Diablo III Beta Now Live

[Mr. 47]

I hope there is a limited shareware version like there was in the first one, a demo, or any word on a console port. I'm not sure whether to be thrilled or not. :/

 

[Tzekelkan]

I hope there is a limited shareware version like there was in the first one, a demo, or any word on a console port. I'm not sure whether to be thrilled or not. :/

They created a Demo version of Starcraft II a few months after release where you can, I believe, play the first missions of the campaign and even join in multiplaer on a limited number of maps. WoW also has a Started Edition now that is free to play until level 20.

I'm betting there will be similar offerings for Diablo 3 some time after release.

 

[Wuvlycuddles]

That is NOT an legitimate comparison at all, Blizzard is NOT forcing people to use the auction house while paying them bottom of the line wages to do so. You're also NOT FORCED TO USE IT. If you don't like it, don't use it! Simple.

Are you dense? Of course Blizzard won't, what they will be doing is profiting off the people who do that horrible crap, which is just as bad.

I don't know, does it? It does benefit some players as well, as many seem to like the idea and want to use it. So... wouldn't it be also wrong to deprive such players of this wanted feature? I don't know!

Obviously, the matter is a bit grey. Blizzard isn't going to say, "We're doing it for the money!", even though they are, they all need their salaries to feed their families. But I really, really doubt they said, "OK, little children are working in China to farm gold, how can we profit from this?" The things you linked are unfortunate side-effects that will always exist regardless of what Blizzard does, unless they decide to stop making games. Even then, another company will just atke on their role of "profiting from harmful situations".

Why get so mad? You solve nothing about it that way. If you're really concerned about the health of your fellow human beings, don't just get mad and rant about it on some forum. Get an education related to your grief, travel over there and educate more people, or whatever.

It's easy to get riled up about such injustices, I know. I used to do it as well, but I realized argueing on some forum about whether it's wrong or not won't help anyone.

That's just the thing, I wouldn't have an issue at all with Blizzard having an online store for items in D3, its the fact its an auction house. I know that you might not see a distinction there, but there is a significant psychological one at least. Its like buying a lotto ticket, your eyes are on the prize so you don't notice the cost of the ticket, but its like everyone who buys a ticket after you has a better chance of winning..... argh... I know I suck at explaining stuff, but I just see something wholly wrong with this on so many levels. Exploitation is what it is, of the poor saps thinking they can make some money from this, of the poor buggers farming items 18 hours a day and undercutting the poor saps so they never make any money and if Blizzard get away with it, what will it mean for gaming afterwards?

In spite of my love of the genre and Blizzards games in the past, I just think D3 has to die in a fire, if you must buy it, don't support the auction house, wait... no. Just don't buy it at all.... if I can convince just one person to do that, I can relax I think. One average person can do very little, but many average people all doing a little can end up doing a lot, at least that's how I choose to look at it.

 

[Ferisar]

That's just the thing, I wouldn't have an issue at all with Blizzard having an online store for items in D3, its the fact its an auction house. I know that you might not see a distinction there, but there is a significant psychological one at least. Its like buying a lotto ticket, your eyes are on the prize so you don't notice the cost of the ticket, but its like everyone who buys a ticket after you has a better chance of winning..... argh... I know I suck at explaining stuff, but I just see something wholly wrong with this on so many levels. Exploitation is what it is, of the poor saps thinking they can make some money from this, of the poor buggers farming items 18 hours a day and undercutting the poor saps so they never make any money and if Blizzard get away with it, what will it mean for gaming afterwards?

In spite of my love of the genre and Blizzards games in the past, I just think D3 has to die in a fire, if you must buy it, don't support the auction house, wait... no. Just don't buy it at all.... if I can convince just one person to do that, I can relax I think. One average person can do very little, but many average people all doing a little can end up doing a lot, at least that's how I choose to look at it.

People who become obsessed over farming items for profit purposes exist regardless of the system in place. My prediction is most people viewing this auction house as a hobby where you could earn a few extra bucks as you go along enjoying the game. There's no net loss for you, ever. You pay for the game, you play the game, you find two identical badass items and put one on the AH because you don't need it. Bam. There's no "deeper implication". It's really -really- simple and, frankly, convenient.

And I'm buying it, and going to trade on the AH with cash. Why? Because the prices aren't going to bypass 5 dollars, if even, because it causes me no qualm, and it's a thing to do after you've finished murdering goatmen for five hours straight as a warm-up to playing. It's a lot less hectic than anything that was in place for D2.

 

[Tzekelkan]

That's just the thing, I wouldn't have an issue at all with Blizzard having an online store for items in D3, its the fact its an auction house. I know that you might not see a distinction there, but there is a significant psychological one at least. Its like buying a lotto ticket, your eyes are on the prize so you don't notice the cost of the ticket, but its like everyone who buys a ticket after you has a better chance of winning..... argh... I know I suck at explaining stuff, but I just see something wholly wrong with this on so many levels. Exploitation is what it is, of the poor saps thinking they can make some money from this, of the poor buggers farming items 18 hours a day and undercutting the poor saps so they never make any money and if Blizzard get away with it, what will it mean for gaming afterwards?

In spite of my love of the genre and Blizzards games in the past, I just think D3 has to die in a fire, if you must buy it, don't support the auction house, wait... no. Just don't buy it at all.... if I can convince just one person to do that, I can relax I think. One average person can do very little, but many average people all doing a little can end up doing a lot, at least that's how I choose to look at it.

I don't know man, I'm sorry for ruining your day, but I'll be buying it.

You talk about a deep psychological impact and all that, but it's like Ferisar says. It's a simple system put in place that, I guess, can be abused and exploited. But it will be exploited in a wholly similar manner even if it's not in place. The difference is that fewer players will be scammed if the system is legit.

Also, saying that Diablo 3 will somehow have destructive influences on the games industry is a moot point. Alan Moore's Watchmen had a huge negative impact on superhero comic books as writers rushed to make dark, brooding, one dimensional heroes to cash in on Moore's gritty vision. We got a lot of lame, angsty stuff out of it. But does that mean Watchmen shouldn't have been written? Are we to ban it now? Where's the limit to banning innovation for the sake of safety?

One last thing before I go to sleep. Saying that the Auction House will ruin people by exploiting them is like saying World of Warcraft ruins lives and kills babies by making their parents neglectful. It's just bullshit that's used to take the blame off of the people who can't handle the consequences they wrought upon themselves. You are the master of your own fate. Whatever trouble you get yourself into, it is most likely not Blizzard's or any of their games' fault.

 

[OMGIllithan]

That is NOT an legitimate comparison at all, Blizzard is NOT forcing people to use the auction house while paying them bottom of the line wages to do so. You're also NOT FORCED TO USE IT. If you don't like it, don't use it! Simple.

Are you dense? Of course Blizzard won't, what they will be doing is profiting off the people who do that horrible crap, which is just as bad.

It is NOT Blizzard's fault that people are willing to shell out real money for games and it is NOT Blizzard's fault that people try to sell items/gold for cash under the radar. The difference between companies using sweat shops to manufacture clothing and Chinese farmers developing a market around selling virtual items is that the sweatshops are being specifically endorsed by the company the sweatshops are manufacturing for. Chinese farmers will exist no matter if Blizzard directly endorses, indirectly endorses, condemns, or ignores them. I feel silly for having to clarify that.

You might personally have moral qualms with purchasing items but that has no weight when players were legitimately damaged from the lack of such a system in D2. As long as a system is beneficial to a group of people, making you feel bad isn't enough justification to omit it. And again, if you don't like the idea, you DON'T have to use it. You can even pretend it doesn't exist because it won't affect you otherwise.

 

[Atmos Duality]

I will die of irony if I open my email and find a Beta invite for Diablo 3.

lets try public locations

Im on a plane
Can i play WC3? Yes
Can i play D3 No

I'm so sick of this argument. Unless you travel a LOT, you're likely going to be on a plane less than 24 hours a year. 24 hours without Diablo 3... Oh. my. god. I think the world is ending, someone prepare the bomb shelter.

I hate to be a stickler here, but you're answering an Objective argument with a Subjective response, and you're committing an exaggeration fallacy in the process (for sarcastic effect..whatever. I do the same thing on occasion).

Some of us can't play Diablo 3 because of the always-online requirement.
(I can't because my home internet barely does web-traffic; it randomly DCs on most action-games I try to play [slow-tick games like Sword of the Stars works fine though]. And my alternative source of internet at my university blocked Bnet 2.0 because some chucklefucks monopolized the student access playing WoW and Starcraft 2 for a month and a half last semester).

However, I'd still say that none of these arguments matter anymore: Blizzard is set in their decision for Always-Online DRM, so if someone is in a similar position as me, the only rational thing to do is to look elsewhere.

 

[Wuvlycuddles]

/snip

/snip

/snip

You guys are really aggravating me, you keep saying that the "gold farming" will happen anyway, with or without Blizzards help and I'm not disputing that fact. But you do keep missing my point.

Like I said before, I'm no good explaining stuff so I'll try to do some easy to understand bullet points and also keep in mind that if this is successful in D3 it will end up in WoW and maybe other games made by other companies, agreed? Ok, bullet point time for why it is a horrific idea.

1. Buying power. Probably the least important point, but buying power for real money in a multiplayer environment is just stupid, maybe balance or power aren't all that important in a game like D3, but like I said, if its successful....

2. Legitimising gold sellers. This seems to be the point you guys have the most trouble with, sure they will exist either way, but are you telling me you can't see the moral difference between trying to combat these people or doing nothing or making a few dollars off it yourself?
Maybe you own a boat, would you rent it to slavers? would you go to the police and set up a sting operation or would you just say no? Different situation, same moral choice.

3. Ferisar, if what you say is true then why isn't the in game currency auction house enough?

4. People are stupid and pay real money for items, I know this and I know it is not Blizzards fault. SO WHY EXPLOIT THIS FACT? Only the worst kind of scum exploit other peoples stupidity; Drug dealers, politicians, gold sellers and now Blizzard.

5. Influence on the games industry. I don't know if you have been paying attention recently, but the industry is currently going through a "lets seem how much cash we can make on top of all our cash" phase. Some of it has had a positive effect, like SOME dlc has basically replaced expansion packs, its easier to distribute and it sells better and we get more of the games we love. Some of it is wholly evil, such as online passes and real money auction houses, they don't serve to enhance your gaming experience, they don't help anyone get more of the games love they are about making money for moneys sake and nothing else. And that is what is fucked with the world. Sure, as a business it makes sense to test the limits of what people will buy and we let them know when they go too far BY NOT BUYING IT.

6. Tzekelkan, you claim people are the masters of their own fate. That is true to a degree, but we need strength to that, until we find it we are just slaves to our compulsions. And Gambling is one of the tougher compulsions to break. And isn't that what the Real Money auction is? Gambling? Lets say you get that epic you can't use, you put it up for £5 and you pay your fixed deposit, it doesn't sell, you put it up again absolutely sure it will sell this time, but you get undercut and you put it up again.... I could go on with this little story, but I made my point I think.

7. Again, there is an in game currency auction house. WHY IS THAT NOT ENOUGH.

Thank you for reading all of this if you did, I know I rant and I ramble. But I honestly do see this as something very very wrong, I hope you will too.

Buy fair trade, buy free range and don't support real money auction houses in video games!

 

[ionveau]

Seen the game play and this game looks very new and up to date, if it was released 4 years ago, because of their own greed(removing lan, online only mode, player made cash shop, removing cheats, ) it delayed their game by a year or two now it looks just as good as any other generic D2 clone, the only thing really holding this game up is the fact that blizzard made it but at this point it means nothing.


The people that cant wait for it, or are dying to play are just waiting for the brand name not the actual game kinda like people that buy COD every year

Removing features (scratch that: Not putting features in), last I checked, does not delay games. This seems like baseless ranting rather than an actual criticism of the game.

What are you talking about? making a system where your game actions are always checked and removing any freedom of editing items and cheats, that takes time to do.

Please can you kindly tell me why this game can even hold up to anything else being released, yes i know it will break sales records but you cant really say the game is good because of this not after COD breaks records every time its released

Have you played Diablo 2 at all and realize that many people have sunk more time into it than most (if not all) other non-Blizzard games because of how fun it was? Have you checked out the D3 skill trees the the incredible amount of customizability? Are you aware of Blizzard's reputation for making amazing fucking games have long lasting appeal? Are you aware of Blizzard's reputation for constantly supporting, balancing, and listening to community feedback for their games long, LONG after they're released?

Thats just a few reasons why people are excited for this game. If you're going to compare this to COD (which is difficult regardless since Blizzard games aren't even in the same genre), tell me what balances and changes Activision has made to their game to help maintain and improve the experience for it's players, aside from $15 DLC 5 map packs.

Your opinion would be 100% correct if this was 2004, sadly blizzard is too addicted to money and their games boil down too

Remake of old game with no creativity --> expansion --> expansion --> expansion
e.g diablo, fall out 2 and 1 where both top down 3 was first person, blizzard sits down and thinks.....nop that takes too much work just update the graphics and we're done

Every expansion for every game Blizzard has made vast improvements to the game and added exciting new content which increased the game's lifespan at least twofold. Diablo 2:Lord of Destruction added a new act, sockets, new items, two new classes, and runes. Frozen Throne added new heroes, new units, a full new campaign, and improved custom map making functionality. Each wow expansion (and to a lesser extent patch) has added vast amounts of new content that any other game in the same genre can hardly compete with. And Starcraft 2 (I 'll just guess from how negative your outlook is that it can be considered an expansion) added a vastly improved matchmaking system, featured an interface that was cleaner and much easier to use and learn, and became an e-sport that is arguably the most popular e-sport today (Though thanks to Dota 2 not quite the highest paying).

Trust me the last game blizzard ever made for the players was WC3, D3 is made to create profit the best example is the auction house, clearly 30-50% from every transaction is going too blizzard, And for what? moving bits of data on their servers.

If you did any research and thought for a few seconds you would see that the RMAH was not only a good business decision for Blizzard, but it also benefited everyone else as well. Diablo 2 was full of scams with people trying to buy, sell, and dupe items. Because of how D3 is structured compared to wow (no soulbound items), theres nothing at all stopping the item selling business from starting in D3. Instead of trying to prevent it (which is difficult enough in wow as it is), Blizzard made the decision to sanction it in a safe environment. This not only benefits Blizzard by being able to make some off of the deal, but it also protects the players from being scammed. It is not Blizzard's fault that people are willing to shell out money for real items and it is stupid and immature to be pissed at them for making a smart business decision. Seeming weird or greedy isn't enough justification to hate it.

Lets try SC2
I have SC2
I give it to my friend
He cant play because he needs an account like its an MMO or something

Your argument has NOTHING to do with the quality of the game. This has to do with Blizzard changing from a CD key based model to a license based model for distributing their games. This does not prevent your friend from playing on your account, only from posting your copy of the game on the internet for others to use.

lets try public locations

Im on a plane
Can i play WC3? Yes
Can i play D3 No

I'm so sick of this argument. Unless you travel a LOT, you're likely going to be on a plane less than 24 hours a year. 24 hours without Diablo 3... Oh. my. god. I think the world is ending, someone prepare the bomb shelter.

Lets try Being bored with the game

Im bored what else can i do?
D2-Make max level characters/Create Custom items/Max health mana/max damage/etc
WC3 Maps/cheats
SC2 Maps/cheats(But more controlled >_>)
D3 Sorry the Auction House is more important than your fun.

Then play a new game if you're bored? Games aren't meant to be played forever. The magic of Blizzard games is that despite the negative weight you've attached to each one of these games, they've still managed to be great games that entertain us long after most other games stopped. In my opinion, that makes them have much more of a value overall.

Overall everything that made blizzard games stand out is long gone

Stating opinions like this without basing them on anything pollutes the community. I don't mind debating points but you have to base them off of something other than "Well look Blizzard is lazy because they only have 3 ips" or "But I can't play this game in a submarine!"

"Each wow expansion (and to a lesser extent patch) has added vast amounts of new content that any other game in the same genre can hardly compete with."


Blizzards formula for expansions,
One major raid.
Two small raids.
Bump all stats and levels so that players are forced to buy it rather than it being an option.
5 zones
A few New monster models or just reskins
New spells
Actual Bug fixes
Three patches over the life span of the expansion.

Blizzards formula for Patches(patches tend to be one/3months so around $45 for hardcore players
One Major Raid
Small number changes, E.G paladins now do 300 damage with crusader strike up from 295
Icon changes?
?????????????

Sure they are content but nothing is really new...the last major thing blizzard added would be flying mounts. everything else feels like its automated all item stat combinations are just copy+paste+30% stats patch to patch

This one isn't worth my time. You don't enjoy the game, thats fine. Enjoy your glass is half empty view of the world and I'll keep having fun.

"And Starcraft 2 (I 'll just guess from how negative your outlook is that it can be considered an expansion) added a vastly improved matchmaking system, featured an interface that was cleaner and much easier to use and learn, and became an e-sport that is arguably the most popular e-sport today (Though thanks to Dota 2 not quite the highest paying)."


From what i understand blizzard just took how WC3 worked and made it very strict and controlled, it takes me over 3min to load my map list because blizzards servers are that slow nothing new with SC2 they could have released a less detailed expansion for WC3 about space and it would have been the same thing.
the interface is just WC3 with a sci-fi theme, If anything they got lazy with the icons.

If it takes 3 minutes to load your map list than the issue is in your isp, not Blizzard. There isn't actually content in this argument. You just say that WC3 was a good game and that you wish they made WC3. Again, the world always looks pretty grim if you see your glass as half empty.

"If you did any research and thought for a few seconds you would see that the RMAH was not only a good business decision for Blizzard, but it also benefited everyone else as well. Diablo 2 was full of scams with people trying to buy, sell, and dupe items. Because of how D3 is structured compared to wow (no soulbound items), theres nothing at all stopping the item selling business from starting in D3. Instead of trying to prevent it (which is difficult enough in wow as it is), Blizzard made the decision to sanction it in a safe environment. This not only benefits Blizzard by being able to make some off of the deal, but it also protects the players from being scammed. It is not Blizzard's fault that people are willing to shell out money for real items and it is stupid and immature to be pissed at them for making a smart business decision. Seeming weird or greedy isn't enough justification to hate it."

Yes that is what blizzard told you, In the real world these actions are true in 0.0001% of users, normal people just used Bots(and bots will be used in D3), or used editing to get those items, your forgetting that D2 was an RPG not a MMO, every single online game has these problems but i dont see mine craft opening "Block auction house" to combat mine craft block selling.

Again Blizzard loves to lie to kids and they fall for it every time.

And explain how dose it benefit me when i know in the back of my head that this guy in front of me may have dropped 50$ to get his gear and that 25$out of those 50$ went to blizzard as a transaction fee, sorry i dont like pay to win, even if it's players selling to players, at least with shady sites people that wanted to cheat got burned while now they are rewarded. and again in D2 i would say 1 out of 10,000 people you would see would have payed for items now thanks to blizzard its going to be 1 out of 20.

Don't pull figures out of your ass without backing them up, you have no idea how extensive the underground market was for D2 and theres no way to track it. It existed, people got screwed. Even in wow where gold doesn't go as far, theres still an extensive market. The minecraft analogy is irrelevant and doesn't make any sense.

Blizzard is a business above all else and they've been very clear about their intentions all along the path. Saying Blizzard is "lying to kids" either makes me thing you're 12 or have the mentality of a 12 year old. If you're offended by the fact that Blizzard exists to make money as a company then grow up, this is the real world.

You're making up numbers again. I'm not sure if Blizzard has released the percentage cut they will be taking from the RMAH but 50% sounds stupidly high. Also, who cares if people spend money on items in game? It doesn't actually affect your game play at all. This isn't wow where the best gear gets you into the best guilds. If someone is really that bent on getting the best gear, they're going to buy it all then get bored with the game a week later. Which means they also wont be affecting your game play at all then either.

"Your argument has NOTHING to do with the quality of the game. This has to do with Blizzard changing from a CD key based model to a license based model for distributing their games. This does not prevent your friend from playing on your account, only from posting your copy of the game on the internet for others to use."


SC1-CD-KEY based protection
SC2-MMO style account system that can easily be lost by the user

I lost my copy of WC3 years ago, now when my hard drives dies my WC3 will go down with it. The MMO style account system makes sure that only WoW players will always be able to login and play since an avrage person like me plays SC2 maybe once or twice in a span of 3 to 4 months, do you honestly expect me to keep track of my battle net account without writing it down? blizzard thinks too highly of them selves are have just isolated themselves to hardcore WoW/SC2 players since any average person will forget their account within a year if not played.

You can redownload any game attached to your battle.net account at any time (even games older than wow if you attach it to your account). If you can't remember your email address then you've got bigger problems to worry about.

posting my game online for other to use? you mean like this? http://n4g.com/news/580631/starcraft-2-the-most-pirated-game-of-2010-so-far And i honestly dont see how that's a bad thing unless your a very selfish person.

You can't pirate the game to play on Blizzard's servers, which would practically defeat the point of pirating a Blizzard game in the first place. Companies exist to make a profit. If you can't understand that and think its not at least morally questionable to give up a copy of your game for anyone to pirate then you can't start accusing people of being selfish.

Also about quality of the game.
SC1 time to load my Maps 5sec
SC2 time to load my Maps 5min.....still didnt load...need to restart my client again....still not loading....
Bob can you host this map and invite me? it wont load my map list for some reason......
bob did you invited me? i didnt get an invite....i didnt even see you online...jim it says you declined...
i didnt......it says your declining....wait let me restart.........
ok invite.......
thanks......
total time 20min

Exaggeration of time doesn't help your argument, it just punches holes in it on top of everything else. I've never taken longer than 5 minutes to get into a custom or ladder game. If your issue is legitimate, I'd recommend contacting your isp and complaining.

Honestly, it's so much more fun to enjoy games rather than nitpick them for silly little flaws. I recommend trying that. Also, write your email addresses in your diary so that you don't forget them.

In total i spent $00.00 this year on gaming, Sorry i dont blindly buy games like a little kid, if you enjoy eating up dirt because they once made cake go ahead its your opinion and i cant stop you, best of luck, i didnt really understand how some of your points have anything to do with what i said but English is not my first language

 

[Low Key]

I lost interest in Diablo 3 after I heard it required an internet connection at all times. If cheating is such an issue, then having two separate characters, one for local and one for online, would be a better solution. Because if I feel like cheating in a game, then I'll cheat in the game. Fuck you Blizzard.

Seriously?

The online only part is what you take issue with?

The real money auction house is a big fecking problem for me, I think it is a sick, money grubbing idea that legitimises gold selling and is more than likely the REAL reason for online only. I mean, ANYONE who thinks they could actually make ANY money from it is sorely mistaken and totally deluded.

Man, I get REALLY enraged by this. More than I should probably, but this crosses a line for me, more so than any intrusive DRM measures or online passes or any of the crap publishers pull to get a little more money and I wish, just this one time, please, that people wouldn't buy into this crap, but they will and I will be sad. ANYONE WHO READS THIS! Please do not buy D3, but if you do and I know you probably will, do not use the real money auction house, ever, that crap has to die.

Consider it order of operations. Had I not been immediately turned off by the online only shit, I'm sure I'd take issue with the auction house. But really, it's already a moot point since I won't be buying the game anyways.

 

[EvilScoop]

Snip

Time Is Money Friend.

The person who wins the lottery doesn't win money, he wins time. He wins the time everyone invested with their one dollar tickets. One dollar of time, until it was millions of dollars of time. Not that lottery winner has a hell of a lot of time.

The corporate official puts a lot of time into his business, long hours, days, weeks and years. His time turns into money. But that money is just the accumulation of his time.

Someone invests hours and hours farming the best gear and the best loot so he can have the most well geared Monk. Another man buys the best gear for his monk. They both invested the same amount of time into the game. Because Time is Money.

Restricting the way someone spends their time in a game is just like saying Time is not money.

But Time is Money and the gold sellers know that. So they make it true.

Blizzard knows Time is Money, they are no longer prepared to say anything different.

The man who wants to turn his time into money isn't saying anything different from the facts either.

You have to decide what your time is worth, if the rest of the people don't accept that then you either have to lower your standards or take your business elsewhere.

The system is no less corrupt than the ideal that Time is Money. And if you have a problem with that then you have a bigger problem than a video game.

 

[No_Remainders]

A very lucky few have been invited to join the public beta of the clicky RPG Diablo III.

Hold on...

Invited to join a public beta?
Surely the point of a public beta is that it's open to everyone?

Maybe I've just missed the point but I'm pretty sure that's what it used to mean.

 

[Signa]

Spoiler: snip

/snip

/snip

/snip

You guys are really aggravating me, you keep saying that the "gold farming" will happen anyway, with or without Blizzards help and I'm not disputing that fact. But you do keep missing my point.

Like I said before, I'm no good explaining stuff so I'll try to do some easy to understand bullet points and also keep in mind that if this is successful in D3 it will end up in WoW and maybe other games made by other companies, agreed? Ok, bullet point time for why it is a horrific idea.

1. Buying power. Probably the least important point, but buying power for real money in a multiplayer environment is just stupid, maybe balance or power aren't all that important in a game like D3, but like I said, if its successful....

2. Legitimising gold sellers. This seems to be the point you guys have the most trouble with, sure they will exist either way, but are you telling me you can't see the moral difference between trying to combat these people or doing nothing or making a few dollars off it yourself?
Maybe you own a boat, would you rent it to slavers? would you go to the police and set up a sting operation or would you just say no? Different situation, same moral choice.

3. Ferisar, if what you say is true then why isn't the in game currency auction house enough?

4. People are stupid and pay real money for items, I know this and I know it is not Blizzards fault. SO WHY EXPLOIT THIS FACT? Only the worst kind of scum exploit other peoples stupidity; Drug dealers, politicians, gold sellers and now Blizzard.

5. Influence on the games industry. I don't know if you have been paying attention recently, but the industry is currently going through a "lets seem how much cash we can make on top of all our cash" phase. Some of it has had a positive effect, like SOME dlc has basically replaced expansion packs, its easier to distribute and it sells better and we get more of the games we love. Some of it is wholly evil, such as online passes and real money auction houses, they don't serve to enhance your gaming experience, they don't help anyone get more of the games love they are about making money for moneys sake and nothing else. And that is what is fucked with the world. Sure, as a business it makes sense to test the limits of what people will buy and we let them know when they go too far BY NOT BUYING IT.

6. Tzekelkan, you claim people are the masters of their own fate. That is true to a degree, but we need strength to that, until we find it we are just slaves to our compulsions. And Gambling is one of the tougher compulsions to break. And isn't that what the Real Money auction is? Gambling? Lets say you get that epic you can't use, you put it up for £5 and you pay your fixed deposit, it doesn't sell, you put it up again absolutely sure it will sell this time, but you get undercut and you put it up again.... I could go on with this little story, but I made my point I think.

7. Again, there is an in game currency auction house. WHY IS THAT NOT ENOUGH.

Thank you for reading all of this if you did, I know I rant and I ramble. But I honestly do see this as something very very wrong, I hope you will too.

Buy fair trade, buy free range and don't support real money auction houses in video games!

Had to ping you to let you know that I thought you did a good job explaining what you wanted to say. If I hadn't already been convinced that D3 will not be worth buying, your post would have been quite persuasive.

Seriously guys, stop pretending that this will be awesome Diablo2 2.0. Judge the game on its own merits and not the fact that Blizzard stamped their name on it, or that it carries the Diablo franchise. Just because you want to like this game before it's even out doesn't justify some of the disrespect that Blizz is showing us.

I doubt many of you would remember a little game called Darkstone. It was a Diablo 1 clone from back in the day. I can't even imagine the uproar that would ensue if the makers of that game announced a Darkstone 2 and added all the new Diablo 3 features - good and bad - into it. No one wants to be told when and where they are allowed to play Darkstone 2, even if they are only going to be in those situations for a brief time. No one would be happy about the lack of offline LAN or single player in Darkstone 2 either (Darkstone's selling point was that you got to play 2 adventurers instead of one). Those features would kill many purchases of Darkstone 2, and yet so many people actually try to justify it for Diablo 3, simply because Diablo 2 was so loved.

Edit: How the hell is my spoiler tag not working? I can't find anything wrong with it.
Edit2: Fixed. Interesting. You can't spoiler between quotes.

 

[EvilScoop]

Snip

Oh man, I played Darkstone and I loved it!

You better believe I would play some of that Darkstone 2.

I can tell you that no offline mode doesn't make it any easier for a lot of people.

No LAN.. well eh. I guess some people really like it.

But I'm not justifying anything, it just doesn't bother me like it does some people.

I've seen the game in action.

From what I've seen it's doing everything I want it to do and more.

That's enough for me. Don't try to tell me it isn't.

 

[Signa]

Snip

Oh man, I played Darkstone and I loved it!

You better believe I would play some of that Darkstone 2.

I can tell you that no offline mode doesn't make it any easier for a lot of people.

No LAN.. well eh. I guess some people really like it.

But I'm not justifying anything, it just doesn't bother me like it does some people.

I've seen the game in action.

From what I've seen it's doing everything I want it to do and more.

That's enough for me. Don't try to tell me it isn't.

I wish I could say I played Darkstone, but one dive into a dungeon didn't really scratch the surface of that game. It was good what I played of it though. Maybe I will try it again in one of my retro phases. I know as things are now, Diablo 2 is probably done for me. I've spent too much time playing it over the years.

 

[Wuvlycuddles]

On D3 real money AH:
Lets think for a few moments about this. It means others than you with more money to spare will get gear without luck. In short, theyre paying money to favor their odds. A bad model for a competetive multiplayer game. HEY, wait a minute, D3 isnt a competetive game! Its a team based game against AI! Yes, it does have PvP, but that was added by popular demand. Blizz have stated it will only be for fun, totally unbalanced and no loot rewards. So we have a non-competetive team game where you and your teamates can buy upgrades for real money if they get annoyed by luck based drops.

Read my posts dude, I'm well aware that D3 probably won't have a huge competitive scene, but like I keep saying, if there is any success for this system here how long before it crops up in other games? This has greater implications for gaming, that is why I am so adamant IT HAS TO STOP HERE AND NOW.

Time Is Money Friend.

I don't know what point you are trying to make, but you can't honestly be arguing that we should effectively pay to not play a game? I can't believe that. But then some people do and they miss the point of the game, the fun and they are poorer for it.

Time is only money in so far that it is a commodity, the quality of which is not assured. People often mistakenly believe that money can buy better time or more time. So I might save time by purchasing an item on the real money auction house, but have I diminished that time saved by not actually playing the game?

 

[rawrmonsta]

I managed to get into the star craft 2 beta. hope is ill get that lucky twice

 

[OMGIllithan]

/snip

/snip

/snip

1. Buying power. Probably the least important point, but buying power for real money in a multiplayer environment is just stupid, maybe balance or power aren't all that important in a game like D3, but like I said, if its successful....

I should be more clear on my stance on the issue as a whole. I personally agree with you on this point, I think buying power in games is pretty stupid and probably degrades the experience for those involved. However, I'm not being forced to use the system and because of the cooperative nature of D3 multiplayer, I doubt it'll ever negatively affect my game play if I stumble across someone who bought gear. You might be offended by that asshole who bought all of his gear instead of playing the game for 30 hours to obtain it but you know what, that person is going to get bored with the game a lot quicker and in the end he or she only hurts him or herself.

2. Legitimising gold sellers. This seems to be the point you guys have the most trouble with, sure they will exist either way, but are you telling me you can't see the moral difference between trying to combat these people or doing nothing or making a few dollars off it yourself?
Maybe you own a boat, would you rent it to slavers? would you go to the police and set up a sting operation or would you just say no? Different situation, same moral choice.

This one is probably the most fickle of the issues, but a difficult choice (and in the end a smart business decision) had to be made. D2 was full of scams and people often got screwed by underground sellers. So the question is do you let the underground market flourish like it was never able to before (no soulbound items compared to wow), leading to likely a much worse situation than in D2? Thats the kind of thing that Blizzard had to weigh their decision against. By implementing the RMAH, it solves all of those problems, while creating the problems you stated in this point. So we're weighing people being scammed and legitimately hurt against the morality of allowing farmers to be legitimate. Despite the fact that YOU wont buy items (and I won't either for that matter), this still protects other players from being scammed. Morality is tough to give up on but there are two sides of the coin.

4. People are stupid and pay real money for items, I know this and I know it is not Blizzards fault. SO WHY EXPLOIT THIS FACT? Only the worst kind of scum exploit other peoples stupidity; Drug dealers, politicians, gold sellers and now Blizzard.

Again, people were going to do it anyways. By putting the market in a safe environment, it protects the people involved in the transaction. No scams will be possible like the ones so prevalent in D2. It was also a smart business decision on Blizzard's part in that sense because now they have some continual income to fund the servers long after the game is out of most people's minds. I still don't understand the reasoning for getting mad at a company for micro transactions. They're not stealing your money, you have to voluntarily use the RMAH.

5. Influence on the games industry. I don't know if you have been paying attention recently, but the industry is currently going through a "lets seem how much cash we can make on top of all our cash" phase. Some of it has had a positive effect, like SOME dlc has basically replaced expansion packs, its easier to distribute and it sells better and we get more of the games we love. Some of it is wholly evil, such as online passes and real money auction houses, they don't serve to enhance your gaming experience, they don't help anyone get more of the games love they are about making money for moneys sake and nothing else. And that is what is fucked with the world. Sure, as a business it makes sense to test the limits of what people will buy and we let them know when they go too far BY NOT BUYING IT.

The difference between CoD $15 map packs and the RMAH is that everyone is still getting the same content regardless of using the RMAH or not. They're not actively exploiting people, they're basically saying "Here, have this feature. You can use it if you want and if you do thats great, but it won't negatively affect you if you don't."

6. Tzekelkan, you claim people are the masters of their own fate. That is true to a degree, but we need strength to that, until we find it we are just slaves to our compulsions. And Gambling is one of the tougher compulsions to break. And isn't that what the Real Money auction is? Gambling? Lets say you get that epic you can't use, you put it up for £5 and you pay your fixed deposit, it doesn't sell, you put it up again absolutely sure it will sell this time, but you get undercut and you put it up again.... I could go on with this little story, but I made my point I think.

Online gambling is illegal in the US.
Ebay is a company based in the US.
Ebay (and equivalent sites) are not illegal in the US.
Real money auctions are equivalent to online gambling.

One of these statements is false.

7. Again, there is an in game currency auction house. WHY IS THAT NOT ENOUGH.

Thank you for reading all of this if you did, I know I rant and I ramble. But I honestly do see this as something very very wrong, I hope you will too.

Buy fair trade, buy free range and don't support real money auction houses in video games!

I think the core of this problem is the fact that a lot of us more hardcore gamers have somewhat of an elitist view of games. We want to be proportionally rewarded for the time and work we put into games and the idea of a system to circumvent that process offends us. The problem is that games are an ever expanding market that continue to appeal to a wider and wider audience. In doing so, they sacrifice some of these, for lack of a better word, grindy features to try to keep this wider audience engaged. Yeah you might think your hot shit because your holy paladin has full Tier 9 gear with a Val'nyr and your guild is killing hard mode Anub'arak while its current, but that kind of status isn't important to a more casual player. They just want to play for fun.

I guess my whole point with that spiel is that its not worth getting offended by games making it easier for some people to get ahead. In most cases, it doesn't degrade from your own experience and in this case, it's giving more funding to help Blizzard further develop the game that you love. Games shouldn't be about who has the biggest epeen, but about who is having the most fun. And if you're having fun, regardless of others, then you already have a successful game.

 

[go-10]

I don't know if I'll play this much with Borderlands 2, essentially Diablo turned into an FPS, I might get my looting fix there. Just out of curiosity and lack of google search at my office, I can't for the life of me remember if character appearance changed based on equipment in Diablo. Does it change like in WoW or are appearances locked based on class? Has Diablo 3 implemented this?

 

[WarKirby]

The spammers are cashing in on this one. i'm recieving a torrent of phishing emails pretending to be from blizzard, asking me to verify my battle.net account by going to their pretend site and entering my password. presumably so i don't miss out on the beta invite that is assuredly waiting for me >.>