A question for Americans

[cobra_ky]

No, Americans do not have free speech. And when you enter a new public arena, speech becomes even more limited.

Here at the Escapist, for example, you are not allowed to say whatever you want. If anybody finds what you say offensive, it gets reported. After a review of the complaint and comment, restrictions are placed against the user who perpetrated the infraction. Certain speech is limited in certain circumstances.

The United States is no different, although inflammatory statements are dealt with far more leniently. Threats on the other hand, are dealt with more strictly. If I were to say "I'm going to rape your mom in the face" on any internet forum, it would be considered inflammatory slander that is not taken very seriously. If I were to say it to a co-worker or a classmate, for example, it would be dealt with far more seriously.

As long as nobody can hear you, everyone on the planet has free speech. As soon as you enter the public arena, free speech is lost.

The Escapist forums aren't a public arena. When you registered an account you agreed to limit your speech in here in a variety of ways, and i'm pretty sure they reserve the right to ban you for any reason they want.

edit:annnnnd i got ninjaed.

 

[Pebkac]

it's a complicated issue. Simply put, however, America has the most lenient laws governing "freedom of expression" of any western culture. Won't give much evidence, but perhaps the best one is that the government can't block websites.

Yeah, that is a pretty hard thing to prove. Especially when there's so many different kinds of expression and different metrics. For example, reporters without borders ranks the United States as number 20 in freedom of the press:

http://en.rsf.org/press-freedom-index-2010,1034.html

But you are right; it is a complicated issue.

 

[interspark]

everyone is America is too sensitive and easily offended these days.

Yet we still teach children that "Sticks and stones may break my bones, but words will never hurt me". Funny, eh?

well thats a load of crap, injuries can heal in hours, a good insult can last weeks

 

[AngelOfBlueRoses]

If you believe America has free speech, perform this simple scientific test.

Stand in a shopping mall, get someone to film you.

Start speaking audibly to passers by, saying "I hate N***ers, and i hope everyone here agrees with me. N****ers will be the death of us all." and repeatedly say it over and over.



If you last beyond 10 minutes before security chucks you out, id be amazed. If you made it past 30, id be dumbfounded and shocked.

Make it a full hour and you can say the U.S has free speech.




The truth is - NO country has true "free speech". Americans just like chest thumping and using the claim its in their constitution as a means to belittle other countries and make themselves feel superior.

They dont have it, and the reason they dont have it is because in reality you dont want it. Because common sense and a civilized country require intelligent people to step in when nutbags, sickos, degenerates and low-life evil people would seek to abuse it.

Except it only protects you from the government infringing upon your rights. If you go into a mall, a private establishment not owned or run by the government, they have every right to chuck you out if they want to. Now, you -could- stand outside on a sidewalk and do just that, think Westboro Baptist Church, and the government, the mall, or nobody else could do anything. ...that is if a passerby doesn't punch you. Get my point? Private =/= government.

 

[MikailCaboose]

everyone is America is too sensitive and easily offended these days.

Yet we still teach children that "Sticks and stones may break my bones, but words will never hurt me". Funny, eh?

That and the Golden Rule, and yet it's never fully followed, now is it?

 

[RobCoxxy]

What's to say the government can't decide that films aren't protected as free speech. So my question for the day is, is your speech truly protected?

That's the MPAA, mate, and they're mostly religious right.

Uh no they're the film industry.

Actually, they're not. The MPAA's "ratings board" is a seperate body, "everyday people/parents" who decide what the ratings are.

Except they're all 40+ and right wing.

So anything that goes against traditional Christian values tends to get R/NC17 ratings.

You kidding me? [/quote]

Nope, I'm genuinely not. Sex/drugs give films an instant NC17 or R rating. Violence is fine, though for some reason.

Any film depicting sex or drug use is really hard to get an NC17. There's no way it'll get a lower rating.

Pulp Fiction
Scarface (although for that one they had to fight for an R rating)
Harold and Kumar
Every stoner movie ever
The Hangover
Most recent comedies (they all have sex in them, though not explicit)[/quote]

...Yes. All NC17/R. It's hard for most of these to convince lowering from R to NC17. It's usually fine for more mainstream movies but anything independent, or indeed, artistic cinema, meaningful cinema with anything "risque" is bumped to NC17/R, ruining the film's chances of getting any success at all.

If you spent maybe two minutes looking up R rated movies you would know that sex and drugs are used all the time in movies. I will agree that many movies might receive a higher rating than necessary for sexual scenes or images but that is all that will happen, a higher rating.

Also the vast majority of film companies and actors/actresses are liberal so I don't know how you got the idea that film or the ratings system in America was run by a Christian company.

If you spent maybe two minutes looking up R rated movies you would know that sex and drugs are used all the time in movies. I will agree that many movies might receive a higher rating than necessary for sexual scenes or images but that is all that will happen, a higher rating.

Also the vast majority of film companies and actors/actresses are liberal so I don't know how you got the idea that film or the ratings system in America was run by a Christian company.[/quote]

Yes. Depicted in R rated movies. As I said. You're not going to get sex/drugs portrayed in a PG-13, but you will get gratuitous violence.

What the hell are you on about, "liberal"?

The ratings board is as right wing as they come. And seriously, your coutry's "liberal" is my country's Conservative, so I really don't see what you mean by saying your liberals are too left.
You said yourself they get a higher rating and "that's it".
But you need to realise that this drastically affects how many people can see a film, how many cinemas will actually show the film.

Yet more ways that the religious right are managing to make sex appear "terrible" while violence is fine and dandy.

Any film depicting sex or drug use is really hard to get an NC17. There's no way it'll get a lower rating.

I can't remember the last time I saw an NC17 rating on anything except hardcore porn. What America are you living in?

Well, stop just watching Transformers and other boring mindless crap then.
And also: I'm a British film student. I do this 24/7.

 

[silver wolf009]

As compared with many places in the world, where you might be shot for even uttering a complaint about someone, yes we do indeed have free speech. Do we have free speech as per the dictionary definition? Absolutely not.

So you have free-er speech?

Free-er-ish.

I have noticed that as a country, we seem to pride ourselves on free speech, but there has been certian occasions (such as World War 1 or the Great War as it was known then) that freedom of the constitution has been taken away.

The exception that proves the rule? I dont thinks so, but I am happy that we are relativly well off in what can be said compared to other places as has been mentioned by Samwise.

 

[supersixfour]

Just a question, do you really have free speech if the government decides what speech is protected or not? For instance, the government can decide that videogames aren't protected as free speech, and ban them. What's to say the government can't decide that films aren't protected as free speech. So my question for the day is, is your speech truly protected?

they can censor games but they can't really ban them unless esrb ratings don't matchup with content, at least ive never seen a game banned i wouldn't put it past some of those right wing jackasses in washington to try to ban video games. But this is what the debate is about this november, whether or not they are considered art , which is protected by the first amendment, its pretty obvious that they are, but the old farts in washington don't know that.

 

[sirkai007]

One thing that got me about the "Free speech" is that they aren't allowed to say "I want to kill the president, or something along those lines, unless it is to tell someone else they cannot say it >.>
Seems "Free" is defined by the government...
I think I'm within my rights to say I want to kill anyone, be it my neighbor, my cousin, some important government person, whoever. Lucky me. I just can't actually do so, even to protect myself :3

Saying things like "I want/will kill..." is not protected speech because it creates clear and present danger. Look it up in the Constitution.

 

[supersixfour]

Freedom (speech or otherwise) is not only a myth but a joke in America.

Lets look at this "Free" and "Democratic" nation...

-It was built on the backs of slaves
-they killed natives for their land
-They BURNED witches, books, comics, films etc
-Jailed japanese americans during WW2
-"The COMMIE Hunt"
-Hippie beatings (and shootings)
-The patriot act
-Only "electoral" votes count in a federal election

That's free and democratic?

its free for those who aren't minorities, I'm american and I'm relatively indifferent to my country but its free because for the most part we can vote to change things (in theory anyway, there's private interests and other technicalities that make shit a bit more complicated) but on our system, in theory, i can vote to appoint someone who will represent the ideals that i most associate with, and in terms of speech, i can say whatever i want, provided I'm either in public or on a TV show with an appropriate rating. OUR COUNTRY IS NOT PERFECT, not saying it is but i am saying that painting a picture of us with such a broad brush isn't exactly fair. you bring up a very good point though, plenty of our history is tainted with hypocritical injustices that we can never out live, and our system is plenty corrupted.

 

[Sovvolf]

-They BURNED witches, books, comics, films etc

Little off-topic trivia here but no witches were ever burned (least not in America or Briton). Most witches that were actually convicted of witch craft were either hanged or in some cases, just given a fine.

 

[TheYellowCellPhone]

Are we allowed to say whatever we want: Mostly yes.
Does what we say earn negative consequences: Usually.

Where I live at least.

 

[Typecast]

Doesn't it depend more on what horse Rupert Murdoch is backing at any particular time?

 

[Tanis]

As compared with many places in the world, where you might be shot for even uttering a complaint about someone, yes we do indeed have free speech. Do we have free speech as per the dictionary definition? Absolutely not.

So you have free-er speech?

Nail on the head my friend.

It may not be perfect, but it is better than a lot of other places.

Word.

How about someone from the Middle East or China talking crap about their government or saying anything that goes against Islam/State Religion.

Ask that Iranian girl Neda...O, wait...that's right.
She's dead.

 

[smeghead25]

IMO, the only place where real free speech exists, is on the internet.

Good thing I live there then

Free speech doesn't entirely exist, we need some limitations on it, but mostly we should be allowed to say and experience what we want when we want as long as it doesn't negatively affect anyone else. Unfortunately, politicians seem to forget this and have decided that videogames are bad even though playing them does not negatively affect anyone else.

 

[crudus]

Its because our government is overly sensitive and is scared of what will happen when someone speaks their mind.....and your like the 8th person to ask us that

It is actually the people (see scared white mothers). The government is just doing what people are yelling about at the time.

 

[ApophisMP]

" This country was built on the back of slaves" give me a break

and the Patriot act was and still is a good idea for the most part if you look at whats it tries to protect us from

Far better than President Failure's idea to censor the internet of content he and party doesnt like
http://baltimorechronicle.com/2010/100110Lendman.shtml

 

[APSunder]

According to the 1st ammendment we have the right of free speech, freedom of religion, freedom of press, right to assemble, and right to a trial. Those rights, however, go away under the condition that you're insulting someone or a particular race, culture, lifestyle etc. to the point where they'd do something like want to kill themselves (e.g. the gay guy at Rutgers that killed himself because someone was videotaping him having sex with a man and streaming it online), or if the material's deemed offensive to a group. These groups can include age groups, and so, if a video game or film is deemed inappropriate for a kid and it's found that they can get access to it the government reserves the right to ban it. Same thing goes for if it's racially offensive, anti-gay etc. That said, I don't think video games will be banned for a long time. If there are some games that are banned, I think it'll be more like Dead or Alive Xtreme Volleyball with cheat codes before it's God of War.

 

[Pebkac]

Comparing freedom in your own country to that in Afghanistan, North Korea, China, some fucked up African country, etc, is not really setting the bar high...

 

[zombays]

Yeah, the free speech is slowly degrading, since court is letting one too many snips in the constitution happen. And the cities aren't the only place where there's INTENSE crime now, 20 houses in my neighborhood were robbed over the summer, but those naive bastards deserve it.