Games that wasted a perfectly good premise/plot

[Dalisclock]

So I'm sure there there games that all of us played and came out the other side(whether finishing the game or not) thinking "You know, the idea behind this is awesome. Why doesn't the game live up to it?"

Especially if the game advertised itself or set up an initial idea of "This game is about X" and then proceeds to do almost nothing with the idea or does it extremely poorly.

Examples off the top of my head.

-Metal Gear Solid V. So this game....oh boy, initially looks like it had a lot of cool ideas. Bridging the gap Between Big Boss truly embracing his nature as an outsider In Peace Walker and building this "nation of warriors" Outer Heaven in Metal Gear, getting revenge against Skullface for almost killing him, and delving more into Cypher/The Patriots.

It spends most of the game....doing very little of any of those. It's made worse when it's revealed that You aren't Big Boss and he's off building Outer Heaven without you and very few of the ideas in this game relate to stuff in other games, despite the attempted fanservice with Liquid, Ocelot and Volgon. There's a bunch interesting stuff in the cassette tapes when you beat the game, and the whole idea of Skullface being mad because of his original language being taken from him is fascinating idea, but very little of it plays into the game at large and instead there's a bunch of random missions in Africa and afghanistan with some plot relevant ones sprinkled in. It feels like you could skip the entire game and miss pretty much nothing as far as important to the overall timeline, especially since Peace Walker already set up Big Boss building his own PMC and getting his own Metal Gear, as well as addressing some of the themes from Snake Eater(notably Big Boss still being messed up over having to kill the Boss).

-Assassin's Creed Syndicate. So I know it's probably not fair picking on an AssCreed game for having a crappy plot(since most of them don't have particularly good plots), but Syndicate feels pretty lackluster. The beginning sets up the idea that the Templars run London and thus the British Empire at the height of it's power in the Victorian Age. Which sounds really cool, except that almost none of the game has anything to do with that and mostly it's "Lets form a gang, and kill the other Templar gang". Sure, there's an interesting thing where killing one of the head Templars messes something up because of how deeply it was controlled by them, only to have it fixed by Evie almost immediately(it was originally planned to stay messed up for the rest of the game).

What about everyone else?

 

[BrawlMan]

Quantum Break. Time travel. How do you screw that up by making it another generic cover shooter? One that is a 3rd rate clone of Vanquish. They don't do much with the time travel or time manipulation. The enemies that can move through times shifts are basically less scary, easier versions of The Taken, except they can use guns. Microsoft stuck their dick in Remedy's creation too much. The live action, shitty, Jason Bourne "action scenes" add nothing to the overall experience. Thank God, they're allowed to be on their own again. I still have to grab a copy of Control. Anybody's thoughts on that without any spoilers?

 

[Dalisclock]

Quantum Break. Time travel. How do you screw that up by making it another generic cover shooter? One that is a 3rd rate clone of Vanquish. They don't do much with the time travel or time manipulation. The enemies that can move through times shifts are basically less scary, easier versions of The Taken, except they can use guns. Microsoft stuck their dick in Remedy's creation too much. The live action, shitty, Jason Bourne "action scenes" add nothing to the overall experience. Thank God, they're aloud to be on their own again. I still have to grab a copy of Control. Anybody's thoughts on that without any spoilers?

I knew there was a reason I skipped that game. I do want to pick up Control at some point, especially since it apparently takes a lot of inspiration from SCP and I've been really getting into that lately.

 

[happyninja42]

I still have to grab a copy of Control. Anybody's thoughts on that without any spoilers?

I loved that game. My wife did as well as an observer of it. She would actively "hint" that I should load up Control so she could watch me play it, because she loved how the storytelling of it went. It's got that weird, Remedy style of "kind of like Twin Peaks, but also kind of silly, but also really awesome." Seriously if I had to describe the game in like 2 sentences it would be "If Remedy had Twin Peaks, and The X Files have a baby, and they turned that baby into a video game, with their classic flair for bizarre shit, and also some goofy humor at times."

That game had multiple times, where I was blown away by the way they structured the storytelling of it. And one sequence in particular, that had me giggling with childish glee at the feels it was giving me. Anyone who's played it, probably knows exactly what I'm talking about, but don't mention it here, we want him to experience it fresh if possible.

But like, from the very first moments of the game, it's weird, but in a good way. The mechanics are really fun, as you get your powers, you start to feel like a pure badass. The controls can be a little janky, and when a lot of the particle effects were going off at once in bigger combats, my PS4 did kind of die inside, and the frame rate would sometimes tank horribly. But that wasn't a common issue. Only when you were like in a BIG fight, and lots of stuffs blowing up around you, and stuffs flying around back and forth. Small scale fights, and medium scale ones were usually fine. It's a noticeable flaw in the design, but it never really bothered me much. And it really didn't come up that often.

The little collectible bits of lore were incredibly engaging and fun to gather,a nd this is coming from someone who HATES the act of gathering codex entries just to gather them. But in Control, they really do help flesh out what's going on. Remedy hid a lot of the story in those little audio clips, and case files, and if you wanted to understand what was going on, it really paid to actually go find those things.

It's probably one of the most fun times I've had in a video game in years. Definitely one of my top games in recent memory.

If you are familiar with Remedy's other titles, you will see some connective tissue here and there, especially if you go poking your nose into all the hidden stuff and case files. I've heard there are some examples of this in Quantum Break, things mentioned, terms used, graffiti on walls, that suggest a link to other titles, and a lot of those little hints are...well...hinted at in Control as well.

Let me say this....no, there is too much...lemme sum up.

Did you like Max Payne 1 and 2? Did you like Alan Wake? Then you will probably really enjoy Control.

 

[BrawlMan]

Did you like Max Payne 1 and 2? Did you like Alan Wake?

The answer to all of those questions is yes.

 

[Dalisclock]

The answer to all of those questions is yes.

I liked Max Payne 1 and 2. Alan wake was fine.

 

[Hawki]

There might be some debate as to whether these count as "wasted" as opposed to "botched," (and I'm not including "disappointing." though there'll be overlap), but okay, I'll try.

BioShock: Infinite

I don't know if this counts as wasted, but it's certainly botched. Said this many times, but BI tries to look at three themes/ideas - racism, classism, and quantum mechanics. From the start, you can tell that one of these things isn't like the other. The first and second themes could inform one another, but the second theme is botched. The game kind of harkens to the ideas of 'A Tale of Two Cities', namely "don't treat the poor among you poorly, otherwise it'll come back to bite you, and all of society will suffer," but the game doesn't even manage that, since the Vox go from a group with legitimate grievances to people who'll turn on Booker at the drop of a hat. I don't know if the game was trying to go for moral equivalance (the idea that the oppressed can be as bad as their oppressors if the scales of power are turned), but it botches that up. Of the first, I'd say it does the racism theme well, in that it builds up to 'that moment,' which recontextualizes everything, and we see how that racism is noramlized everywhere, but the idea gets pushed to the wayside. So the result is that we have one strong theme that's built up but then peters out, one average theme that's never fully explored, and dimension hopping that if anything, lessens the impact of everything that's just occurred because we can just hop through realities ad nauseum.

BioShock 1 worked for many reasons, but one of those reasons is that it had a core idea and stuck to it - "what would happen if lassie faire capitalism/Rayndism actually played out?" We walk through a ruined city that shows us the answer. BI tries to do too much, and stumbles as a result.

Golden Sun: Dark Dawn

Per above, I'm dubious as to whether this counts as botched, as opposed to just being disappointing, but again, I'll try.

GS2 didn't need a sequel IMO, but if it was going to get one, in my mind, there were two logical places for the series to go - one, the lost city of Anemos, and two, the fate of Alex. Dark Dawn comes along, taking place thirty years later in-universe and ignores the former, and teases the latter. Yes, Alex is still there in the background manipulating everything, and we've yet to fight the bastard.

The weird thing about Golden Sun is that if I ranked the stories, it would go 1>2>3, but if I ranked the worldbuilding, it would go 3>2>1. But worldbuilding isn't the same as plot, and therein lies the problem. Dark Dawn introduces new stuff, sure, and it shows how civilization has sprung up because of the rise of the titular sun, but so little of it feels like it's leading on from the previous games. Yes, it delves into a lot of world history, and it introduces the Tsuperang and whatnot, but again, none of this feels congruent with the previous games in a sense of plot progression. Probably the best example I can give is Resident Evil 4. Now, I love RE4, but look at it from a plot perspective - the last main entry, Code: Veronica, had Chris say "it's time to take out Umbrella!" before flying away from an explosion. Then RE4 comes along and says "yeah, nah, Umbrella fell apart in-between games, enjoy this new setting with only tangental links to the series up until now." Course, Umbrella Chronicles partly mitigated that, and RE4 was selling itself mainly on gameplay, but Dark Dawn has neither of those excuses. And the result is that it took a series with a self-contained ending to one that's ended on a literal cliffhanger, and one that'll almost certainly never be resolved.

Metroid: Other M

I'm far more forgiving towards Other M than a lot of people, but if I take the purpose of the story to tell the backstory of Samus Aran, then I think a much better way to do it would be to have the game take place earliest in the series, before anything else. If you did that, you could have similar plot events (fleshing out Samus's relationship with Adam, her fear of Ripley, etc.) and have it be less jarring. You'd have to alter certain elements of the plot (e.g. no metroids, Adam couldn't die, no M.B., etc.), but we can all agree that Other M's excecution was flawed, at best. The Samus characterization is the most complained about, but even then, the plot harms Fusion. "Oh no, the Federation is breeding metroids on BSL, it's such a shame I was never on any other space station that showed me the EXACT SAME THING!" Gah.

Perfect Dark Zero

I'm dubious as to whether I should include this, because it really depends on what you define as the "premise" of Zero. However, it is a prequel, and one that shows how Joanna joins the Carrington Institute. Okay, sure. Fair enough. Here's the problem with its execution:

-Joanna in Zero acts nothing like she does in the original. Now, that isn't bad in of itself, characters can change after all. But there's no sense of a bridge between this Zero!Joanna and PD!Joanna. She starts the game as one individual, and is more or less the same individual by the end of it.

-Joanna meets Jonathan in this game, whereas in the original, it was implied that their meeting in Area 51 was their first. And again, Jonathan in this game acts nothing like he does in the original, and again, there's no bridging of his character.

-Zero establishes that alien life exists. The protagonists, including Jo, more or less accepts this. So it does kind of undercut the reveal of the maians in the original game. "Oh my God, that's an alien...which isn't really that shocking in retrospect, because I encountered alien tech three years ago."

There are many more problems with Zero, but again, if I take its premise as being a prequel meant to sync up with the original game, then it fails. The best thing to come out of the game were the Greg Rucka novels/comics, which, among other things, took the scraps of Zero and did an excellent job of infusing worldbuilding to the setting.

Sonic Forces

I'm sure some of you are raising eyebrows as to me including any Sonic game on this list, but hear me out.

Sonic Forces had potential plotwise. Eggman taking over the planet, forcing a bad of rebels to take it back? Yes, that could work. It's been done before, in the Archie comics, in the Fleetway comics, in SatAM, and in Underground. The premise works for the Sonic franchise, because multiple forms of media have shown it to be able to work. And a darker tone? Sure. Not Shadow dark, but SA1/2 dark? Sign me up, I like my Sonic with a bit of edge. I mean, what could go wrong?

Well, quite a lot actually. Classic Sonic is thrown into the mix, and has no bearing on the plot. Everything Classic Sonic does, Tails could do, and that would make for a better arc for Tails rather than retarding the character growth he had in SA1/2. Infinite isn't the worst thing in the world, but the problem is that his fights are way too easy, so there's a disconnect between them and following cutscenes where he trounces the protagonists. And there's a sense of all-round cheapness to the production.

There's worse narratives in the series than Sonic Forces, but the difference between this and, say, Generations, Heroes, or Colours, is that those games aimed low with their plots. Forces has aspirations of greatness, but just flounders. And again, I've seen this kind of plot work with Sonic, but the game just doesn't manage it.

Star Fox Command/Zero

This is a weird one, but let me explain.

Command doesn't have a good plot. Not that the Star Fox series was ever known for intricate plots, but of every Star Fox game I've played, Command has the weakest. Nevertheless, per its endings, interesting possibilities are raised, especially since some endings aren't mutually exclusive. I mean, you have a potential next generation of pilots (including Fox's son), while Dash seeks to emulate Andross by building a Venomian empire. Y'know, sins of the fathers, sons of the protagonist/antagonist meeting in a future game, duking it out, cycle of violence, etc. Yes, I'm probably giving this game more thought than the developers intended, but at the very least, the potential is there. And then, the next game...

Does nothing with it. Absolutely nothing. The series is rebooted for the second time, giving us the same premise for the third time. I've said it before and I'll say it now, Nintendo doesn't know what to do with the Star Fox series, even though it's got a solid template with Star Fox 64. And while that's mainly a gameplay argument, the setting's been underutilized, and never is this represented more aptly with Command and Zero. Command has a lacklustre story that at least hints at future potential, and Zero does absoutely nothing with it.

Final Note

Again, this is wasted, not botched or disappointing. For instance, the premise of Wolfenstein: The New Order isn't wasted per se, in that its worldbuilding highlights just how terrible the world is per a Nazi victory, but its storytelling is heavily flawed. However, I'm not including that because again, the premise isn't wasted, it's just that the storytelling within that premise is.

 

[happyninja42]

The answer to all of those questions is yes.

Then odds are pretty good, in my opinion, that you will enjoy Control. It's very much a Remedy game, with all that entails. I can't say if you will love it like I do, but it's a damn fun game in my opinion. It hit a lot of the beats that I enjoy in a video game. It's not perfect, but the things it got wrong, were few and far between in my mind. Like, the physics engine they used to realize the powers....can sometimes make objects act reeeaaaally janky. But, in my head canon, I justified it with "well the shit going on in this game is super bizarre, you could totally say it's because of that, and not just a slightly wonky engine" xD

I liked Max Payne 1 and 2. Alan wake was fine.

Yeah Alan Wake was fun, but it did suffer, at least in my mind, from a bit of "the game mechanics killing some of the tension." For example, the way the shadows would sometimes move in on you, and you'd get the creepy sound effects along with the loss of visuals. It would always make me tense up, which was good, because you didn't know where the attack would come from.....until the camera would whip over to the Boss Enemy, clearly indicating "oh, he's right over there...ok well, I guess I'm not that worried about this cloud right now then."

So that was bothersome, but not a huge problem for me.

 

[Dalisclock]

Then odds are pretty good, in my opinion, that you will enjoy Control. It's very much a Remedy game, with all that entails. I can't say if you will love it like I do, but it's a damn fun game in my opinion. It hit a lot of the beats that I enjoy in a video game. It's not perfect, but the things it got wrong, were few and far between in my mind. Like, the physics engine they used to realize the powers....can sometimes make objects act reeeaaaally janky. But, in my head canon, I justified it with "well the shit going on in this game is super bizarre, you could totally say it's because of that, and not just a slightly wonky engine" xD


Yeah Alan Wake was fun, but it did suffer, at least in my mind, from a bit of "the game mechanics killing some of the tension." For example, the way the shadows would sometimes move in on you, and you'd get the creepy sound effects along with the loss of visuals. It would always make me tense up, which was good, because you didn't know where the attack would come from.....until the camera would whip over to the Boss Enemy, clearly indicating "oh, he's right over there...ok well, I guess I'm not that worried about this cloud right now then."

So that was bothersome, but not a huge problem for me.

Yeah, Alan Wake I felt suffered from a gameplay loop of "Shine light on enemy, kill enemy" that gets a bit repetitive, and the tension of the shadows didn't work nearly as well as the game thought it did. Too bad because I like the idea.

Control I like the idea of because it sounds a lot like if you cross Max Payne and Saints Row 4 with SCP, and those are 3 things I'm quite fond of. The worst thing I heard was there are some really wierd dfficulty spikes.

 

[happyninja42]

Yeah, Alan Wake I felt suffered from a gameplay loop of "Shine light on enemy, kill enemy" that get a it repetative, and the tension of the shadows didn't work nearly as well as the game thought it did. Too bad because I like the idea.

Control I like the idea of because it sounds a lot like if you cross Max Payne and Saints Row 4 with SCP, and those are 3 things I'm quite fond of. The worst thing I heard was there are some really wierd dfficulty spikes.

*blinks* Not sure where the Saints Row 4 similarities would be? Maybe in wacky supporting cast ? *shrugs*

But yeah, there are some spots where you can get really stomped by enemies. Some fights were super frustrating for me, due to the mechanics, and I'm not a Souls disciple, so I don't equate Hard with Good, so it got frustrating for me at times. There were a few times where I was like "ok I need to put down the controller and go do something else, because this boss fight is genuinely pissing me off." But that wasn't too often. And some of it could probably be countered with a different weapon type for that fight, or a change of strategy. Like, using the Force Move ability isn't as good a plan against this boss, as opposed to simply shooting them with bullets.

I will say the mocap for the peoples faces could be a little....uncanny valley at times. It wasn't too often, and since you don't really spend a ton of time with them, it wasn't a big issue. But it felt like they were instructed to emote their facial expressions larger than normal, so the equipment could capture the movements. And it turned out the equipment was very good at minor movements, so the expressions come off as slightly....manic? Like BIG SMILES and wide mouth motions while talking. Again, not a big issue for me, not even an issue really, as I just found it funny when it would happen.

 

[Dalisclock]

*blinks* Not sure where the Saints Row 4 similarities would be? Maybe in wacky supporting cast ? *shrugs*

I was trying to think of another game wear you could toss objects are people for combat purposes on regular basis and Saints Row 4 is what I came up with. I'm sure I'm missing a much more obvious one. Maybe one of the Jedi games? I haven't played one of those in years.

 

[happyninja42]

I was trying to think of another game wear you could toss objects are people for combat purposes on regular basis and Saints Row 4 is what I came up with. I'm sure I'm missing a much more obvious one. Maybe one of the Jedi games? I haven't played one of those in years.

Yeah mechanics wise, it felt WAY more like Force Unleashed, at least as far as the projectile physics go. The "grab random object and hurl it where you are aiming" is way more indicative of that in my opinion. The other powers don't really have a Jedi equivalent? Well, some do a little. But it was really fun building your own combat style based on which powers you liked most.

 

[Elvis Starburst]

Sonic Forces

I don't even like most Sonic games all that much (Let the fans screech at me when I say Sonic and the Black Knight is in my top 3), but Forces was such a disappointment. Never played it, but the marketing, the setting, all of it sounded so good on paper. And then they just super botched it in any way they could. Sonic Team is an absolute travesty. It feels like anyone in charge of direction needs to be booted out and replaced.

Star Fox Command/Zero

Nintendo doesn't know what to do with the Star Fox series, even though it's got a solid template with Star Fox 64.
The setting's been underutilized

Command's story was shiiiiiiiiit, oh my god. I dunno how I managed to 100% that game, but it wasn't the most fun at times.

The thing bout the story here is that since Command's story was such garbage, I don't think I would've even wanted it to continue past that point. Some of the possible endings were neat ideas, but ultimately it wasn't a future I looked at with a lot of excitement. It is too bad Zero just reboots it. But after 64 and Adventures, Nintendo did try and expand the story, narrative and world with Assault, and it once again got kinda mixed reception on that front. Following that up with Command and the little things it tried to do (Ghost of Andross, blech) was just a second kick to the gut. It seems that whenever they do do something different, it's not as well liked. But now when they do what people liked, everyone craps on that too. Kinda puts them in a bit of a bind, ya know? What direction do you take at that point?

OT:

Nano Assault

I doubt many people have heard of the DS shoot-em-up series called Nanostray, but it and its sequel are some of my fave shooters out there, especially the second one. So when I randomly heard a sequel was coming out for the 3DS, I was super hyped. But instead of a shooter with a ship over planets/in space, it instead takes you into a microscopic ship in order to destroy cells and stuff. I get it's a follow up to the previous game's threat, the Nanostray virus, and you're finally finishing it off on a molecular level, but... I dunno, it just didn't feel nearly as fun as previous titles. Levels weren't as interesting, the music wasn't as fun, and the gameplay loop wasn't as enjoyable. Not what I hoped for in a follow up.

Kingdom Hearts Dream Drop Distance

Whatever interesting stuff this could've done with the story, I ultimately couldn't care less cause of the way the gameplay loop was handled. Being forced to have to switch to the other character's story at the whims of some timer, ESPECIALLY in the middle of boss fights (And thus resetting the boss fight) was infuriating levels of stupid. It killed any drive I had to continue. I also didn't care for the Dream Eaters as enemies, thought they were kinda dumb.

Freedom Wars

Stupid name aside, this game had some fun gameplay and good ideas, and I really liked the world. The oppressive feeling of having to buy your rights back was awesome. I just kinda wish there were more to buy, and that the game didn't just take the reigns off entirely in the last third of the game, making it no longer feel oppressive in nature. The ending was also super sudden and extremely lame, and I really wish it didn't end up such a rush job by the end. I doubt we're ever gonna get a sequel either, which is such a shame

 

[Worgen]

Quantum Break. Time travel. How do you screw that up by making it another generic cover shooter? One that is a 3rd rate clone of Vanquish. They don't do much with the time travel or time manipulation. The enemies that can move through times shifts are basically less scary, easier versions of The Taken, except they can use guns. Microsoft stuck their dick in Remedy's creation too much. The live action, shitty, Jason Bourne "action scenes" add nothing to the overall experience. Thank God, they're allowed to be on their own again. I still have to grab a copy of Control. Anybody's thoughts on that without any spoilers?

Really? I thought it was quite good, I mean sure they could have done more with it but that can be said for pretty much anything.

OP: I have to say Bioshock Infinite. I have never seen a game throw away such an interesting premise and early potential like Bioshock Infinite. The initial introduction to the tears is really cool and there are a few neat cutscenes with them, but aside from a few "oh neat" moments they are totally wasted both in story and gameplay where they just become a make a thing appear button, but its not even a creative thing, you can't open a tear to make a train or plane show up kill an enemy in a certain area or something neat, you just make ammo appear or a drone or cover or even just a grapple point thing. Then you also have the Song Bird, such an awesome design and he pretty much does nothing for the whole game then at the end you can summon him to do the aformentioned, kill all enemies in an area move during the last fight and thats pretty much it. Then you have things that really don't gel with the feeling of the game, such as the fact this is supposed to take place in a living city and your only real interaction with it is killing law enforcement, then you have the vigors which are just plasmids but with less narrative consistency. There are like 2 enemies that have vigors but they seem to just be handing them out to random people so you would assume you would face more of them. It really does feel like a game with lofty goals where 90% of what the team wanted to do got cut in favor of just making Bioshock again.

 

[BrawlMan]

Nano Assault

I doubt many people have heard of the DS shoot-em-up series called Nanostray, but it and its sequel are some of my fave shooters out there, especially the second one. So when I randomly heard a sequel was coming out for the 3DS, I was super hyped. But instead of a shooter with a ship over planets/in space, it instead takes you into a microscopic ship in order to destroy cells and stuff. I get it's a follow up to the previous game's threat, the Nanostray virus, and you're finally finishing it off on a molecular level, but... I dunno, it just didn't feel nearly as fun as previous titles. Levels weren't as interesting, the music wasn't as fun, and the gameplay loop wasn't as enjoyable. Not what I hoped for in a follow up.

I played the 3DS and Wii U version. Vaguely heard of the original DS game when the 3DS game released. Nice to see another fan. Even if you prefer the original.

 

[Dalisclock]

There might be some debate as to whether these count as "wasted" as opposed to "botched," (and I'm not including "disappointing." though there'll be overlap), but okay, I'll try.

BioShock: Infinite

I don't know if this counts as wasted, but it's certainly botched. Said this many times, but BI tries to look at three themes/ideas - racism, classism, and quantum mechanics. From the start, you can tell that one of these things isn't like the other. The first and second themes could inform one another, but the second theme is botched. The game kind of harkens to the ideas of 'A Tale of Two Cities', namely "don't treat the poor among you poorly, otherwise it'll come back to bite you, and all of society will suffer," but the game doesn't even manage that, since the Vox go from a group with legitimate grievances to people who'll turn on Booker at the drop of a hat. I don't know if the game was trying to go for moral equivalance (the idea that the oppressed can be as bad as their oppressors if the scales of power are turned), but it botches that up. Of the first, I'd say it does the racism theme well, in that it builds up to 'that moment,' which recontextualizes everything, and we see how that racism is noramlized everywhere, but the idea gets pushed to the wayside. So the result is that we have one strong theme that's built up but then peters out, one average theme that's never fully explored, and dimension hopping that if anything, lessens the impact of everything that's just occurred because we can just hop through realities ad nauseum.

BioShock 1 worked for many reasons, but one of those reasons is that it had a core idea and stuck to it - "what would happen if lassie faire capitalism/Rayndism actually played out?" We walk through a ruined city that shows us the answer. BI tries to do too much, and stumbles as a result.

I'd say it counts. I like Bioshock Infinite, but I won't deny it's a giant mess because of the reasons you stated. It's trying to do a ton of things at the same time and judging from the earlier trailers for the previous 5 or so years It's obvious they were trying to figure out how to make the whole thing work. It's also clear they really wanted to explore racism and quantum physics from way back when and I think that's a massive part of the problem because as you said, those things don't mesh very well and I dislike how "QUANTUM PHYSICS!" becomes a shorthand for MAGIC!

It almost feels like the game needed a couple more hours of running time to do what it wanted to do, but at the same time it would have hurt the pacing. Then again, nobody was asking for the goddamn lady comstock fight 3 FUCKING TIMES either.

It really does feel like a game with lofty goals where 90% of what the team wanted to do got cut in favor of just making Bioshock again.

I believe at one point they said they tossed like 5 games worth of material over the years they were making it. It would explain a lot. Seriously, look at the videos below and compare it to the game we got.


There's similarities there but man they also changed a number of things, apparently because they couldn't figure out how to make them work properly as part of the game.But man, that 2nd video really makes me sad for what could have been. I don't remember anything that big or involved in the final game we got.

 

[Elvis Starburst]

I played the 3DS and Wii U version. Vaguely heard of the original DS game when the 3DS game released. Nice to see another fan. Even if you prefer the original.

Well, I didn't expect someone to know the series, let alone respond so quickly. Nice! I tell ya though, one thing that got me suuuuper hyped was the Nanostray music remixes and locations in Fast Racing Neo/Fast RMX. The Sunahara Desert music remix is top notch, and Kamagori City's remix of Nanostray 2's Kaikan Outpost music is probably my fave on the soundtrack

 

[BrawlMan]

Really? I thought it was quite good, I mean sure they could have done more with it but that can be said for pretty much anything.

I'll give credit where it's due with the sound engineering and soundtrack Top tier stuff.

Ideas are wasted gameplay which hurts the most. There are enviormental hazards from the time stutters, but they rarely play in to gunfights and are usually relegated to platforming/puzzles. Rinse and repeat. Combat section, "exploration", puzzle or platforming, combact section, timeline split (choose your own timeline), and live-action lower than TV/Straight-to-DVD budget. Jack Joyce, I don't find that interesting of all of Remedy's protagonists, but I do enjoy the relationship he has with his brother, Will. They remind me of my older brother, and seeing them care for each other, gets me in the heart. My brother and I always have to look out for each other.

 

[BrawlMan]

Really? I thought it was quite good, I mean sure they could have done more with it but that can be said for pretty much anything.

My main grievances are pointed out in the video. The video will start at 10 minutes and 23 seconds. Check the 16 minute mark too for more on QB.


For some reason, the website won't let me edit my previous post. This has happened several times before.

 

[EvilRoy]

I'll throw in FFX. Its a very interesting world with very interesting characters (except for the main character somehow) that really could have had a very deep, not-stuck-up-its-own-butt story, but somehow they just screwed the pooch. Most of this is plot spoilers so just a general warning here.

Titus is just a douche, and in spite of his origin, and the fact that he basically catalyzes the story, he just doesn't amount to much compared to the side-protags in his own battle party. Being a dream of creatures that want to end a cycle of destruction is interesting, but nothing is really done with it. Its just windowdressing for a dude who has emotional issues because his dad was a prick. Yuna is a summoner who is trying to follow in her fathers footsteps of CHOOSING TO DIE to better the lives of the people in the world. That is the endpoint of her entire story, and as she travels through the world she faces off with people trying to compete with her to die (other summoners), people trying to replace her (knights who attempt to destroy the big bad through military might [and fail spectacularly]) and people who want to stop her (a race of people who oppose the sacrifice of summoners). And each time she has a reaction and she has a little character growth. She goes from doormat to a person who attempted to solo-orchestrate a takedown of a side-big bad in a way spectacular enough to fuck with the heads of her enemies and make her moral standing clear to the public. And yet somehow she's second fiddle to 90's hair. And that's just one character. We've got a fish out of water story where a character from a small craphole town wrestles with guilt and projected hate against a race because of the traumatic and senseless death of his brother as he attempts to come to terms with what he's helping Yuna do. Then we've got a member of that race who opposes the sacrifice of summoners working with the group hoping that she can use reason and positive action to stop Yuna from ending herself, rather than the borderline terroristic methods of a portion of her brethren. And so on.

How do you have that much good shit to work with and fuck it all up by focusing on daddy issues and stupid pants.

Next on my list is Deus Ex: HR

Its a good game without a doubt, but somehow they managed to miss the really interesting parts of what a cyborg future could look like, or they kind of glance sideways at it but never actually engage. As an example, at one point in the game you can find a log that basically says Adam J didn't need the full tire rotation he recieved, and probably could have avoided losing a couple limbs and maybe an eye or something, but bossman decided he wanted a fully pimped ride out of his security officer. So you see that, and you read that in game... and... nothing. No reaction, no discussion, not even a muttered "suck my fuckin dick dude". Like, there could have been some really interesting twists and turns there but for some reason we just didn't get that. Stuff like that just keeps happening over and over. You look over and see the future version of a meth lab where they chop shop people and cook up new mods, and we get like a standard blueblood style commentary on it and then nothing. The game feels like it wants to just show you everything, let you make your own judgements and come to your own conclusions, and then gives you a three choice ending with no denouement. That could work, but the world is too interesting to leave so much unsaid.

And finally Thimbleweed Park.

I loved this game so much until the story took its own head and placed it up its own ass and farted up its own nose. There was a bunch of really interesting plot threads and funny interactions and just plane cool story ideas and then we get the digital equivalent of "it was all a dream". Thanks guys. I don't want to dig in too far into the details first because if you do want to try a 90s style point and click this is a great game and you shouldn't ruin it for yourself too much even if the ending is crap, and second because it feels too easy to take cheap shots at a silly game made for fun by people who loved a certain era of gaming. Yeah its dumb, and yeah we could have gotten just zonks of cool game story if they hadn't decided to crap up and cut it off, but its still a worthwhile play.