DMing Problem - Don't Split the Group

[alittlepepper]

And as an addendum, while this is a pretty sticky situation for any DM to deal with, the PC Diva and all, just wait until you run into the Rules-Lawyer Munchkin.
Good luck if you ever do, you'll need it. (I game with an entire group of them. :| Last time we played a high level campaign, the DM had to throw out a marilith with class levels, enchanted armor, enchanted weapons ((+2 Vampiric weapons all)) and feats to even be a challenge for the group. Which was intensely boring, by the way, hence why we stick to playing low level characters. )

 

[Johnny Impact]

He should have consulted with the other players, figured out whether his concept could jive with the rest of the group. He did not. He made a character who would hate everyone else in the group.

He does not have the right to a disproportionate amount of your attention. He is denying everyone else their fair share.

While you should respect your players' right to roleplay -- encourage it, in fact -- you're gonna have to do something here.

You could make sure your plot overlaps his character's interests: "Why should I care if the goblin army destroys Humanville?" "Because Humanville is on the border of your country. Where do you think the goblins will go next?" Give the character a reason to care.

Next time he goes solo, you could confront him with an encounter he can't defeat on his own, something clearly requiring a full party. If he's smart he'll ask for help. If not he may die. Either way, he'll learn a lesson.

You could suggest that his character leave the group permanently. Clearly he places no value on their companionship. The party thing just isn't working for him. He could go back home, to where his true interests lie. The player could stay on, rolling up someone who isn't too bigoted to join a group.

You could offer him the GM job. He likes control and has definite ideas for things to do. Let him have the big chair for a while.

You could present the character with serious consequences regarding his attitude. He wants to experience racism and exclusion? Fine, show him how unpleasant racism or exclusion can be. Have the next town be humans-only. He'll be stuck outside for days while the rest of the group has adventures within. The next time the group asks for help from a powerful NPC, have the NPC be racist against him, refusing to help any group that allows ____s to join. After a session or two of this, ask him if he'd like to be part of the group again.

I'm sure there are more options.

Edit: I ran a D&D campaign with a spotlight hog. I presented his paladin character with a difficult moral test, for his own good (no, really). He flatly refused to decide. Against my wishes, the campaign ended there. I hope you have better luck.

 

[Royta]

We had a party member like this. Racist to the core. But we figured a way to make it work.
Firstoff, since he's a hardcore roleplayer, messure which characters his characters like. Think of situations where that bond can become stronger. Have his character bond with another, so that he'll atleast have incentive to stay on the 'path'.

Now, what we did was to have a few quests that involved multiple races. What made this quest work was that it was about some sort of hidden village with elves. Our party wanted to find them to save them, yet our Racist partymember joined in under the guise of helping but in the end to sell them out.
Make quests or storylines wherein his racisme will be tested and in such a way that it forces his character to join the group.
Another way is to send your group on a long important quest, have him be an undercover esque agent. He'll be forced to be with them, have all the knowledge that they know and then betray them.

The final thing, and this is how our story ended up. The rasist betrayed us, we found out, and we killed him in a epic battle. Sometimes, killing off the character is a good way to do it, but not forcing it. Have it occure naturally.

Last but not least, talk to the player. Tell him that you respect his playstyle, but if he's so serious about roleplaying he should respect the DM as well. And that he's making things more then difficult for you by this adverse style of play.
Good luck!

 

[Silverfox99]

I have always believed that a Dm's job is to provide consequences for the characters actions.

The problem with him leaving the group is that he is weaker, has no help and is more likely to get killed, captured etc. It doesn't mean it will happen but is more likely. It also means that in an unexpected situation he can't adjust as well as a group can that works as a group.

So if a wandering monster finds him and this monster looks weak like maybe a single kobold that looks shaken and has scratches on em, he will be more likely to attack said monster. What he doesn't know is that the kobold is this way because he is carry an item of great power and has been running for his life. This kobold will be jumpy and not trusting of anything that crosses his path and more willing to shoot and then ask questions. If you player starts to mess with the kobold then the kobold pulls out his 'D&D mini gun'. The mini gun is something like 6 wands tied together with the same command word. This kibold could be a threat to the whole party. But its only one person. If you have the kobold be a plot device and use it to give the party important information he can't say you are hating on him, or Deus Ex.

The point is as a character he can't deal with everything that is why you have a group. When he goes alone he will at some point encounter something unexpected that he can't handle. It could be as simple as a bear trap that he didn't see. Or the kobold.

 

[Hawgh]

Ideas:

Have a talk with him, try to convince him to ease it up, offer some suggestions that both he and the rest of the group can go with, or roll up a more team-oriented character.

Have a main villain wipe out his entire people while he's away.

If all else fails, give him the boot.

By the way, what game system is this?

Personally, I generally start campaigns out with setting up some sort of agreement that we're all there to have fun and work together.

I remember one DnD campaign, where one of the players had the intriguing idea of playing a character with two minds: A good and an evil. At the first failed will save that resulted in a personality shift, he shapeshifted into an eagle and flew off, leaving the rest of the party to finish off some winter wolves and generally going "what the hell?".

Session ended shortly thereafter, and the group fell apart due to unrelated, infantile reasons.

Good times.

 

[TheDrunkNinja]

...and it sounds like he's in charge, that's not fun either...ambush him, pit trap him, make his solo quest hell...take it to a dedicated D&D board with his sheet and get some help to break this guy if need be, there WILL be ways, lots of, and no ONE person has allt he angles covered - power players are generlaly not fun unless it's a group of power players and his skiils as a roleplayer say not a true munchkin

That's kind of the way he likes it. I've noticed that in nearly every campaign he's been in, he's always tried to assert some level of control in the direction of the group. I even remember him going into diva mode when no one would listen to one of his characters.

... You wouldn't happen to know a good D&D board I could take this up with?

And as an addendum, while this is a pretty sticky situation for any DM to deal with, the PC Diva and all, just wait until you run into the Rules-Lawyer Munchkin.

Oh god, there's actual terms for these kinds of things?!

 

[wilsontheterrible]

I've been DMing for years for friends and strangers alike at my local game shop and at this point I've started to look at characters like gears in a machine that makes the story go forward.

As long as the pieces all move towards the same end you can split the group all you want. I've done campaigns where some of the characters don't even meet face to face for 3-4 sessions.

Oh and rolls? There are three very easy words that can make even the most seasoned player rethink their amazing combat/social prowess, sorry you failed. I make up rolls more often then not, the point of the game is to have fun, if a character crits an NPC that you need just lie. The rules serve the GM, the GM does not serve the rules. Thats the idea White Wolf operates on but it applies to all table top games and I find it especially fun in D&D.

Scenario: If I throw a group of difficult monsters his way, he'll demand I have him roll perception before they arrive, which would technically be fair. He'd roll stealth and case the monsters. If he believes he can't take them, he'll just walk away since he has made stealth skills. If I don't let him do any of this, he'll just get pissed off.

Responce.

Be deceptive. Who's to say larger, more powerful creatures didn't send a weaker party forward to draw opponents out? Technically he did see the threat, he just failed to see the bigger picture. Once he gets into combat give him another perception check -4 for being distracted to notice the actual threat approaching. Beat him to a pulp and have him ransomed to the party. That will strip the player of his ego and his character of some of his dignity, humbling on all counts.

That can be a whole campaign. Capture then break out/liberate. Characters are people and people can be broken.

 

[Neo10101]

Well, you can write in an event for him that you know his character will go off and do no matter what, make sure there are characters that warn him against doing it, but if your good enough and can write it well enough he's still go, then kill him off while he is alone, he makes a new character, you say he had a fair warning and shouldnt have gone alone. He can't do shit, and hopefully he wont make the same character.

 

[alittlepepper]

Oh god, there's actual terms[/ib] for these kinds of things?!

Oh yes. In fact, here's a handy-dandy reference guide to many RPG cliche's that exist out there. Note: Just because something is mentioned in the guide doesn't always mean it's bad, just that it's common.

http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt3831.html

I think I probably did make up the specific term "Rules-Lawyer Munchkin", but you should be able to figure out the meaning pretty well.

Anyway. Best of luck with your game, mate. Dealing with a problem player can be really annoying, but if you do it right it can make for a pretty complex story, too...if you're up to it.
Your choice though, most of the suggestions I've seen here so far are good.

 

[TheDrunkNinja]

By the way, what game system is this?

Pathfinder. That was by my request since it's the one I'm most used to.

Also, I've thought about killing off his village, but I'm under the impression he would just run off to find the culprit by himself saying something along the lines of this being a "family matter".

 

[Imperioratorex Caprae]

There's a quick fix. Explain, diplomatically, that he is derailing the game with his lone-wolf actions, and interjecting his own story in the game using the "rules" or personal gripes as a shield to hide behind. Tell him that if he insists on doing this he can either a. create his own game and DM it, or b. leave the game altogether.
Its not his game, its yours and the other players. He does not dictate the terms, you as the DM dictate the universe and using a deus ex to move the plot forward is not harming the game nearly as much as he is.
A DM's role is more like a referee at times. I can't count how many games I've spent attempting to keep players from derailing the game by various means. While I can improvise on the spot when players choose a direction I didn't think about, I refuse to let players completely trash the campaign for their own pleasures.
Personally it sounds like you have a tabletop version of a troll and I hate trolls like that and usually ban them from my games.
Also, there's nothing wrong with not letting players roll on every event that happens. The dice do not dictate every aspect of the game.

 

[spartan231490]

Lose the player. No, seriously. Lone-wolf style players do nothing but drag the overall quality of a campaign down. I've played with them and I've DM'ed for them; my personal experience has been that they're just not worth having around. The game always improved significantly after they were removed.

Normally I'd agree with this. but I got the impression from the OP that it's not the players normal style, it's just this character. i would kill the character, and then let the player roll a character that wasn't lone wolf. At least not that bad.

 

[live2laugh]

If this guys character wants to be on his own quite so much what would be his incentive to stay in the group? try not to give him attention when he goes off maybe cut back everynow and again but he cannot take up more of your time than all the other players. talk to this guy about it and explain to him that you have put a lot of effort into these sessions as being a DM is not easy, try to make him see things from your point of view. Just remember that the rules are there to help the game along and help people have fun. Good luck with your game though

 

[Xaio30]

Make him go through hell whenever he wants to do something on his own.

 

[Maze1125]

My answer is quite different to the majority of the thread:

Accommodate him.
Let him run off on his own and have is own adventure with-in the world you have created, while having him lead back to the main group for major events.

If you're a good enough DM then there's no reason you can't run two separate campaigns in the same world. Obviously he's going to have to wait around a lot, as your main focus will be the main group, but that's his choice.

Worst comes to worst, then, as someone suggested, just make his adventure happen off screen until he meets up with the party again.

 

[theultimateend]

This is why you put bomb collars on all of them and anyone that separates gets their head blown off.

That's how Obsidian handled people douching out .

 

[haloman13]

Hey guys Ive never played d and d but it seems like fun, can I get a fast 101 on how to play this thing? some links would be nice

 

[sniddy_v1legacy]

...and it sounds like he's in charge, that's not fun either...ambush him, pit trap him, make his solo quest hell...take it to a dedicated D&D board with his sheet and get some help to break this guy if need be, there WILL be ways, lots of, and no ONE person has allt he angles covered - power players are generlaly not fun unless it's a group of power players and his skiils as a roleplayer say not a true munchkin

That's kind of the way he likes it. I've noticed that in nearly every campaign he's been in, he's always tried to assert some level of control in the direction of the group. I even remember him going into diva mode when no one would listen to one of his characters.

... You wouldn't happen to know a good D&D board I could take this up with?

And as an addendum, while this is a pretty sticky situation for any DM to deal with, the PC Diva and all, just wait until you run into the Rules-Lawyer Munchkin.

Oh god, there's actual terms for these kinds of things?!

I don't I'd either go direct to source and the main boards for the system

Or Order of the stick has a lot of real knowledgeable type people who can point you in better direcitons

 

[InsaneMaggot]

Allright, i'm not a good DM at all but i think i have an approach for this. tell me what you think.

Make 2 quests, seemingly unconnected.
For the lone wolf it would be from his tribe, something along the lines of "the kidnaped your sister!". he obviously is going to go alone and try to settle matter on his own.
While the rest of the group has an unconnected quest, like say, They have to kill a monster that is terrorizing the nearby town.
The rest plays out like this (and i would talk with the group beforehand, excepting the lone wolf so they know what's up) :
lone wolf will quest alone and ultimately find the guy who holds hist sister/whatever hostage, but it turns out that the guy is friggn powerfull.
While the other group happens to be near that spot still searching for the monster. If they have a ranger on board, maybe they can find the hideout quickly, but don't make it too obvious.
Lone wolf is nearly losing and at that moment the group arrives and helps him out, giving his character a reason to see the mistake in his racist nature.

Could be done in one setting, the entire thing would revolve around him (presumably what he wants) and gives his character growth. If he is a good rp'player like you said, i highly doubt that he will continue to play like before (with his current char)

Y/N, folks?

 

[Crystalite]

hm, rule number one:
Never ever play with people who take this to seriously, or get upset about the fate of their characters.
Believe me, it always always ends in drama.

You say this person is your friend, but you describe him as a selfish prick, when gaming at least. Why do you want to play with him? No, he is not a good player if he cannot understand that the enjoyment of the group is more important than some hype he has created about some make-believe figure of his.

If you absolutely must wait on his strange whims, then just make a solo campaign for him and this character, and play with the others in peace - without him.
That or just tell him how you feel, and that he should act like a grown up, or stuff it.

Just saying, get some perspective both of you.


Sorry if that is harsh, but this is a hobby of yours.
Nobody needs that kind of Diva in his free time.


Edit: That is also why you never let your players control the amount of power their characters have. Sorry, that is just not a clever thing to do. Sooner or later you will be calling down tactical nukes on their heads without scratching them, trust me.
Characters should be more or less on par with one another and slightly less powerfull than the campaign demands, forcing them to think and improvise.