legally had a gun at a protest! Oh no!

^ Don't you know? Only Right Wingers are responsible enough to have a gun! If anyone else does, they're either a dangerous criminal or an anarchist! ^ /s

 

[Revnak]

^ Don't you know? Only Right Wingers are responsible enough to have a gun! If anyone else does, they're either a dangerous criminal or an anarchist! ^ /s

This shit is getting spread by left of center outlets too though. It’s obvious they just think anyone with a gun is heinous for... unknown reasons? They’re waiting for their Sorkin-esque hero to step out there and insult the cops into being nice then get the kids to pull up their damn pants and vote. Doing anything else is one of the bad guy moves.

 

[tstorm823]

Then you're just wrong.

There's a 0% chance you can justify this claim.

 

[Worgen]

U.S. federal troops staying in Portland for now, Wolf says

Acting U.S. Homeland Security Secretary Chad Wolf told Fox News on Friday that federal troops would remain in Portland until he was assured that the Oregon governor's plan to handle daily protests was working, and said sending in the National Guard was still an option if...

www.reuters.com

 

[Seanchaidh]

There's a 0% chance you can justify this claim.

Column: Activists’ call to ‘defund the police’ is a confusing message that could backfire

One little ambiguous prefix threatens to undo much of the apparent progress in the area of justice over the past two weeks: That prefix is “de-,” as used in the dangerous phrase, &#8220…

www.chicagotribune.com

Hey, that's already 100% more examples than you've provided.

 

[tstorm823]

Column: Activists’ call to ‘defund the police’ is a confusing message that could backfire

One little ambiguous prefix threatens to undo much of the apparent progress in the area of justice over the past two weeks: That prefix is “de-,” as used in the dangerous phrase, &#8220…

www.chicagotribune.com

Hey, that's already 100% more examples than you've provided.

Wat?