Fantastic?
- Thread starter MovieBob
- Start date
I imagine the whole 'going in an opposite direction' the new FF films are doing is a response from the Tim Story films nearly a decade ago; the films were considered too goofy and too silly, so the producers made it more serious.
A Batman Begins for a Batman & Robin. A Fant4stic Four for the 2005 movie.
A Batman Begins for a Batman & Robin. A Fant4stic Four for the 2005 movie.
"But now is the age of the Marvel Cinematic Universe, where heroes and their stories arriving onscreen looking like a live-action splash-page is now the expected norm."
Can we stop with this fallacy!
Thor in the comics has the helmet nearly all the time while in the Avengers and Dark world no helmet. Thor from the films could be an extra from any sword and sandal epic in look (what annoys me is they made the helmet then only used it for one scene).
Hawkeye, Falcon, Scarlet Witch and Quicksilver all look nothing like there comic counterparts hardly a live action version of a splash-page.
All the MCU gives us is CGI when it comes to real costumes there no different from Fox, Sony or WB in being afraid.
So far only 3 comic book super heroes get proper real costumes Superman, Spiderman and Captain America.
Can we stop with this fallacy!
Thor in the comics has the helmet nearly all the time while in the Avengers and Dark world no helmet. Thor from the films could be an extra from any sword and sandal epic in look (what annoys me is they made the helmet then only used it for one scene).
Hawkeye, Falcon, Scarlet Witch and Quicksilver all look nothing like there comic counterparts hardly a live action version of a splash-page.
All the MCU gives us is CGI when it comes to real costumes there no different from Fox, Sony or WB in being afraid.
So far only 3 comic book super heroes get proper real costumes Superman, Spiderman and Captain America.
I'm veeeery interested in seeing how this turns out, but my interest has nothing to do with any investment in the characters or the license or anything to do with the artistic content. If it's bad, reconstructing the trail of behind-the-scenes events leading to it being bad will be a fascinating intellectual exercise, just like when Lone Ranger bombed. If it's good, that will somehow be even more improbable given how ashamed the studio appears to be of this thing.
If it was just the Marvel/Disney movies going superhero costumes it would be one thing. But now the Flash on CW is going superhero costumes on TV. Heck Green Arrow even got his mask after it seemed that viewers wanted comic book stuff not "realism".
Ultimate Fantastic Four also seems to get thrown around a bit with the trailer. Well that's just a brilliant idea take a comic book that most people haven't read and base things around that. People don't think Ultimate Fantastic Four when they think of the Fantastic Four they think of one of the great past ages of comic books, the cartoons that the Fantastic Four showed up in, or even the parodies like on The Venture Brothers.
Yea I just can't see this film burning up the box office with the now film cliche of let's put all the heroes in black uniforms like that X-Men movie. After films like Man of Steel got beaten up for being too dark and gloomy while Guardians got praised for bringing the fun back to movies I just don't see a huge demand for dark gritty no fun Fantastic Four.
Ultimate Fantastic Four also seems to get thrown around a bit with the trailer. Well that's just a brilliant idea take a comic book that most people haven't read and base things around that. People don't think Ultimate Fantastic Four when they think of the Fantastic Four they think of one of the great past ages of comic books, the cartoons that the Fantastic Four showed up in, or even the parodies like on The Venture Brothers.
Yea I just can't see this film burning up the box office with the now film cliche of let's put all the heroes in black uniforms like that X-Men movie. After films like Man of Steel got beaten up for being too dark and gloomy while Guardians got praised for bringing the fun back to movies I just don't see a huge demand for dark gritty no fun Fantastic Four.
I can't speak for Bob, but I get the impression you took that painfully literally, going from the examples you cited. Plus, the examples you cited weren't very good...P-89 Scorpion said:
Quite - he looks just like Maximus in Gladiator. I think it's the Ultimate-esque design, red cape and magic armour that does it.
Hawkeye looks pretty nailed on to his Ultimate variations. As for Wanda? I think her Age Of Ultron design will just be her intro to the MCU as a villain. If she joins the Avengers down the line, will she have the same look? No one can say for sure right now, but I very much doubt it (classic Scarlet Witch on the bigscreen might look a bit goofy, though).
Ditto with Quicksilver on the intro-to-the-MCU idea, too. If he ends up in a dull black-ish suit, however, he'll look just like his Ultimate variant.
What do you mean by that?
As far as designs and adaptations of material go; Iron Man, War Machine, Black Widow, Hawkeye and Nick Fury, to name a few, would be added to that very incomplete list. To further underline Bob's point there's the Winter Soldier, who, for me at least, is one of the best renditions of a comicbook character ever seen. It's clear Marvel Studios do care about ties to the page, but they've shown from the off that they're mixing classic Marvel and Ultimate as well as adding in a twist here and there (visually speaking).
I don't really care about this 'Fant-4-stic' film, one way or t'other. I think that team - more than most other properties - deserves a pretty decent, faithful Silver Age version, however; something that embodied why the Fantastic Four were so important to comicbook culture. So in that context, I'd have certainly preferred a more page faithful iteration.
Sony and Fox can go die in a ditch somewhere as far as me and their Marvel flavoured box office sales go, so it'll be ages till I maybe get around to watching the film itself.
![jFr[e]ak93](https://eg-forums-escapist-data.nyc3.digitaloceanspaces.com/data/avatars/l/91/91030.jpg?1620781506){kind=avatar}
To be fair, those scenes with Quick Silver and Scarlet Witch are (imho) from the second act. They may have their costumes by the end of the film... or within a few films. We don't know yet.P-89 Scorpion said:
That being said, you are right. The characters aren't as comic book looking as people say they are.
Wait, what about Iron man? Because when I learned that many of the scenes were not CGI, I was pretty impressed.P-89 Scorpion said:
Sure, they make some changes here and there (there is even a cut scene in Thor about him being mocked for the helmet), but considering most costumes are hardly possible in real life, I think they make a pretty good job. Even in cases where they changed the costumes, their personalities and core appeal were pretty much unaltered (except for the recent Guardians movie, but I like that version better than the comics anyway).
Or, just to drive the point home, a quote from one of the "competition": What did you expect, yellow spandex?
To quote from some source material (Scott Summers): "Sorry, Logan. Superheroes wear costumes. And quite frankly, all the black leather is making people nervous". Is anyone happy with Fox's awful X-Men designs so far?hermes200 said:
Darth Rosenberg said:
Just think how better it would be if Sony and Fox never bought the film rights. Marvel would have gone bankrupt again and disappeared into history with only the Blade films to show for it.
Disney only buys things once they have shown they can be profitable it was the original X-men and Spiderman trilogy's that showed it yet now it's we wish they never happened by 'censored'.
Everybody pretty much thought they were awesome and a fair compromise, and the aforementioned 'yellow spandex' line was loved and quoted as one of the best jokes from the movie.Darth Rosenberg said:
Really? Because I remember when that first xman film came out, while people thought it was good many many people did not like black outfits.Windknight said:
I do wonder why its not called "Ultimate Fantastic Four" instead of "Fantastic Four". It is funny that they made this movie based on a comic that soon wont exist now they are destroying the Ultimate universe. I think the gritty dark can work for some movies, but it doesnt work for all. You can tell darker stories without the direction being dark, look at Cap America 2 for that. Personally it works for Batman as he is all about the shadows.
I guess we do need to wait for a better trailer as there could be more lighter content and some fun banter. Though this movie might suck as a FF movie. But given the chance it might be a good movie on its own account - just like the Evil Dead remake.
I guess we do need to wait for a better trailer as there could be more lighter content and some fun banter. Though this movie might suck as a FF movie. But given the chance it might be a good movie on its own account - just like the Evil Dead remake.
I agree. Can't we just focus if the FILM is any good, and if it isn't, then gripe about the costumes? Because otherwise, those complaints Rosenburg made are...well, nitpicks. I want these movies to good. Not because I have a strong connection to the source material, but because A. I have some idea as to how "the first family of comics" is supposed to be, (I want to give Trank a chance here, but in the deeper parts of my mind, I'm hoping this bombs; so Marvel can take it back, and make a proper movie. If I may quote a movie that many people like: "Why so serious?") and B. I'd like to enjoy myself if I go to see this. I'm all for realism, but at some point, I want them to remember just how silly the premise IS, and not to take itself so seriously. (It's part of the reason I'm glad Micheal B. Jordan is in this, he might deliver some much needed levity to it.) If it's like Chronicle, then I'm fine with that, but remember what the movie was about.Windknight said:
And just what percentage of the people who watched Guardians of the Galaxy do you think had read a Guardians comic before they saw the movie? Hell, what percentage of people who watched Dark Knight had read a Batman comic?Ashley Blalock said:
Comic book readers are a very small minority of the population these days. I don't think it's worth caring that much about divisions between books that are more or less popular when probably 80%+ of the audience won't have read even the most popular comic book. 25,000 people [http://www.comichron.com/monthlycomicssales/2014/2014-12.html] bought a physical copy of a Fantastic 4 comic last month. Even if we assume that ten times that many regular readers and they just share copies and none of them read Ultimate Fantastic Four, and all of them are going to go see this movie, if they're a majority of the audience the movie is a flop no matter what they think.
If you're relying an audience who mostly haven't read any version of the material, you may as well go with the version you think will work best, even if it's not the most popular version.
I'll just leave these here...
(that one they did for me)
I'll give you Hawkeye, I think MovieBob himself put it best by saying "he looks oddly underdressed compared to everyone else."
Adi Granov is the artist that does the concepts for a lot of the movie costumes, and he also does covers for some of Marvel's comcics which is why there are some very striking similarities.
This is his Scarlet Witch....
And you can see his Quicksilver here
(that one they did for me)
I'll give you Hawkeye, I think MovieBob himself put it best by saying "he looks oddly underdressed compared to everyone else."
Adi Granov is the artist that does the concepts for a lot of the movie costumes, and he also does covers for some of Marvel's comcics which is why there are some very striking similarities.
This is his Scarlet Witch....
And you can see his Quicksilver here
I very much disagree with this article. Fantastic Four has always been timelocked in the much more scientifically optimistic and speculatively simple sixties. We live in an age where we're more impacted by the scope of all we don't know and how truly much there is to learn AND by how easily we can go astray by assuming that we 'already know enough.' All that in mind, the FF almost HAS to be rebooted for the era (not the least of which the fact that its primary characters have never emotionally developed past the sixties. Even their 60s-era colloquialisms have been taunted in meta-jokes throughout even the comics). Furthermore, to assume that it's not possible for these characters to arc over the course of the movie to something more recognizable (or to assume that ALL of the information about this movie can be gleaned from an incredibly vague teaser) seems a bit willfully ignorant.
To be clear, MASSIVE respect for Moviebob and his opinions, and I myself would certainly like to see FF revert back to Marvel, but at the same time, this seems to be a fresh take for a series that, in all honesty, I've never truly understood outside of Galactus.
To be clear, MASSIVE respect for Moviebob and his opinions, and I myself would certainly like to see FF revert back to Marvel, but at the same time, this seems to be a fresh take for a series that, in all honesty, I've never truly understood outside of Galactus.
Wait, who's that guy who looks like just some dude? The one who would look like he's trying to photobomb if it wasn't for the stuff orbiting around his head.