270: A Knife to a Gun Fight

[Brett Staebell]

A Knife to a Gun Fight

It seems incongruous that so many multiplayer shooter matches can devolve into fisticuffs, but Brett Staebell proves that strong melee weapons actually make shooting more important.

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[GothmogII]

This may be going off point, but, the melee weapons are a big reason I love Team Fortress 2, as they're not only handy back-ups to your main arsenal, but beyond the standard melee weapons you start off with, all of the unlockable melee weapons have abilities on them that ensure they aren't simply a last resort when your ammo is gone. And some, like the Demoman's 'Eyelander' and 'Scotsman's Skullcutter' the former a broadsword that grants you increased speed via decapitation of your enemies, and the latter a massively powerful albeit slow and heavy battleaxe are designed to be used as primary weapons.

Yet many as you say, still hold on to that sense of superiority of gutting an opponent with ostensibly a weaker or more difficult to use weapon that requires you to be up close and personal. And with TF2, with many of the classes actually being slower than others, a melee kill is even more satisfying, like get a killing blow on a Scout with a Heavy using his fists, glorious!

 

[Jezzascmezza]

Melee combat is fun, but when you look at a game like MW2, you realize that it's starting to get a little out of control.

 

[Kollega]

"No matter how over-the-top the ranged attack, it simply can't hold a candle to being inches from your enemy's face as he expires. Letting enemies into the player's personal space gets a reaction like no machine gun can."

I have to disagree with this here. A well-realized Gatling gun or a flamethrower can be just as visceral as smashing your enemy's face in - if not more so. It's too bad they rarely pop up in multiplayer because of "OMG balance".

And yeah, i'd say that melee weapons have gotten slightly out of hand: "insta-kill" is simply way too much for an emergency weapon, especially considering how cramped maps are in MW2.

 

[coldfrog]

Truly Halo was the first shooter to specifically have a melee button? I must admit I'm not a huge multiplayer shooter fan, but that's an interesting bit of trivia. Having not been in the loop of the game, I'm finding several articles giving me more appreciation for just what Halo meant to that world of gaming.

I will say, though, that the best thing to do was whip out a knife in Counter-Strike and run like hell!

 

[jamesworkshop]

I think part of the problem is play style it seems to me that sniper rifles are the only weapons that gets used as a ranged weapon.

Sure sometimes you turn a corner and get a knife in the face but mostly I see people with semi-automatic rifles charging headfirst towards an enemy across the open to fire at point blank range.
It's not a balance issue most people just can't aim

Don't change your play style complain about others taking advantage of your mistakes

 

[BlindTom]

This made me think that they should make a multiplayer shooter using shields similar to those in Dune. Anyone who has nipped in and out of a bubble shield in Halo will know how I'm seeing this. Melee becomes a drawn out affair and whilst a specialist will still likely win the fight. Somebody who knows how to use their shield will be able to stall them long enough for an ally to help.

 

[Iron Mal]

I personally dislike the use of a one-hit kill melee button, in my opinion it reduces close range encounters to being a race to press the mystical 'save me' button before the other guy does.

People panic at close range? Good. This rewards the players who are prepared for close combat (namely those who's playstyle is based around it, such as myself) and punishes those who require a sense of saftey at long distance, the weakness of snipers was always supposed to be how helpless they are at close range, by giving them an easy way out it undermines this, you don't see shotgun players being given mortars in case they find themselves pinned down by a sniper so why should snipers have a close range failsafe?

This is one of the reasons I liked Rainbow Six: Vegas, there was no melee button (there was plenty of long range and mid range fights, but close range was very clearly dominated by SMGs and shotguns), if you panic because someone appears in front of you, you die for it and that is something you will have to learn to adapt to, you keep calm and respond appropriately and you have a fair chance of effectively defending yourself with no stabbing or auto-aim lunging required.

 

[Layz92]

I don't mind the melee of games like TF2 and CSS but MW2 can go die. Insta-kill is just rediculous. High damage I get (after all getting a blade impaled through your chest would sting a little), but when melee becomes "who can press thumbstick faster" it becomes a joke... an annoying joke.

 

[Daveman]

I think instakill melee is fair enough. The whole point of it is to teach you to be aware of what's going on around you and not to put yourself in a position where you can easily be stabbed. The thing with modern warfare 2 is that ALL the weapons are powerful. Snipers can easily be 1 shot kills, rapid fire assault rifles are 2 or three shot kills guarunteed with stopping power on, guns still beat knives in almost all cases unless you weren't expecting to get knifed. The main advantage of the knife I find is that it's silent, so you don't show up as a blip on the radar, if it weren't for that I'd just shoot them.

 

[Darth IB]

FEAR comes to mind, the only FPS where I really got into the multi-player business.
Oh, how fun the instant-kill jump kicks were. If you were the kicker, that is.
If used more than very rarely, melee quickly became something you hated everyone for using, or that everyone hated you for using.
So I would only do it to people I knew, and only if I happened to sneak up behind them. Because then it was still fun, and thus acceptable.

 

[Xombiebubble]

It's like the gauntlet from Quake 3. Damn near impossible to land a hit on a human target but a few good hits and they are down.

It's an essential when dealing with rail-gun snipers

 

[Iron Mal]

I think instakill melee is fair enough. The whole point of it is to teach you to be aware of what's going on around you and not to put yourself in a position where you can easily be stabbed. The thing with modern warfare 2 is that ALL the weapons are powerful. Snipers can easily be 1 shot kills, rapid fire assault rifles are 2 or three shot kills guarunteed with stopping power on, guns still beat knives in almost all cases unless you weren't expecting to get knifed. The main advantage of the knife I find is that it's silent, so you don't show up as a blip on the radar, if it weren't for that I'd just shoot them.

That's easy to say when looking at gameplay on paper but when you're actually playing you'll often notice that you'll notice a lot of times that you'll be shooting someone in the torso with a light machine gun yet they will still charge foward and rip your face off in a single fell swoop, this isn't just when people aren't expecting it, it usually happens because as powerful as guns are, they often don't kill fast enough to deny the Khorne Berserker other player an oppertunity to get their instant kill (or the knife player simply moves too fast for the player to even get a shot off, this can be particularly bad if there is lag).

 

[Outright Villainy]

This may be going off point, but, the melee weapons are a big reason I love Team Fortress 2, as they're not only handy back-ups to your main arsenal, but beyond the standard melee weapons you start off with, all of the unlockable melee weapons have abilities on them that ensure they aren't simply a last resort when your ammo is gone. And some, like the Demoman's 'Eyelander' and 'Scotsman's Skullcutter' the former a broadsword that grants you increased speed via decapitation of your enemies, and the latter a massively powerful albeit slow and heavy battleaxe are designed to be used a primary weapons.

An even clearer case of this is the spy, an entire class based around getting as close as possible, and poking them instead of shooting. I think it distils the thrill of melee combat to it's purest essence, as a high risk, high reward mecahanic, knowing any moment if your distracted enemy turns around you're essentially defenceless.

I guess it take someone like Valve to make something so archaic as stabbing your gun toting foes seem subtle.

 

[WanderingFool]

I dont mind Melee, but intant kill is just stupid. Theres no way a knife and kill a soldier by just slashing them, you have to hit them in specific parts of the body to do so. I think melee should either be:
1) kept as a low damage attack used to strick and daze an enemy long enough for you to either waste his ass or put distance between the two of you, than waste his ass.
2) Be made its own weapon, so you have to select it and cant just press the magic "kill the fucker" button.
3) be made into a stealth weapon, like the TF2's spy's knife. (from what I understand) the knife is only best used on enemies who are not aware of you, i.e. backstab. Making the knife one-hit kill on an enemies back is alot more acceptible to me than the guy running up and slashing me and I die.
4) the Knife doesnt kill right away, but simply causes a bleeding effect that drains health for a short time, until you find a med-kit.
5) make the melee knife kill a long and tedious (and dangerous) affair. No quick slashing, instead when you use the knife, you have something similur to the Halo: Reach Assassination animation, which I beleive can actually be interrupted by someone else, saving the would be assassinated.

 

[The_ModeRazor]

BONK!
That's what I always said. Nothing more satysfying than sneaking up on and crit-hitting someone with the Heavy. Or Bonking them into oblivion. Or charging in with a medic and pwning 4 guys with the bonesaw.
Yay melee!

 

[Erick.S]

That's easy to say when looking at gameplay on paper but when you're actually playing you'll often notice that you'll notice a lot of times that you'll be shooting someone in the torso with a light machine gun yet they will still charge foward and rip your face off in a single fell swoop, this isn't just when people aren't expecting it, it usually happens because as powerful as guns are, they often don't kill fast enough to deny the Khorne Berserker other player an oppertunity to get their instant kill (or the knife player simply moves too fast for the player to even get a shot off, this can be particularly bad if there is lag).

Lol, great use of 'Khorne Berserker' there. I'm going to borrow that phrase, if you don't mind.
Knifing an unaware opponent in the back was always satisfying, but give me a break about these ridiculous tiger pounces through hails of bullets.

 

[Megacherv]

The extension of this is taunt killing in TF2. Getting a taunt kill without doing it on an acheivement server is a damn good acheivement.

 

[Not G. Ivingname]

Snip

A witch blade knifing class?

Care to share?