Disney Infinity Will Have On-Disc DLC

[Wesley Brannock]

I've seen ONE argument about on disc D.L.C that I agree with. Here it is.

 

[Doom-Slayer]

-snip-

Comparing purchasing physical and digital objects is kind of pointless since they are so different(see also the piracy and theft argument)

It doesn't matter if the DLC is finished, balanced, was originally in the design doc and someone said "hey..lets take this out and charge for it".

The basic argument can be broken down like this:

-The dev believes their vision of the "entire game" is what they put out in the DVD available for acces and what they advertised on the box. The DLC is extra, and since it cost money to produce, they will charge for it.

- The consumer(the upset consumer that is) believes the "entire game" is all the content they created up to the relewase date. They belives therefore that the DLC is part of the game, and should be included.

And do you know whos right? The people that actually made the game. I doesn't matter if you think the DLC should be part of the game, and it doesn't matter if you think you should have everything on the disk. Its not your call, its not your game.

In the Tekken example. Those extra characters were deemed by the devs to be extra. Therefore they included on the disk as a convenience to consumers in case they wanted to buy them. It doesnt matter when they made those characters, it doesnt matter what devs made it, it doesnt matter what funding money was used to pay for it, the devs say its extra content and since its their product, what they say goes. Trying to demand what content a dev should include in THEIR OWN product, is arrogant plain and simple.

You can be frustrated that specific content wasnt included in a game, but dont tell me that because you payed full price you are entilted to it just because they included it on the DVD.

 

[Doom-Slayer]

I've seen ONE argument about on disc D.L.C that I agree with. Here it is.

I have to admit, I love me some Jim but thats the only video of his that I find really misinforming and contradictory.

Take a moment to watch it while keeping the title in mind. Go on Ill wait.

You may of realized that nowhere in the video did he say that on disk DLC was by on its own unjustifiable. He straight up does not say that ANYWHERE in the video. What he DOES say, is that devs using the "we have to include it" is a stupid and wrong excuse, and he says that if your going to do paywall content, go to the fremium market.

But then he tells devs to just admit that they want more money for content and thats why they are doing. Isnt that justification? Isn't that a pretty damn good reason they are releasing on disk DLC...to make more money? What if they just want to make more content for gamers to play, but cant afford to give it away for free?(Or dont want to). And nowhere on his video does he say thats not a good enough reason. Nowhere. All he does is say that on disk DLC is not neccesary, therefore saying its neccessary is not a valid reason. And hes right funny enough, but nowhere does he say that on disk DLC is not justifiable.

 

[Shadow-Phoenix]

..Wait, given the recent era of consoles, the content needs to be on the disc? Isn't digital distribution the thing everyone is pushing so hard for cause its like the greatest thing ever that cuts costs and puts the screws to the consumer? All the major consoles have stores loaded with multi-gig games that can be downloaded. What exactly is holding this particular project back from having their DLC actually be DLC?

Could you imagine if they did this with digital dlc using the cloud system?

They would probably coin it CDLC and it would be the new nightmare all over again.

If it's going to happen the Crapcom way then consider my interest shattered into a million digital pieces and then replaced by Elder Scrolls online instead.

 

[Doom-Slayer]

-snip-

*sighs* So you say you understand what I mean but then ignore so many details and go off talking about things I have already addressed...Right Ill try once more since I have nothing better to do clearly.

The consumer has a voice, it is a practice hated by many because they believe it is greedy to charge for finished content already on the disc (which it is) and the ones who are hit the hardest are the ones who bought it FULL price.

I know why they do it, to make more money whilst simultaneously giving the finger to anyone who expected to get the full game for full price (getting full content for full price is not being entitled)

This argument is needless to say one of the funniest I see..and I see it a lot. You're calling this kind of DLC a rip off, that people hate it that it isn't worth it. Yet they do it...and make TONS of money off it. Consumers just like you, who "hate" this kind of DLC...do all this ranting, and buy it anyway. It blows my mind that you can make this accusation that its a cash grab, yet so many people buy it, Its like people complaining MMO's like WOW are a rip off and blindly ignoring the fact that million of people still play them.

It's simple, If I buy a bar of chocolate

Already mentioned this..physical and digital media are different, comparisons are not useful. And Ill mention again, its the same reason you cant compare piracy and theft, because they refer to 2 different things.

So in essence, yes, I am telling you that for full price, we should be paying for full content, anything off the disc is extra for download.

And once again your point is flawed.

All devs do then is release that same content that was made before release on day 1 instead of putting it in the disk. And thats even assuming you realize.

"But then its Day 1 DLC and thats just as ba.."

Then release it on day 2

"But thats still pretty close to relea.."

Do you see how arbitrary it is? Do you see how silly your argument is? And once again your saying that by not getting pre-release day DLC your not getting the "Full game". Repeat the same process as above indefinitely but instead say "But Im still not getting the full game", once again..just as arbitary. You dont decide what the "full game" is, its not your product.

For example. Preloaded games. You obviously cant play these before release dates.. BUT..you own the game, and you may have it on your hardrive or even the disk in your hand. BUT I OWN IT, WHY CANT I PLAY IT? Because ownership isnt the entire law.

Im probably not going to respond after this. I can think of about 3 or 4 other examples I can give of on disk dlc/downlaoded dlc, and I know you wont be able to give a logically consistent answer. The basis of your argument..the "I own the disk therefore I own everything on it and can do whatever I want with it" is completely unture and you haven't provided any basis for it.

 

[Doom-Slayer]

If you are not going to respond, then I won't bother giving my points, after claiming I will fail to give a logical answer, why should I?

This has gone on long enough, we both share different opinions, we won'r be swayed by one another, so we'll end it here.

Actually...lets do this simply, lets not deal with what I think, but what you think. I like analyzing arguements and we'll see if yours comes up consistent.

So in essence, yes, I am telling you that for full price, we should be paying for full content, anything off the disc is extra for download.

So you say..anything off disk is fine for DLC.

So again to my point. What if they delay the same content they produced before release, and release it as Day 1 DLC available for download only(ie not on the disk) So thats fine? Or are you saying, any content made before release has to be in the game and shouldnt be DLC, and everything AFTER release is fine for DLC?

 

[J Tyran]

1)

Anyone surprised that a game that involves buying toys to use in game would have "DLC" on the disc isn't paying attention. Skylanders has 'on disc dlc' in that you need the RFID with the toys to unlock the content.

2)

They're supplying the data for future toys in the system even if they haven't revealed what those toys are or will be. This can be because they haven't manufactured the toys yet, it could be that they're waiting for a movie/tv tie-in, or whatever. But given point 1, it doesn't make any sense to require any sort of download when they already know what they're going to do. Secondly, given that the toys won't be platform specific, they can't simply include the data with the toys without having to provide a copy of the data for every platform the game is for--that's a lot of wasted packaging and material. It'd only make sense to people who think that sort of thing is free and costs nothing.


So, in light of those things, this shouldn't come as a surprise to anyone whatsoever. Add in the justification that the target audience doesn't necessarily have internet access and you have the possibility of a lot of people who the product isn't designed for getting huffy over things that probably can't and shouldn't be done any other way.


So, before you get huffy about "on-disc DLC" on principle, consider that this specific product is NOT similiar to most other products, and the product it IS similiar to has On-disc DLC by design as well. Then if you still complain, explain how the product COULD be released without it.

3)

Someone WILL hack it--and I would bet good money that not only will there be 'leaks' about the unlocked content within a couple weeks of launch, some of those 'leaks' will involve people playing with that content as if they bought the content outright.

Just like Skylanders.

You are not getting it, it doesn't matter that this is not a normal game and you buy the content bit by bit as the new figures are released. It doesn't matter that they need the content built into the game so they can just sell the toys, none of this matters because its on the damned disk! They are owed it because they own the damned disk! Its not DLC if its on the damned disk! -has meltdown and hugs a pile of DVDs- my precious disks!

 

[KingsGambit_v1legacy]

If the people who bought it are given access for free when the project is released, then I see no problem. However, if they're going to go all Crapcon and charge for it, then there's a big problem.

/signed

Putting it on there in order to keep it a surprise, time it to coincide with something from the real world, etc, if given for free is not only okay, it's actually quite cool. But charging for something already on the disc is not on. I have no issue with enterprising players unlocking this content themselves, like they did with Javik.

 

[RJ 17]

Perhaps he's going with "Honesty is the best policy", believing that if they're up-front with On Disc DLC that gamers won't be as upset because it won't seem like they're actually trying to hide the stuff.

Still though, he's grossly over-estimating the good will of the internet. While people might get pissed off that they're hiding DLC content on the disc and trying to be all secretive about it, hoping no one will notice, telling people that it's already there and asking them not to touch it is the same as telling a 4 year old that they must absolutely NOT touch the big shiny red button. We all know that 4 year old is gonna push the button the first chance it gets.

 

[Jumpingbean3]

Oh my God I am so shocked, who could have possibly predicted this? (Sarcasm)

 

[RJ 17]

Snip

For the record, he mentions twice that "The industry tries to justify it as (bleh), but....." which implies that it's unjustifiable.

The rest is summed up in his closing argument: on disc DLC isn't DLC. You pay to download a key, not the content itself that's already there. If anything the argument is more along the lines of there's no justifiable reason to call on-disc-DLC DLC at all since, word-for-word, you're not actually downloading content.

The full argument, as presented at the beginning of the episode, is that devs use on-disc DLC for compatability issues. Jim's argument is that the very presence of on-disc DLC creates any issues that it was meant to solve in the first place. It's not so much DLC at that point but rather a cash-grab. He's not saying "Justify your on-disc DLC by just admitting you want more money", he's saying "Don't call on-disc DLC "DLC", call it what it is: a cash grab."

 

[Korzack]

Well this is a dumb idea - "Ooh, we have spoilers for our new films, but we're gonna Hide them on the disc until the right time to sell them to you"... No, some Genius rogue'll have that hacked + out in the open inside a Week.

 

[Sheo_Dagana]

So if this game is trying to capitalize on the success of Skylanders, why the hell would it need DLC at all? Why not just sell figurines and stuff? I mean, people are way more likely to buy that than they are DLC. This is why this game isn't going to do as well as Skylanders, in my opinion.

Captcha: Keep More Money

Thank you, Captcha.

 

[Disasterpiece Press]

Seems like a silly idea if you ask me. Some crafty person out there will reverse engineer the files and release the info onto the internet within days of release. I'm willing to bet this is actually a clever ploy at marketing, making people actively search for the "yet to be announced" Disney projects.

This.
Reading all the comments, they make this guy out to be a huge idiot. This is Disney we are talking about - they have been marketing and branding for years. It is next to impossible for them not to know that the sort of thing they are "afraid" of will happen. So, why not announce it now and generate a "hype" for knowledge about future Disney projects? It is evil marketing genius is what it is. He is relying on the internet to behave like the internet. Welcome to the future.

"We're hoping that isn't something that is widespread reported because then people are going to start looking for it, and it's going to ruin the magic for the consumer,"

- he says with an evil smirk on his face.

 

[DracoSuave]

You are not getting it, it doesn't matter that this is not a normal game and you buy the content bit by bit as the new figures are released. It doesn't matter that they need the content built into the game so they can just sell the toys, none of this matters because its on the damned disk! They are owed it because they own the damned disk! Its not DLC if its on the damned disk! -has meltdown and hugs a pile of DVDs- my precious disks!

It's...

...a game...

...based on game-toy interactions.


....which requires toys...


...to interact with...


...so....


...ellipses are fun...

So if this game is trying to capitalize on the success of Skylanders, why the hell would it need DLC at all? Why not just sell figurines and stuff? I mean, people are way more likely to buy that than they are DLC. This is why this game isn't going to do as well as Skylanders, in my opinion.

Captcha: Keep More Money

Thank you, Captcha.

:facepalm:

The... figures... are how... you... unlock... the... content...

...it's like people don't even read.

 

[Ed130 The Vanguard]

I can see this ending real well.

< "We're hoping that isn't something that is widespread reported because then people are going to start looking for it, and it's going to ruin the magic for the consumer,"

Hope is the first step on the road to disappointment, and you've just challenged the denizens of the internet not to spoil everything.

 

[Nurb]

Disney needs a lesson in economics... When your customers are rooting for the pirates, you've really screwed up

Go pirates!

 

[Frezzato]

Personally I'm really glad to hear about this. They just saved me money by warning me to stay away from their product or from buying it for any of my relatives for that matter. It's like how you know to stay away from brightly colored frogs. They're super poisonous, or in the case of this Disney IP, cause intense delusions should you come into contact with one.

 

[Wesley Brannock]

I've seen ONE argument about on disc D.L.C that I agree with. Here it is.

I have to admit, I love me some Jim but thats the only video of his that I find really misinforming and contradictory.

Take a moment to watch it while keeping the title in mind. Go on Ill wait.

You may of realized that nowhere in the video did he say that on disk DLC was by on its own unjustifiable. He straight up does not say that ANYWHERE in the video. What he DOES say, is that devs using the "we have to include it" is a stupid and wrong excuse, and he says that if your going to do paywall content, go to the fremium market.

But then he tells devs to just admit that they want more money for content and thats why they are doing. Isnt that justification? Isn't that a pretty damn good reason they are releasing on disk DLC...to make more money? What if they just want to make more content for gamers to play, but cant afford to give it away for free?(Or dont want to). And nowhere on his video does he say thats not a good enough reason. Nowhere. All he does is say that on disk DLC is not neccesary, therefore saying its neccessary is not a valid reason. And hes right funny enough, but nowhere does he say that on disk DLC is not justifiable.

Listen I except that its GREED but that in and of itself isn't an acceptable way for a company to behave. Movie theater owners don't stop a movie in the middle of a showing and tell the audience " If you want to watch the rest you have to pay a fee "( not even the indie movies do that keep in mind they don't have a lot of cash either ). Books aren't sold a single page at a time my point is that D.L.C isn't being used to add content but being used to force the person who PAID for the content to pay yet again. You wouldn't pay twice for the same book , movie , music so why would you pay twice for content that you already paid for. ( This is the ONLY response I will do )

 

[Myrph]

To be fair to them, if putting unlockable content on the disc is something they're gonna do regardless of what they're consumers think or not, especially if its unannounced future content, then regardless of whether or not its announced or not, someone is gonna go looking, and is more likely than not to find it. All things considered, the shit storm surrounding the reveal is going to be exponentially smaller if it were them who announce its presence than if someone just stumbles across it.