D&D 4.0E Monsters?

[Alexei F. Karamazov]

I was checking out a thread recently and someone said something that I happened to agree with: the monsters in 4.0 have an absurd amount of health. I've played some of 3.5, and both characters and monsters had HP that was pretty scaled back in comparison to 4.0. I'm currently running a game, but it's been in a bit of a hiatus due to college absences, and I'll be starting another game within a month.

What I was thinking of was homebrewing every monster slightly so that they have less HP but deal more damage. From my experience with the first campaign, it seemed like the length of each encounter was an issue (which the lower HP should help alleviate) and damage to the PCs never seemed at all serious. I don't think anyone's HP ever really reached a critical stage, except for when I accidentally broke the rules one time.

Overall, I hope to make encounters shorter without lessening the number of foes in an encounter and make each monster actually a threat, or at least add some amount of tension to the fights. Does this seem like a good idea? Have you ever had experience adjusting the stats like I'm thinking about? How much so? I was thinking maybe a certain percentage of HP to make it fair across the board to change HP, and maybe an increase in damage die size or number of damage dies to change damage.

 

[nomotog_v1legacy]

The effect is kind of easy to see. Your lowering HP well increasing damage. That is going to make battles shorter and more random. Who attacks first becomes more important. Monsters will have less time to show off. Players will be at higher risk of dieing.

You can do some basic experiments yourself. Pick an encounter from your next adventure and start big. Cut the monster HP by half and have them do X2 damage. Run a a few mock encounters where you play both sides and see how things play out.

 

[DoPo]

Personally, I'd just stick with the good ole Epic 6 [http://www.myth-weavers.com/wiki/index.php/Epic_6] (or you could scale it to 8 or 10, if you wish) which should work pretty much the same way as it does in 3.5. Modifiers on the health/damage can still be applied, of course, but you'd require less of them - just slight tweaks to suit the length of combat you want. Still, it depends on whether you want this sort of game, of course - it's just my preference because I really like the E6 idea. Though I've never officially seen it in 4e I have actually never really played past level...8, I believe - 8 or so at any rate but that's solely because I've not played much 4e (and that much D&D as a whole).

 

[Weaver]

I heard some people would just drop a monster's health by 25% about to make fights go faster.

 

[Phoenixmgs_v1legacy]

4th edition is horrible due to the ridiculous HP levels. My friends and I tried it for a few sessions (trying high and low level characters) and the battles just suck at high level as you know you can't die and you will beat the monsters but it just takes so god damn long (the battles just end up feeling pointless). Low level 4th edition is actually pretty fun and actually better than low level 3.5 and Pathfinder, but it only plays worse and worse as you level up.

 

[Elvis Starburst]

I actually run a 4.0E campaign myself, and I lowered the HP a bit for higher damage. Seeing Phoenix's comment, I might make bosses have a bit less from now on, but, the problem is how much the players deal in terms of damage. We have a well balanced array of classes, but they really tear things up

 

[Flunk]

I personally would just play 3.5, because what they "added" in 4.0 seems more like things they took away.

That being said I currently run a AD&D 2nd Edition campaign so... yeah...

 

[Nieroshai]

At least in modules (and let's face it, 4.0 was designed around modules and the RPGA) I find where 4.0 lacks is that no matter what players do, no matter how smart they are (and I have a really creative group right now), you CANNOT win a module fight unless you have 4+ players or some magic item that tips the balance. Fortunately, however, the classes are so samey that it has never mattered what classes are played. Enemy health did become an issue as well, but here's the very first scenario that sets the tone:
In the introductory module (I forget its name), three of my players showed up. For perspective, this trio of players alone stomps challenges meant for a larger party of at least 2 levels higher in 3.5 and Pathfinder regularly and I have to pull out all the stops to make a fight memorable (Formian hive: a bug hunt, or worthy of nuking from orbit? Once lightning and mental magic gets involved, you decide). Anyway, immediately they walk into the first room of the dungeon and see goblins around a fire. They wanted to plink the goblins from range, but the module had contingencies for proactive players: i.e. goblin rogues ALREADY behind them waiting for the party to try attacking. The players weren't GIVEN a perception roll(in 4.0, perception vs stealth is assumed to be a Take 10 roll unless the player is consciously searching, and there's no way--even through minmaxing--that they couldve seen these goblins), and these three had to deal with 4.0 goblins. 4.0 goblins can do all sorts of crazy things like attacking while moving, and other things I can't remember. These players who took on a L20 challenge as a L16 party in Pathfinder got chewed into hamburger by 6 L1 goblins.
I have a lot of faith in this particular group, and it seems (and they agree) that 4.0 is more of a numbers game than any edition prior. You don't need 3 players who can take L3 challenges at L1, you need 5 players. Period. Not that it's a bad game; RPGA is what it's made for, and RPGA play is fun in its own context. But as an RPG, I'm afraid I'm sticking to Pathfinder, 3.5 and d20 Modern.

 

[Smooth Operator]

Well the intention is to have a lengthy fight where everyone gets their turn and sort of build suspense, in previous editions characters could one shot almost anything and vice-versa.
But without that high risk the game also gets dull I find, instead of building up the fight you just know things will take a very long time and if you have a DM who pulls encounters out of the book on every encounter roll that shit starts to feel grindy as hell.