Brad Pitt Will Tank You Very Much in Fury

[youji itami]

In any case, a part of my sighs at the prospects that this'll be another "Let's make another glorify-the-US WW2 movie" and all that military heroism porn. But at the same time; woooo tanks and explosions and action yay!

Even though WW2 was a fight for control of the world, which the Americans primarily won and thus became the most powerful empire in human history, it can be reimagined as a fight against the evil Nazis - just like the war in Iraq, which is primarily about regional domination and control of key resources (especially oil) can be reimagined as a fight against irrational terrorists or for the pseudo-intellectuals a fight against an emergent global caliphate.

Nazis made WW2 colonizable to the fantasies and imaginations of Americans who long to believe themselves noble. This colonizing has been such a success that "evil Hitler" became "evil Saddam Hussein" when Americans needed to feel noble over their actions in Iraq and "evil Osama bin Laden" when Americans needed to feel noble over their actions in Afghanistan.

The successful result of marketing shapes the definition of future marketing. The purpose is to construct a version of history useful to the beneficiaries of war - this version is neither true nor false - truth and lies become judged for how useful they are within the propaganda model and accepted, rejected, or more often twisted, accordingly.

One of the most terrifying aspects of reality to me is that individual Americans do precisely the same thing. They establish a propaganda model *for themselves* and then each piece of reality or fiction that they experience is manipulated to benefit the model, which fuels their sense of well-being. When confronted they explain that there's something called "subjectivity" which accounts for this - it's therefore totally fine. Reality serves US, not the other way around. Anyone who believes otherwise is simply not a "good citizen".

I'm pretty sure the Russian's would have a thing to say about the idea that the USA primarily won WW2 when it was the Russians who beat the Germans and that the western contribution was helpful but not essiential.

Look up Operation Bagration in the Eastern Front were in between 22 June ? 19 August 1944 a less than 2 months long offensive a 1 million strong German army was crushed by the Russian's.

In comparison 1.5 million German soldiers fought the Allies throughout the entire 6th June 1944 - 8th May 1945 period.

 

[youji itami]

But the Sherman was inferior to both British and German tanks. Though not saying this movement wont be great if they play on that fact that they are facing an enemy with far superior vehicles. Lets hope they take into account their were other countries involved instead of the usual lies and rewriting history that USA war movies normally do.

Hoping its realistic in the same vein as Saving Private Ryan. Should be a fun movie.

British tanks were crap that's why the we here in the UK were so happy to get M3 Lee's and M4 Sherman's it's the gun's that sucked (at least by 1943) but we had the 17lb'er so no problem there.

Yeah, should edit my comment a bit to read that the British tank had a better gun for attacking German tanks (USA had smaller rounds). The German tank was better in main gun power and armour protection. But from what i remember wasnt the German tanks overly complicated to make?

Well the Tiger 2 and Panther were overcomplicated and they are very famous but the Panzer 4, Tiger 1 and the multiple tank destroyers Germany fielded were no worse in reliability than what the US and UK used.

The problem was where the repair station's were kept. The German's kept there repair units in Germany with the idea being the damaged tanks would be sent back to be repaired and while that was fine over a short distance campaign like Poland or France once they invaded Russia and North Africa it didn't work so well while the Russians and Allies kept there repair units closer to the front.

 

[Scorpid]

But the Sherman was inferior to both British and German tanks. Though not

Hoping its realistic in the same vein as Saving Private Ryan. Should be a fun movie.

Depends on what and how you call a tank worse.
The M4 did well. The myth that German tanks were much better... really is getting old

I guess id go for armour and main gun power as you can destroy the enemy and they cant do much to you. But then USA/UK had thinner armour but better maneuverability so I guess you could say they are better as they are harder to hit. But as you said, it does depend on what a person views what makes a better tank. I guess we can both agree it then comes down to strategy and the quality of the tank drivers.

Well, the Shermans were much more modable, much cheaper to maintain and use. Much more reliable against all but the latest models of battle tested German designs.

So, I as a battle commander, would prefer the M4 Sherman to Tigers and Panthers. And Panzer 4s thogh.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BrlmaRvzsvw

This documentary makes me strongly disagree with you. In the trailer the Sherman and Tiger were just trading blows at point blank and the Sherman just took it. That came off as sketchy history unless they were deflecting the shots which it didn't look like they were.

 

[Frost27]

In any case, a part of my sighs at the prospects that this'll be another "Let's make another glorify-the-US WW2 movie" and all that military heroism porn. But at the same time; woooo tanks and explosions and action yay!

Even though WW2 was a fight for control of the world, which the Americans primarily won and thus became the most powerful empire in human history, it can be reimagined as a fight against the evil Nazis - just like the war in Iraq, which is primarily about regional domination and control of key resources (especially oil) can be reimagined as a fight against irrational terrorists or for the pseudo-intellectuals a fight against an emergent global caliphate.

Nazis made WW2 colonizable to the fantasies and imaginations of Americans who long to believe themselves noble. This colonizing has been such a success that "evil Hitler" became "evil Saddam Hussein" when Americans needed to feel noble over their actions in Iraq and "evil Osama bin Laden" when Americans needed to feel noble over their actions in Afghanistan.

The successful result of marketing shapes the definition of future marketing. The purpose is to construct a version of history useful to the beneficiaries of war - this version is neither true nor false - truth and lies become judged for how useful they are within the propaganda model and accepted, rejected, or more often twisted, accordingly.

One of the most terrifying aspects of reality to me is that individual Americans do precisely the same thing. They establish a propaganda model *for themselves* and then each piece of reality or fiction that they experience is manipulated to benefit the model, which fuels their sense of well-being. When confronted they explain that there's something called "subjectivity" which accounts for this - it's therefore totally fine. Reality serves US, not the other way around. Anyone who believes otherwise is simply not a "good citizen".

I'm pretty sure the Russian's would have a thing to say about the idea that the USA primarily won WW2 when it was the Russians who beat the Germans and that the western contribution was helpful but not essiential.

Look up Operation Bagration in the Eastern Front were in between 22 June ? 19 August 1944 a less than 2 months long offensive a 1 million strong German army was crushed by the Russian's.

In comparison 1.5 million German soldiers fought the Allies throughout the entire 6th June 1944 - 8th May 1945 period.

We didn't so much "Win and become the most powerful empire..." As we bounced back and experienced the greatest post war cultural boom out of everyone on earth because out of everyone that fought the war, we were the only ones that didn't get our infrastructure crippled and cities wiped out by it. The U.S. had nowhere to go but up. So while we were experiencing the "Baby Boom" and a post war cultural explosion, our allies like Great Britain still had rationing in effect on some resources until the 70's and 80's.

Essentially, the U.S. got lucky because the war was fought there, not here, and left us with no rebuilding.

 

[Marc Shakter]

Ok, everyone trolling here from the WOT forums, this is about a movie, not a historical debate, get out of the pool and go home... Now.