CoD: Black Ops - How violent is too violent?

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Nohra

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Violence and video games. Not a new pairing. You might call it the peanut butter and chocolate of electronic entertainment. It's understandable really, to some extent I think everyone wants to hurt their fellow man in some way from time to time. Video games provide a safe way to do that.

I've been playing Call of Duty: Black Ops, however, and wondering if we may have reached a point that we need to step back from.

Something about the scripted events in Black Ops started bugging me. Fairly quickly, really. It started when I was thinking about how the main character, Mason, can't seem to go two steps without getting blinded by something or nearly blacking out. Then I started thinking about some of the scripted kills. A couple from early on stick out:

1.) Stealing uniforms from the Russians in the rocket launch site. You pull out a special knife while sneaking up on them, and its usage becomes fairly evident. More or less, you jam it into the base of the skull of your target.
2.) Watching Reznov's buddy be a target of the chemical weapon plot MacGuffin. This one is really creepy if you think about it for a little bit.
3.) Later, in Vietnam, you're fighting a few VCA. At one point you drag one underwater and saw out his trachea with your knife.

I didn't really want to describe in this level of detail, but I figured it would help if I explained what I saw happen, and it would be more inclusive to people who hadn't played the game.

I'm not quite sure why this bothers me. After all, I've played Gears of War and its sequel, and eagerly anticipate the third title. We're talking a game where the mainstay weapon has a chainsaw used to bisect enemies on a regular basis. The second game had the inclusion of more forms of 'executing' a downed opponent.

Part of my thinking is that kills in CoD: BO feel excessive. GoW, kills are quick, or not overtly gory. Curb stomps are over almost immediately, and half of the 'long' execution moves are bloodless (clubbing someone with the Boltok or sniper rifle). Black Ops seems to be saying "Look how far we can push the envelope. Look at what we can do and still get an M rating that'll allow us to be sold nearly everywhere! I am going to rub your nose in how much of a psychopathic badass killer this guy is!"

This is not a cry for censorship. I think the last thing we need is to censor video games. But it's a little disturbing to see people intentionally push things as far as they can when there's no real reason for it.

I guess that's what bothers me the most. Black Ops is a spectacle. It feels like playing a movie, and the frequent interruptions of scripted events (like watching Woods get clubbed by a VCA because the M16 was a jammy POS in Vietnam, wait until you draw your gun, and then have to save his ass before he gets shot or watch it all over again) make sure you follow the movie's script very closely. As far as I can tell, there's no overarching message like "Vietnam was bad" or "the US soldiers were brave and valiant" because the game focuses purely on the action sequences and pretty much says "fuck you!" to standard plot elements like character development (except for Reznov).

So instead of making us think, Black Ops wants to be a pretty rollercoaster ride for a few hours and $60. Do we really need to be quite so extremely graphic with exploded legs and slit throats, then? Don't say you're trying to tell me war is hell when you're advocating running around with dual-wielded guns spamming more ammo than god in the general direction of the enemy while healing bullet wounds in three seconds flat.

Though after the debacle surrounding MW2, I guess I shouldn't have expected anything less. Sure it's Treyarch instead of Infinity Ward, but someone was pushing someone to top that.

I don't know. I haven't finished the game yet, and I'm going to regardless, but it'd be interesting to hear some other thoughts on this. Maybe I just watched a few too many of the wrong videos on the internet. Damn you, fourth channel!

Now maybe I can actually sleep, having put this forth.
 

northeast rower

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I don't think that the violence of Black Ops is unnecessary. When you think about it, this was a very tumultous time period. What may be making you uncomfortable is how personal the violence gets- up-close, personal, and disturbing because you think "wow, these used to be people". I think that it fits well with the game because of this aspect- Black Ops tells a more personal story than the other Call of Duty games, thus making the violence fit better, and it also (in my eyes, at least) represents the maturation of the franchise as it becomes less afraid to show the ugly side of warfare.
 

Nohra

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FargoDog said:
The gore and disturbing imagery builds up an atmosphere.
But is there a line. Or do you want to be able to see each individual layer of fat, bone, and muscle when you slice an opponent open with a sword?
 

baddude1337

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I'd say the manhunt games are the ones that have taken it too far, but to be honest people do like gore porn. I mean look how many SAW's and slasher films there are. Violence only goes too far when it tries too hard to unsettles the player through large amounts of bloods and gore.
 

Nohra

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northeast rower said:
I don't think that the violence of Black Ops is unnecessary. When you think about it, this was a very tumultous time period. ... I think that it fits well with the game because of this aspect- Black Ops tells a more personal story than the other Call of Duty games, thus making the violence fit better ...
I'd believe that if the game didn't play out like a Rambo movie.
 

ThatLankyBastard

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Nohra said:
FargoDog said:
The gore and disturbing imagery builds up an atmosphere.
But is there a line. Or do you want to be able to see each individual layer of fat, bone, and muscle when you slice an opponent open with a sword?
That sounds pretty good to me...

I have no problem with violence in video games because I know the real world is more violent...
 

RobCoxxy

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I didn't feel it was excessive. Because these are 3 occassions in a 20-level game. Big whoop.
 

northeast rower

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Nohra said:
northeast rower said:
I don't think that the violence of Black Ops is unnecessary. When you think about it, this was a very tumultous time period. ... I think that it fits well with the game because of this aspect- Black Ops tells a more personal story than the other Call of Duty games, thus making the violence fit better ...
I'd believe that if the game didn't play out like a Rambo movie.
True, but stop thinking about that aspect of it for a second and think about the story and time period itself.
 

KiKiweaky

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Nohra said:
GoW, kills are quick, or not overtly gory.
You said it not me, the chainsaw kills cover the screen in blood while you hack it through what ever your killing. Sure its quick but its nasty.... and I love it =D

I like violent video games, the gorier ther better.
 

lostzombies.com

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It's far, FAR less violent then the real Vietnam War.

Ths game is "tellytubbies do the 'nam" compared to what is could/should have been.
 

omega 616

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Nohra said:
I have only read a part of your OP but I can tell you haven't touched a properly gory game yet.

Try postal for some twisted gore, using a cat a suppressor, for example.

If you want to get the meat of the gore world, go and look up on youtube manhunt executions! They will make even the most hardened gore fan wince, for example putting a sickle between a mans legs and pulling it from front to back. Another highlight is, cutting off a guys head with machete/axe/wire then putting it in a plastic bag to use as a distraction on other guys.

Black ops is rather tame to be honest, I think Resident evil out does it. Silent hill Definitely does!
 

Thunderhorse31

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I get the impression that Treyarch thinks that severed limbs and shouting "fuck" 1800 times makes a game gritty and edgy and mature. Of course the counter is that it's war, and that it's more "realistic," but a lot of it still comes across as contrived and overboard. I don't have a problem with over-the-top violence or swearing if it's organic; many places in BO felt out of place.

I guess that means I have a bigger problem with the writing than the content itself. Ah well.
 

DaemonicShadow

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Violence is just as much a part of CoD as my arms are a part of my body. Just the way it is. Oh, and
Nohra said:
2.) Watching Reznov's buddy be a target of the chemical weapon plot MacGuffin. This one is really creepy if you think about it for a little bit.
Reznov's buddy? Did you just call Dimitri Petrenko Reznov's buddy without a name? CRIME!
Just kidding. Seriously, that bit depressed me though.
 

Amishdemon

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DaemonicShadow said:
Nohra said:
2.) Watching Reznov's buddy be a target of the chemical weapon plot MacGuffin. This one is really creepy if you think about it for a little bit.
Reznov's buddy? Did you just call Dimitri Petrenko Reznov's buddy without a name? CRIME!
Just kidding. Seriously, that bit depressed me though.
Yeah, that part after that level I played as though it didn't matter if I died because my best friend just died.
 

ninetails593

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Bullshit. Sure, when a movie tries to make things as gory as possible that's fine, but when you can actually PRESS BUTTONS TO ACTIVATE CERTAIN EVENTS?!?!? Dear lord ban this pornography! HOLY SHIT! It's not like this kind of stuff ACTUALLY HAPPENS IN REAL LIFE! Really. These people, do not like each other. These people, do not like each other! Dear lord! What if my son saw two people that weren't immediate friends?? Ban!Ban!Ban!Ban!Ban! ..... Active parents make me sick.
 

BadassCyborg

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It's an 18+ game. This stuff is to be expected, stop being a whining pussy trying to get everyone down. Play Aliens vs Predator, you can rip guys heads off and impale them, all from a first person viewpoint. It's actually quite funny.
 

RobCoxxy

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northeast rower said:
RobCoxxy said:
I didn't feel it was excessive. Because these are 3 occassions in a 20-level game. Big whoop.
Actually, there are around 15 of these. Yes, I counted.
Well the VC knifing and slowmo headshot thing is one level, thats about six right there haha
 

Nohra

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ninetails593 said:
Bullshit. Sure, when a movie tries to make things as gory as possible that's fine, but when you can actually PRESS BUTTONS TO ACTIVATE CERTAIN EVENTS?!?!? Dear lord ban this pornography! HOLY SHIT! It's not like this kind of stuff ACTUALLY HAPPENS IN REAL LIFE! Really. These people, do not like each other. These people, do not like each other! Dear lord! What if my son saw two people that weren't immediate friends?? Ban!Ban!Ban!Ban!Ban! ..... Active parents make me sick.
>implying I didn't say "Censorship is the last thing I think video games need"
>implying I'm a parent

Most movies don't simulate real wounds, either. They have pretty, clean, Hollywood wounds. There are more than a few websites you could visit if you wanted to see a compound fracture, bone splinters, or some of the more nasty things that can happen to the human body. I'm not linking any of them here.
 

DeadlyYellow

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Nohra said:
Something about the scripted events in Black Ops started bugging me. Fairly quickly, really. It started when I was thinking about how the main character, Mason, can't seem to go two steps without getting blinded by something or nearly blacking out.
It's a Treyarch game. The majority of missions in CoD3 started or ended with a blackout.