Any good (opposite of evil) necromancers in fiction?
- Thread starter DoPo
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I think she mostly uses her necromancer powers to slam her vagina into sexy things, according to most of what I've heard from people who've read the series. Or at least the later books anyway.kitsunefather said:
The Necroscope books feature Harry Keogh, a character who is a necroscope (obviously), having the ability to talk to the dead. In desperate times the dead are also willing to rise up and fight for him, rather than being compelled against their will.
Planescape: Torment allows the Nameless One to communicate with (but not raise) the dead and while you can be as good or evil as you want, the act itself is presented as neutral. The game also has the also morally grey Dustmen faction who routinely use animated zombies and skeletons as labourers and guards.
Most of the Necromancers in the Diablo series are good and follow the teachings of Rathma and believe in maintaining the Balance of the world.
Also, the girl magic user in A Certain Scientific Accelerator is a necromancer.
Also, the girl magic user in A Certain Scientific Accelerator is a necromancer.
Eucliwood Hellscythe from Is This a Zombie?, and Horance from Ultima VII, off the top of my head.
In Arcanum all the healing magic was under the school of "white necromancy" so anyone who practiced it could be considered a "good necromancer."
Older book, but in The Shattered World by Michael Reaves (published 1984), necromancy was feared but is revealed as essentially a neutral art. How it was used could be good or evil, but the power itself was neither.
Man, I love that game, even with all its bugs. Thank you for reminding me of it.Canadamus Prime said:
Lots of benign examples of the first one in fiction and folklore both. Native American spirit magic was specifically brought up. The book Mystery Walk by Robert R McCammon featured a spirit healer who soothed and laid the violently made dead to rest.
If you in insist on the concept of black magic inherently being tied to necromancy it's a little less common. The Ruby Knight has an example that I read first hand. But on the one reading of that book I did over 20 years ago I wanted to slap the entire cast silly for being blithering idiots.
Pretty much all I can think of first hand right now. Spirit magic in many cultures though is not "evil" it's just a way of dealing with the horrors of death in a way that might make one more comfortable with it's inevitibility. Pop culture took the idea of reanimating corpses and some Biblical stuff and turned the whole concept into pure evil.
Only example that springs to mind is Fomorous Hugues from Kingdoms of Amalur, and even then its a stretch since he has one success against thousands of failures.
Define good?
There's pen and paper games revolving around death, manipulation of the departed,and policing the boundaries of flesh and the lands of the dead. Such as White Wolf's Geist. They are a really awesome take on Necromancers.
You also have 'Sin-eaters' in history, who absorb the evils of the departedthrough an arcane feasting ritual. So I suppose 'define necromancy' as well.
There's pen and paper games revolving around death, manipulation of the departed,and policing the boundaries of flesh and the lands of the dead. Such as White Wolf's Geist. They are a really awesome take on Necromancers.
You also have 'Sin-eaters' in history, who absorb the evils of the departedthrough an arcane feasting ritual. So I suppose 'define necromancy' as well.
Not much to define. If you think they are good - there you go. I could list off some criteria and then people would go "but what about X who covers everything but that" or start picking at the criteria as if they don't have better things to do. So I prefer to just keep it simple - are they trying to take over the world and kill everybody? They aren't good. Are they doing acting "doing what's necessary" by selectively killing but not on a big scale and trying to find justification for that? That could "not evil" but is probably going to be morally grey, which also means "not good". Are they Santa Claus but can also wield necromancy? That's good. I am pretty sure you can use your own judgement for a character to determine where in the spectrum they fit.Addendum_Forthcoming said:
There's pen and paper games revolving around death, manipulation of the departed,and policing the boundaries of flesh and the lands of the dead. Such as White Wolf's Geist. They are a really awesome take on Necromancers.
I have. Multiple times. It has to be called necromancy in-universe. While I agree that the Bound in Geist are pretty cool, overall, they aren't actually referred to as necromancers and their powers aren't called necromancy - they have Keys that unlock Manifestations[footnote]as a side note, that's an AMAZING mechanic. I try to praise it every time I get to mention it[/footnote] and their powers do generally deal with the dead but that's it. There are lots of practices that can be called necromancy but aren't. I'm looking for the ones that actually are.Addendum_Forthcoming said:
Oh, on the contrary - there are overwhelmingly many examples of black magic being tied to necromancy - in fact, the two concepts are very, very commonly linked together - either black/dark/evil magic (or whatever you want to call it) allows for the manipulation of the deceased or the school of necromancy happens to also unleash terrible curses, plagues, maladies and other nasty things alongside commanding the dead.jklinders said:
Also, I'm looking for examples where this isn't (necessarily) the case.
There is Lady Zozo from Code of Princess. Unfortunately, you really don't see her using much necromancy, aside from using it on herself.
Steve Spellslinger in Spellslinger vs C.R.A.P practices a form of necromancy where he only brings back those who wants to come back willingly. Mostly grandmothers and at least one dog..
Their relatives even pay him (in food and furniture) to do it.
Of course, in the eyes of the "Heroes" it's still considered inherently evil..Just like his goatee and his exotic garden.
Their relatives even pay him (in food and furniture) to do it.
Of course, in the eyes of the "Heroes" it's still considered inherently evil..Just like his goatee and his exotic garden.
I love those little conversations in Venture Bros - like Jefferson Twilight talking to the one prospective villain about hunting Blackulas and that there's no such thing as a "British" African American vampire.ccggenius12 said:
Mortegro from Ultima 7 part 2 the Serpent Isle was a good Necromancer, technically a Necromage but same area of expertise. He didn't raise the dead just summoned their spirits to communicate with them, usually to pass on messages to or from them to loved ones.
http://ultima.wikia.com/wiki/Mortegro
http://ultima.wikia.com/wiki/Mortegro
There are a couple different ones. I'm surprised only 1 person mentioned Diablo so far, as their necromancers are anything but evil.
Pathfinder also features a White Necromancer, which is described with the following line when looking at the supplement, New Paths Commpendium by Kobold Press, in paizo's store "The white necromancer, wielding death magic for the side of Good".
Guild Wars was already mentioned and specifically highlights the differences between good and evil necromancers.
More specifically, the new necromancer subclass they are introducing this month is a good example of this, with the info we got about its lore so far being that it protects spirits, and likely bodies, from being enslaved by a fairly powerful lich. The unique weapon you can unlock by playing it is even called "Guide for the Lost".
Technically, there is Warhammer Fantasy's Amethyst Order as wellm, who are not quite true necromancers in that they don't reanimate dead bodies, though they do wield some power over the dead and death. I guess they, and the following entry as well, would be more neutral than good.
Same setting also got the Tomb Kings. Gonna just copy paste a part of the description for their basic troops.
"The Skeleton Warriors of Nehekhara are not mindless automatons slaved to the will of an evil necromancer. They are instead animated by the souls of their former bodies. The incantations of the Liche Priests summon the spirits of longdead soldiers from the Realm of Souls and bind them into corporeal forms. However, without the extensive mummification lavished upon their lords and betters, the spirits of these warriors do not retain the full memory of their former existence. Upon awakening from their deathsleep, the only things that every one of these Undead soldiers can recall with perfect clarity is their unswerving loyalty to their king and the ways of war that were drilled into them in life. Thus, the skeletal regiments of Nehekhara obey every command of their Tomb King without hesitation, as they served him in life, so they serve him in death."
Pathfinder also features a White Necromancer, which is described with the following line when looking at the supplement, New Paths Commpendium by Kobold Press, in paizo's store "The white necromancer, wielding death magic for the side of Good".
Guild Wars was already mentioned and specifically highlights the differences between good and evil necromancers.
More specifically, the new necromancer subclass they are introducing this month is a good example of this, with the info we got about its lore so far being that it protects spirits, and likely bodies, from being enslaved by a fairly powerful lich. The unique weapon you can unlock by playing it is even called "Guide for the Lost".
Technically, there is Warhammer Fantasy's Amethyst Order as wellm, who are not quite true necromancers in that they don't reanimate dead bodies, though they do wield some power over the dead and death. I guess they, and the following entry as well, would be more neutral than good.
Same setting also got the Tomb Kings. Gonna just copy paste a part of the description for their basic troops.
"The Skeleton Warriors of Nehekhara are not mindless automatons slaved to the will of an evil necromancer. They are instead animated by the souls of their former bodies. The incantations of the Liche Priests summon the spirits of longdead soldiers from the Realm of Souls and bind them into corporeal forms. However, without the extensive mummification lavished upon their lords and betters, the spirits of these warriors do not retain the full memory of their former existence. Upon awakening from their deathsleep, the only things that every one of these Undead soldiers can recall with perfect clarity is their unswerving loyalty to their king and the ways of war that were drilled into them in life. Thus, the skeletal regiments of Nehekhara obey every command of their Tomb King without hesitation, as they served him in life, so they serve him in death."
I think you read me wrong or perhaps I expressed myself incompletely. I was responding to the original topic of examples of "good" necromancers. I was not saying that there were few examples of bad ones but saying that there were few examples of dark magic being applied for good. A more complete reading of my post should make that a little clearer. The evil necromancer trope is boring as fuck. I rather like the idea behind spirit magic personally but it is usually applied in the most prosaic boring way possible. *shrug*DoPo said:
Insisting that they must be called necromancers in universe is a little restrictive IMHO but whatever this is your thread. That's just in my opinion being overly attached to a label which is nonsense. Some even worse fictionthan David Eddings has the Mud People in the Sword of Truth series being necromancers in all but name. It, in their case is a nearly Roman style ancester worship where their honored dead can answer questions and help guard their borders.