138: You're Not Allowed To Do That.

jezcentral

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Nov 6, 2007
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Thsi doesn't just apply to videogames. I remember creating loads of rules that existed for years (or just an afternoon), when playing various games as a child. From "War" (running around with guns yelling "Ah-Ah-Ah-Ah! You're dead!" "No, I'm not!" "Yes you are, I shot you in the back. You have to lie down dead and count to 30" "Oh, alright then...") to "Space War" on the Atari 2600 ("You're not allowed to wait until I've shot all my ammo before firing back") to breaking up a fight that was getting to close to a low wall or step, and restarting it further away in a safer area in the exact position as it had been before the break, to playing Co-op games whilst sharing kills and loot.

It's all part of the growing up to be (relatively) well adjusted members of society. :D
 

incoherent

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May 7, 2007
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Echolocating said:
Alan Au said:
Have you read Sirlin's Playing to Win [http://www.sirlin.net/ptw/]?

Basically, he posits that there's a difference between "playing to win" and "playing for fun," and that players should be conscious about why they choose to adhere to specific sets of rules. There is of course the subtext of how players end up compensating for poor design decisions, where a game sometimes isn't fun as implemented (due to exploits, unbalanced characters, etc.)
After reading through the first page of the article, "Playing to Win" popped into my mind as well. Actually, I'm surprised that Sirlin's site isn't listed on the Recommended Sites section. He definitely has some great articles... always analyzing and never leaving well enough alone. ;-)
I definitely thought of Playing to Win when I saw this article: people making house rules because the disallowed behaviors are "cheap". Granted, that's the only thing of Sirlin's I've ever read, and his premise that you should allow everything sort of falls apart when he recognizes that there are some "cheap" things in games that CAN'T be countered. But if you've never seen it it's a nice read.
 

Sylocat

Sci-Fi & Shakespeare
Nov 13, 2007
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My friends and I went the opposite route: We ALL played Oddjob. It provided interesting situations in levels with height.

Which reminds me (slightly off topic), I never understood why they made Oddjob so short anyway, Oddjob was only marginally shorter than Bond. It was Nick Nack who was the midget, why didn't they make him the short character?
 

Jindrak

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Jan 11, 2008
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*clap clap*
All the N64 rules were basically in the article, though drunk fraternity nights of my brother's friends are STILL spent playing Mario Kart 64 and shouting at unreasonable volumes.

The servers I play on in Counter Strike: Source have developed their own etiquette. If you're winning by 10, drop the AWP, AutoSnipe, and Para. If you have been tracking someone for half the map, put away the knife and shoot them. If someone continues to abuse frequent camping positions, find the most humiliating way possible to end it (de_tides, their is a ledge above the entrance to bombsite A which I could frequently reach before they could get out of the entrance, it ended with me being knifed.)
 

wilsonscrazybed

thinking about your ugly face
Dec 16, 2007
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Sorry if this is a bit off topic but I am just wondering about the modeling talent. Normally you guys use in stock pictures and in game footage. Do you hire out to a talent agency or are the models someone on staff's relatives? Also does your photographer have a website?
 

Darkong

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That sounds a lot like my Uni house is at the mo. Here Smash Bros Melee and Guitar Hero 2/3 dominate the games, even the girls in the house are getting into it, one of them has become a little too adapt with Pikachu for my liking (damn rat!).
 

UncleNic

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Mar 2, 2008
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jezcentral said:
This doesn't just apply to videogames...
Absolutely - although I remember well in my first week at University (in 1979) discovering the unspoken rule about the Space Invaders machine: if you wanted a game at lunchtime, you put your 10p on the top in a little queue with everyone else. And you had to wait an eternity for the queue to start moving, because there was always the expert player who managed to rack up a massive score one-handed, whilst drinking his pint AND eating his bar meal...

But outside video games there are many other examples, such as commonly-known 'house rules' in Monopoly (land on Free Parking to get the kitty of fines & taxes; land on 'Go' to double the payout from 200 to 400). Beyond games altogether there are 'accepted behaviours' which avoid landing you in trouble - don't talk to people in a lift (in the UK, at least!); don't look down at other people in the toilets...

All of these (and Richard's observations in his article) help make up a society. Some people get ahead by not conforming, but end up ostracised by those who just "know what's right".

Nic
PS - My username is accurate - I really am Richard's uncle...
 

JohnH

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Jul 31, 2007
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The root of the "No Oddjobs" class of house rules is an attempt to keep more of the options of a game open to players by outlawing some playstyles that make some decisions obviously bad.

Oddjob, because of his height, is the only Goldeneye character with a play advantage. His existence, alone, makes character selection into a strategic choice. If players are playing to win, Sirlin-style, then they will choose Oddjob, full stop. It would make no sense to pick anyone else, of the many characters included. Since a big part of the fun of Goldeneye is shooting each other up with James Bond characters, this would make the game considerably less entertaining for most people, hence the rule. It is relatively easy to enforce, too: if someone selects Obbjob from the selection screen, then it has been broken.

The test I use is follows: if a given strategy is so effective that everyone who uses it wins, then it is not really a strategy. It is to be assumed that players will choose it. If it is not outlawed, it makes the choice not to use it inviable. If the intent of the designers of the game is that people make this decision then fine, but if it is not then this is a game-breaking problem and a house rule should be formulated to restrict it.

Similar is the case where there is a tactic that always produces wins, or even a considerable advantage to winning, that some players can perform but not others. Snaking in Mario Kart games requires lots of practice to pull off consistently, with "lots" meaning many hours of doing nothing but learning to snake. Players who can snake well may object, but the fact is that Mario Kart is still obviously intended to be a racing game, not a snaking game. (Lots of people don't even -want- to play a snaking game.)

This is a problem that I have with Sirlin's Playing To Win, it assumes there are no game-breaking exploits. In a game like Street Fighter II, which has been extensively tested to remove game-breaking exploits, then this kind of all-out approach makes sense. For a fighting game, where movement is along a single line and player positions and speeds really cannot vary too tremendously, this is a lot easier to do than in a fully 3D game in which velocity vectors can potentially, once in a great while, cause the player to miss clipping walls or send him over obstacles.
 

NoPantsMan

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Oct 31, 2007
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I'd agree with this article. Mario kart 64 brought my family closer together than Dr. Mario had, and even closer to my father as that was the only video game he ever got into. And as much as I like to chastise the Halo series, it really built and maintained my friendship with my best friend after we got tired of Perfect Dark and Smash brothers on the 64.

Well some gaming cultures are great places for creating and building friendship, especially through coop mode when possible, some can be really snobbish though, especially fanboy cultures that hog the controls, criticize games you like, and enjoy playing one or two player games, especially fighting games that you're not experienced in where they constantly eject the loser.

Anyway, I think a game company out there should really focus on making a really good, totally devoted coop game. Extra points if they don't require that you play with someone online and can develop a really good split screen system like Rockstar games did for Warriors.
 

Agent Larkin

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Apr 6, 2009
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I thought it was Nick-Nak how was the midget. Bare in mind I haven't played Goldeneye in a while but I do know a lot about the movies and Oddjob was a very tall guy while Nick-Nak was a midget.
 

Little Duck

Diving Space Muffin
Oct 22, 2009
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That is so true. We had a no shelling rule on wario ware on the big jump, no oddjobs in goldeneye, you name it, we have it. Even today, castle crashers, no potions in fights for the princess. Everyone knows them rules. We keep to them religiously.