Dissidia 2: Yuna, Trailer, Release dates

[Arehexes]

they need:

EDIT: For the sake of the argument Seifer would be a cool villain:

Oh god yes

 

[Tsaba]

YES. Acutally, they just need Ramza, Vivi, and Gilgamesh, and thats pretty much everyone satisfied.

Oh god yes

Ramza needs the original art and it would be freaken awesome. ie no nose!!!!

 

[Arehexes]

I just realized who we need

This dude, guess who he is .

 

[Kanlic]

*sigh* I don't know why I always see this or what makes people even hope for this. They are not adding Kingdome Hearts characters or any of that other junk. It's Dissidia: FINAL FANTASY, not Dissidia: Square Enix Franchises. The whole Kingdom Hearts thing is not a two way conduit and adding non FF characters would ruin the entire premise and spirit of the game. It's also terribly unfair to the dozens of other FF characters that have more right top be in. Not to mention it would just be stupid in general.

The first game was a "Happy 20th Birthdays FF!!", while this game is more like a "Thank you" for the fans, if they wanna add KH characters and all that junk they can get their own fighting games.

Really, adding them in now would just be out of place and ruin the game in he same way stupid star wars characters in Soul Calibur did.


On another note, it's nice to finally see EX revenge at work and it looks pretty sweet. Although Vaan there did 3 attacks without any cool down....and I am certain that is not p[art of his switch bonus techs. Guess because it slows down time for your opponent it lets you string together more hits.

Even got to see EX break work, boy I hope Gabranth doesn't suffer too much because of that. He's all about staying in EX mode, and EX break will make him that much harder to play.

Assist chase is also gonna be a boat load of fun too, really good way to close in the distance gap on your opponent, especially them pesky mages.

speaking of Vaan, why include him? He was useless to the story, and it would have made more sense to put Baltier or Basch. That shit is wack.

 

[-Seraph-]

speaking of Vaan, why include him? He was useless to the story, and it would have made more sense to put Baltier or Basch. That shit is wack.

Good god not this stupid complaint again, don't make me get SpaceMedarotterX in here to spew a massive wall of text on how wrong you really are. I have not played 12, but I damn well know enough about it and from what my buddy has told me to know that Vaan isn't as useless as people think.

That and *shcok* Vaan is popular in Japan, thus including him was inevitable. Whether you like it or not, he is the protagonist of FF12 and that's that.

Spoiler: Besides, Basch is sort of in the game. Gabranths 3rd costume is when he was disguised as him

As for Belthier, meh. Vaan turned out to be an interesting fighter, just leave it at that. Lord knows I fucking despised Squall and FF8 in general, but that didn't stop him from being an awesome fighter.

 

[Kanlic]

speaking of Vaan, why include him? He was useless to the story, and it would have made more sense to put Baltier or Basch. That shit is wack.

Good god not this stupid complaint again, don't make me get SpaceMedarotterX in here to spew a massive wall of text on how wrong you really are. I have not played 12, but I damn well know enough about it and from what my buddy has told me to know that Vaan isn't as useless as people think.

That and *shcok* Vaan is popular in Japan, thus including him was inevitable. Whether you like it or not, he is the protagonist of FF12 and that's that.

Spoiler: Besides, Basch is sort of in the game. Gabranths 3rd costume is when he was disguised as him

As for Belthier, meh. Vaan turned out to be an interesting fighter, just leave it at that. Lord knows I fucking despised Squall and FF8 in general, but that didn't stop him from being an awesome fighter.

Not to get defensive, but how was he important other than introducing the story of FF12

 

[T0MCAT]

That part of the trailer made me well excited, fekkin love Yuna

 

[RabbidKuriboh]

the character roster so far seems to be pretty interesting (seriously laguna!?) but i will be gutted if vivi or gilgamesh don't make it

oh and i guess i'll have to wait for dissidia 5 for*points at avatar* oh well a man can dream, a man can dream

 

[Arisato-kun]

Needs MOAR Vivi.

This. Get Shantoto the fuck out of the game and put him in. -_-

This.

they need:

And this.

And just to add on this if I see anybody from Final Fantasy XIV I will rage.

I'll still buy it regardless because my dream of a playable Laguna has been satisfied.

 

[-Seraph-]

speaking of Vaan, why include him? He was useless to the story, and it would have made more sense to put Baltier or Basch. That shit is wack.

Good god not this stupid complaint again, don't make me get SpaceMedarotterX in here to spew a massive wall of text on how wrong you really are. I have not played 12, but I damn well know enough about it and from what my buddy has told me to know that Vaan isn't as useless as people think.

That and *shcok* Vaan is popular in Japan, thus including him was inevitable. Whether you like it or not, he is the protagonist of FF12 and that's that.

Spoiler: Besides, Basch is sort of in the game. Gabranths 3rd costume is when he was disguised as him

As for Belthier, meh. Vaan turned out to be an interesting fighter, just leave it at that. Lord knows I fucking despised Squall and FF8 in general, but that didn't stop him from being an awesome fighter.

Not to get defensive, but how was he important other than introducing the story of FF12

Like I said, I have not played the game, but I damn well have been given lectures on it. But fine, here is a reply from my buddy in a PM discussion we were having over it and he makes it damn well clear. There are more, but this one should keep you occupied for a good 10 minutes or so. Be warned, it's LOOONG

Spoiler

A short while back I said that in order for a character to be pointless they must be able to be removed from the narrative with no change to the games plot or to the story within, or character motivations or anything else that affects the narrative. I used the "Party Member unlocks a door so he can be replaced by a key" example.

Well I have run into someone so fucking stupid that this is literally what they said to me

You could write Vaan and Penelo completely out of the game without effecting much.
Basch would be the older, experienced voice advising her. It'd make more sense than Vaan doing it.
Balthier provides a link to the Empire, including an important enemy figure.

I told him he was wrong for several very obvious reasons, mostly Vaan being the main reason the party got together

You can remove Vaan and nothing much changes.

Vaan and Penelo never do that heist thing.
Game starts off following/controlling Ashe as she's leading the rebellion and escaping where she meets up with Balthier after a botched heist.
They get a lead that has info on the location of her father's murderer. They go and get Basch.

Congratulations, I just cut the pork fat (Vaan and Penelo) out of the game with little damage.

Except that violates rule 1, you can't change the narrative to remove them, btw did I mention that Ashe actually gets taken to a seperate prison from the rest of the party in the actual game? meaning a good 50% of motivations have to be rewritten to make that work?

Spoiler: Headdesk

The point is nothing important/relevant to the plot is fucked with by removing Vaan and Penelo.

They're like a lego piece that can be plugged into from ANY side, but it in itself is not important and can be removed and/or replaced without incident.

They are generic.[/quote]

Except character motivations, the progression of the plot, the dialogue and everything else?

Bullshit. Vann was a late addition. His presence didn't do anything.

The whole beginning with Reks was a solid tutorial and told us a bit about Basch. We could have then had a timeskip, took control of Balthier breaking into the castle and nothing would have changed, they would take the rock and escape.

Balthier would have run into Ashe in the sewer and the lot would be captured and thrown in prison to find Basch.

Then we get to the part with the pretty rock. Since Vann wasn't there to take it himself, Balthier would want to get rid of it. Since Vann isn't around, Penelo wouldn't have been a factor. Balthier, Fran and Basch travel to the floating city to strike a deal with someone who wants the rock as well as get in touch with the resistance. They head into the cave with some kid named Lamont tagging along to meet with the buyer. Turns out - it's Ba'Gammnan! They escape, learning some junk about Nethicite from Larsa.

After that, Vann and Penelo not existing wouldn't affect a thing. What little pivotal dialogue they had would just be spoken by another character.

I don't think this guy gets what it means by "Can't change the narrative"

Sorry, but you're not seeing the poroblem.

Just because one character suggested Bhujerba, doesn't mean one of the remaining ones could. Hell, they're older and more traveled so they have MORE reason to want to go there.

Ashe, for example, could go there to meet her uncle. Suddenly Penelo's entire suggestion is unnecessary. You see? They only used Vaan and Penelo to babble generic shit, they brought nothing unique or relevant to the table and it shows.

Seriously I'm NOT MAKING THIS UP, this is an actual human being saying this.

Posting in capital letters doesn't make you right, bro. Nothing changes the fact that in the final product we received, Vaan and Penelo are auxiliary characters at their BEST, and utterly without purpose for being in the game the rest of the time.

And we know the reason for this from finding out they are solely there to appeal to youngsters who can't relate to older characters. This discussion is over.

And his main proof for this is he can rewrite the games entire narrative to accomidate it. I can too, hell I HAVE rewritten a games entire narrative before as practice. doesn't make it any less wrong

This is the main problem I have with them.

They don't matter.

They never mattered.

The dev team admitted they were forced to put them in purely for marketing reasons.

All of that shows in the game, where if Vaan wasn't your avatar in towns you'd completely forget about him being i the game (like many people did with Penelo and Fran).

Excuse me, Seraph you've only seen a bit of the game and only had heard me talk and I may be biased, but even from the few scenes I've shown you can you honestly say "Oh yeah we can remove that guy with no change to the plot or character motivations"

I am filled with shock and awe that someone can be so STUPID so undeniably THICK that even after having me say in as little words as possible "If you have to make an edit then it doesn't count" and sticking to the same argument, despite ALL EVIDENCE to the contrary.

Want the maximum reason it wont work?

A. Ashe is taken away for half the game after being captured, taken to a seperate prison from Vaan's group
B. Balthier only got caught because of Vaan
C. Basch was in the prison they were sent to
D. Basch killed Ashe's father, Balthier is a thief and she's a revenge filled princess. She hates them, she only worked with Balthier because it was conveniant.

But lets say that somehow Balthier goes to prison, free's Basch, goes back to Rabanastre with him despite all that.

Okay... He has no reason to pursue Ashe because he's an AMORAL PIRATE! he has no reason to take Basch to Buhjerba for any reason because there's nothing in it for him, what's Basch a guy who just got out of jail after 2 years, who's been thought dead for 2 years going to give him?

See originally Penelo had been kidnapped by Headhunters and Vaan begged and pleaded Balthier to take him, even if he wouldn't help promising the Goddess Magicite if Balthier would help him (the prize they were both after) But if Balthier doesn't have it, then it's still in the palace, if he does, then he has no need to go to Buhjerba.

But lets ignore ALL THAT lets say he chooses to go, lets say he brings Basch with him, lets say they become best buddies. They still have to deal with the fact they got no reason to meet Larsa and the Head Hunters (unrelated to one another) because the reason they came has been lost (rescue Penelo)

I have to make huge GAPING CONSESSIONS to even alow this, if I presented this seriously to anyone I would be straight up laughed at. And yet here's some moron continuously telling me this.

But lets just leave it at that, like I said there is no point in complaining now. This isn't the place to whine and discuss FF12, so I'm just leaving you with this food for thought and drop the subject now. I know quoting another person ain't a good argument, but he's the smartest person I know pertaining to this game so leave ti at that.

 

[Kanlic]

snip

Thanks, that was interesting enough to see the minority viewpoint of the game. I still don't agree with him, even though he is obviously passionate about the subject, but thanks anyways.

OT, what is the new character roaster as of late, as far as I can tell there are the original characters from the first game, those in the trailer, and what else? Will the roster be upped to 30 characters or what?

 

[-Seraph-]

snip

Thanks, that was interesting enough to see the minority viewpoint of the game. I still don't agree with him, even though he is obviously passionate about the subject, but thanks anyways.

OT, what is the new character roaster as of late, as far as I can tell there are the original characters from the first game, those in the trailer, and what else? Will the roster be upped to 30 characters or what?

As of right now, ALL the characters from the first game will be returning with new balance tweaks, moves and everyone is getting a 3rd alt costume.

Right now there have been 6 new characters revealed: Kain Highwind, Lightning, Tifa Lockhart, Laguna Loire, Vaan, and Yuna. That brings the current roster to 28, BUT Nomura said there are still characters yet to come. So we will get between 8-10 new characters in total most likely. He said the characters yet to be revealed are from the SNES era games and up.

Gilgamesh is one of the highest probability characters to be added. Not only would he be great for the chaos side (seriously, we need SOME new bad guys), but Nomura actually was interested in adding him to the first game.

Kain, Lightning and even possibly Gilgamesh were supposed to, or thought about added to the first game but that never followed through. So now we are getting all the rejects lol.

So yea, expect a roster of 30-32 fighters in total. And I pray that they make Cosmos into a CPU boos character like Chaos was, would be fucking epic fighting her and she had her own "EX" form.

Any other new info I have is detailed in my OP, but if there are any questions pertaining to gameplay and what not I have no problem on filling people in.

 

[SpaceMedarotterX]

snip

Thanks, that was interesting enough to see the minority viewpoint of the game. I still don't agree with him, even though he is obviously passionate about the subject, but thanks anyways.

OT, what is the new character roaster as of late, as far as I can tell there are the original characters from the first game, those in the trailer, and what else? Will the roster be upped to 30 characters or what?

They said 10 additions max so we have 4 more to go.

As for why Vaan's important

Spoiler

He's Ashe's Shadow, they have literally the same developments from hating the empire for the exact same reason to seeking revenge, to handling the same pains and grief. They may have come from different castes but the two of them are the sides of a coin. But while Ashe spends the majority of the game debating and in doubt of what to do, Vaan has long since assumed the position that revenge is not the way. Think of the Occuria showing Ashe Prince Rassler, then remember that Vaan could see the same visions, we later learned they were used to spur Ashe on with thoughts of revenge, now consider that when Vaan has discarded his revenge he no longer see's them. The moment they get the Sword of the Kings he suggests they break the Nethicite they have on them. He does not agree with Ashe seeking revenge. Balthier and Basch also provide aid, in the forms of someone with direct Nethicite experiance and as someone who represents the knightly order. Vaan represents the people however and his contributions are probably the main thing that kept Ashe from jumping off the slippery slope of villainy. The difference between the Balthier, Basch and Vaan is how they handle the situation, Balthier is snarky and sarcastic as a front for his own fears, Basch is so used to pain both physically and emotionally that he is constantly fighting the war of attrition, the tactic of enduring pain. Vaan handles things MUCH more aggressivly which makes him the perfect foil for Ashe's own aggression. When they are at Eruyt Village and the Viera are refusing to budge it's not Balthier or Basch who gets them talking, it's Vaans "I don't give a damn what your rules are" attitude. it;'s unfortunatly undermined by the comedy scene at the end of the village segment but it's still a good moment.

The climax of this duality you see at the Pharos when Vaan and Ashe are confronting not only the Nethicite, but Gabranth. At the beginning it seems like Ashe is going to destroy it as Vaan correctly guesses after having watched her grow up. at that moment we as the player see how far Ashe has come as she repeats one of her repeating lines 'Don't interrupt' the first two times she says this it's filled with spite and anger, but when she says it on the pharos it's soft and whimsical, she's not really angry with Vaan or anyone. When Gabranth is egging her on she turns to Vaan, who has lost what she lost to Gabranth, a family member, his life became just as much a hell as hers. He's seething with anger and holding his sword and then he looks at her, and his breathing slows and then he puts down his sword and nods at her. And she's made the decision right then and there that revenge isn't the way. Balthier couldn't have shown her that, Basch couldn't have shown her that. you may be thinking 'But Reddas destroyed the Sun-Cryst not Ashe' that's true but he also only stepped in to act when Ashe cut through the ghost of Rasler and declared that she wouldn't be a false saint of the Occuria. And in that scene with the Sun-Cryst raging you see Ashe and Vaan struggling towards it, she's holding the Treaty Blade and he's holding the Sword of the Kings. symbolisim and duality, she's holding the weapon that would create nethicite, and he's holding the one who will destroy it forever.

I didn't make any of that up. A lot of people don't seem to remember much about FFXII either motivations or events. but upon replaying the game and focusing on the story. you really do get a lot out.

Anyway onto Dissidia!

Love Laguna mocking Squall in the trailer, Tifa looks fun as hell to play as, ah hell ALL the new characters look fun as hell to play as. Yuna will most likely be intresting because who knows how her summoning arts will work. Personally? I'm hoping for a 'Stand' like Ghostly vision behind her which throws magic or fists or whatever.

Looks like Vaan, Terra, Onion Knight and Gabranth are all in one story, I guess we can assume Cloud of Darkness is in and Kefka as well (I mean for there specific story of course)

And who was that of the floor in the villains lair it Kinda looked like Tidus or Cecil

 

[-Seraph-]

And who was that of the floor in the villains lair it Kinda looked like Tidus or Cecil

You talking about that scene with Chaos, Emperor and Garland? That was Jecht lying there. He was on Cosmos' side in this war before he was corrupted or whatever and joined Chaos' side. I wont be surprised if it was the Emperors scheme and doing that allowed them to capture Jecht and convert him. Dude was one of the most devious bad guys in the first game.

Although funny observation that I have not seen brought up AT ALL; Jecht and Tidus are fighting in that CG trailer which is no doubt the opening scene lik the first game. Does this mean Tidus was fighting for Chaos at some point in this conflict? Because you clearly see Jecht standing with the other Cosmos warriors in the beginning so maybe Tidus is under the same situation as Terra is in that they are being controlled by Chaos or something.

Just a little theory just now.

 

[SpaceMedarotterX]

And who was that of the floor in the villains lair it Kinda looked like Tidus or Cecil

You talking about that scene with Chaos, Emperor and Garland? That was Jecht lying there. He was on Cosmos' side in this war before he was corrupted or whatever and joined Chaos' side. I wont be surprised if it was the Emperors scheme and doing that allowed them to capture Jecht and convert him. Dude was one of the most devious bad guys in the first game.

Although funny observation that I have not seen brought up AT ALL; Jecht and Tidus are fighting in that CG trailer which is no doubt the opening scene lik the first game. Does this mean Tidus was fighting for Chaos at some point in this conflict? Because you clearly see Jecht standing with the other Cosmos warriors in the beginning so maybe Tidus is under the same situation as Terra is in that they are being controlled by Chaos or something.

Just a little theory just now.

Maybe it's more than that, maybe Tidus opted to fight for Chaos so his father wouldn't have to again as a sort of deal, when they capture Jecht and convert him the deals off so he defects back to Cosmos?

 

[-Seraph-]

hmm, maybe, anything can go down in this game from the looks of it. There are gonna (hopefully) be some interesting plot threads given when I've seen and know so far.

Why are Lightning and Warrior of Light at each others throats in that one scene?

What did WoL do (probably pertaining to Lightning) do to make him say how he is unfit the wear the light?

What fate will befall all these "new" characters?

How did Sephiroth kill himself?

More introspection on Emperors plans


How Jecht became corrupt?

Any story bits that involves Golbez; seriously, he was one of the most interesting characters in the entire story. His rather chaotic neutral stance and what ever relationship with Kain will be interesting.

Who remembers what? Tifa has no real memory of CLoud or Sephiroth for some reason. Those who fell in the previous cycle and were reanimated lost their memories which the Emperor explains.

How did Cosmos lose this war and what extra bits did they add to the first games story.

ect...

 

[Reg5879]

WHERE'S AURON?!?! Also, where's Vincent for that matter?

 

[SpaceMedarotterX]

WHERE'S AURON?!?! Also, where's Vincent for that matter?

Why would you want vincent? He's an emo (for real this time not the word people throw around with abandon) little ***** who is in no way fun to have around. I may have called Laguna Erectile Dysfunction Man but at least he wont make me put my fist through my PSP

 

[-Seraph-]

WHERE'S AURON?!?! Also, where's Vincent for that matter?

Why would you want vincent? He's an emo (for real this time not the word people throw around with abandon) little ***** who is in no way fun to have around. I may have called Laguna Erectile Dysfunction Man but at least he wont make me put my fist through my PSP

A bit off topic but why did you call Laguna that?

I'm pretty sure it's a reference to his notorious Leg cramps that he gets when he's around a pretty girl. Heh I don't blame him for getting a "leg cramp" in front of Cloud of Darkness XD

 

[SpaceMedarotterX]

WHERE'S AURON?!?! Also, where's Vincent for that matter?

Why would you want vincent? He's an emo (for real this time not the word people throw around with abandon) little ***** who is in no way fun to have around. I may have called Laguna Erectile Dysfunction Man but at least he wont make me put my fist through my PSP

A bit off topic but why did you call Laguna that?

I'm pretty sure it's a reference to his notorious Leg cramps that he gets when he's around a pretty girl. Heh I don't blame him for getting a "leg cramp" in front of Cloud of Darkness XD

That?s what I thought.

yeah it's a joke about the 'leg cramp'