How Aliens Ruined A Franchise

[DrStrangelove]

How Aliens Ruined A Franchise

With the release of Alien there was a chance for a truly great sci-fi series, but reality is rarely as good as you want it to be.

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[Clive Howlitzer]

I can agree with this, it is very much a 'to teach their own'. I've always preferred the original Alien film as my Alien movie of choice. It certainly is a style of film I vastly prefer over Aliens.

 

[RJ Dalton]

There is also the problem that James Cameron lacks a human soul.

This. Very much this.
Personally, The original is my fave and I'd rather the rest never happened. The whole franchise has been nothing but dumbed down ever since the second film. I liked Aliens when I was younger, but I was younger, which means not as smart. The older I get, the less the other films in the franchise interest me.

 

[Ishigami]

Yay someone like me who liked Alien better than Aliens. Those are rare to come by these days. Kudos!

At least Aliens was better than someone trying and failing to repeat the original.

I like Alien³ better than Aliens.

 

[Callate]

1. In some very real ways, Aliens is still a horror film. The overwhelming tone of the film is not a gung-ho celebration of the marines' prowess, but instead a sense that, for all their hardware, the marines are still losing a war of attrition with something scarier than they are on their best day.

2. I can't help but feel that the idea Aliens "ruined a franchise" is more than a little ridiculous, predicated as it is on the idea that there were untold riches of Aliens movies that could have been made closer in tone to the first, "horror" offering...

...This was the 1980s. Name three horror franchises of the era that weren't varying degrees of ridiculous, exploitative, or outright god-awful by the time they got a sequel or two. I'll wait.

 

[Fappy]

I feel like if they were not to take the franchise where they did it shouldn't have happened to begin with. I mean, Alien is a great sci-fi horror film, with profound imagery and themes that film classes all over the country will be talking about until the end of time, whereas Aliens is a great standalone action movie. Strangely enough, I don't really consider them to be of the same vein. The only thing that really connects the two films at all is the character of Ripley (and let's not even talk about the third movie).

The original Alien should have never really been a franchise to begin with in my opinion, so I don't really agree that its sequel really ruined anything other than continuing Ripley's character for no good reason (granted, I do actually like her arc across both films).

There is also the problem that James Cameron lacks a human soul.

Say what you will about him, but James Cameron directed Terminator 2, which is the best action movie ever made XD

EDIT: Also, when did you become the Community Manager Schuyler? I thought you were just hired to remind Louis that he is a pedophile for liking Justin Bieber!

 

[Sir Thomas Sean Connery]

Eh, no.

I've seen this argument before, I'll probably see it again and it still doesn't make much sense.

Alien was a very good movie, but a large portion of its excellence was in the department of innovation.
The tension is nice, but most of the characters don't even have the level of depth Aliens had. In addition to that, they're all, with the possible exception of Ripley, astoundingly stupid. I was actually rolling my eyes when the captain climbed into a tight vent with a shitty homemade flamethrower, alone, hoping to take out an unknown presence IN THE DARK that had already killed several crew members.

And as another said, it's better to have a sequel that actually takes the series in a new direction rather than the first movie repeated.

I've actually come to despise James Cameron, but I've never understood these accusations of 2D characters in Aliens. Most of the marines put on the facade of these shallow baddass, but that's quickly stripped away as the squad in slaughtered. Gorman goes from the whiny incompetent idiot to realizing how useless he is and eventually saving people. It isn't a drama, so there's not a ton of characterization, but it's certainly there.

 

[Dr.Awkward]

There are those who would call Aliens the "magnum opus" of the series, yet it could be argued that the word "magnum opus" is a self-condemnation for furthering a series. In fact, many series in gaming could be seen the same way - Ocarina of Time is seen as the magnum opus of the Zelda series, Super Metroid is the magnum opus of the Metroid series, Persona 4 is the magnum opus of the Persona series, just to name a few. Even worse is when the first game ends up being the magnum opus of the series like what we see with Deus Ex.

In a way, it wasn't Aliens' fault for "ruining" a series, it was the demand for a such a successful series (or product) to continue and to try outdoing itself. Once you achieve "magnum opus" stage, there's no doubt it will affect morale and the quality of later products. Yet it's hard to resist the urging of fans and their money...

 

[loa]

Aliens is one of THE most iconic sci fi movies, now deeply rooted in our pop culture.
It is ridiculous to assume the choices made did anything close to "ruining the franchise".

 

[BrotherRool]

Alien didn't have a franchise to ruin. Where could you have gone with that story? 'Alien, but in SPACE!' 5 films about a lone alien running around a cramped environment would have gotten as old as all the other horror films with a bajillion sequels got. James Cameron took it in the only direction which had any life at all instead of being a rehash, and that direction might not have spawned any truly great sequels, but it did inspire other filmmakers and create some truly brilliant games.

Besides, Aliens is absolutely not brain-dead, and whilst it may not be so complex cinematography, it has as much if not more relationship drama. And it makes a much more interesting case in terms of how androids would affect our lives than the normal frankenstein plot of Alien (a plot which Ridley Scott did yet again in Prometheus) . Most of the time in Alien is spent with half the crew dead and people walking round a dark area in typical slasher fic fashion. It was a truly great film, but so was Aliens

 

[SonOfVoorhees]

But Alien on its own isnt a franchise, so how could Aliens ruin it? Its a sequel.....which even then it takes more than 2 movies to be deemed a franchise. What ruined the franchise was the producers inability to be original and also to think that they had to add Ripley into every movie. Thats what ruined it, lack of creativity to tell a new story.

 

[SouthpawFencer]

I very much enjoyed both movies, for different reasons. Alien was certainly scarier, but I feel that James Cameron was wise to not simply rehash the first movie. In taking the second movie in the direction that he did, he played to his own strengths (good action sequences and special effects that STILL hold up quite well), rather than doing a poor man's imitation of Ridley Scott's style.

The franchise could have thrived in either direction, or thrived in BOTH directions, with followup movies either playing up the horror or action elements, depending on the script-writer and director.

What I believe killed the franchise was that Alien3 was a vastly inferior horror movie to Alien, Aliens vs. Predator 1 and 2 were vastly inferior action movies to Aliens, and Alien: Resurrection wasn't particularly competent at horror OR action.

 

[Drummodino]

Yea I don't agree with this. Sure Aliens was more of an action film than horror, but it was a damn good action film. I feel the characters have more depth than you're giving them credit for, they all had more personality than most modern action casts do.

What ruined the Alien franchise was milking the license as much as possible. That's what spawned the likes of AVP 2 and Colonial Marines, not a movie released over 30 years ago.

 

[CrescentCrux]

I honestly prefer Aliens to Alien but I despise the fourth, The third is a slight okay but the ending is ruined a bit with bishop lookalike return, and lets not talk about Prometheus albeit it is more about the forerunners then the aliens.

The marines lacking character? Some lack, some don't. Hudson is one of the more iconic goes from bad-ass "We got tools to slaughter everything" to "You are going to die, their going to die, and I'm going to die!" Hicks keeps the same attitude thought, but shows that he is willing to stand though the thick and thin for the rest of his team. Gorman actually changes a lot; initially he wants to be the man in charge lacking the real credentials to impress the marines it backfires quickly, After he wakes up from the concussions he begins to help out and in the end is willing to sacrifice himself with Vasquez to take down the approaching aliens when there is nothing left. Bishop doesn't change at all, but then if you realize that works because he acts as he is, an android, it makes sense.

I will agree that it was more of an action movie then the first; but it retains its horror roots, more so with the extended cut, by slowly bringing the viewers into the changed world from what we first envisioned with Alien. Things are more dire as the aliens have taken over every colonist but newt, the weapons technology helps little to the overwhelming odds to the obviously smart aliens who bypass security and fortified areas, stealth their way into areas they would not be expected in, and overwhelm the highly trained military force. They keep tension high as they foreshadow and allude viewers with melted floors, bottled face huggers, rooms left astray mid way though usage, and a desolate base ruined by fighting. When the marines enter the rebuilt hive not even Ripley realizes what is going on, as the aliens come out of hiding they approach with slow tension all around coming from every angle! Soon the acid for blood takes its tole on quite a few marines and a heavy retreat is needed along with Ripley to bring in their APC closer. Aliens was horror in a different light, but expanded the idea of the series to include a more structure to the aliens own society and how it might have worked. The end in the reactor with Ripley surrounded by eggs with aliens closing in and newt in her arms made many hearts thump in their chests.

In the first, alien, we do learn about some of the crew. The mechanics are close with each other but are very untamed and very childish, the android Ash hid himself very well from the crew and had ulterior motives clear cut to the companies wants, Captain Dallas is unsure of himself but willing to lead as he needs, Lambert when in a bind can not be relied upon and easily freaks out. The idea was that this is a crew who is trained to operate the machines they know well but in a situation beyond their control with a monster they can not comprehend they are slowly riddled away to nothing. A lone but smart survivor ends up ejecting the alien out a airlock and into the engines of a escape craft.


A different take to the tension, and a different side of the horror, both movies help the idea of the franchise build upon one idea: A unknown xenomorph alien species of overwhelming strength, stealth, speed, and cunning eaither alone or in large numbers and how much damage they could do.

 

[Right Hook]

Oh god, did it just become popular to hate on Aliens? After all that has been stolen from that film over the years? If this sequel didn't exist the first would be all but forgotten by this point. This argument doesn't hold water...with that said, I'd love to see a new Alien film that is made with a slower pace and gets back to the roots of the franchise.

 

[Therumancer]

I think you've got a lot of it wrong, starting with a very flawed premise. The thing is that arguably "Alien" should never have been turned into a franchise, it worked well as a specific, stand-alone story. "Alien" worked because it presented a specific setting, characters, and enemy, that could conceivably come together and play out a lot like you saw in the movie. Part of what made it believable and helped create the tension is that just as the characters were flawed, the alien itself wasn't so invincibly superpowered that things were a foregone conclusion which added to the tension as people went looking for it and so on. The way the alien dealt with the crew was as a result kind of fascinating, and while it was an alien, it was very similar to what a stealthy predator like a large cat might due to people under the right circumstances...

The thing is that outside of that specific scenario the "Alien" itself wasn't that threatening and that was kind of the point. You put it up against guys who are properly prepared and trained for dangerous situations, and it's a lot different. "Aliens" deserves points for being able to use largely the same material and tell a new story doing it. If you made a franchise simply based around what you saw in "Alien" it would turn into predictable seriel-horror, playing out the same way, again and again. Our "xenomorph" would become yet another creature picking off unprepared people using slight variations on the same set of tricks until people got really, really, bored with it. To be honest if someone had just made "Alien 2" and did it like the first movie, I doubt there would have been anything else in the franchise (comics, movies, novels, etc...).

As far as "deep" characters go, I'll add as a side note that I find it kind of annoying when people complain constantly about not having them in books and movies, especially when they do not belong, and might detract from the overall work. At the end of the day most people aren't all that deep, and when it comes to certain things like military squads, the whole point of being "military" is to sort of force everyone into a specific mould, that's what Boot Camp is for, to beat down individuality and build someone back up as a soldier (which is literally a tool). A bunch of marines on a combat drop are not going to be showcasing much in the way of deep sentiment, contemplating their navels philosophically, or whatever else. Veterans moving from hot spot to hot spot in particular are going to be very repressed emotionally since part of fighting a war is to put everything that is positive about humanity in some deep part of your mind and lock it up with a key while you run around being a monster... which incidently is why a lot of combat soldiers have trouble taking their humanity back out and being normal when they come home. On a lot of levels what makes a movie like "Aliens" work is that it sells the situation by having the marines act like... well... marines.

Not every story has to be deep to be good, and honestly attaching a lot of garbage onto things that don't need it has probably ruined as many, if not more, things than it's saved. Sure "Terminator" and "Aliens" were very simple stories at their heart, but I don't quite consider them "brain dead action fare" so much as they stayed pretty much on topic. Both movies also sold some pretty amazing concepts (robots, aliens, time travel, space ships) and got people thinking about those kinds of things, at a time when science fiction, fantasy, and things like video games, had nothing like the penetration that it does now. "Terminator" for example would not have benefitted from a digression where Reese spends 30 minutes of screen time trying to live out his secret fantasy of being a male ballet dancer now that he's in the past, just to prove how nuanced he is (awww, look, a hardened tough guy and demo expert, who secretly just wants to dance...).

Don't misunderstand the point here, deep characters who evolve are fine, but they don't always work, sometimes a movie is as much about the situation as it is about the people in it, if not more so. What's more, as I said earlier, not everyone is all that deep, even without training that serves to suppress individuality.

 

[SnakeoilSage]

I don't see the connection in your argument. Aliens was a distinct take and while there were flat characters who's only existence was to make for death-fodder, you did get as much a look into the character of the core group as you did for the Nostromo's crew. Hicks is the quiet, reserved marine who's professional and lets Apone do the barking. Hudson is the cocky thug who realizes he's in way over his head but learns to toughen up even though it doesn't save him. Vasquez is the tough girl in a boy's-club of soldiers, she got their respect by refusing to bend or be a nagging den-mother, and even when she's about to die she never loses that bravado. Even Gorman, unconscious for a good measure of the movie, has his moments where he goes from being an inexperienced lieutenant to a soldier ready to die for his men.

Consider Newt as a character. As a child, she's been forced to mature fast. She's had to face some pretty horrible stuff and you can see the memories flashing in her eyes when Ripley mentions her missing brother. Yet she's tough. She manages to have little-girl moments too, like putting on a marine helmet and flashing a salute. There's a lot of meaning in those actions that doesn't need more exposition to make her a well-rounded character. Her saying "mommy!" at the end of the movie is a huge moment.

Now compare this to characters like Kane, Dallas or Brent from the first movie. Kane wanted to explore, but that's all we really got out of him. Dallas was perpetually bored and annoyed at his own crew when he had to take command in any meaningful way. Brent said "Right" a lot. I don't see how these people were any more richly nuanced than the core cast of Aliens. Ripley herself was underdeveloped, a hard-nose about her job but otherwise no more distinct from her comrades. That's what made her survival so impressive because in a way it was like her name was picked out of a hat. She didn't have any great ideas, didn't know how to handle herself any better than the others. It was as much luck that got her out alive.

In a broader sense, I don't think Aliens ruined the franchise. I don't even think Alien 3 ruined it. Nothing truly ruins a franchise because as long as there's interest there are ways to bring it back to life. Aliens was a step in a different direction, but one I think was healthy.

Consider a similar franchise that was coming out at the same time: Jaws. The first is a classic, the grandfather of the summer blockbuster. Then Jaws Two came out, and it was the same movie. Same type of shark, same main character, same theme music. Then Jaws Three came out. Same movie. Same shark. By the time Jaws 4 came out, the love for the franchise had dried up. People don't talk about Jaws they way they talk about the Alien franchise.

Because there is variety. There is something for everyone to enjoy. Alien is a slasher-movie in space, but one with a lot of creativity and thought behind it. Aliens is an action-film in space, but again, one with lots of creativity and thought behind it. Both have survived the test of time in their own distinct ways.

Aliens killed the franchise? I say Aliens saved the franchise from death by repetition.

 

[Zykon TheLich_v1legacy]

Aliens didn't ruin a franchise, it created one, without Aliens you just have Alien, that cool horror film in space. It's not like Star Wars that actually has some sort of story to carry on, it's a slasher flick. Admittedly I'm not much of a horror fan but I can't really think of a horror film series that's kept on giving us decent quality films and hasn't changed things a fair bit.

EDIT: Huh...seems like the previous 2 posts put it far more eloquently than me.