CD Projekt Admits Writing Letters to Pirates Doesn't Help

[Neonit]

snip

its a strange game.... the only winning move is not to play.

OT: i can see why publishers would hate the idea of piracy, but to be honest, at this point i think they should "write it off" as marketing budget, and save on the DRM costs.... DRM is a system - the first thing that people must know about systems is that none is 100% fail-proof and every system can be broken.

in the end, you waste money, piss off your customers, and AT SOME POINT it will still be cracked, 9 out of 10 times it will be a simple exe to be copy pasted - much simpler for pirates than customers who have to jump the hoops to play the game they bought.

yes, you could argue that if it is easier (as in, no drm at all) more people will pirate, but come on, at this point cracking a game is so easy im pretty sure its of no concern.

and threatening people will post.... i dunno, it just seems silly to me.

They don't need it to be perfect, though. They just need it to last long enough that people decide it's easier to pick it up in the store during the three weeks or so that the developers have the shelf-space than it is to find a working pirated copy.

yeah, but lets be honest here. 3 weeks? those are awesome drm systems, those the publishers will "advertise" basically saying "try this you pirate scum!" and they happen once every X years.
in most cases, the game will be up and running in a day. 3 days if it is a reasonable drm. and lets not forget about those legendary cases where the game was playable MONTHS before the LAUNCH. those happen more often than one week protection drm.

thats why i have to wonder whenever it is worth it. and dont just say "well, apparently - seeing as they keep doing it" because frankly, there are a lot of silly business decisions involved in gaming industry atm.

i see what you are getting at, but i dont think thats the reason why they keep making their little drm systems. you see, i think they do this to make their "investors" happy. "look at us, we are trying to protect your money from being stolen! so dont leave with your money and stay with us!" because i have to wonder whenever they REALLY believe their drm systems to be worthwhile.

also, lets not forget that piracy is the "get out of weak sales" card.

 

[RhombusHatesYou]

I don't know if this is feasible, but i would implement a system like a usb pass. Meaning that every copy of the game would have a piece of hardware that has a hardwired algorithm. The algorithm on the usb will be used for many parts through the game.

The piece of hardware you're talking about is called a dongle and they used to be quite popular with high end professional software. They fell out of favour because they were expensive and not much of a barrier to skilled crackers.

 

[RhombusHatesYou]

i see what you are getting at, but i dont think thats the reason why they keep making their little drm systems. you see, i think they do this to make their "investors" happy. "look at us, we are trying to protect your money from being stolen! so dont leave with your money and stay with us!" because i have to wonder whenever they REALLY believe their drm systems to be worthwhile.

Close... it's not so much about keeping investors as it is having preventing investors and others with a financial stake suing them to buggery for 'failure to take reasonable measures to protect their investment', which can even result in forfeiture of IP.

 

[Doom972]

I don't see what those "fans" should have against it. I don't mind if their next game gets extra funding from lawsuits against pirates. As long as the pirates suffer and not the customers, anything they do against piracy is fine by me.

 

[Entitled]

Your problem is with the whole retail sales industry and the concept of limited shelf space. Best of luck on your crusade, Mr. Quixote.

Digital downloads make retail obselete.

And thankfully I don't have to crusade against anything, I most assuredly like the direction in which things are going.

 

[RubyT]

I wish pirates would just go and bury themselves to be honest

How would that help the developer?

 

[Baldry]

I read the title and thought they'd sent legitimate letters, like not once that were gonna prosecute but kinda like "Dear sir or madam it has come to our attention you have pirated our game and we'd like if instead you went out and bought the game, please. It would mean a lot to us" Which personally I think would've worked better and been an awesome story.

 

[BrotherRool]

I wish pirates would just go and bury themselves to be honest

How would that help the developer?

Well okay, I wish pirates would become honest and buy games they play.

..it probably still would help though. Piracy is basically a social problem, like all crimes at the very core, I've got a friend whose pretty cool with admitting he's a pirate and that's not socially unacceptable for him and actually shutting him down on that would be pretty rude. It's not the same as admitting you took a bike or even stole someones Youtube video and made money off it.

If it was a little less common there'd be less new pirates 'cos of social pressure.

 

[Knight Templar]

Oh wow Escapist,

Title: "CD Projekt Admits Writing Letters to Pirates Doesn't Help"

Content: "Michal Nowakowski, VP of Business Development, went so far as to say that, as far as he knew, "the vast majority of people identified decided to admit to piracy and pay the compensation as a means of settlement.""

Not sure if bias or just plain old sloppy?

Did you read the entire article?
""We're not afraid to say that wasn't the best choice and best solution we could have done," said Szóstak. "And that's why we kind of resigned and we don't do it anymore.""

 

[lolobar]

First of all respect to CD Projeckt for admitting their "error".

I understand what they tried to do and this is against their good willed nature.

I'm trying to put myself in their shoes. It's difficult to defend against piracy and at the same time not to create problems for paying customers.

I don't know if this is feasible, but i would implement a system like a usb pass. Meaning that every copy of the game would have a piece of hardware that has a hardwired algorithm. The algorithm on the usb will be used for many parts through the game. If you don't have the usb keycard, the game will be broken.

The usb though will not be a flash drive. If it is a flash drive then just copying it would break the system. In my imagination it would be a piece of hardware. Making it hard to replicate.

The paying customers buy the game with the usb pass. They install the game put on the usb and everything's fine. This works for as many years as you want.

The pirate may get the game, but cannot have a usb pass unless they construct, or buy one.

Sounds good right?

Sounds terrible. The production costs per copy go through the roof, it is impossible to digitally distribute, the consumer now has to keep track of the usb device instead of just the disk itself and pirates have a tiny modification to the game .exe that points it at an equally tiny .dll pile with the same algorithm on it. What you are proposing is ubidrm but reliant on millions of usb devices, which is even dumber then a single server somewhere.

Darn it... i thought i had it
He, you're right though!

 

[Neonit]

i see what you are getting at, but i dont think thats the reason why they keep making their little drm systems. you see, i think they do this to make their "investors" happy. "look at us, we are trying to protect your money from being stolen! so dont leave with your money and stay with us!" because i have to wonder whenever they REALLY believe their drm systems to be worthwhile.

Close... it's not so much about keeping investors as it is having preventing investors and others with a financial stake suing them to buggery for 'failure to take reasonable measures to protect their investment', which can even result in forfeiture of IP.

thats an even beter theory, didnt think about that.
yep, the law might just be crazy enough for this to be feasible.

still, it all comes back to the point of game industry being in wrong hands.
oh well, thats the way of any kind of media, it had to hit the gaming as well.

 

[Lonewolfm16]

Oh wow Escapist,

Title: "CD Projekt Admits Writing Letters to Pirates Doesn't Help"

Content: "Michal Nowakowski, VP of Business Development, went so far as to say that, as far as he knew, "the vast majority of people identified decided to admit to piracy and pay the compensation as a means of settlement.""

Not sure if bias or just plain old sloppy?

Not to be a dick or anything, but did you even read the bloody post before you quoted it for its supposed bias? Or were you just too sloppy?

I wish pirates would just go and bury themselves to be honest, it's annoying to see good people bending over backwards to accommodate them and going through all this hassle and doing stupid things that annoy the fans, all because some people want to be able to have things they can't/won't pay for

The world is a pretty simple place: convince people to give you money for the hard work that you've done. If enough people don't purchase the things you like, then the things you like won't be made anymore. Crying that pirates aren't paying for products does nothing. Either enough people pay for content they like, or the company should go bust. Free market people. It might suck sometimes, but that's life.

The issue is that in a fee-market you pay someone to provide a good or service. Pirates take a good/service without paying for it therefore making the company who produces it unable to turn a profit from their aquistion of that good/service. As far as free-market economics go pirates are essentialy equivilant to thieves.

 

[Sonic Doctor]

I for one think it is bizarre how people think it is right for CD Projekt to have to apologize for going after pirates, when the were actually going after pirates and not paying customers.

How is it not sane for them to send a letter to people they know that are pirates and played their products without paying and saying they will sue if they aren't compensated?

If anything, true fans of CD Projekt should be throwing their full support and praising CD projekt for going to get the money they are owed.

I think CD Projekt was in the right here, as far as policy goes. The way they played those policies (i.e. politics [read: pandering to the public]) goes against the innovation of creative enterprise. I think it's honourable that they tried to do the right thing, but the fact that they didn't stick with their convictions makes them spineless and I'm not sure what's worse; if they would have let pirates get away with it in the first place or giving up in the end.

I think the worse part is that they are saying they are sorry for going after pirates for stealing their products, and saying it was an error on their part. They have every right to sue people that steal from them.

(To people thinking of arguing about my "stealing" remark. Don't even try to convince me that pirating/downloading a free copy of a game isn't stealing. You will never change my mind on that subject. I will always have the stance that I will always know as fact that taking something without paying is stealing, no matter how you try to wrap the crime with newfangled labels and such stupid stuff. If you don't pay, you have stolen stuff. Physical or not, by doing such, you have experienced something you have no right to if you haven't paid.)

 

[Doom972]

When will software companies learn? Every pirated copy is NOT a guaranteed lost sale! NO PRODUCT IS TAKEN OFF THE SHELVES! NO SALES ARE LOST!

Some of them are guaranteed sale, in the case where pirating wasn't an option. I admit that some probably don't have the money or just don't buy stuff other than necessities and tasteless ornaments, but many of the pirates would've bought it if that was the only way of playing the game.

 

[Gilhelmi]

I wish pirates would just go and bury themselves to be honest, it's annoying to see good people bending over backwards to accommodate them and going through all this hassle and doing stupid things that annoy the fans, all because some people want to be able to have things they can't/won't pay for

Amen brother.


I actually take great offense at legal gamers defending pirates.

If I break down their door, and steal their stuff. I wonder if they would be upset?

 

[Sonic Doctor]

When will software companies learn? Every pirated copy is NOT a guaranteed lost sale! NO PRODUCT IS TAKEN OFF THE SHELVES! NO SALES ARE LOST!

It's better that people don't play because they can't pay, than not pay and unfairly get to play.

It doesn't matter if nothing was taken off of shelves. That isn't even the matter at hand. People that pirate/download a free copy, are getting to experience something that they had no right to.

They stole the experience.

Whether a person was going to pay or not doesn't matter. They did something illegal. Other than packaging and launching media, a physical copy of a game is no different than a digital one, they both contain the same experience.

If I sneak into a movie theater and watch a movie without paying, that is stealing an experience. There was no product taken off a shelf, but it is illegal because I didn't pay for the experience of watching the movie. It's just like people not paying for the experience of playing CD Projekt's games.

I will never understand how people think it is wrong for a company to go after people for experiencing something that they had no right to experience because they didn't pay.

If people were experiencing something I created, without paying, when I had set a price for getting the experience, then I have every right to go after them for not paying.

 

[jmesch04]

This is just sad. CD Projekt was absolutely right, they just need to change their approach. In the letter they just need to write that we believe you have stolen our game. Ask them for a reasonable amount "Value of game" or then they can ask for more. If you are worried about this they just include a line in the letter that says if you are being wrongly accused please login online with our customer service and show us through which service you made the purchase. If you bought it online you will always have the visa/paypal receipt, so no big deal. Then if they did wrongly accuss you they can offer you like 5% off another game title of theirs in the future. Or even 5% off a game at GoG, since they are a distributor.

Pirates need to stop taking the moral highground and start taking it more up the behind.

 

[Jack_in_theGreen]

Well, the Escapist's "contributor" really only posted THE LEAST interesting part of the interview by PCGamer, which included very neat details abouot the Cyberpunk 2077 working title...

http://www.pcgamer.com/2012/10/24/cd-projekt-red-interview-cyberpunk-2077-witcher-2-piracy-windows-8-and-more/

I mean, if you are just gonna copy-paste another media's interview, why dont quote the WHOLE THING, not just the part that is A YEAR OLD. The "piracy policy and its debate with the fans" bit is old news, guys...

 

[tautologico]

When will software companies learn? Every pirated copy is NOT a guaranteed lost sale! NO PRODUCT IS TAKEN OFF THE SHELVES! NO SALES ARE LOST!

This is as simplistic as saying "every pirated copy is a lost sale". Probably none of those two extremes are true in practice.

Some pirated copies will definitely affect sales. Some won't. How many in each case? I don't know, and it may be hard to determine. But I'm quite sure the percentage of lost sales due to piracy is neither 0% nor 100%.

 

[Strazdas]

1. advertise your product by claiming you are anti DRM and cuasing media havoc - free advertisement.
2. after you made money try to make mroe money by persecuting people that wouldnt have bought anyway.
3. after social backlash to your stupidity, admit to be wrong to save face, while keeping the damage you done to humanity.
4. profit.

This is as simplistic as saying "every pirated copy is a lost sale". Probably none of those two extremes are true in practice.

Some pirated copies will definitely affect sales. Some won't. How many in each case? I don't know, and it may be hard to determine. But I'm quite sure the percentage of lost sales due to piracy is neither 0% nor 100%.

well according to study done in Latvia and Lithuania (both though to be pirate havens, and i know about those cause im from Lithuania), piracy actually encourage sales while otherwise people wouldnt have seen the game, liked it, and didnt buy it. In low-income countries piracy is more advertisement than theft.