Are we living in an age without innocence?

[tkioz]

I'm currently reading a novel set during holocaust and it made me think of a conversation I had with my grandfather when I was a small boy; we were learning about the second world war in primary school and one night I asked him in that way only children can why no-one did anything about the concentration camps until the end of the war.

He answered me that there were rumours about death camps and so on, but no-one really believed it, it was too impossible to be true.

Remembering that conversation has prompted me to wonder if later generations were born into a world without innocence, while I am sure that people in the allied nations at a high level had some idea of what was going on, but I don't want to debate that, the majority of people didn't believe it, because it was too horrible to contemplate, even if they knew of evil things that had been done in history, it wasn't possible to be that evil, but now today, anything that I read, or see, I can see somebody doing, nothing is too evil for the human race.

So my question is, after growing up in a world were we learn about the horrors committed just decades ago, and even now still going on around the world, have we lost our (perceived) innocence? Is there any evil you can not imagine the human race doing?

 

[BonsaiK]

Actually I think these days humans are more "innocent" than ever. In previous generations it was much more common to see your own dead relatives, and if you wanted to eat meat you'd have to kill the animal yourself. Nowadays you can choose to shelter yourself from all that stuff. If anything people have lost touch with the true meaning and function of violence, to the point where when they actually do see violent acts happening, the only way they can rationalise it is often to say "it was just like in a movie"...

 

[Redlin5_v1legacy]

It is easier now to immerse yourself in something that distracts you from the brutal nature of mankind than ever before. Someone get gangbanged in a school yard? Funny, I was too busy watching videos on Youtube, roleplaying on a forum and drinking energy drinks to hear about that. The capacity of mankind to be utterly disgusting has not diminished. The ability to ignore it has skyrocketed.

 

[unoleian]

I have a hard believing in any remaining innocence, especially after explaining Rule 34 to my boss, and noting his reaction. He was incredulous.

I knew better.

Point stands, after exploring the depths of depravity available on this here fine internet, there's not much left to truly confound and offend fine senses.

 

[chronolos]

Innocence is a funny word in that it is defined through relativity. Compared to a robber, a sleezy merchant can look innocent. To the merchant, the people he rips off can be considered innocent. It's entirely objective. I know that there are genuinely good people in the world with varying senses of morality. Just because people back then didnt believe in the terrible things they heard, doesnt mean they are any less corrupt. People now a days have just been a bit more desensitized to violence and tragedy than back then.

And honestly if someone told me today that germany was reverting back to full on nazism and made a bunch of internment camps, i probably wouldnt believe it until ive heard it from another source.

 

['Aredor]

Well you certainly have a point, in past times, the population general didn't have much of an idea about the atrocities going on all over the world. Nowadays, news coverage brings you everything in clear and crisp pictures into your living room.

But on the other hand, what BonsaiK said is right as well, at least in the industrialized countries, there's little in the ways of child labour, girls having to marry strangers, villages being burnt by vikings or ravaged by the plague.

 

[AvsJoe]

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Both of you bring up excellent points, but I believe the truth is in the middle. We are much less innocent in some ways and much more innocent in others. Think of sex for instance. People are exposed to sex early and often today in various media, from books to movies to television and especially the Internet. However, not as long ago as you think and still in many parts of the world today, people used to or are having sex in the same room as other people, including possibly relatives or even their children because sex had or has different taboos in previous times or other cultures. Another example would be violence, for similar reasons.

It all comes down to different cultures and societies. We (at least North Americans; I cannot speak for the rest of the world) are a much different group of people than we were even 60 years ago and especially so than a century ago. Much has changed, including our innocence and naivete.

 

[Quid Plura]

On the Second World War, I think the harsh reality is that most people didn't care about what happened in those camps. Most Americans, Brits, Africans, even people in the occupied countries didn't care enough to find out what happened to all the Jews. The army officials had to know though.

On innocence: I think nothing really changed. When compared to other periods in history, we're even living in a fairly peaceful time. People have always been capable of doing bad things, some of us don't even know it. Interesting read if you're interested in 2nd World War and evil deeds: C. Browning - Ordinary men

It's about the Ordnungspolizei that was responsible for a part of the Holocaust. In his book, he proves that most people in these death-units were normal people.

 

[Scout Tactical]

I think we had a very strange bump of conservatism. People are worried about the "scandalous" clothes that teenage girls wear, when it was not uncommon to take seven or eight year olds as wives back in the good ol' days. Of course, the husbands wouldn't probably be much older.

That said, it's very difficult to get a good Halocaust joke, even these days, so I guess we truly are innocent.

 

[The Geek Lord]

Are we living in an age without innocence?

I feel remarkably uncomfortable around homosexuals[footnote]I believe in gay rights and everything, I just don't want them near me.[/footnote] because of an incident that happened to me when I was 8-10. All the other kids involved in the incident were around my same age group, and I was the only one who hadn't been exposed to porn yet.

If you still can't figure out my answer to the question, read through the above sentence a few times. You guys are smart, you'll figure it out.

 

[Bon_Clay]

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This, a thousand times this.

Both of you bring up excellent points, but I believe the truth is in the middle. We are much less innocent in some ways and much more innocent in others. Think of sex for instance. People are exposed to sex early and often today in various media, from books to movies to television and especially the Internet. However, not as long ago as you think and still in many parts of the world today, people used to or are having sex in the same room as other people, including possibly relatives or even their children because sex had or has different taboos in previous times or other cultures. Another example would be violence, for similar reasons.

It all comes down to different cultures and societies. We (at least North Americans; I cannot speak for the rest of the world) are a much different group of people than we were even 60 years ago and especially so than a century ago. Much has changed, including our innocence and naivete.

I still think the first part regarding TV just comes down to our perceptions. We've become a lot more sensitive and obsessed over controlling sex and violence. At the ages a lot of people discover internet porn today, you used to be basically ready for marriage in the past.

I honestly don't believe there has been any fundamental change to human's interest in sex or violence, just the ways and amount to which we are allowed to explore and express them. Nudity is a big deal because its covered up and treated like a big deal. Murder (outside of losing a loved one) is shocking because all the adults say how shocking it is, so you agree and eventually express the same thing (by that time genuinely) to your kids.

 

[Dark Knifer]

Well since it is a fact that all humans do bad things and that it's been like that forever, did we ever have an age of complete innocence? I somehow doubt it.

 

[tkioz]

Well since it is a fact that all humans do bad things and that it's been like that forever, did we ever have an age of complete innocence? I somehow doubt it.

Innocence isn't a physical state, it's a mental state.

For example if someone told me that, let's say Canada, was rounding up every non-Caucasian and sterilising them I wouldn't necessarily believe it was happening, but I would believe that it could happen, innocence is being unable to think such a thing is possible.

 

[Dark Knifer]

Well since it is a fact that all humans do bad things and that it's been like that forever, did we ever have an age of complete innocence? I somehow doubt it.

Innocence isn't a physical state, it's a mental state.

For example if someone told me that, let's say Canada, was rounding up every non-Caucasian and sterilising them I wouldn't necessarily believe it was happening, but I would believe that it could happen, innocence is being unable to think such a thing is possible.

WIkipedia:
Innocence is a term used to indicate a general lack of guilt, with respect to any kind of crime, sin, or wrongdoing.

I can see your point however and going back to OT, if we look back through history we weren't really that innocent. Millions would die just for profit and land so all that really changes overtime is what the big injustice is. In truth, we all lose our innocence shortly after we have been born so injustice is bound to happen.