Combat in Horror games

Kurt91

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If you can't fight, then you have the comfort of knowing that in order for the game to be possible to win, there will always be a safe place to hide or evade the enemy. At that point, it's not really horror, but more of a creepy-themed puzzle game.

If you can fight, and the game makes no effort in limiting your arsenal, then it's still not really horror. It's a creepy-themed action game. You practice the fighting system that the game uses, and beat the shit out of whatever is supposed to be scaring you.

In my opinion, the best option gives you a method of defending yourself or driving the enemy back temporarily, without being too ham-fisted about it. Let's say that you have a gun. One approach is to be insanely stingy with bullets, so that you have to pick and choose whether it's possible to escape the current threat without combat, with the reward being that you still have the bullets later on when you'll need them.

Another approach instead is to show the player that while they aren't defenseless, they still aren't nearly in the same class as whatever is hunting them down. You may have a healthy number of bullets, but they aren't going to be strong enough to pierce the monster's hide. However, if you line up a shot and shoot it somewhere like in the eyes, you might cause it enough pain to recoil for a split second and give you the opportunity to run away. Maybe give the player a silencer, so they can use the gun to shoot something at a distance. Let's say that the player uses a silenced sniper rifle and shoots a window a couple buildings away. While the monster goes to investigate the sound of the window shattering, you might have time to run towards where the monster was previously to do what you need to before it gets back.

The best way to approach something like this would be to make sure that the monster is intelligent to some degree. Otherwise, a sufficiently skilled player can just constantly shoot it in the eyes to "stunlock" it. Maybe shooting it in the eyes will work in early encounters, but if you stick around too long, it will realize that it merely needs to cover its eyes to render you defenseless. Later encounters would have it know right off the bat to do this, so you have to find alternate ways to distract is like I mentioned above while it's eyes are covered.

Long-story-short, a good horror game needs to balance not leaving you completely defenseless to avoid becoming a puzzle game, but not leaving you capably armed to avoid becoming an action game. An easy way to do this is to limit ammunition and weapons, while a more complicated way would be to make sure that your fully-stocked arsenal still isn't enough to make things a fair fight.
 

gyrobot_v1legacy

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Also deal with the fact the player is usually a civilian, murder is something they have never done in their life. Killing an insane inmate is going to leave you shocked and feeling sluggish which may hurt your chances of survival in other parts of hiding where you really don't have the luxury of fighting them. Attacking the horrors should feel like a desperate cornered rat last resort.
 

Thaluikhain

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In 7 Days a Skeptic, there'd be bits where

when you enter a section, after a time the monster would appear at a random doorway and come after you. You could zap them and then they'd stay down, but the same thing would happen every time you entered a new section, and you'd have to move around the ship a bit to solve the puzzle

That was tense, it had combat (sorta), but not something you'd win per se/
 

lacktheknack

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I'd disagree, honestly.

Silent Hill 3 allows you flee everything except bosses, but it's still tense and upsetting if you refuse to face anything.
 

Zhukov

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I'm not scared of shit that I can kill.

This is what completely undermined the Dead Space games for me. OH SHIT A TWISTED THRASHING ABOMINATION COMING TO EAT YOU KIDNEYS! Yeah, whatever, blow off his leg, blow off his arms, have a bit of a giggle, move on.

Decent action games, utter failures as horror games.
 
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Here's the thing about my psyche. When I know it isn't real, it can't really scare me. In that respect, the power to restart from a check point is just as powerful as giving me a gun. Either way, I will succeed.

That's why I don't go for fright, but being unsettled. Silent Hill 2 is the still pinnacle of that for me as I know everything I'm seeing is just wrong. The imagery makes you not want to know, instead of actually just being shocking.
 

Blood Brain Barrier

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kurt91 said:
If you can't fight, then you have the comfort of knowing that in order for the game to be possible to win, there will always be a safe place to hide or evade the enemy. At that point, it's not really horror, but more of a creepy-themed puzzle game.

If you can fight, and the game makes no effort in limiting your arsenal, then it's still not really horror. It's a creepy-themed action game. You practice the fighting system that the game uses, and beat the shit out of whatever is supposed to be scaring you.

In my opinion, the best option gives you a method of defending yourself or driving the enemy back temporarily, without being too ham-fisted about it. Let's say that you have a gun. One approach is to be insanely stingy with bullets, so that you have to pick and choose whether it's possible to escape the current threat without combat, with the reward being that you still have the bullets later on when you'll need them.
That's ridiculous. If the horror part comes only from the possibility of not surviving, then it's not horror either.
 

JUMBO PALACE

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Igor-Rowan said:
I don't know how to explain, but not being able to fight gives me some form of comfort in knowing whatever threat comes by I don't have to face it, thus diminishing the horror. Not being able to fight seems more like a way to circumvent the problem rather than solving it, RE and other Silent Hill games the combat may not be the most mechanically perfect, but it enhances the horror knowing that you can fight and the game can force you to. And recently, Outlast II showed that frustration of that kind of trial-and-error can and will completely shatter the atmosphere the games was going for. Or maybe that's just me.
I see what you're saying here. I'm playing through Soma right now and I'm really not finding it very scary. Maybe playing Amnesia and Outlast 1 gave me my fill of this style of hide-and-seek horror, but I'm finding the monsters more annoying that frightening. Not being able to fight them just leaves me hanging around in corners staring at walls until they decide to move on and I can finally get to the next story bit I want to see.

Xprimentyl said:
Personally, while I can enjoy both, I prefer a combat option in my horror, and I think Condemned and Condemned 2: Bloodshot set the gold standard with their visceral, melee-intensive combat. You felt you could defend yourself, but survival was never guaranteed and never and easy given. They did scares really well and the environments were some of the most haunting of the last generation
We're on the same page here man. I thought the second game was a little weaker but the Condemned series is definitely top tier horror. The sewer section and farmhouse in the first game were absolutely chilling.
 

stroopwafel

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I think Resident Evil 7 is absoutely perfect in this regard. You're not a special forces hero but you're not so defenseless that you can't fight back either. You don't have perfect aim and your ammo is limited but atleast you know how to handle a gun. It makes encounters more memorable and intense knowing you have the means to defend yourself instead of knowing you'll have to memorize a perfect and predetermined escape from an enemy. And the tedium of having to repeat that until you get it right. It might be 'horror' but it just doesn't make for a fun game in my opinion. Also Outlast takes it in the extreme opposite direction. Ok I get you're not a 'fighter' but when your life is on the line and some crazy hick comes storming at you won't you atleast like grab a chair or a piece of wood to fend the fucker off? In Outlast 2 there is even like axes and assorted farming equipment laying around. Alien Isolation however did get it right but here I guess it's more believable that facing a xenomorph head-on is suicide anyway. The creature's AI and the fact the game is immediately over when he/she spots you also helped mitigate tedium. Also you still had some explosives and a flamethrower so it's not like the game was completely void of combat either.

So yeah, personally not a fan of horror games that don't have any combat whatsoever for the simple fact that these games just aren't fun to play. There is a middle ground between no combat and all-out shooter. My favorite horror game is one that racket up tension but is still fun and satisfying to play.
 

Aerosteam

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I don't think it's scary when I'm useless. Only when I'm rendered useless.

If for the entire game all I'm doing is running away no matter what the situation, all surprise that game might have is lost. However if at some points I have a gun, I can actually kill things for a little bit, then I run out of bullets and suddenly I no longer have that power I'll start to freak out.

Basically, having my safety taken away is far more scary than not having it in the first place, at least for me.

As how it relates to combat, you gotta have a variety of enemies. Some which you'll blow through quite easily to tell you you're at least capable of something, then others you'll have a tough time on to give you the realisation you're not capable of all that much.
 

The Wykydtron

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I've been playing some of the new Friday 13th game and it's honestly pretty damn good, launch weekend plagued with server issues removed anyway. It speaks to the genre I think when the councillors have a wide(ish) array of means to defend themselves from Jason both in weapons, items and just putting as many walls and doors inbetween you and him and yet it's not just scary but really fun.

I'm convinced the first person cannot defend yourself setup of games like Outlast has pretty much run their course. Outlast wasn't scary to me, it was just mechanically frustrating. Some fuckin' dick with a pipe has me glitched into a corner and I can't even move. Amazing.

Meanwhile i've stunned Jason twice with firecrackers, stabbed him in the neck to break his hold on me (Shift/Grab is a little ridiculous, devs pls fix) juked him through 3 houses and even fucking shot him and he STILL gets me. It's the same thing in the end, defenceless guy gets his face bashed in by serial killer but the latter is vastly more entertaining on both ends. Voice chat is great too, you have some poor sod climbing through a window of a house we're all holed up in, clutching a gas can, bleeding everywhere, Jason right outside with "I have gas! Please tell me someone has keys so we can get the car working!" They nail the slasher movie feel perfectly.
 

KoudelkaMorgan

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My favorite horror games all let you fight back if you want to, and you will occasionally need to. I think the only one I've played where you couldn't was Shatter Memories and I absolutely hated that game on every level except the music. I kept the soundtrack and tossed the game.

Fatal Frame requires you to be quick and stare at ghosts long enough to be effective when you take their picture etc. They come out of the walls and so on randomly, but sometimes you need to run away. Kyrie is still the scariest boss in the series to me but I never got to play past 3.

Siren leaves you pretty much helpless even when you DO get a weapon, and the enemies won't die. Blood Curse kinda reversed that unfortunately as once you had literally any weapon you could beat the crap out of anything as much as you needed to. I never got to play Siren 2 though.

Even Doom can be scary when you think you are alone and then you hear an imp tearing your ass up, or a Baron yell behind you.

A horror game you can't fight back in may as well be a Dark Souls game where you just run past every enemy and then summon twinks for each boss while hiding in a corner. Not scary at all.