A View From the Road: FarmVille Isn't Going Away

[ZephrC]

Funny how people seem to be assuming that they're being forced to believe that everything newsworthy is good.

Zynga makes games that we, as a community, do not want. So perhaps it is news when people start to emulate them, isn't it? I don't buy this crap about everything that's brings in more gamers is good for us. All other things being equal more gamers is good for us, but when games are becoming simpler, cheaper and less interesting, all other things are not equal.

The main point of this article was that it's news either way though, and that is absolutely correct.

Honestly, I don't personally believe that FarmVille and its ilk are really that big of a deal. There's a lot of money being spent by gamers, and a lot of companies dedicated to that market. That's not all going to evaporate overnight. Some companies may move on to simpler and more profitable things, but there are still millions of us with money and expectations of quality. There will always be someone ready to fill that niche. To claim that 100 million people playing an electronic game is irrelevant to us is pretty ridiculous though.

 

[VanBasten]

I'm saying that people need to stop being surprised/angry at the games being considered noteworthy by press and developers alike.

And you need to stop being surprised/angry at people violently disliking those noteworthy games.

I don't think anyone disagrees that a lot of people play these games and that the industry is going to try to make some money out of it. The "Why is this news?" comments aren't suggesting otherwise, they're most likely just "Why is this news here?".

Let me go for the music business parallel again, it's like if you posted a news item on Justin Beiber on a music site focusing on Heavy Metal. You may be writing about how some new Heavy Metal bands are looking into youtube and twitter for promotion, but you'll get a lot of "Why is this news?" if not a bit more... let's say graphic reactions.

Personally, I think you definitely should write about those aspects of the industry, just getting surprised that Heavy Metal fans don't like Justin Beiber is a bit silly.

 

[Bat Vader]

And yet, the VP of Zynga is speaking as the keynote speaker at GDC Canada. Whoops, guess the people in the industry disagree with you.

And whats he going to be able to say, exactly? What valuable insight is he going to be able to grant to actual video game developers?

"Make your game as shitty, but rewarding as possible, and people will flock to you in droves."
"If someone else has a good idea, just rip it off completely and release it as your own."
"If you're strapped for cash, offer a "full version" which is really just a 3kb html file, containing a link to a copy of the .swf file."
"Turn your players into free advertising, by offering extensive rewards for spamming links to the game all over their social networks."

Yea, zygna has made some money through extremely shoddy business practice. Does it translate to actual gaming? No. Should it? No. Will it? We all better pray not.

"Oops, you're out of bullets, get 3 more people to play to reload."

Edit: Forgot that outwar beat zygna to the whole "turn your players into free advertising" bit by about a decade. Pretty sure they weren't the first either.

I don't know. He hasn't given the keynote yet - I have no idea what he'll say. But the fact that you're automatically dismissing it outright shows what I think is a profoundly willful ignorance on your part.

The fact of the matter is, people who call the shots in the industry think that there are things that can be learned from what Zynga does. And to pretend that it isn't the case because their products don't appeal to you personally is, I feel, narrowminded.

My point is zygna products shouldn't appeal to anyone. The fact they do is some sort of twisted perversion of reality in my mind. Its as confusing as how popular that "feed the flash fish" thing was a few years ago.

Zygna's products are essentially non-satirical versions of progress quest (yet another confusing popularity explosion). Except with in-game rewards for spamming links for progress quest.

Zygna took what other people were doing and made money off it. The amount of money got them noticed by people who actually develop games. The attention they're getting is a terrifying precedent. If every real developer started copying zygna's business model, then... sites like this would cease to exist. You would all be out of a job. There wouldn't be any need for any sort of centralized "gaming press" as each gamer would become little more than a spam-bot for whatever "game" they played.

Considering that there are over 6 billion people in this world I would have to say that Zyngas products will appeal to someone. It is not a twisted perversion of reality. It would be annoying if game developers tried Zyngas business model but I don't think they will.

 

[silasbufu]

I'm not a flamer or anything , but can you bring a few arguments to this affirmation : " but you hating them doesn't mean for a moment that they aren't relevant to society or the gaming industry" ? .
I fail to see how farmville revolutionises gaming industry.

 

[secretsantaone]

I feel this article misses the point somewhat.

I don't think anyone can argue that Zynga isn't a massive influence on millions of people.

However, comparing Zynga to 'real' developers is like comparing McDonalds to Michelin star restaurants. Sure it may appeal to millions as it's cheap and easy, but you start telling food critics that it should be seen on par with L'Atelier de Joël Robuchon and they'll lose their shit.

Yes, this sort of gaming is appealing to millions. Yes, it is many times more popular than console and PC gaming. However, from a gaming site, I would expect articles on Zynga as rare as the food column in The Times discussing the new McFlurry.

 

[Benjeezy]

So social games are here to stay. Um yes, I agree. Is the point of this article just to hear yourself talk?

So you have a tenuous grasp of the concept of an editorial. Um yes, I agree. Is the point of this post just to hear yourself talk?

Insult an editor, who gives you free entertainment and news on a daily basis. Really cool. Fuck away with you.

 

[Tanya Sabolsky]

I love farmville

 

[RvLeshrac]

Zynga is not "relevant to the industry." Unless, of course, you're talking about the industry that revolves around Affiliate programs who try as hard as they can to scam people.

Do I have a problem with games like FarmVille, Mafia Wars, et al? No, I don't. I still have Drug Wars on my calculator. ALL of my calculators. For two decades now, I've had version of Drug Wars on *some* device I own. I've had a Harvest Moon game on the majority of my consoles. I have a L14 Kongregate account, so I obviously have no issues with flash games. I don't get upset about PopCap's existence. I don't have a problem with Big Fish, or the Casual Game Portals out there (that is to say, the ones which don't resort to the same scam-ridden Affiliate programs as Zynga).

Zynga, and the companies like them, hurt gaming. Zynga, and the companies like them, hurt the *legitimate* Affiliate programs. Zynga, and the companies like them, hurt social networking. Why? Because the company is run by a scammer. This would normally be a statement I'd have to back up with some conspiracy theorist's nonsense about how Zynga stole his cat, but I don't. Why? Because I have guess you shouldn't make promises you can't keep, <a href=http://www.time.com/time/business/article/0,8599,1935698,00.html>and an article that basically sums up the whole ordeal.

And I'm hardly the <a href=http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/96024-Zynga-CEO-Admits-to-Being-a-Scammer>first to <a href=http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/96310-Zynga-Sued-Over-Deceptive-Advertising>link to stories on Zynga's scam-filled background. Even the <a href=http://www.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/issues/issue_228/6787-An-Offer-You-Cant-Refuse.2>stories about how much 'fun' a Zynga game is can't stay away from the scamming nature of the company.

How long before you find other slimy companies to praise?

You have to understand that the individuals who hate Zynga because "they make crappy games" are largely idiots. The majority of us hate Zynga because they have done everything in their power to cheat users out of their money, shortly before lying about it.

I still can't believe I read that the discussion "isn't about its ethical practices."

That's the only discussion we should be having. The only discussion that matters.

 

[JEBWrench]

Zynga is not "relevant to the industry."

The gaming industry disagrees with you, what the awards and the speaking at major conferences, and the working with the government to use gaming as a vehicle to promote healthier living in youth.

 

[Eldarion]

Zynga is not "relevant to the industry."

The gaming industry disagrees with you, what the awards and the speaking at major conferences, and the working with the government to use gaming as a vehicle to promote healthier living in youth.

Healthier living at the expense of what comes with Zynga? We don't want the rest of the games industry learning to be a bunch of spyware using, add spamming, game stealing morons. The games industry has nothing to learn from Zynga other than facebook apps and dirty business practices earn cheap success.

And being addicted to Farmville isn't exactly healthy, neither is being addicted to facebook which is all this is, a facebook fad. Nothing more.

 

[JEBWrench]

Healthier living at the expense of what comes with Zynga? We don't want the rest of the games industry learning to be a bunch of spyware using, add spamming, game stealing morons. The games industry has nothing to learn from Zynga other than facebook apps and dirty business practices earn cheap success.

And being addicted to Farmville isn't exactly healthy, neither is being addicted to facebook which is all this is, a facebook fad. Nothing more.

A fad with 83,000,000 MAUs and around 30,000,000 DAUs.

And I have no idea what exactly they're planning on doing, and I doubt it will be anything halfways decent. But that's not the point. The point is Zynga is extremely relevant to the industry.

People who want to use the self-imposed label of "gamer" to justify their being introverted not liking that relevance are just deluding themselves to just how massively popular Zynga's games are.

 

[Eldarion]

Healthier living at the expense of what comes with Zynga? We don't want the rest of the games industry learning to be a bunch of spyware using, add spamming, game stealing morons. The games industry has nothing to learn from Zynga other than facebook apps and dirty business practices earn cheap success.

And being addicted to Farmville isn't exactly healthy, neither is being addicted to facebook which is all this is, a facebook fad. Nothing more.

A fad with 83,000,000 MAUs and around 30,000,000 DAUs.

And I have no idea what exactly they're planning on doing, and I doubt it will be anything halfways decent. But that's not the point. The point is Zynga is extremely relevant to the industry.

People who want to use the self-imposed label of "gamer" to justify their being introverted not liking that relevance are just deluding themselves to just how massively popular Zynga's games are.

That massive popularity doesn't automatically mean that the rise of Zynga is a good thing either. Plenty of mediocre crap has been hugely popular for a short time before. Like I said before, if real developers follow the Zynga example the industry as a whole will suffer. And for what? Popularity? Money? You cane make tons of money on a fad on facebook, thats all I see this doing.

 

[JEBWrench]

That massive popularity doesn't automatically mean that the rise of Zynga is a good thing either. Plenty of mediocre crap has been hugely popular for a short time before. Like I said before, if real developers follow the Zynga example the industry as a whole will suffer. And for what? Popularity? Money? You cane make tons of money on a fad on facebook, thats all I see this doing.

I don't think I said anything about it being good. Just relevant.

I don't doubt for a minute that "real developers" (EA comes to mind, since they, you know, did) would be interested in the Zynga example. For popularity and money. The thing the entertainment businesses want. Especially money.

 

[Eldarion]

Zynga is not "relevant to the industry." Unless, of course, you're talking about the industry that revolves around Affiliate programs who try as hard as they can to scam people.

Do I have a problem with games like FarmVille, Mafia Wars, et al? No, I don't. I still have Drug Wars on my calculator. ALL of my calculators. For two decades now, I've had version of Drug Wars on *some* device I own. I've had a Harvest Moon game on the majority of my consoles. I have a L14 Kongregate account, so I obviously have no issues with flash games. I don't get upset about PopCap's existence. I don't have a problem with Big Fish, or the Casual Game Portals out there (that is to say, the ones which don't resort to the same scam-ridden Affiliate programs as Zynga).

Zynga, and the companies like them, hurt gaming. Zynga, and the companies like them, hurt the *legitimate* Affiliate programs. Zynga, and the companies like them, hurt social networking. Why? Because the company is run by a scammer. This would normally be a statement I'd have to back up with some conspiracy theorist's nonsense about how Zynga stole his cat, but I don't. Why? Because I have guess you shouldn't make promises you can't keep, <a href=http://www.time.com/time/business/article/0,8599,1935698,00.html>and an article that basically sums up the whole ordeal.

And I'm hardly the <a href=http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/96024-Zynga-CEO-Admits-to-Being-a-Scammer>first to <a href=http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/96310-Zynga-Sued-Over-Deceptive-Advertising>link to stories on Zynga's scam-filled background. Even the <a href=http://www.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/issues/issue_228/6787-An-Offer-You-Cant-Refuse.2>stories about how much 'fun' a Zynga game is can't stay away from the scamming nature of the company.

How long before you find other slimy companies to praise?

You have to understand that the individuals who hate Zynga because "they make crappy games" are largely idiots. The majority of us hate Zynga because they have done everything in their power to cheat users out of their money, shortly before lying about it.

I still can't believe I read that the discussion "isn't about its ethical practices."

That's the only discussion we should be having. The only discussion that matters.

Also this. Basically what I was saying.

I play harvest moon myself quite a bit. Casual games aren't the issue, Znyga's douchbaggery is.

 

[Eldarion]

That massive popularity doesn't automatically mean that the rise of Zynga is a good thing either. Plenty of mediocre crap has been hugely popular for a short time before. Like I said before, if real developers follow the Zynga example the industry as a whole will suffer. And for what? Popularity? Money? You cane make tons of money on a fad on facebook, thats all I see this doing.

I don't think I said anything about it being good. Just relevant.

I don't doubt for a minute that "real developers" (EA comes to mind, since they, you know, did) would be interested in the Zynga example. For popularity and money. The thing the entertainment businesses want. Especially money.

I'm not gonna disagree with you there. In fact I agree wholeheartedly.

I do not for one second though, thing the rise of Zynga is the rise of a new casual gamer or some such nonsense. I also don't think the industry should be praising them for one second and I completely disagree with the article when It says Zynga's scamming should not be part of the picture and that we should focus on their success. Thats bullcrap. The only discussion worth having is about how Zynga scammed and spammed their way into becoming a facebook phenomenon.

 

[JEBWrench]

I'm not gonna disagree with you there. In fact I agree wholeheartedly.

I do not for one second though, thing the rise of Zynga is the rise of a new casual gamer or some such nonsense. I also don't think the industry should be praising them for one second and I completely disagree with the article when It says Zynga's scamming should not be part of the picture and that we should focus on their success. Thats bullcrap. The only discussion worth having is about how Zynga scammed and spammed their way into becoming a facebook phenomenon.

I think, though, that it's pretty evident that Zynga's success has had a large impact on the industry. It's not just that they did it using underhanded tactics. It's that they did it so freakin' fast that's gotten so much attention.

Remember, Farmville launched in summer of last year.

83,000,000 MTUs in less than a year.

That's why the industry has taken notice. That's why Zynga nabbed another EA developer. That's why Nintendo is getting into Social Gaming. That's why Zynga sells gaming currency cards in 12,000 stores in the US alone.

 

[Eldarion]

I'm not gonna disagree with you there. In fact I agree wholeheartedly.

I do not for one second though, thing the rise of Zynga is the rise of a new casual gamer or some such nonsense. I also don't think the industry should be praising them for one second and I completely disagree with the article when It says Zynga's scamming should not be part of the picture and that we should focus on their success. Thats bullcrap. The only discussion worth having is about how Zynga scammed and spammed their way into becoming a facebook phenomenon.

I think, though, that it's pretty evident that Zynga's success has had a large impact on the industry. It's not just that they did it using underhanded tactics. It's that they did it so freakin' fast that's gotten so much attention.

Remember, Farmville launched in summer of last year.

83,000,000 MTUs in less than a year.

That's why the industry has taken notice. That's why Zynga nabbed another EA developer. That's why Nintendo is getting into Social Gaming. That's why Zynga sells gaming currency cards in 12,000 stores in the US alone.

I know, that success is worrying to say the least. The underhanded tactics aside, this rampant growth is pretty astonishing. But thats the power of social networking sites, on its own merits Zynga would never have survived doing what it is doing. Lets not forget that the games themselves are designed so that you need to come back to them to replant crops or whatever, this is done so that people have to come back and see the adds thus generating site revenue. The games BY THESELVES are just a money making scam that taps into the social networking people who are already addicted to facebook and giving them something addictive, simple and mindless to do while browsing facebook. This is not a model of business we want the games industry learning from or much less *shudders* giving awards to.

 

[sageoftruth]

I'm not too peeved about the lack of play elements in Farmville (I'm already desensitized from all the Wii and DS games on the game shelves). What really peeved me was when I read that the game punishes you for NOT playing it. Games are supposed to be fun. You're not supposed to go, "Oh shoot! If I don't get back to Farmville soon things could get bad!" That's called a job.

 

[Susan Arendt]

I'm not too peeved about the lack of play elements in Farmville (I'm already desensitized from all the Wii and DS games on the game shelves). What really peeved me was when I read that the game punishes you for NOT playing it. Games are supposed to be fun. You're not supposed to go, "Oh shoot! If I don't get back to Farmville soon things could get bad!" That's called a job.

Same thing happens in Animal Crossing and Nintendogs. Of course calling it "punishment" is a bit excessive. If you don't tend your crops, they did. Big whoop, plant some more.