Armed civilian, 17, shoots 2 dead during Kenosha happening

[Mister Mumbler]

It's probably because they saw nothing illegal happened. I mean, they didn't have the obligation to protect the protesters. That's why they didn't arrest him after he killed two people.

Nothing illegal except being both armed with guns and out after curfew, which again, as 2020 has shown us police love a good curfew to go around and start kicking the shit out of protestors. And yes, I know police have made it clear that they aren't there to protect you (I don't agree with it but hey, what do I know), but it is their job to investigate crimes and such by, oh I don't know, detaining someone who admitted to shooting a few people, especially since they were more than close enough to hear the commotion of gunfire and panic from just a block away.

EDIT: Also, "didn't know a crime happened"? There were so close that fuck face McMurder pants literally ran up to them, and they evidently knew something happened because they moved up towards the commotion after conveniently not arresting him.

EDIT2, ELECTRIC BOOGALOO: Shit, my bad, just realized the saw nothing happened was in relation to the thanks/water bottle nonsense.

 

[Specter Von Baren]

The most appropriate way to refer to a murder victim.

Seems appropriate. Everyone keeps trying make it out as if Rittenhouse was going there with the intention to shoot everyone despite only shooting the people who attacked him yet they have no interest in what the intent was of the racist guy at these apparent protests against racism from cops or the guy who was illegally carrying a pistol and may have even been the one to initiate the whole series of events if he's the one that shot in the air when Rittenhouse was running.

So what is it? Do only you guys get to bring up the background of the people involved? Do they not count just because they represent your "side"? If the kid hadn't shot the first guy and he had pulled his gun from him and then shot him, would you have a different opinion of events or would you still play this game of partisan bullshit and say the kid deserved it?

I'd rather leave the backgrounds of the people here out of it unless its relevant and with the footage we have it's clear that it isn't relevant unless Rittenhouse provoked the first guy but also with the footage we have it is much more likely that the guy who was trying to goad about a dozen armed people to shoot him would be even more aggressive with just one person. That's why this pisses me off. You have all this evidence, video evidence, showing how things played out and you still want to play this political game of right vs left. If you're going to do this now then the country really is doomed.

 

[Revnak]

Seems appropriate. Everyone keeps trying make it out as if Rittenhouse was going there with the intention to shoot everyone despite only shooting the people who attacked him yet they have no interest in what the intent was of the racist guy at these apparent protests against racism from cops or the guy who was illegally carrying a pistol and may have even been the one to initiate the whole series of events if he's the one that shot in the air when Rittenhouse was running.

So what is it? Do only you guys get to bring up the background of the people involved? Do they not count just because they represent your "side"? If the kid hadn't shot the first guy and he had pulled his gun from him and then shot him, would you have a different opinion of events or would you still play this game of partisan bullshit and say the kid deserved it?

I'd rather leave the backgrounds of the people here out of it unless its relevant and with the footage we have it's clear that it isn't relevant unless Rittenhouse provoked the first guy but also with the footage we have it is much more likely that the guy who was trying to goad about a dozen armed people to shoot him would be even more aggressive with just one person. That's why this pisses me off. You have all this evidence, video evidence, showing how things played out and you still want to play this political game of right vs left. If you're going to do this now then the country really is doomed.

“He yelled at me so I shot him” isn’t a fucking defense, and the background of “was committing a crime and expressed a desire to do violence at this event” are legally consequential background for establishing motive and the kind of charge he’ll face while “victim was in the sex offender registry” absolutely isn’t and will never be brought up in court.

If the kid had his gun taken and was killed I would take issue with the fucking murderer because he committed a murder. Did you miss where I criticized the John Brown Gun Club for doing that shit in “self-defense” from “gang violence” at CHAZ despite being supposedly on my side? Do you think I’m out here chomping at the bit for murder? No, I am fucking not. You play your sick culture war, leave me the fuck out of it.

 

[Buyetyen]

Well holy shit, I literally didn't think this shit show could get worse, but I guess that one is on me for not updating my imagination to 2020 levels of awful yet. Police were interacting with him and his group fucking 20 minutes before the shooting puts them at about 11 o'clock, which is so far past the curfew it's fucking staggering. Police sitting a fucking block away from active gunfire from multiple different shooters (this is another fucking twist I still can't believe), and didn't even fucking move in until after the bodies were starting to cool and fucking let an armed person, with him and others saying he shot people go. Not even detaining him to fucking figure out what happened, just let him fucking walk.

Oink oink, man. The cops don't exist to protect us, they exist to keep us lower classes in line. Like I said before: class traitors.

I don't doubt it.

....
Kyle Rittenhouse loved cops, guns, President Trump, and “triggering the libs,” according to some of his former classmates at Lakes Community High School in Lake County, Illinois. His clothes were often branded with pro-police slogans, and he carried a Blue Lives Matter phone case, one student said.
Some of his classmates joked that he’d be a mass shooter one day. “I personally believe he went to Wisconsin with the intent to kill,” said one former classmate, who asked not to be identified out of fear for their safety.
...
While Rittenhouse was only enrolled at Lakes Community High School for the 2017 to 2018 academic year, he left an impression. Students reached by VICE News described him as short-tempered and easily offended.
“When he got mad or offended he would always say he could ‘fuck me up,’ but everyone would just laugh because he was like a 5-foot-4 chubby freshman boy who we thought wasn’t capable of harm,” said Joe, who’s a minor and asked that his full name not be used.
....

Rittenhouse was also known as a “ride or die” Trump supporter. “If you said anything bad about Trump, he’d threaten you,” Joe said. In January, Rittenhouse even traveled to Iowa, where he had front row seats at a Trump rally, Buzzfeed reported. “Kyle was the type of kid to wear a MAGA hat or other apparel just for attention, or to “trigger” people,” Joe added.

....

Another one of Rittenhouse’s classmates said he used to refer to the school, located in a Chicago suburb, as “libtard af.”
“Kyle was kind of shy from what I remember, but he was definitely in your face and pushed his views hella,” they said. “Like one of those kids that liked ‘triggering libtards.’”

....

He posted on Snapchat about Blake, the father of six, whose lawyers say he was shot by police while trying to break up a domestic dispute. Rittenhouse posted Blake’s mugshot from a prior arrest with the caption “lol, he’s innocent.”

Alleged Kenosha Killer Loved Cops, Guns, Trump, and ‘Triggering the Libs,’ Former Classmates Say

The 17-year-old was only enrolled at Lakes Community High School for a year, but he left an impression.

www.vice.com

In other words, future Republican National Committee chair.

I mean, they didn't have the obligation to protect the protesters.

I keep wondering why people think it's acceptable for cops to protect the status quo for those in power but not the citizenry. And then I remember it's because they're not the ones actively hurt by this.

Seems appropriate. Everyone keeps trying make it out as if Rittenhouse was going there with the intention to shoot everyone despite only shooting the people who attacked him yet they have no interest in what the intent was of the racist guy at these apparent protests against racism from cops or the guy who was illegally carrying a pistol and may have even been the one to initiate the whole series of events if he's the one that shot in the air when Rittenhouse was running.

He killed 2 people.

So what is it? Do only you guys get to bring up the background of the people involved? Do they not count just because they represent your "side"? If the kid hadn't shot the first guy and he had pulled his gun from him and then shot him, would you have a different opinion of events or would you still play this game of partisan bullshit and say the kid deserved it?

The background of the victims is irrelevant because, wait for it... the kid wasn't a cop. He had no authority or jurisdiction and was in possession of a weapon he was not legally able to own and operate.

I'd rather leave the backgrounds of the people here out of it unless its relevant and with the footage we have it's clear that it isn't relevant unless Rittenhouse provoked the first guy but also with the footage we have it is much more likely that the guy who was trying to goad about a dozen armed people to shoot him would be even more aggressive with just one person. That's why this pisses me off. You have all this evidence, video evidence, showing how things played out and you still want to play this political game of right vs left. If you're going to do this now then the country really is doomed.

So being opposed to vigilantes murdering people is a leftist thing exclusively?

 

[Kwak]

So being opposed to vigilantes murdering people is a leftist thing exclusively?

Certainly if those people are anything that could be described as 'leftist'.

 

[Agema]

Seems appropriate. Everyone keeps trying make it out as if Rittenhouse was going there with the intention to shoot everyone despite only shooting the people who attacked him yet they have no interest in what the intent was of the racist guy at these apparent protests against racism from cops or the guy who was illegally carrying a pistol and may have even been the one to initiate the whole series of events if he's the one that shot in the air when Rittenhouse was running.

People don't care so much because these other guys didn't kill anyone.

Rather like people are a lot more bothered about a person who does 50mph in a 30mph zone and mows a pedestrian down than they are by someone who does 50mph in a 30mph zone and doesn't. The former merits jail for killing someone. The latter merits a speeding ticket. Consequences matter.

 

[Dreiko]

You mean call the police that outright thanked the militia for showing up and said via megaphone that they REALLY appreciate them?
The police that some militia people told them would "push the protestors towards them because they knew they (the militia) could handle them"?
The police that let a militia guy walk away after he opened fire on the protestors instead of, you know, arresting him for being involved in a shooting, until an investigation is done?

Oh, and let's not forget, the police the protesters are currently protesting against because once of theirs shot a guy in the back 7 times earlier that same week?

THOSE police?

^ Yes, I'm sure that the police would ABSOLUTELY take any issues the protestors have with the militia completely seriously and would tell the militia people who have no authority to "patrol" there to kindly move along and not cause issues! ^ /ExtremeSarcasmSnowboarding2020

No we were talking about in general what to do when right wing militias start bothering people. In the very specific circumstances where the militia is being approved by the police, what you wanna do is just avoid conflict at all cost and go and talk to the police about it so they will rein them in.

In every other situation, you handle it like you handle any sort of gang of armed people violating your rights. And no, merely standing armed in front of a store menacingly so that you won't loot it doesn't count as violating your rights, security guards do that every single day and they aren't domestic terrorists.

 

[Buyetyen]

In the very specific circumstances where the militia is being approved by the police, what you wanna do is just avoid conflict at all cost and go and talk to the police about it so they will rein them in.

I'm just going to leave this here and trust that everybody else can see the essential flaw in the logic.

 

[Dreiko]

I'm just going to leave this here and trust that everybody else can see the essential flaw in the logic.

There's no flaw, the presumption is that the police are unaware of the militia doing anything that violates your rights, which is why they approve of it, so when you notify them of the transgression they will act.


If you can't have that as the presumption going into the situation, that's all the more of a reason to not initiate conflict, because there will be no way to protect yourself if the militia people go nuts. You're already in serious danger without even doing anything if your presumption is actually correct. Trying to antagonize them is like kicking the bee nest.

 

[Buyetyen]

There's no flaw, the assumption is that the police are unaware of the militia doing anything that violates your rights, which is why they approve of them, so when you notify them of the transgression they will act.

Which, as we saw in this case, is the incorrect assumption. I can't speak to the police force in Greece, but stateside they're corrupt as hell. Ex-cops have told stories of refusing to participate in the corruption and finding themselves on shitty, dangerous details with no partner or backup. It goes all the way to the top. Hell, the KKK have been getting their people into law enforcement for decades. Because if you can't trust a white supremacist domestic terrorist group, who can you trust?

 

[Revnak]

Which, as we saw in this case, is the incorrect assumption. I can't speak to the police force in Greece, but stateside they're corrupt as hell. Ex-cops have told stories of refusing to participate in the corruption and finding themselves on shitty, dangerous details with no partner or backup. It goes all the way to the top. Hell, the KKK have been getting their people into law enforcement for decades. Because if you can't trust a white supremacist domestic terrorist group, who can you trust?

The police force in Greece is notoriously corrupt and fascist, with close connections to Golden Dawn.

 

[Buyetyen]

The police force in Greece is notoriously corrupt and fascist, with close connections to Golden Dawn.

And that's fucking horrifying. It seems there is no country in which ACAB is not applicable.

 

[Mister Mumbler]

There's no flaw, the presumption is that the police are unaware of the militia doing anything that violates your rights, which is why they approve of it, so when you notify them of the transgression they will act.


If you can't have that as the presumption going into the situation, that's all the more of a reason to not initiate conflict, because there will be no way to protect yourself if the militia people go nuts. You're already in serious danger without even doing anything if your presumption is actually correct. Trying to antagonize them is like kicking the bee nest.

In this particular case though, the shooter and others did go to the police and notify them...at which point they calmly did nothing, which means that he had to be arrested by his hometown police force for this double homicide (it's up to the courts to determine whether or not it was justifiable but I'm leaning towards a hard no there personally) the next day.

 

[Revnak]

And that's fucking horrifying. It seems there is no country in which ACAB is not applicable.

I’d say that it’s normal for people to not know about the abuses of their police force but in Greece’s case I’m pretty certain there’s places the cops aren’t allowed to go not because the places are too dangerous but because in earlier governments the cops would just abduct people so the current more democratic government made it illegal so honestly I don’t know how people don’t know that if they live there.

 

[Buyetyen]

In this particular case though, the shooter and others did go to the police and notify them...at which point they calmly did nothing, which means that he had to be arrested by his hometown police force for this double homicide (it's up to the courts to determine whether or not it was justifiable but I'm leaning towards a hard no there personally) the next day.

And of course, because he's white, he gets 30 days before extradition to Wisconsin to stand trial so that his family can pick him out a private defense attorney rather than relying on the public defender.

I’d say that it’s normal for people to not know about the abuses of their police force but in Greece’s case I’m pretty certain there’s places the cops aren’t allowed to go not because the places are too dangerous but because in earlier governments the cops would just abduct people so the current more democratic government made it illegal so honestly I don’t know how people don’t know that if they live there.

Same way they do it here in the States, I imagine: it's easy to look the other way when you're not the one getting wailed on or shot at by the pigs.

 

[Dreiko]

In this particular case though, the shooter and others did go to the police and notify them...at which point they calmly did nothing, which means that he had to be arrested by his hometown police force for this double homicide (it's up to the courts to determine whether or not it was justifiable but I'm leaning towards a hard no there personally) the next day.

I haven't seen the particulars about what transpired after he reached the cops. I don't know if for example they had already let him go by the time the protesters told em what happened. Maybe he just lied to them so they had no reason to suspect him. Who knows.

 

[Avnger]

Maybe he just lied to them so they had no reason to suspect him.

He was an unescorted minor from out of state on the streets after curfew illegally carrying a firearm even if we discount the murders he had just committed. When "the guy was within 500ft of a sharpened crayon" is not-irregularly the level of justification given for police gunning down citizens, how the fuck does this kid give "no reason to suspect him?"

 

[Thaluikhain]

Ok, so still explaining that murder is bad, not surprising, but I didn't expect the "5.56 isn't a military round, and it's less powerful than 9x19 anyway" stuff.

(Ok, yes, an assault weapon loaded with .223 isn't the same as an assault rifle loaded with 5.56 (assuming the reports didn't just equate 5.56 with .223), but still)

 

[Kwak]

Who knows.

People not gleefully trying to construct a slanted narrative.

 

[Neuromancer]

I’d say that it’s normal for people to not know about the abuses of their police force but in Greece’s case I’m pretty certain there’s places the cops aren’t allowed to go not because the places are too dangerous but because in earlier governments the cops would just abduct people so the current more democratic government made it illegal so honestly I don’t know how people don’t know that if they live there.

Quite simply, they benefit from the system.

I should also mention that current government has greatly increased police numbers, repealed the law that barred cops from campuses outside emergencies, has been raiding anarchist neighborhoods under fabricated reasons and has busted and closed refugee squats to have said refugees brought to their sodily-run internment camps.