It DOES fly though, constantly. I mean, look at DS 2, EA is making a killing with downloadable skins and extra weapons for Isaac that should've been in the game in the first place..Cpu46 said:
DLC, or why isn't my game finished in the first place?
- Thread starter The Robotman
- Start date
Somewhat agree. I don't like patches myself, as it seems that you are sold a beta and you're given a nicer version of the game later(likely after your save file crashes), but it's still better than being sold a buggy game from the beginning.
And DLC is completely subjective for me.
And DLC is completely subjective for me.
Were cartridges the main format back then? Because I remember CD games being pretty cheap when the PS1 popularized them.SturmDolch said:
There's already quite a few weapons/armour sets in the game, selling additional weapons and armour after release isn't too unreasonable. I'd say DS2 is well worth the money I paid for it ($70 over here in Canada) and if they want to charge a little extra should you want to beef up your arsenal, it's not exactly a crime.The Robotman said:
the Internet is a privilege, and is just now being introduced in certain countries as we sit and type. Some places on the planet haven't even seen TV's, though that's becoming an almost inconsistent amount, dwindling to certain tribes in deeper parts of Africa and what not. The point is, alot of gamers simply aren't connected to the internet because they can't afford or simply don't want to be!
note this is refering to console games only, pc games have had updates and dlc LONG before.The Robotman said:
you have to remember that back in the day they didnt have the internet to facilitate online updates. they HAD to release a perfect game because they knew they wouldnt get another shot at it. also keep in mind how often games are coming out today; we have a fraction of the companys spitting out four times the number of games every year. and dlc? it used to be that you would get the occaisional expansion because the company wants to give something to the fans, and still see some profit from it, and again they only have one shot because online updates wernt possible. today they see only profit from dlc because they only spend a fraction of the time on it, and dont need to worry about shipping or producing. even advertising thanks to things like the 360 dashboard.
now pc games realized they were eaisally hacked so after they released the game they knew user made content would carry it long after the company was done with it. tribes, morrowind and starcraft im looking at you.
EDIT: one final thing. you complain about lag? the people who made modern warfare wernt prepared for the HUGE number of players that all bought the game and all decided to play at the same time. so many people played that all xbox games, not just COD were lagging.
Games are never completed, they're just finished within a deadline and sold. Back in the day you wouldn't get any fixes not in new game sequel form or in the form of the many re-releases of SF2.
It's the lesser of two evils basically and who is the worst evil varies from game to game. Some games rock so much that you're willing to excuse it just because you're really wanting more of them no matter what. Some games aren't that good and while dlc most likely won't turn them good, in the chance that it does (by fixing some major problem...though how often does that happen...I can only think of PS3's Bayonetta version for this) you're still not connected enough to them so you'll not be as lenient.
In the end, I didn't mind getting nickle and dimed for Disgaea 3 stuff.
It's the lesser of two evils basically and who is the worst evil varies from game to game. Some games rock so much that you're willing to excuse it just because you're really wanting more of them no matter what. Some games aren't that good and while dlc most likely won't turn them good, in the chance that it does (by fixing some major problem...though how often does that happen...I can only think of PS3's Bayonetta version for this) you're still not connected enough to them so you'll not be as lenient.
In the end, I didn't mind getting nickle and dimed for Disgaea 3 stuff.
On patches:
Games are a lot more complex than they were before, especially sandbox games (which were BTW always buggy). It's ludicrous to think that developers can iron out all the possible bugs in a game that lets players create their own experience in a completely open world. Good developers (like Bethesda) fix most bugs as they learn about them, and bad developers (like Obsidian) let players rot. But crying about there being too many pacthes is the weirdest thing since blue ketchup.
On DLC:
Nobody's putting a gun to your head to buy them. Most Day 1 DLC is either A) Useless skin packs and shit that are meant for people with very high disposable income and/or stupids or B) Free for people who buy new copies that actually get their due to developers and publishers. This is meant to convince people to not buy used games, and I support the idea.
DLC that's not Day 1 are additions that can be great or a profound waste of time. You mentioned Fallout 3: the original 50$ game packed plenty of content, and the five 10$ DLCs added more stuff that you could get if you want, or ignore. If you ignore them, you still have your money's worth with the original F3. Again, complaining about all this is the weirdest thing since complaining about patches. (See what I did there?)
Games are a lot more complex than they were before, especially sandbox games (which were BTW always buggy). It's ludicrous to think that developers can iron out all the possible bugs in a game that lets players create their own experience in a completely open world. Good developers (like Bethesda) fix most bugs as they learn about them, and bad developers (like Obsidian) let players rot. But crying about there being too many pacthes is the weirdest thing since blue ketchup.
On DLC:
Nobody's putting a gun to your head to buy them. Most Day 1 DLC is either A) Useless skin packs and shit that are meant for people with very high disposable income and/or stupids or B) Free for people who buy new copies that actually get their due to developers and publishers. This is meant to convince people to not buy used games, and I support the idea.
DLC that's not Day 1 are additions that can be great or a profound waste of time. You mentioned Fallout 3: the original 50$ game packed plenty of content, and the five 10$ DLCs added more stuff that you could get if you want, or ignore. If you ignore them, you still have your money's worth with the original F3. Again, complaining about all this is the weirdest thing since complaining about patches. (See what I did there?)
I doubt countries that are just now getting the internet are going to be worrying about what DLC they're missing out on.The Robotman said:
What about free DLC that counts towards the story? Such as those from Valve and Epic Games?Julianking93 said:
Never heard of free DLC like that, but yeah, if it's free that's fine. It just pisses me off that I have to spend yet another ridiculous amount of money to get the game finished after I've already paid more than what the game's worth.Firetaffer said:
Your comment made me laugh. Now that I think about it, you're completely right. *Slaps forehead.*IronicBeet said:
Some people seem to forget something else along with - surprise, surprise - games haven't fluctuated in price all that much: there's a small chance that someone will have an idea well after the game is completed and released. An extra level here, another character there, hell, even something as mundane as a new costume - someone might have gotten that idea one, two, three months after release. Are you really gonna fault the developers for that? If so, then that's pretty fucking petty.
And "too many patches" are a problem only when they ultimately do nothing, i.e. Ninja Gaiden 2. A new patch seems to drop every 3 days, but they only seem to add to the list of problems the game already has.
One last thing: you feel your game is "incomplete"? Stop playing it, either return it or trade it in, and play something that you feel is better worth your time. It's not that difficult - believe me, I've tried. Watch I get attacked...
And "too many patches" are a problem only when they ultimately do nothing, i.e. Ninja Gaiden 2. A new patch seems to drop every 3 days, but they only seem to add to the list of problems the game already has.
One last thing: you feel your game is "incomplete"? Stop playing it, either return it or trade it in, and play something that you feel is better worth your time. It's not that difficult - believe me, I've tried. Watch I get attacked...
And why, pray tell, should they have been in the game in the first place? It's like saying the guys who made your car should give you the ski rack, genuine leather seats and sunroof for free because they made those extras before release (and they are extras, no matter how much you rationalize it). You want the Isaac Clarke Winnie the Pooh mascot costume? Buy it. You don't? Then don't.The Robotman said:
I spot a blanket statement. Saying that all companies use DLC to get away with selling broken games is absolutely ridiculous. DLC is also the result of the developers getting a great idea after a game's release.
As for patches? Other than games like Fallout: New Vegas, I haven't been seeing many games which were "broken." In fact, more often than not, I see patches which address glitches that I didn't even know existed. Of course, that doesn't apply to every patch, but I think there's a good deal of overreacting going on here.
As for patches? Other than games like Fallout: New Vegas, I haven't been seeing many games which were "broken." In fact, more often than not, I see patches which address glitches that I didn't even know existed. Of course, that doesn't apply to every patch, but I think there's a good deal of overreacting going on here.
Games have grown FAR more complex (graphics and shizz). And this only goes up over time. What some day was simple as 2D tetris cake, now demands four video cards, sound cards, eight CPUs and to utilize all that simultaneously in orchestrated manner. You know, just because we need it all be like "for real" with all the graphics and whatnot.
Complex projects are... complex and have many problems during development. Deal with it. Either let them delay or don't whine.
Complex projects are... complex and have many problems during development. Deal with it. Either let them delay or don't whine.
A couple of things:The Robotman said:
Games have never been glitch-free. So don't say that bugs have only become prevalent in this generation because of patches. While there are companies that take advantage of the ability to fix their games later, most companies do it to improve and fine tune their products using the time that wasn't available during production. Take Daggerfall, for instance. That game was a buggy mess that could've desperately used a patch (or ten). When Oblivion was released, it was full of bugs that Bethesda couldn't have found. So when players reported them, they were able to fix the issues through patches. Granted, Oblivion still has problems, but it used to be a lot worse.
As for DLC, there's nothing wrong with it. Developers are offering additional content. It's up to you whether you buy it or not. What's the issue here?
I'm not a fan of DLC...it was a wonderful concept back when it was on paper where you could get new content for games, expansions, if you will, for your gaming experiences right from your own home. Somehow that became "ship out a portion of the game at full price and ding the consumer for the rest of it again when we ship the DLC". I'm looking at you Force Unleashed 2. And to some extent, Fable 3.
As for glitches and the patches thereof, I can only say that I wish that I had never updated my Elder Scrolls Oblivion game back in the day. They hooped the magic system and made it useless and the game is literally so buggy that I cannot cross the map without crossing some sort of hot-zone of game crashing catastrophe.
As for glitches and the patches thereof, I can only say that I wish that I had never updated my Elder Scrolls Oblivion game back in the day. They hooped the magic system and made it useless and the game is literally so buggy that I cannot cross the map without crossing some sort of hot-zone of game crashing catastrophe.