Asylum of the Daleks
A Doctor Who discussion for longtime fans and newbies, too!
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A Doctor Who discussion for longtime fans and newbies, too!
Read Full Article
Asylum of the Daleks
- Thread starter Susan Arendt
- Start date
My biggest gripe with the episode... well at least the first part of it... a Zombie Episode with Daleks is still just a Zombie Episode, nice try Dr. Who writing team.
Though I did love the Oswin plot twist at the end, it was particularly interesting and creepy.
Though I did love the Oswin plot twist at the end, it was particularly interesting and creepy.
I thought that was more because the Doctor-Donna screwed with the reality bomb and the Supreme Dalek blamed Davros despite his protests that the Doctor did it.
Yeah Oswin was a genius and that's why she was turned into a Dalek, but 80% of the things she does in the Asylum are based around her being able to be able to control Dalek-tech, which we discover she is only able to do because she is connected to the Daleks by being one. She may be smart but so was Captain Jack. The Doctor is definitely smart but he also seems so much smarter compared to the humans he picks up that know jack-squat about science or time travel. He's shown before that he dislikes anyone whose intellect rivals his own (Jack, River, the Master because he is as smart as him and that intelligence is used against him) but 21st century humans are so ignorant to the wider universe that he can lord it over them with what he knows because he can show off!
I liked the Doctor's pure fear at being trapped against the Daleks. He may have beaten them at nearly every turn but they can still kill him when he is unprepared.
I think the "Doctor Who?" question is an interesting one. Moffat talked pre-series 6 saying that there was something in the show that "had always been there" that would be shown to shape and/or change the Doctor's life. There's no way they'll end this story arc quickly, we still haven't had answers to the end of series 5[footnote]Who controlled the TARDIS? Why did it explode at that specific date? What was the being who destroyed the TARDIS hoping to achieve? etc[/footnote] yet and it's been 2 years! This is a much bigger question that has been teased throughout the entire history of the show and I don't see being given a one line answer any time soon.
Was the whole Oswin thing really a "twist" though?
Not to sound like one of those "Pfft, I figured that out right away" kinda guys but the Doctor's questions, Oswin's vague as hell answers to said questions, the dalek-guy at saying he forgot that he died or something like that and the fact that Oswin seemed to have total control over the facility really made it obvious that she'd be a Dalek. Although I'll concede that I expected her to be a human/dalek thingy rather than a full blown Dalek.
I also think that they tried to do too much with Rory and Amy in the one episode. They went from "Getting divorced" to "Rory still loves Amy" to "Amy still loves Rory too" to "Amy can't have babies which is why she left" to "We're back together again" in the space of what, 30 minutes? Maybe it's just me but it felt like a rushed solution.
Not to say I didn't like the episode. Basically, if I didn't bring it up in this post then I loved it.
Oh, and as much as Matt Smith is my favourite Doctor of the new series, the man just can't pull off "Tough Doctor". I happen to think he does a very good "Angry Doctor" but that whole "Who do you think?" line had me cringing a little bit.
Not to sound like one of those "Pfft, I figured that out right away" kinda guys but the Doctor's questions, Oswin's vague as hell answers to said questions, the dalek-guy at saying he forgot that he died or something like that and the fact that Oswin seemed to have total control over the facility really made it obvious that she'd be a Dalek. Although I'll concede that I expected her to be a human/dalek thingy rather than a full blown Dalek.
I also think that they tried to do too much with Rory and Amy in the one episode. They went from "Getting divorced" to "Rory still loves Amy" to "Amy still loves Rory too" to "Amy can't have babies which is why she left" to "We're back together again" in the space of what, 30 minutes? Maybe it's just me but it felt like a rushed solution.
Not to say I didn't like the episode. Basically, if I didn't bring it up in this post then I loved it.
Oh, and as much as Matt Smith is my favourite Doctor of the new series, the man just can't pull off "Tough Doctor". I happen to think he does a very good "Angry Doctor" but that whole "Who do you think?" line had me cringing a little bit.
Unlike some of the people in the comments above me, I actually didn't really like the whole "Doctor Who?" line. I didn't mind it in last season's finale; for me, that worked because it seemed to be a one-off thing, implying that "The Question" was related to who the doctor is/was. If Moffatt is planning on making that line a central theme of the season, I will be sad indeed.
It will be interesting to note *why* Oswin was locked up in the room. Was it because she was deemed more insane than all the others for refusing to acknowledge being a Dalek? If not, then why lock her up with all "Doctor-survivor" Daleks? Had she met the Doctor before getting changed, and if so, why didn't she remember him?
SO MANY QUESTIONS!
It will be interesting to note *why* Oswin was locked up in the room. Was it because she was deemed more insane than all the others for refusing to acknowledge being a Dalek? If not, then why lock her up with all "Doctor-survivor" Daleks? Had she met the Doctor before getting changed, and if so, why didn't she remember him?
SO MANY QUESTIONS!
Of course, none of the Daleks threatening the Doctor at Oswin's door had blasters, so what was there to be scared of? That bugged me rather a lot.
I would assume it was, as you said, because while she is a genius and thus good Dalek material, she refused to give up her humanity.Wilcroft said:
I think the bigger question is how is the Doctor going to save Oswin when she becomes his companion without screwing with what she did to the Daleks. Oswin said herself that the Daleks have grown stronger in fear of the Doctor, so it's not just his own security against the Daleks the the Doctor would sacrifice by saving Oswin pre-Alaska but the entire universe. While the Daleks may still advance and exterminate, they won't do it to combat the Doctor directly, unless saving Oswin resets what she did, which would be a pointless waste of an episode and an Intersting universe shift she created.
I'm a huge fan of the Classic Series (owning a considerable collection), and I loved the New Series up until Moffat took up the reigns of showrunner; although Series 5 did have redeeming features. It probably won't surprise anyone to say I think this episode sucked hard. It's just another example of the populist takeover and pandering to idiots that the show seems to enjoy so much these days.
I'd talk about the huge plotholes, the boring and unlike-able characters, the raping of lore, and the odious Dalek lady if I had more time and were less tired. That isn't currently the case, though. But I will name my biggest grievance; I'm sick of all the female companions being sassy, pretty, intelligent and young. Amy and Oswin are just annoying bitchy/quirky archetypes that aren't really interesting; more annoying in that they try to act smarter than the Doctor.
I'd talk about the huge plotholes, the boring and unlike-able characters, the raping of lore, and the odious Dalek lady if I had more time and were less tired. That isn't currently the case, though. But I will name my biggest grievance; I'm sick of all the female companions being sassy, pretty, intelligent and young. Amy and Oswin are just annoying bitchy/quirky archetypes that aren't really interesting; more annoying in that they try to act smarter than the Doctor.
I think it's hasty to assume that it is Oswin, per se, who becomes the companion, and not just the actress playing someone else. When we saw Lalla Ward, for example, she wasn't Romana.TimeLord said:
The lone defenceless Dalek in 'Dalek' suffocated its torturer to death with it's plunger arm and the Cult of Skaro used it to drain the life and memories out of the scientist in Torchwood tower.Susan Arendt said:
Also you've got this iconic image of the Daleks. Maybe Moffat was paying homage to it?
Hmm...perhaps. Though it's worth noting that The Doctor has dodged past Daleks by putting his hat on their eyestalk, too. Bit weaksauce, is all I'm saying.TimeLord said:The lone defenceless Dalek in 'Dalek' suffocated its torturer to death with it's plunger arm and the Cult of Skaro used it to drain the life and memories out of the scientist in Torchwood tower.Susan Arendt said:
Also you've got this iconic image of the Daleks. Maybe Moffat was paying homage to it?
True and Karen Gillan played a bit part in 'Fires of Pompeii' before becoming the companion. But that was years apart and it's literally 3 months until the Doctor gets a new companion. It wouldn't make sense to me to use the same actor for two quite large parts in the same series. But then again who knows what goes through Moffat's mind!Susan Arendt said:
I enjoyed the "it is offensive to us" spiel from the Daleks about destroying 'beautiful' objects of such hatred (not as a personal concept, just as a further addition to the Daleks' character). I'm not a fan of the slide in depiction from total warrior race to Saturday morning cartoon villians, so something that gave them a bit more venom was appreciated.
The killer-line of the episode was "Perhaps that is why we have never been able to kill you." directed at the Doctor...and then it was just left hanging there, what was with that?
The killer-line of the episode was "Perhaps that is why we have never been able to kill you." directed at the Doctor...and then it was just left hanging there, what was with that?
You can add Freema Agyeman to the whole 'in Doctor Who before playing a companion character' list too.TimeLord said:
I think what we are all forgetting is that the SPECIAL WEAPONS DALEK showed up for a second, and that's awesome.
http://www.kasterborous.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2010/dw-sn25-rembrance-swd.jpg
As for the episode itself, I really enjoyed it. It really felt like an old school episode, you know? Doctor gets roped into doing something, has to "fight" through a load of Daleks, then does. Simple.
http://www.kasterborous.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2010/dw-sn25-rembrance-swd.jpg
As for the episode itself, I really enjoyed it. It really felt like an old school episode, you know? Doctor gets roped into doing something, has to "fight" through a load of Daleks, then does. Simple.
Now, be fair. Lalla Ward was literally Princess Astra in one episode and Romana in the next.TimeLord said:
They didn't want to destroy such "exquisite hatred" as they saw in the failed Daleks, they were implying that they saw something similar in The Doctor... which is of course horrifying to him.IndianaJonny said:
I know! A punchy line with such weighty implications and the episode just seemed to..glaze over it and carry on - my reaction was very much in the "Wait up, he just said WHAT?!" camp.PedroSteckecilo said:
This is one cool compendium you've got here. I am genuinely impressed might make this a regular friday evening/saturday morning read to refresh myself for the new episode.
With regards to the episode, I saw the twist coming (because I'm awesome like that) but when he asked where she got the milk from... well, I had already come up with a reasonable but unpalatable solution to that. The real question was where did the eggs come from?
Also OMG! The question has been asked... I await the fall of the eleventh... though we all know that won't happen.
With regards to the episode, I saw the twist coming (because I'm awesome like that) but when he asked where she got the milk from... well, I had already come up with a reasonable but unpalatable solution to that. The real question was where did the eggs come from?
Also OMG! The question has been asked... I await the fall of the eleventh... though we all know that won't happen.