Building a Better Ghostbuster

VaporWare

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So, this morning I found myself contemplating what would go into making a better remake of the Ghostbusters franchise than the one we got. Before I go on, let me emphasize: this isn't really a suggestion or a list of demands or anything like that. I have exactly zero expectation that anyone relevant to making decisions about the franchise will ever lay eyes on this let alone give so much as half a dry fart about my ideas.

I don't even really intend this as a criticism of the new film (I haven't had a chance to watch the whole thing myself, but I hear it's living up to my expectations of it). It's just a fun thought experiment and I thought I'd toss it out there and see if anyone else had their own thoughts to share.

Starting with the basic concept: group of friends starting up a business together. This is a somewhat different process now than it was in the 80's, and there's a lot of tools and processes out there that didn't really exist back then.

Consider bringing in things like Kickstarter and Patreon to establish their funding. Can work in some commentary about the ups and downs of crowdfunding ambitious, out-there projects like paranormal investigation. This is also a good starting point for the inevitable skepticism of their project to flow from, as well as expanding on the original's undelivered idea of franchising ("backers above the umpteen dollar level get a PKE Meter phone attachment kit once we've got production on working units" et cetera, look into pumping AR stuff for marketing...think Pokemon Go but with ghosts?).

Who are they? A three-person starting team works for a lot of reasons...you have room for a decent set of personality dynamics like Spengler, Venkman and Stantz (The Vulcan, the Sleaze and the Enthusiastic Puppy in the case of the original), and room for new characters to slot in as the story unfolds (Melnitz, Tully, Barret and Zeddemore) at relevant points without getting too cluttered.

Let's assume a final cast layout similar to the original, with three-and-a-half leads and a few support characters. Who should they be? The original three each played a key role in making the Ghostbusters business plausible: Spengler brought the hard* science and technical know-how, Stantz brought enthusiasm, soul and, with assistance from Venkman's exploitative cleverness, the funding. If we're doing the Kickstarting route, this dynamic changes a bit since nobody needs to talk Stantz into taking out a horrible mortgage on the family farm.

Spengler and Stantz honestly need the fewest changes here in concept. I would probably reframe Stantz as much more clearly the 'true believer' character, someone who is completely into and certain of the paranormal even before Spengler proves anything. If Stantz has a fault, it's a willingness to believe /prior/ to evidence, contrasted against Spengler's relative cynicism and skepticism.

Venkman can still function well as their interface with normal people, and I think I'd dial that up a bit. Bring Venkman in as a 'science communicator' type, an enthusiastic and affable yet somewhat sketchy YouTuber decent at pulling in clicks but known for being a bit of a regurgitation artist if not an outright content thief (gives the character some growth-room as they start dealing with things first-hand).

Between the three of them, they form the idea for the Ghostbuster project/business, Venkman throws together a crowdfunding page and, the internet being what it is, money and drama flow like water from a broken hydrant.

The initial success gets them the resources they need to assemble their prototype gear and get to started. Around here we can bring in the Melnitz and Tulley characters. I'm fond of the idea of slotting Melnitz in as their sysadmin, someone they bring on to handle the nuts-and-bolts of their internet presence, social media, et cetera (somebody has to keep an eye on the containment grid while the team is out on a job, right?). Venkman makes a good 'face', but somebody has to actually run things.

They'll need Tulley in as their legal representation, especially once the opposition starts cropping up (Melnitz and Tully also form a decent place for the inevitable shipping/romance side-story if they both spend most of their time in the office, and that could give some social play for the main cast as they encourage the two...emphasize that these are /relatively/ normal people doing relatively normal jobs in the presence of paranormal craziness), and at some point Zeddemore slots in as the 'everyman' new-hire. I don't think these characters need to change much in their dynamics. Whoever else Zeddemore is, they are for our purposes the grounded, unexaggerated everyday random-person-on-the-street looking for a job. Zeddemore is there to play off the more extreme personalities of the first three leads, with grounding dialog and perspective.

For opposition, in the original we had the EPA. They could still be relevant here, but environmental issues are somewhat less at the forefront. Skeptics of the paranormal are an obvious grab, but I think it would be more interesting to talk about the implications of someone actually finding out ghosts are real. What's the civil right's position for the dead, you know? If a ghost is still capable of thinking, speaking and so forth, do they have the right to vote? Stand trial? Witness? Do #DeadLivesMatter?

How does this affect people who fake the paranormal to exploit people? What about people are /actually are/ psychic and have been struggling under the preponderance of frauds and the difficulty of validating their techniques (Barret might fit in well here in some format, as a latent psychic being accosted by the big-bad-evil-ghost?).

I'd like to re-imagine the Peck character as one of the fakes, someone who has made a tidy living bullshitting people about the wellbeing of their dearly departed Aunt Annie. At first, they might see the Ghostbusters in a friendly light, assuming them to be every bit as fake as Peck is and hoping to weasel in on the act. There's a lot of room for play here, especially as the Ghostbusters' legitimacy threatens their business and steals or agitates their audience ("You lied to us!" style of thing).

Alternatively, there's also room for antagonism from the government/military. Setting aside the paranormal angle, proton packs as compact directed energy weapons could definitely draw their attention, though I think this would ultimately be a minor thread with everything else going on.

What about Gozer/Zuul/Clortho? A paranormal film should culminate in a confrontation with a paranormal antagonist, and Gozer is a solid entry for this role. Something above and beyond all the petty human bullshit, that reduces all the squabbles of people like Peck to dust on the wind, and can be boiling away quietly in the background while no-one is paying enough attention. Ultimately, as a trio, they can target Barret, Melnitz and Tully as a way of highlighting the direct confrontation between the Team and the less savory elements of the metaphysical world...depriving the protagonists of critical support and undermining them as would-be heroes. If we wanted to we could drag Peck in as their Zeddemore analog for a sort of 4v4 face-off of Mortal Heroes against Lovecraftian Gods and Minions.

While I would like to see more paranormal exploration rooted in real-world mythology, I don't think Gozer really needs to change at all for the purposes of the film. This character's motivations should be fairly alien and implacable, less a villain anyone could relate to and more a natural disaster that can look down on you.

Anyway, I think this text wall is just about high enough on my account.

tl:dr, What would /you/ do if you were handed the IP rights to Ghostbusters and tasked with laying out the framework of a reboot for current audiences? What changes would you make, and why? What elements of the original would you keep, if any?
 

Saelune

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Wouldn't make it a reboot for one. Just have the original group quit/disappear (depending on if they cameo in the film or not) and a new group decides to take on the mantle. Then I would...not make the cast a gimmick.

As for the actual plot, well, maybe deal with how is life years later where ghosts are just pests like rats or bugs? Maybe the villain is a ghost who wants to make the living fear them again, instead of being considered a joke.
 

Silentpony_v1legacy

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I'd start with Ghostbusters being a government service, like police or firefighters. Meaning some lazy ones, some hard working ones, prejudice and political drama. The works.
I'd add psychics who can communicate with the dead and basically talk them out of hauntings.
I'd add a level of humanity to the ghosts. Some are confused, in denial, want closure, want to help solve their death, want revenge, etc. Different motivation beyond scaring Markiplier.
If I have to keep the reboot cast, Gilbert is a disgraced ex-team leader who lost her entire team, Yates is an eager but naive recruit, Patty is following in her uncle's footsteps, and Holtzman is a eccentric psychic.
And those three are a team in training.
And the A team is led by Hemsworth, Erin's ex boyfriend, with Rowan his second in command, Bill Murray as Venkman, and I dunno, Michelle Rodriguez as a no nonsense action girl.
And the plot starts when Rowan betrays his team to get God like powers. Murray is killed heroically, Hemsworth looses his memory, and Rodriguez is possessed.
And Erin has to come out of retirement to lead the B team, stop Rowan and save the world. And there's a subplot on Erin wanting to get back together with Thor, but mindful of the moral ambiguity of it all.
And maybe a few other subplots. Party wants her uncle's approval, Holtzmann is looking for her dead brother, and McCarthy is trying to prove herself or whatever.
 

Breakdown

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I'd have a sequel, retaining the female cast. In the years following the first film, paranormal studies degrees have become popular at colleges. However, there have been no actual ghost sightings after the second film, and the paranormal studies field has gradually become a total joke. In the present, Wiig and McCarthy (I dunno what their characters were called) are the last two professors who take this field of studies seriously, McCarthy is a true believer while Wiig just wants a position without any actual responsibilities and no work involved.

A new supernatural event occurs and the authorities turn to our heroes as experts. Wiig is naturally horrified at this, and tries to pass the buck to the original Ghostbusters instead. They're all retired or busy (and Egon is dead), but Wiig and McCarthy get access to their old equipment, which is a lockup somewhere. They rope in an eccentric Physics professor to try to figure out how it all works, while the authorities insist on having a military officer to act as liaison and to secretly spy on them (Jones). Together, the four characters must defeat the evil menace and save the world!

I'd avoid the New York setting in favour of somewhere boring and unglamorous, maybe a coastal town for a Lovecraft vibe.
 

DrownedAmmet

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Breakdown said:
I'd have a sequel, retaining the female cast. In the years following the first film, paranormal studies degrees have become popular at colleges. However, there have been no actual ghost sightings after the second film, and the paranormal studies field has gradually become a total joke. In the present, Wiig and McCarthy (I dunno what their characters were called) are the last two professors who take this field of studies seriously, McCarthy is a true believer while Wiig just wants a position without any actual responsibilities and no work involved.

A new supernatural event occurs and the authorities turn to our heroes as experts. Wiig is naturally horrified at this, and tries to pass the buck to the original Ghostbusters instead. They're all retired or busy (and Egon is dead), but Wiig and McCarthy get access to their old equipment, which is a lockup somewhere. They rope in an eccentric Physics professor to try to figure out how it all works, while the authorities insist on having a military officer to act as liaison and to secretly spy on them (Jones). Together, the four characters must defeat the evil menace and save the world!

I'd avoid the New York setting in favour of somewhere boring and unglamorous, maybe a coastal town for a Lovecraft vibe.
Yeah, it seems so obvious that they should have made it an actual sequel and threw in some references to the first film (Does slimer even feature in the reboot? ) There's so much they could have built on
 

Breakdown

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DrownedAmmet said:
Breakdown said:
I'd have a sequel, retaining the female cast. In the years following the first film, paranormal studies degrees have become popular at colleges. However, there have been no actual ghost sightings after the second film, and the paranormal studies field has gradually become a total joke. In the present, Wiig and McCarthy (I dunno what their characters were called) are the last two professors who take this field of studies seriously, McCarthy is a true believer while Wiig just wants a position without any actual responsibilities and no work involved.

A new supernatural event occurs and the authorities turn to our heroes as experts. Wiig is naturally horrified at this, and tries to pass the buck to the original Ghostbusters instead. They're all retired or busy (and Egon is dead), but Wiig and McCarthy get access to their old equipment, which is a lockup somewhere. They rope in an eccentric Physics professor to try to figure out how it all works, while the authorities insist on having a military officer to act as liaison and to secretly spy on them (Jones). Together, the four characters must defeat the evil menace and save the world!

I'd avoid the New York setting in favour of somewhere boring and unglamorous, maybe a coastal town for a Lovecraft vibe.
Yeah, it seems so obvious that they should have made it an actual sequel and threw in some references to the first film (Does slimer even feature in the reboot? ) There's so much they could have built on
Yeah, I think they missed an open goal. The franchise was wide open for a sequel, once you decide not to use the original cast. Compared to say, Highlander...
 

Erttheking

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Not sure it would've mattered. Things are so freaking divided on the internet that people would've hated it and praised on principle. So why bother making it better?
 

Recusant

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Here's another thought: don't make it a comedy. Think about it: we have firm, absolute proof of an afterlife, of sorts, and people's response is to hire a group of unvetted thugs to grab the souls/psychic remnants/whatever of their ancestors and store them in a locker for all eternity? I always saw the original movie as a hybrid of Invasion of the Body Snatchers and Logan's Run. It's an easy adaptation for horror.
 

Redd the Sock

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Premise: A relation of Walter Peck is majoring in environmental sciences when she has a life threatening paranormal experience. Not sure what to do she talks to the "weird" classmate (we'll use Hotlzman) she's known for years but never really talked to for advice. Holtzman is a fan of the now defunct Ghostbusters and knows how to get into contact with them. The go to the firehouse where, probably Ray, is there keeping the containment unit going and trying to find a way to do more than hold the ghost, but send them back to the ghost dimension. He spells out that they never expected the extermination aspect of the gig to be as serious as it was. That Venkman expected to spend most of their time providing a non-service to people that hear noises in the night and occasionally getting something legit to study, but surprisingly hit a real problem due to major paranormal events (why ghosts are only seen around major end of the world crises) that left them with a permanent bomb needing to be dealt with. Holtzman savantly solves the problem, and they start the tasks of sending the currently contained ghosts back where they came from, dealing with a new wane of paranormal events, and finding the cause this time before it gets too bad with Peck hanging around because she remembers Walter's stories and wants to keep them by the book and less prone to nuclear explosions. She actually brings in 2 friends to fill the ranks and keep an eye on Ray Holtzman.

The development: The cause is linked to the mood slime, which had never gone away, just lain dormant, but now is being used by Roawn, who is exactly what is was in the remake: an uber nerd filled with anger and wanting revenge on the world. He is quickly dealt with, but (here's the twist and the social commentary) Peck and the other 2 see the slime as a threat that will exist as long as there is negativity and hatred in the world, and using family contacts, prove the existence of the slime to the world and start pushing social justice issues with a heavy use of social media. Ray and Holtzman have doubts about this but are ignored as they were they were nerds like Rowan and didn't know any better. After a montage of seemingly good actions, the slime really blows up gaining sentience. It have been using Rowan to build hate, but found they had done it better as most of the people that had been taking actions had been doing so out of one form of anger or another (the it's not justice, it's revenge, greed, and narcissism angle) which in turn creates hatred in those they're trying to force changes upon against those trying to force the change, which creates more hate in the first group.

The ending: Going back to Holtzman for help, it's spelled out how much of our culture and media perpetuates the idea that one's life should be perfect and to hate things that keep it from being so, even oneself. Holtzman technobabbles a solution that banishes the slime after cracking the hatred shell with Peck realizing how all her actions were due to her hatred of the Ghostbusters and the paranormal pushed on her by Walter for his own mistakes and she had to let that go.
 

BloatedGuppy

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erttheking said:
Not sure it would've mattered. Things are so freaking divided on the internet that people would've hated it and praised on principle. So why bother making it better?
Because films are still entities distinct from their reception or position in online culture squabbles? Because the end goal of a creative endeavor should typically be to deliver the best possible end result, either creatively or...if you're aiming for more commercial ends...in terms of popular acclaim.

While I think the strength of the Ghostbusters IP is rooted in a single iconic film and likely doesn't have anywhere near the legs or potential people consistently insist it does, there was room for a decently put together Ghostbusters 3, rather than a cynical "brand re-launch" with a poorly cobbled together tent pole at its heart.
 

Erttheking

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BloatedGuppy said:
erttheking said:
Not sure it would've mattered. Things are so freaking divided on the internet that people would've hated it and praised on principle. So why bother making it better?
Because films are still entities distinct from their reception or position in online culture squabbles? Because the end goal of a creative endeavor should typically be to deliver the best possible end result, either creatively or...if you're aiming for more commercial ends...in terms of popular acclaim.

While I think the strength of the Ghostbusters IP is rooted in a single iconic film and likely doesn't have anywhere near the legs or potential people consistently insist it does, there was room for a decently put together Ghostbusters 3, rather than a cynical "brand re-launch" with a poorly cobbled together tent pole at its heart.
To people off the internet, most certainly. But truth be told, when it comes to people on the internet, the new Ghostbusters could've been absolute dogshit or a masterpiece that surpassed the original, and the battle lines would've only shifted moderately. That's mainly the context from which I'm coming at.
 

BloatedGuppy

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erttheking said:
To people off the internet, most certainly. But truth be told, when it comes to people on the internet, the new Ghostbusters could've been absolute dogshit or a masterpiece that surpassed the original, and the battle lines would've only shifted moderately. That's mainly the context from which I'm coming at.
If you want to address attitude polarization in online discussion, implying there is "no point" in improving media because "the internet" won't properly value it regardless probably isn't the best way to go about it. More than anything, it suggests you've become just as polarized as the people you're complaining about.

Yeah a lot of stupid-ass things were said about "Ghostbusters", but a lot of perfectly sensible conversation was had about it too. It's not actually THAT hard to divest oneself from encamped shit-flinging online. No one has a gun to your head forcing you to read YouTube comments or get into flame wars on Twitter.
 

Erttheking

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BloatedGuppy said:
erttheking said:
To people off the internet, most certainly. But truth be told, when it comes to people on the internet, the new Ghostbusters could've been absolute dogshit or a masterpiece that surpassed the original, and the battle lines would've only shifted moderately. That's mainly the context from which I'm coming at.
If you want to address attitude polarization in online discussion, implying there is "no point" in improving media because "the internet" won't properly value it regardless probably isn't the best way to go about it. More than anything, it suggests you've become just as polarized as the people you're complaining about.

Yeah a lot of stupid-ass things were said about "Ghostbusters", but a lot of perfectly sensible conversation was had about it too. It's not actually THAT hard to divest oneself from encamped shit-flinging online. No one has a gun to your head forcing you to read YouTube comments or get into flame wars on Twitter.
Yeah probably. I'm not going to lie, I'm very bitter towards the internet right now, and I find it hard to be interested in things the way I used to be. It's sucked the happiness out of me, made me not want to bother with the things I used to care about because I don't want to deal with all of the cunts.

*Sigh* Truth be told, the Escapist is pretty much the online website I talk to people on. I never really bothered to find another place, it's all I said. And the attitudes around here...heh. Well. I don't need to spell it out for you.
 

BloatedGuppy

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erttheking said:
Yeah probably. I'm not going to lie, I'm very bitter towards the internet right now, and I find it hard to be interested in things the way I used to be. It's sucked the happiness out of me, made me not want to bother with the things I used to care about because I don't want to deal with all of the cunts.

*Sigh* Truth be told, the Escapist is pretty much the online website I talk to people on. I never really bothered to find another place, it's all I said. And the attitudes around here...heh. Well. I don't need to spell it out for you.
At some point you need to be able/willing to filter your own experience if you don't want to poison your brain with garbage. The Escapist is an alright site...it's hardly irredeemable. Are there contentious/inflammatory posters and contentious/inflammatory opinions to be found? Absolutely. Exposure to same could even be said to be intellectually healthy, in small doses. You need to be able to walk away, find a different thread, laugh it off, not engage, etc, etc, etc. If you treat internet forums like hills to die on, or even accurate mirrors of average human psychology, you're really setting yourself up for a bad time. Negative experiences tend to take primacy, so you're going to remember the 10 page thread dominated by a sociopathic mushroom and not so much the perfectly sane individuals talking around them, or the hundreds of same going about their lives in your building or neighborhood.

Go Google up some "Faith in Humanity" threads and videos and give yourself a colonic. And next time you read some idiot shrieking hateful bullshit online, remember that children exist, that a large portion or even a MAJORITY of these people are Poes or Trolls, put in the proper perspective, and chuckle it away. You can't cure idiocy by consuming it. You CAN turn yourself into an embittered, angry person though. Not terribly constructive as a long term goal.
 

sageoftruth

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I know this is probably too far our of left field to be considered a sequel or a re-make, but how about it takes place after the Ghostbusters expire, and they suddenly find themselves being pursued by the organization they helped created?
 

KissingSunlight

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I watched the original Ghostbusters couple of years ago. My reaction was that they caught lightning in a bottle. The success of the movie was hinged on the chemistry that Harold Ramis, Dan Aykroyd, and Bill Murray had with each other. These three actors have known and worked with each other for over ten years before they made the movie.

Best thing for Ghostbusters is to leave it alone. If you want to do an original movie inspired by the premise of Ghostbuster, I would recommend it. Even the original guys stumbled when they tried to make a sequel to Ghostbusters.
 

VaporWare

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KissingSunlight said:
I watched the original Ghostbusters couple of years ago. My reaction was that they caught lightning in a bottle. The success of the movie was hinged on the chemistry that Harold Ramis, Dan Aykroyd, and Bill Murray had with each other. These three actors have known and worked with each other for over ten years before they made the movie.

Best thing for Ghostbusters is to leave it alone. If you want to do an original movie inspired by the premise of Ghostbuster, I would recommend it. Even the original guys stumbled when they tried to make a sequel to Ghostbusters.
Ezekiel said:
Never really felt Ghostbusters needed a sequel or reboot. The movie is good enough on its own. Probably better for it too.
erttheking said:
Not sure it would've mattered. Things are so freaking divided on the internet that people would've hated it and praised on principle. So why bother making it better?
Again, this isn't really supposed to be about could or should or even realistic expectations. It's just a thought exercise: imagine you're a production assistant or something in Hollywood and your boss has just handed you a Ghostbusters project. I was riffing off of reboots initially, but some folks have ideas for sequels or spinoffs, and that's interesting too.

Presuming you /had/ to, what would you do or not do to try to make it work (or, I suppose, fail spectacularly if you wanted to discourage people from doing it again) as best you could?