Dark Souls 2: Not as hard as people claim?

[Rellik San]

Now don't get me wrong, I've never played either Demon or Dark 1. 2 is my first run through on one of these games.

All I have to say is; why the reputation? Seriously, I don't get it. Maybe it's just me, but I'll begin from the beginning.

I decided looking at character creation I wanted to create a dex fighter, someone who gets in, hits and gets out before he can be countered. So to this I set my stats logically, with light armour, dual wielding and began my game and what I found was this... I died... to bad jumping controls but it wasn't until the boss I died again (the giant btw). I discovered that patience and tight control was rewarded and impatience resulted in death.

Now don't get me wrong I probably died about 20-30 times in my run through, but I was expecting many more deaths, (about half of mine were attributed to the jumping controls... seriously, it's bullshit).

I'd agree it's challenging and I don't consider myself a particularly good gamer or maybe it's the just the types of games I play gave me an advantage. But I really don't see why people should prepare to die.

My question is, what was your first Souls experience like and did you find the reputation to be unfounded or not?

 

[Sniper Team 4]

I think you may find that Dark Souls II to a lot of people is not as hard as Dark Souls. I am one of those people myself, actually. I still found the game challenging and fun, but it didn't seem to kick me in the teeth like Dark Souls did. Maybe just punch me in the stomach.
Of course, that could entirely be because I made sure that, when I entered a new area, I put down my summon sign and waited until I was summoned, so I could explore without the risk.

My first Soul experience was Dark Souls, and that game lived up to the "DIE!" hype for me. I got so frustrated because I didn't know what to do, where to go, or what was even happening, and the fact that people I asked for help refused to help me or just mocked me, that I gave up entirely for several years. I am pleased to say that I have restarted the game and just recently got the Lord Vessel. Still, I do find this one to be more challenging that the second. Like running up that castle buttress with those two archers. That right there was crap. That wasn't challenging. That was mean-spirited.

 

[Pink Gregory]

Well it may be a more challenging game than most and one that requires learning; but that's the thing, it *can* be learned, after that it's a matter of keeping up your technique.

I don't really understand how anyone finds it frustrating to be denied progress by challenge. If the playing of the game is fun (which I find it to be), then I can happily throw myself into a wall until it breaks.

 

[EternallyBored]

Yeah, Dark Souls 1 and 2, and Demon Souls tend to get their actual difficulty fairly overstated. It's not so much that the game is hard, or at least not hard in that constantly die until you get lucky or memorize a single pattern way that some games do. Dark Souls is a series that has a steep initial curve for those that don't pick up the mechanics quickly, but after that it's pretty much smooth sailing as long as you've got a half-way decent build and a good idea of how the mechanics worked. In all of the Souls game, most of the difficulty seems to come from the beginning while you're stumbling around with no idea what to do, once you've got some spells and weapon upgrades under your belt, the difficulty pretty much hovers around the level of challenging but pretty doable as long as you're paying attention.

In all of the Souls games, I never really hit a difficulty brick wall, stuff like the Ornstein and Smough fight, or the ancient dragon in 2 require a little finesse, and most people will die a couple times to a few of the harder areas. The idea that you'll be grinding dozens of deaths against every boss and area is an exaggeration of the difficulty in all the Souls games, not just 2. Even the worst players can generally muddle their way through the majority of the series with a little persistence, which is honestly part of why I like the series, it's usually just hard enough that you can't breeze your way through it without paying any attention, but it's not so hard that you get stuck trying to grind out levels and equipment just to chip away at a boss that you've been stuck on for the last week.

Generally, people with action game experience, who are used to watching bosses for dodge prompts will have a much easier time with the game.

The difficulty of the Souls series sort of became memetic after the release of Dark Souls, so, like Chuck Norris jokes, people exaggerated the subject matter to the point that those who've never played the series have probably developed kind of a warped view about how hard it actually is. It's really not nearly as hard as the "hardcore" crowd like to brag it is, or at least not difficult in the constant death, only a few people would be skilled enough to win sort of way.

TL;DR: the Soul's series isn't nearly as hard as people like to brag about it being, it became a meme to brag about how hardcore the game was, so its actual difficulty was lost in a sea of hyperbole and exaggeration.

 

[Fieldy409_v1legacy]

Dark Souls 2 is a lot easier if you are observant and cautious.

And once you actually know all the tricks in a level the second playthrough feels way easy!

Unless you play a squishy mage, better get good at dodging!

 

[teebeeohh]

that's because most people are idiots and all they can say about the game is the "OMG IT SO HARD" blurb they have heard reviewers and youtube people. the more relevant aspect would be the visual design and general bleakness of the world and the approach to story that doesn't shove things into your face and at the same time can be very deep if you are willing to get into it. but that doesn't make it into a collection of rage reactions so it's not as marketable.

and dark souls 2 is easier than dark souls but at the same time has a lot more bullshit in it. there are some cases where, even if you are observant you have no chance of avoiding a scripted ambush, unless you are just tanky enough, and the ridiculous tracking on some of the weapon swings.

 

[Hieronymusgoa]

I found DS2 in the beginning as not so hard. But I realised soon that this was because of my DS1 experiences. I would still think that someone playing this for the first time can be easily frustrated since it's not THAT much easier than DS1 (imho). The whole series has some special ways of controlling the character as to which buttons are used and such if you play with a controller. At least I still can't properly play it with a controller. Mouse and keyboard for me with some tweaks to it.

I found my second playthrough much easier, too. And I bet it's the same with DS2. You just get better and better with the boss patterns. Normal enemies dont pose a big threat it seems to me with very few exceptions. At least with sorcery.

 

[Fractral]

Of course, that could entirely be because I made sure that, when I entered a new area, I put down my summon sign and waited until I was summoned, so I could explore without the risk.

You do realize how frustrating that can be for the host, right? I've lost count of the number of times I've been doing co-op in the Bastille, only to see a Summon go straight through that trick door and die. A lot of the time I've been playing with people who obviously haven't seen the boss before, so they go straight in and then die to a slow, easily readable attack, and you're left without a summon and a boss who has twice the health as normal.
(Of course, I'm not attacking you personally. For all I know you could be one of those players who is capable of reading the game well enough to dodge traps and enemies on a blind run.)

 

[Frission]

You know this is weird, since we have the exact threads going around now, which were present during the heyday of the original Dark Souls.

Threads about how the game isn't a great as everyone said it was, and threads which say the game isn't that hard. I wonder if I'm missing any?

 

[Maximum Bert]

Its marketed as hard and basically people then pick up on that and think it is even though there are plenty of people who beat the games without much problem.

I have completed Demons Souls and am a fair way into Dark Souls (havent got to 2 yet) but the difficulty is pretty fair most of the time this isnt like an old school hard kinda game (thank god) nor is it something that takes ages to be any good at its pretty accessible and thats one of the main reasons the series is successful.

The games just punish you if you dont play cautiously its rarely downright BS (except from some technical issues in DS I have encountered). I guess people just propagate the its really hard myth because one marketing tell them it is and two it makes them feel good that they can play it despite it supposed difficulty.

Just enjoy the games and dont sweat on the marketing.

 

[Sniper Team 4]

Of course, that could entirely be because I made sure that, when I entered a new area, I put down my summon sign and waited until I was summoned, so I could explore without the risk.

You do realize how frustrating that can be for the host, right? I've lost count of the number of times I've been doing co-op in the Bastille, only to see a Summon go straight through that trick door and die. A lot of the time I've been playing with people who obviously haven't seen the boss before, so they go straight in and then die to a slow, easily readable attack, and you're left without a summon and a boss who has twice the health as normal.
(Of course, I'm not attacking you personally. For all I know you could be one of those players who is capable of reading the game well enough to dodge traps and enemies on a blind run.)

No, I understand how you feel. There were a few times where I'd summon someone and within a few seconds after the start of the fight, they were toast. I am one of those people who does a decent job of staying alive the first time. Often times it would be the host doing exactly what you describe--charging in against Freja and getting mauled to death in one hit. I did my best not to be a burden in new areas. I would stay back out of the way so the host could keep playing, but not so far back that I couldn't help. And when boss fights started, I would raise my shield and try to draw the boss's attention, or stay back and study the move set for a few seconds so, as you said, I didn't get killed and leave the guy all by himself.

Now though, I'm a terror at that game. If someone summons me, we are killing the area boss no problem, unless the host does something dumb.

 

[jademunky]

I am finding it a LOT harder than DS1. Granted I am trying a build that I have never attempted before (a faith/int character, lightly armoured). I am seriously contemplating respeccing into an agility-based character and dual-weilding Ricard's Rapiers.

 

[Rellik San]

I am finding it a LOT harder than DS1. Granted I am trying a build that I have never attempted before (a faith/int character, lightly armoured). I am seriously contemplating respeccing into an agility-based character and dual-weilding Ricard's Rapiers.

With that kind of respec, if my experience is anything to go by most of the game becomes:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sTSA_sWGM44

 

[Ml33tninja]

Congrats you have discovered what EVERYONE who can think more than three steps ahead has been saying since Demons Souls. You have to understand who are reading articles and post from either two types of people. 1) Many journals who are on a schedule can can't afford to play at an acceptable pace(plus lets be honest many mainstream games for some time have been holding our hands to all hell. 2) People who do not have the time to play the souls games (due to other engagements and duties ex. school, job, and/or family). Demons Souls was my start into the series and is my favorite. Is it challenging? of course even have all this time I still make mistakes and the game takes it out of my ass. However after playing games like Ninja Gaiden 2 the difference between unfairly difficulty and challenging is very easy to see. The main problem is people relay TOO MUCH on the opinions of others without even attempting to coming up with their own thoughts.

 

[Mr.Squishy]

Having played Dark Souls 1, and some of Demon's Souls (durn flatmate hogging the Ps3 grumblegrumble), I agree that Dark Souls 2 is less difficult, but it's still fun. Now, you say you've only died around 20-30 times. Fair enough. I started my first time as a Strength build myself, and found it to be pretty chill. First death was to jumping controls, as seems to be a theme here, and a whole host of them happened after I discovered (and thusly fucked around with) Bonfire ascetics. I rarely found any one thing *that* difficult, although Shrine of Amana was a pain in the ass due to ranged opponents with infinite castings and the longest aggro range I've seen in a while, which was more tedious than actually difficult. I've since started a pyromancy/sorcery build, and my god, it's even easier, almost shamelessly so (except I did get beat by Velstadt after running out of fast spells and having to rely on stuff like Firestorm).
I find that the Souls games remind me of AD&D 2nd ed, more than anything, and it's hard to put into words why.

 

[jademunky]

What is your agility stat? If I'm brutally honest, the thing that made the game the easiest for me was getting it up to over 100. I basically rolled through the firebreath of dragons because the immortality frames are long enough for me to get TO DA CHOPPA...

I myself am a faith based caster with a bit of melee power (45 str, 20 endurance, 50 faith, 26 attument, 20 adaptation).

Agility is 18, just enough to handle a shotel when magic runs out.

 

[jademunky]

I am finding it a LOT harder than DS1. Granted I am trying a build that I have never attempted before (a faith/int character, lightly armoured). I am seriously contemplating respeccing into an agility-based character and dual-weilding Ricard's Rapiers.

With that kind of respec, if my experience is anything to go by most of the game becomes:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sTSA_sWGM44

WTF did I just watch!?!?