Dark Souls II Review - Dark Souls Refined

[ChickNaney]

There's one thing I want to know, but I can't find the information anywhere. How does the coop work? I remember hearing a long time ago that there was a timer for the summoned, and every enemy they kill takes more time off it. Is that still true, or did they change it to be more like the first? The coop was the deciding factor on if I wanted to get it or not, and when I heard about the timer, I lost all interest.

 

[Therumancer]

Glad to hear the game is just as good if not better than the original. Now to wait a month for the PC version...

... Which irritates me as well, I'm not especially happy that PC gamers need to wait a month since that's the platform I want.

While it doesn't change anything, I will say that I am a bit disappointed that they apparently haven't done a radical revision of the feasibility of magic (at least from how this sounds), as the article talks about the great melee system and the balance between armor, dodging, blocks, staggers, etc... which implies this is still the major focus of the game, and that a simple "I will roast everything with fireballs right from the start" approach hasn't really been balanced into the game. Though to be fair I have wondered if such a thing is even possible given that so much of the game's difficulty relies on it's melee centric nature and forcing perfect (or near perfect) timing with a viable build and/or strategy for each boss. I guess being able to rely entirely on magic and ranged attacks would make things too easy from the perspective of the developers, but for mage fans, it's kind of a let down... we'll see what happens when it comes out though, this is admittedly me reading into things based on what the article says and focuses on.

 

[Gizen]

Apparently you can only be invaded a certain amount of times before it should generally decrease or stop all together, but also as everybody can be invaded the pool of users should be enough from preventing a constant invasion in only your world. Unless your specifically asking for it (certain Items raise your chance of being invaded or Convenants can do similar things) you shouldn't be invaded as much as you were in human form in Dark Souls.

Well, if you say so, but I'll have to see for myself. There was talk of some timer in the original Dark Souls as well, but as I've mentioned above, I shit you not, I just had invasions lining up one after another.

Did you use the Dried Finger item at all? The timer in Dark Souls was about 15 minutes, but using the Dried Finger would remove the timer and allow you to be invaded repeatedly and endlessly for people who wanted to pvp more.

Also some Convenants summon other Members to protect you, this works without signs (a sort of auto summon) there we're convenants for this in Dark Souls aswell but they we're restricted to certain areas or hidden in high level areas where you just wouldn't need protection as much. It seems like all of this has been balanced a lot better this time, so I'm guessing most people won't find being invaded quite so annoying anymore.

There's no such thing that I'm aware of in Dark Souls. You never get auto summoned to help someone fend off an invader. In fact, the closest thing to an "auto" summon is the invader kind, the Cat Covenant Ring and the Darkmoon one. But if someone wanted your help AGAINST an invader, they'd need to summon you manually.[/quote]

My understanding from a friend who obtained a copy of the game early is that the very first covenant you encounter in Dark Souls 2 is supposed to auto-summon somebody to help you the moment you get invaded. However, the online having not been active yet means he wasn't sure if it auto-summons a player or an npc.

 

[Sheo_Dagana]

So the PVP is forced no matter what you do? Ehhh, that killed Aion for me. I was thinking of picking up this one since I was intrigued enough by the first one to give it a shot but I think I'll wait it out.

The PVP in Dark Souls has always been one of the more unique elements to the game, but if you're deadset against it, you can always play the game offline. That said, if you reject the pvp by doing so, you'll also be rejecting the co-op.

I will say this though, if you intend on playing the game online but you're afraid of the PVP, then waiting to get the game later is the opposite of what you want to do. In the original Dark Souls, once the game had been out long enough (a couple months or so), the newbie starting areas of the game became absolutely FILLED with griefers who had managed to obtain gear and magic far beyond what the average player had at that level, and they would abuse this by invading the games of new and low-levelled players who would have virtually no way of defending themselves. To this day the newbie zones are still cesspools of trolls. I have no reason to believe Dark Souls 2 will be any different, and in fact it could be worse since now you can't even stay hollow to avoid it. So for those who are strongly adverse to pvp, either don't play online at all, or get the game as soon as possible so that the pvp will at least be somewhat fair when it happens.

Hmmm, well the only problem I would have with playing the game offline is that if my friends did get in on the game, would I then be able to take my offline character online? I'm sure the game's not set up like Diablo, but if the PVP is going to get that harsh, with bored end-gamers raiding newbie fields for fun, I think everyone will get frustrated at the end of the day. It sounds like a unique experience, more unique than Aion at least, but I may have to play it offline, which is a shame because the various, subtle interactions with other players is really nifty.

 

[bjj hero]

I thought Dark souls was alright but it Id paid full price for it I would have been seriously disappointed.

Im glad they fixed the AI but I wonder if they fixed the inexcusable lag in PVP. It was terrible and left parrying etc as guess work. It was frustrating to look like you dived out of the way or just plain be far away from an enemy player and hed hit you anyway. We are a long way from 56k modems, it was unexcusable for me.

 

[tippy2k2]

I'm not sure if anyone here has played it or can shed some light on this but I have a question and I am hoping for some enlightened soul to help me out.

I played Dark Souls on the 360. I was greatly enjoying it...except for how freaking bad the technical issues got. How in the hell a game can be released on a console with such shitty frame-rate issues at times just baffles the hell out of me. Anyway, it eventually frustrated me so much that I just said "fuck it" and dropped the game (for those of you wondering, it was the "Hellkite Dragon; the red dragon that burns the bridge you attempt to cross). The lag in that section got so bad that I could not effectively fight, rendering the game kind of impossible to play.

So I'm wondering if DSII suffers from these same frame-rate issues on the 360 (the reviewed copy was a PS3 review)?

 

[sXeth]

2 hours in on PS3. No deaths yet (then again, its not like they've added anything new to the combat to learn since beatin DS1). Actuallly, I think my only major damage was from a cheap shot from an ambush bomber on a stairway, who was totally unavoidable without being psychic.

The framerate seems fine, though there's a lot of texture popping going on. Which for the level of graphics seems inexcusable, it's not like they're rocking the bleeding edge here. NPC's also seem to have little or no animation at all.

The AI is improvement is questionable. Granted, I'm not far in, but I'm well past the tutorial, and it spends a lot time waiting to attack, leaving ample time to just swish-swash most of them down before they do anything. Its not as blatantly obvious where its zone of activity ends to exploitively kite it, but it makes up for it by lacking aggression. A few blatant cases (especially with archers if they lose sight of you) of them just watching me stroll up and murder them.

The excuse plot is even more of an excuse plot, so far. It even self-references that there's no reasoning behind what you're doing. You're cursed, you need souls to not go insane (except you don't, they didn't bother mechanizing that or anything). You go to Draegnai, uhm, cause reasons.

Accessibility, there's a full-featured settlement after the brief tutorial zone. Skipping the "rescue" type effort of finding the people in the Undead Burg in DS1. Also, there's only 1 estus so far, but there's 'healing gems', of which I started with 10, and now have 23, and haven't even bought any yet. They provide regen over a brief period of time when used.

 

[Mr Companion]

So the PVP is forced no matter what you do? Ehhh, that killed Aion for me. I was thinking of picking up this one since I was intrigued enough by the first one to give it a shot but I think I'll wait it out.

The funny thing is Dark Souls PVP used to terrify me and I used to fear it, avoid it. I used to literally start shaking like a frightened child if I saw an invader.

Then... then I got my first kill YEEEESSHHAHAHA KILLING OO. Suddenly all the fear, the quivering was gone. There was only the predators, and the prey. My dream to become the former has not yet come to pass but this time things will be different!
So now hearing that the PVP is unavoidable elates me no end

 

[Ishal]

I'ma good ways in right now. I'm at the third boss and holy shit... I might be stuck on it for a while. I can see casters or archers getting by them alright, but straight melee... oh man.

If the game keeps this up... it'll be worth every penny.

 

[Insideout Ink Demon]

The long arduous wait for the PC release begins..wish me luck!

not good luck, instead i'll say "praise the sun"

this 1 month+ wait is gonna be long

 

[AdagioBoognish]

Has anyone heard if the control scheme for pc will work better this time or should I be running out before release to get a controller?

 

[BreakfastMan]

I'm not sure if anyone here has played it or can shed some light on this but I have a question and I am hoping for some enlightened soul to help me out.

I played Dark Souls on the 360. I was greatly enjoying it...except for how freaking bad the technical issues got. How in the hell a game can be released on a console with such shitty frame-rate issues at times just baffles the hell out of me. Anyway, it eventually frustrated me so much that I just said "fuck it" and dropped the game (for those of you wondering, it was the "Hellkite Dragon; the red dragon that burns the bridge you attempt to cross). The lag in that section got so bad that I could not effectively fight, rendering the game kind of impossible to play.

So I'm wondering if DSII suffers from these same frame-rate issues on the 360 (the reviewed copy was a PS3 review)?

From a guy who has it on PS3... It does have some framerate issues so far (about 2 hours in), but nothing that stops it from being playable. It dips from 60 to 30 or 25 sometimes, but there has been nothing like Blightown so far.

Anyway, my first impression are positive. There are lots of small changes that I like, and some of the more annoying, time-wasting stuff has been streamlined, which is always a plus. Game does have slightly more cheap areas than Dark 1 or Demons so far, which is worrying but not a deal breaker. Looks freaking gorgeous too, and has a great soundtrack. Can't comment on the online, as it didn't seem to be up when I played... Also, there are bugs. Nothing game breaking so far, but they exist. The structure of the tutorial could really use some work, though; I completely skipped the combat tutorial without realizing I did so until later. XD

 

[IrenIvy]

All I want to know if PC version would have the same horrible controls as the first Dark Souls had.

 

[Vrach]

Did you use the Dried Finger item at all? The timer in Dark Souls was about 15 minutes, but using the Dried Finger would remove the timer and allow you to be invaded repeatedly and endlessly for people who wanted to pvp more.

Nope, still had them lining up to the point of ridiculousness. And the Dried Finger isn't a completely figured out item, most say that resetting the timer is what it's supposed to do, but even the community after all this time wasn't sure of it (read a post by a bloke who said he did the testing, he was invaded more frequently than that without using the Finger etc.)

My understanding from a friend who obtained a copy of the game early is that the very first covenant you encounter in Dark Souls 2 is supposed to auto-summon somebody to help you the moment you get invaded. However, the online having not been active yet means he wasn't sure if it auto-summons a player or an npc.

Yeah, yeah, I was just saying there's no such thing in the first Dark Souls. There's covenants that increase the chance of seeing co-op covenant signs, but no auto-summoning one.

 

[major_chaos]

After four hours of dying every ten seconds in the first area (Giant's something) I feel a bit disappointed. I love the first Dark Souls and have over a hundred hours logged just on PC but two is just bothering me at every turn. In no particular order:
The changes to the healing system make the game even more harsh when you are first starting out, every attack leaves you horrendously vulnerable and getting stunlocked and instakilled is common, any enemy that doesn't stagger when you hit it devolves into -hit once-> roll away frantically-> repeat for ten minutes until dead, titanite seems ungodly rare which is making me hesitant to experiment with different weapons, perma-health loss on death is awful considering how rare effigies are, enemies not respawning makes it easy to get stuck at a low level, rolling was horrendously and unnecessarily nerfed, enemy attacks don't bounce much or at all when they hit your shield forcing you to stand out of range waiting for an enemy to give you a chance to attack rather than making an opportunity for yourself, stamina seems to be way more of an issue than in the first game, and weapon selection seems comparatively limited.
To make matters worse I can't shake the feeling that some of these changes (namely the flask, shield, roll, and backstab uber-nerfs)were made to appease the PvP-ers, which is the one element of Dark Souls that I thought was the weakest.

 

[vipLink]

What matters is a ratio of invaders to non-invaders. If they're 50/50, you're always gonna have an invader and after a while, certain areas become more filled with invaders than actual players going through the content. So once it gets to 50/50, all those "reduced chances" are flushed down the toilet because the situation is a bunch of invaders on one side and not enough actual live Humans for them to hunt. Add onto it the fact that if someone's playing the content, they're a lot more commonly gonna be Hollow. So it's either gonna be several invaders on one Human, or the odds of getting invaded in Hollow form are quite real.

I agree with you here, but the ratio will now at least be leaning less to an overflowing amount of Invaders as there are more players to invade then there used to be. I'm not guaranteeing that these situations won't still be possible, but the chance is definitely not quite as high as it used to be. I played Dark Souls in hollow form for most of the game and only went human when I was specifically going into PvP and I'm sure almost every other player started the same way. But now that health is also linked to how hollow you are I'm sure more people will won't to go human than before.

The hollow system is still quite important in Dark Souls 2. If your hollow your chance of invading, or summoning/seeing summon signs and seeing player messages decreases. The more hollow you are the more this chance decreases, the ingame explanation is that your becoming more distant to connecting worlds the more you hollow. So yes you can summon and be invaded while hollow, it's just less likely.

Cool, I figured it works this way, would be truly evil of them to make it you can be invaded, but not actually summon for help with the content. I like that explanation too, it makes sense within the world, which is always a nice plus

Yeah, I'm sorry but I'm going to have to disappoint you here after all. According to this video (No Spoilers): Youtube: VaatiVidya [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ayDrTngtGL0]

You will not be able to summon after you've hollowed even once. So You'll need to be fully human to see summon signs at least. This video was released this morning and I find the information in it more reliable then what I had previously heard. I'm a bit disappointed by this.

Also some Convenants summon other Members to protect you, this works without signs (a sort of auto summon) there we're convenants for this in Dark Souls aswell but they we're restricted to certain areas or hidden in high level areas where you just wouldn't need protection as much. It seems like all of this has been balanced a lot better this time, so I'm guessing most people won't find being invaded quite so annoying anymore.

There's no such thing that I'm aware of in Dark Souls. You never get auto summoned to help someone fend off an invader. In fact, the closest thing to an "auto" summon is the invader kind, the Cat Covenant Ring and the Darkmoon one. But if someone wanted your help AGAINST an invader, they'd need to summon you manually.

Your right, I was thinking of the Blade of the Darkmoon Convenant but their ring only lets you invade Players who had killed a certain NPC, which is obviously the opposite of protection.

 

[Sack of Cheese]

Only two more days for Europe till release date!! I cannot wait!

 

[ExtraDebit]

Just played a couple more hours and it seems the game is extremely imbalance. In coop the game seems extremely easy, for boss and mobs alike the only strategy is to keep the enemy busy while the other one wacks away from the back.

But while playing solo, alot of the boss seems impossible or at least frustratingly unfair. There is one that constant rushing you that only give you windows to attack one or two times before you're force to defend, which doesn't make it challenging only time consuming.

There is another boss that spawn 2 mobs at the same time and gives you no help if not coop.

 

[Robyrt]

After four hours of dying every ten seconds in the first area (Giant's something) I feel a bit disappointed. I love the first Dark Souls and have over a hundred hours logged just on PC but two is just bothering me at every turn. In no particular order:
The changes to the healing system make the game even more harsh when you are first starting out, every attack leaves you horrendously vulnerable and getting stunlocked and instakilled is common, any enemy that doesn't stagger when you hit it devolves into -hit once-> roll away frantically-> repeat for ten minutes until dead, titanite seems ungodly rare which is making me hesitant to experiment with different weapons, perma-health loss on death is awful considering how rare effigies are, enemies not respawning makes it easy to get stuck at a low level, rolling was horrendously and unnecessarily nerfed, enemy attacks don't bounce much or at all when they hit your shield forcing you to stand out of range waiting for an enemy to give you a chance to attack rather than making an opportunity for yourself, stamina seems to be way more of an issue than in the first game, and weapon selection seems comparatively limited.
To make matters worse I can't shake the feeling that some of these changes (namely the flask, shield, roll, and backstab uber-nerfs)were made to appease the PvP-ers, which is the one element of Dark Souls that I thought was the weakest.

Let me guess, you're playing as a Cleric? That's what I thought too - then I looked on my stat screen and saw a whopping 3 points in stamina. A few levels later, it's much better - you can block and not leave yourself hilariously open.

 

[Mahorfeus]

Playing through the game as a Swordsman right now. The temptation to just say screw it and take up a shield is there, but I have been enjoying the power stance a little too much... even if the game raises a huge middle finger to anything that can't block. That's Souls for you.

Spoiler

Also, that pirate-viking ship place is at least TWICE as worse as Blighttown ever was. Seriously, fuck that place.