A DRM

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Paragon Fury

The Loud Shadow
Jan 23, 2009
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After the recent Ubisoft DRM debacle, I began thinking of what could be done about the issue. Most of it centered around how PC gamers are ignorant, selfish douches (Its true. Most of you have little understanding of law and IP ownership and they're workings from the way you react), but that is a long, angry rant, and not one I'm inclined to give right now. Obviously, some form of DRM has to be used - to suggest otherwise is insanity. Yet there is no need to totally sodomize the customer.



No DRM is uncrackable. This is true. But one can be made that slows pirates and hackers down, or a situation created wherein they make fools of themselve by making them look like they are taking advantage of a company trying to meet people halfway. So what to do to create this situation?

For purposes of this example, the game developers in question will be called Paragon Studioes and the game will be called War.


"With the release of their new game War coming soon, Paragon Studioes has finally released details about their new DRM scheme.

To start with, War can be downloaded or installed to an unlimited number of devices, in addition to not needing the disc to be in the tray after installation. In addition, using the new "Paragon Center" system, Paragon Studio's new central account management system, players can fairly effortlessly transfer their save games from one machine to another using the "Upload/Download" feature announced today, though a game save can only be downloaded to one machine at a time - in order to use it somewhere else, it must be uploaded to the server first, then downloaded at the new machine. This is in addition to the stat-tracking and other services the Paragon Center offers.


Of course, this is still a DRM system, so there is one hoop to jump through. Attempting to play War without officially purchasing it will cause players to find themselves quite unable to save the game. All installs and downloads of War will completely lack the nessacary parts to create a save-game.

Without a save-game, the players will only be able to access the first three levels of War, and a multiplayer demo on one map. Players will also not be able to download or use patches, DLC or any other official content.

In order to save the game, a player must have a legitmate Paragon Center account and Profile Code for that game. Each legitimate copy of War will come with 1 profile token, that can only be associated with 1 Paragon Center account. Upon activation, the system will automatically be promoted to download a unique save-game for that account, allowing full access to the game. Afterwards, a player only has to interact with the servers if they want DLC or updates. If a player wishes to have more than one profile per game, extra profile tokens will be avaliable at little charge (.50c to $1) for accounts that have a legitimate copy of the game registered to them. Those who download or borrow the game and then wish to play the full version for themselves can buy a full Profile Token from Paragon Studio's website at normal price.


Paragon Studioes hopes this will be a more effective DRM the other systems, and that the trade-off will be worth the minor inconvience.

"We really don't think its a bad trade. You can lend the game as a demo to anyone you like, and if you/they want the full game, all you have to do is pay, access the Internet for about 10 minutes one time, and then the game is yours forever. And paying for the game gets you a lot of things that you won't otherwise recieve. Obviously this is still going to irk some, but honestly, we can't please everyone, and we certainly can't be just throwing our work out into the winds unguarded."

War release Febuary 31st, 2012."
 

Henrik Persson

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Mar 14, 2010
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Obviously, some form of DRM has to be used - to suggest otherwise is insanity.
Why? What makes a game with DRM that's cracked before release any better than a game without DRM?
 

Paragon Fury

The Loud Shadow
Jan 23, 2009
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Henrik Persson said:
Obviously, some form of DRM has to be used - to suggest otherwise is insanity.
Why? What makes a game with DRM that's cracked before release any better than a game without DRM?
Because releasing something without making sure most people have to pay you in order to get it is insane.

It'd be like leaving doors to your Ferrai unlocked, keys sitting in the ignition, leaving on vacation, and then not expecting someone to take it.


Also, you execute tighter controls on the release, possibly making it so that physical copies are not distributed until after the digital version is released in order to cut down on the time hackers have to get at it.


Combine this with the stigma of "Hey, were giving you a lot for only $40 and 10 minutes of your time" so that pirates don't look like liberators, but rahter asses.
 

RhombusHatesYou

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Mar 21, 2010
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Henrik Persson said:
Why? What makes a game with DRM that's cracked before release any better than a game without DRM?
A publisher who puts out a game with 'adequate and reasonable attempts to protect their IP' is open to getting the fuck sued out of them by their investors/shareholders.

Admittedly, that doesn't make a game better or worse but it's one of the reasons although not often mentioned in the middle of flapping their arms madly and shouting "PIRATES!!!"
 

Poomanchu745

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Paragon Fury said:
Most of it centered around how PC gamers are ignorant, selfish douches (Its true. Most of you have little understanding of law and IP ownership and they're workings from the way you react), but that is a long, angry rant, and not one I'm inclined to give right now.
Ya...calling people douches is not usually a good way to start a argument. After that was said I really didn't care what you had to say as you called me a douche and I really don't appreciate that. Now because I am above that, I will not call you any names back and will move on with my life.
 

RhombusHatesYou

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Hopeless Bastard said:
RhomCo said:
Hopeless Bastard said:
Heres a solution: Move PC gaming to bluray, games at least 400gb.
That's what? 16-20 BR discs... They'd charge a fucking fortune for that.
http://www.engadget.com/2008/08/05/pioneer-finds-20-layer-500gb-blu-ray-disc-feasible/

Not to mention eating some of the costs associated would have them about breaking even with the money wasted on DRM.
Fair enough.

OTOH, what the hell would they fill all that data capacity with?
 

Poomanchu745

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Paragon Fury said:
Poomanchu745 said:
Paragon Fury said:
Most of it centered around how PC gamers are ignorant, selfish douches (Its true. Most of you have little understanding of law and IP ownership and they're workings from the way you react), but that is a long, angry rant, and not one I'm inclined to give right now.
Ya...calling people douches is not usually a good way to start a argument. After that was said I really didn't care what you had to say as you called me a douche and I really don't appreciate that. Now because I am above that I will not call you any names back and move on.
The problem is there is no arguement to be had.

PC gamers and pirates are simply wrong.

They have no moral/ethical high ground, no legal high ground, and no practical high ground.

They simply have a case of the "MEMEMEMEMEME!"s, and their constant heel dragging on the issue is pretty close to douchebaggery as you can get. And when you've listened to it for 10 damn years, and then see the childish outrage that erupts when a company decides its finally time to throwdown (albeit not with most effective opening move ever), I think douche is a rather nice term for it.

You can't act surprised when you act like something, or remain silent about something, and the get called that something, or something akin to it.
So basically all PC gamers are pirates and we have no morals? Wow that is called stereotyping and that is wrong due to the fact there are people like me who have NEVER pirated a game in our life. If it weren't for us you wouldn't have half the games you have today on console and gaming would most likely be nowhere near where it is today. Plus I got one question for you. When was the last time you pirated music or anything for that matter on the internet. Because I know plenty of console people that steal music like it's their job. So get off your pedestal and meet me back on earth...
 

RhombusHatesYou

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Paragon Fury said:
The problem is there is no arguement to be had.

PC gamers and pirates are simply wrong.

They have no moral/ethical high ground, no legal high ground, and no practical high ground.
Wait up... Why are PC gamers and pirates(yarrr) being lumped together like that?

As a PC gamer, I pretty much don't give a rat's arse about DRM as long as it's not a massive incovenience to me.

Publishers and Developers are free to try and protect their IP anyway they see fit but if I don't like the scheme, then sod them, they don't get my money. Of course, that also means I don't get access to their IP but life's like that if you're gonna take a stand on principles... but apparently I have an underdeveloped sense of entitlement.

Now if I'm gonna steal something I'm not gonna steal it because of some high minded ideals. No, I'm gonna steal it because that makes it FREE SHIT. Admittedly illegally obtained FREE SHIT but FREE SHIT none-the-less. I'm not taking a stand against DRM - I AM GETTING SHIT FOR FREE! I may not be entitled to it but I'm gonna take it anyway. Why? Did I mention it's FREE SHIT? That's why.
 

armaina

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Nov 1, 2007
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I still think Valve was the only one to really get it right, with Steam. It makes people want to get the legitimate copy so that they can play with their friends on steam, but at the same time it doesn't penalize people who don't have 24/7 Internet access like some of these new options. Not to mention the fact that Steam doesn't hamper the performance of game itself, where as many existing DRMs already do this. Oh, and all those random weekend sales make a huge difference and really help with sales as a whole. 5$ for the original Mass Effect? Yes Please!

Honestly some of these ridiculous DRMs that are hampering the ability to actually play the game are only making someone's desire to pirate a game worse. Of course we will never have the real numbers to be able to say if these new DRM features are making things better or worse.
 

RhombusHatesYou

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Poomanchu745 said:
Because I know plenty of console people that steal music like it's their job.
I know people who make a living soft-modding consoles so people can... well, officially it's so they can play 'back ups' and some handwaving about regions... but it's so they can play pirated(yarrr) games. Consolers like their FREE SHIT, too.
 

Paragon Fury

The Loud Shadow
Jan 23, 2009
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Poomanchu745 said:
Paragon Fury said:
Poomanchu745 said:
Paragon Fury said:
Most of it centered around how PC gamers are ignorant, selfish douches (Its true. Most of you have little understanding of law and IP ownership and they're workings from the way you react), but that is a long, angry rant, and not one I'm inclined to give right now.
Ya...calling people douches is not usually a good way to start a argument. After that was said I really didn't care what you had to say as you called me a douche and I really don't appreciate that. Now because I am above that I will not call you any names back and move on.
The problem is there is no arguement to be had.

PC gamers and pirates are simply wrong.

They have no moral/ethical high ground, no legal high ground, and no practical high ground.

They simply have a case of the "MEMEMEMEMEME!"s, and their constant heel dragging on the issue is pretty close to douchebaggery as you can get. And when you've listened to it for 10 damn years, and then see the childish outrage that erupts when a company decides its finally time to throwdown (albeit not with most effective opening move ever), I think douche is a rather nice term for it.

You can't act surprised when you act like something, or remain silent about something, and the get called that something, or something akin to it.
So basically all PC gamers are pirates and we have no morals? Wow that is called stereotyping and that is wrong due to the fact there are people like me who have NEVER pirated a game in our life. If it weren't for us you wouldn't have half the games you have today on console and gaming would most likely be nowhere near where it is today. Plus I got one question for you. When was the last time you pirated music or anything for that matter on the internet. Because I know plenty of console people that steal music like it's their job. So get off your pedestal and meet me back on earth...
Since I've yet to see pirates cast out as phariahs and the general pulic attunted the attitude of their actions being unacceptable, yes, the stereotype fits. Silence implies and means condonement. The stereotype sticks because it works - just ask most developers that make PC games if PC gamers have shown themselves to be a truly trustworthy bunch. We know what Ubisoft's and EA's answers will be at least.

And I've never pirated or stolen anything on the internet, or the real world. Disbelieve it if you want, but that doesn't change it. I've also never hesitated to make my opinion on pirates and the issues at hand known. I don't deny piracy is an issue on consoles, or on the internet as a whole - but its the core issue of the PC gaming community.

What you did in the past is irrelevant. PC gamers are quickly painting themselves into a corner because of their selfish, unruly and rather, to use a word you might find more acceptable, elitist point of view. Its not consoles or developers killing PC gaming - its PC gamers.
 

ratix2

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Feb 6, 2008
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great idea, only problem is that there is already something very much like this, its called steam, and though its very popular it still gets a lot of criticism.

and there are a few other holes in your theory there. first off, this also means that those without an internet connection are loft with only a demo of a game, despite paying full price for it, one of the major drawbacks of ALL online drm schemes. true that youd still be able to play SOMETHING if you dont have a connection, but is only being able to play 3 levels any better than being able to play none of them?
 

Altorin

Jack of No Trades
May 16, 2008
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So you can't save the game, unless you download the little software dongle that lets you save?

So they crack the Dongle.

DRM is an ugly elephant in the room. Publishers need to use them for liability purposes.. all legitimate consumers ask is that it doesn't impede their ability to play the game. Like it or hate it, Ubisoft's DRM is the ultimate reflection of that complaint. Even after you shell out 50 dollars for the game, you can't play it unless Ubisoft says so. Apart from subscription based multiplayer software, that's pretty unprecedented.

If that's all this program needs, is a one-time internet check, and a 50 cent charge to unlock saving on another computer... I think legitimate customers won't mind it so much... It still will suck though, if Paragon Studios goes out of business, and their website goes down, and suddenly you can't uninstall the game because if you do, you can't purchase a new save dongle.

however, I'm sure by that time, the pirates would be happy to oblige.
 

Henrik Persson

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Mar 14, 2010
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Paragon Fury said:
Henrik Persson said:
Obviously, some form of DRM has to be used - to suggest otherwise is insanity.
Why? What makes a game with DRM that's cracked before release any better than a game without DRM?
Because releasing something without making sure most people have to pay you in order to get it is insane.

It'd be like leaving doors to your Ferrai unlocked, keys sitting in the ignition, leaving on vacation, and then not expecting someone to take it.


Also, you execute tighter controls on the release, possibly making it so that physical copies are not distributed until after the digital version is released in order to cut down on the time hackers have to get at it.


Combine this with the stigma of "Hey, were giving you a lot for only $40 and 10 minutes of your time" so that pirates don't look like liberators, but rahter asses.
So every game developer on the planet is insane? Because noone has successfully made sure that most people have to pay you in order to get it. Most people do pay for it, not because they have to, but because they choose to. Everyone with an internet connection could pirate it. Most DRMs don't do squat except annoy the paying customers and the games would be better without them. It's the fact that it's illegal and immoral that's the most efficient preventer of piracy.

RhomCo makes a good point though.
 

Plurralbles

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Jan 12, 2010
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HG131 said:
Hopeless Bastard said:
Heres a solution: Move PC gaming to bluray, games at least 400gb.

Once CDs hit, the average game size greatly exceeded the average internet connection's ability to move it. The pirate's solution were 'rips.' Games with all the movies removed, the sound files reduced to absurdly low bitrates and/or compressed with retarded schemes that took hours upon hours to decompress. But were still fucking huge, compared to the average connection. In this period, piracy was dead. The only people who could even hope to pirate any game had to work in IT as the administrator.

So, yea, content, content, content. The longer it takes to download, the less people will want to expose themselves on public trackers. The more content you force the pirates to remove/compress/downsample/re-encode to make distribution viable, the better the retail version becomes.

And hell, putting bluray games on a platform capable of doing something of actual fucking worth with the format would be a huge step forward.
One problem. Computers wouldn't be able to fit that. So, no. Here's the perfect way: USE STEAM! In fact, there should be a law: All PC games must be sold through Steam. Fixed and done.
a legal monopoly for steam? FUCK that. Te only reason you see great deals on it is because they have to fucking compete with teh hard copy and the minority of the digital distritubtion sites.
 

Paragon Fury

The Loud Shadow
Jan 23, 2009
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It wouldn't be so much a "crack" as a "Have to construct the ability to save the game from scratch". Without the download, the game wouldn't even know what a save is, much less have anything to crack. Even if you bypassed the check for the levels, you'd still be unable to save the game or use the MP.

And even they do crack it, it meant as a deterrent and stigma measure, not as a stop. For all that work, they could've just paid, enjoyed the game and gotten on with it.
 

RhombusHatesYou

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Paragon Fury said:
Since I've yet to see pirates cast out as phariahs and the general pulic attunted the attitude of their actions being unacceptable, yes, the stereotype fits. Silence implies and means condonement. The stereotype sticks because it works - just ask most developers that make PC games if PC gamers have shown themselves to be a truly trustworthy bunch. We know what Ubisoft's and EA's answers will be at least.
Of course, by remaining in PC gaming, they are also indirectly condoning the apparent behaviour of PC Gamers. If PC Gamers and developing/publishing PC games are such tribulations then why are they still trying? That's Enabling behaviour.