Do many Westerners really dislike Japanese games for such shallow reasons as "anime"?

[Aerosteam]

And the dialogue .... oh feth me the dialogue. I shall leave you with this scene.....


Oh, the horror.

That's the reason I hate most anime. Or, at least, one of them.

The way characters speak English in a JRPG either irritates me or is just humorous, pick any Unskippable episode of a JRPG and notice how many times Graham and Paul make fun of the dialog.

 

[Rastien]

Personally i enjoy most games sports games not so much as im pretty sure if i play fifa 2013 (when did we skip ahead a year in these games anyway :S) it will play the same as fifa 2001 i played 12 years ago with better graphics and possibly phsyics but they seem abit copy pasted also

I agree that not every year of a sports game is worth buying but don't throw out the entire sports game genre, MLB 12: The Show is a great sports game and although the jump from 2011-2012 wasn't that big of a step (didn't they change wildcard rules this year IRL?) the game is still a solid buy and easily my favorite sports game (Tiger woods coming up second)

OT: While anime style doesn't bother me, for the most part Japanese story-telling isn't my cup of tea. It's just so damn cheesy, there's only so many times I can hear someone say 'believe in yourself' before my mind automatically thinks I'm watching a disney movie and I zone out.

Final Fantasy is the best example of this, Metal gear has a little more mature of a story but it's way too long winded about it's message.

Also, screw Japanese developers, every since Super Mario 2 they've decided to not release some of their best games in North America. Project Rainfall anyone?

seriously though, time to release mother 3.

Hehe fair shout, my jaded view comes from friends throughout school eager as hell to get the latest fifa or pro evoloution soccer and i'm sat there struggling to tell the difference between 2001 and 2002 and the fact they blindly argue its so much better as they sunk £35 into it. It did have updated rosters mind you! , but yeah ill give some new ones a go again.

Also i can see where your coming from on the story telling front it is abit stagnent which makes some of the other games shine alot more Valkyria Chronicles comes to mind, closest a game has come to dealing with the issue of

Spoiler

genocide.

But even that had elements of believe in yourself. That and as yahtzee said if you show up to the army with your own tank they let you be a commander, sweet deal if you ask me .

 

[Squidbulb]

That's the reason I hate most anime. Or, at least, one of them.

The way characters speak English in a JRPG either irritates me or is just humorous, pick any Unskippable episode of a JRPG and notice how many times Graham and Paul make fun of the dialog.

Agreed. And for the people that say you should watch it in Japanese, that doesn't help. I'd rather not watch the bottom two inches of the screen for the entire game. That, and it's just more pleasant to hear something in a familiar language.

 

[Nexxis]

I don't care for many games with a heavy anime influence because, after a while, they start to look the same to me. Aesthetics are very important to me. A game could be good, but if the art style doesn't suit my fancy, they I won't get to the point of enjoying the gameplay. That said, I don't really like anime. Don't get me wrong, I love some of the styles in them, I just don't care for the stories.

 

[DustyDrB]

I won't lie. That art style is a hurdle for me to overcome. And the more...cutesy (?) it is then the harder it is for me to get past it. Tales of Vesperia represents about the furthest I can go with it, though I do enjoy the gameplay in it.

I'm fickle, I guess. I don't like things to look like a children's show (except Rayman: Origins. But that game is just too gorgeous). But I hate the look of things like Gears of War even more. I actually quit playing Gears of War pretty much due to its awful visual aesthetic.

That said, there are plenty of Japanese games that don't go overboard with the cutesy visuals.

And all this reminds me: I need to go download Persona 3 from the PSN.

 

[Zack Alklazaris]

While both Western games and Japanese games have overused their typical story lines.

American: You are the only hope to save the world.
Japanese: A team of misfits band together to defeat a powerful foe.

In general I just don't click with Japanese culture. While I respect it as a society it just seems weird. What little exposure to the entertainment industry in Japan I have had has not been pleasant. Sure "Castle in the Sky" and "Spirited Away" and wonderful animes, but they seem to be drowned in ridiculous corny dialogue or has blatant pedophilia.

The games I'm sure are better. I have dabbled in Final Fantasy, but since most seem to be only on console and I'm a pc gamer, I do admit I have not been properly exposed. Still what little I have played while enjoyable at first, tends to get old and repetitive.

In the end why do you care? You like it, you have millions of people who are with you in liking it, what does it matter? Don't let your identity be shaken by what the majority in your community clings to. Don't be offended by it ether. After all we all have our right to like what we want and hate what we don't want.

 

[someonehairy-ish]

I don't like the voices in (most) animes and japanese media in general. Why do the girls have to speak in a high pitched annoying yap? Grr. Also the effeminate pretty boy characters tend to annoy me too. They look like they belong in pop bands. I hate pop bands.

As for the 'manly men' main characters in video games, I don't really see that many overly macho characters in games that you wouldn't expect to be hench. Marines are supposed to be in shape. So are sword weilding warriors; that armour weighs a ton. God of War? Yeah, you'd expect the god of war to macho.
Yeah, the characterisation and writing for a lot of manly characters could do with some work but honestly it makes sense for most of them to be fairly muscley.

 

[Adeptus Aspartem]

Aestethics are as important as game mechanics. Sometimes doing one of both exceptionally good can make you overlook flaws in the other but only to a certain extend.

And not everyone likes all graphic / arts style, so i don't see any reason why someone should play something, he doesn't enjoy.
Also "shallow" is the wrong word, it's superficial and i can't see anything bad about being superficial to games, these things live from their visual appeal too.

You wouldn't call out someone shallow who'd say: "I don't play this game because i don't like mechanic X."
But why can't he enjoy the nice aestethics and not only shallowly judge the mechanics? I could still be a beautiful game!

Or do you also think people should listen to music they can't connect with, just to give the songtexts a chance?

 

[worldruler8]

Honestly, I like anime the same way I like all art forms. They need to be done correctly, or at least with a sense of artistic expertise and originality, or else I despise them. This isn't just for anime, I hate when realistic art styles are done badly. From making explosions and contrast bland (look at old WW2 films showing the bombing runs at night, look at the contrast. I want to see someone do that correctly. it's a beautiful (albeit horrific) culmination of bright orange (or white, since most are black and white) and jet black.) to not having realistic gameplay (bullets don't travel in straight lines). When you have a certain artstyle, you tend to constrict yourself to a certain gameplay style as well. You can try to do a different style, but you risk making your game seem odd and very out of place.

I do enjoy some anime, particularly with things made by Miyazaki, with Spirited Away being my personal favorite, as it has fantastical elements that were played so straight, yet felt so...right. I've only seen this with one other medium, and that was with Morrowind, which had a much different artstyle, yet had a similar concept of having fantastical elements played straight. That was also why I hated Oblivion's artstyle, as I felt the "cartoony" look was toxic to the environments of Cyrodiil.

However, anime seems to follow certain...issues. I'll split this into two parts. When I see anime fall flat on its face, it tends to follow these two, that being "animu" and being very generic. "Animu" is a stereotypical art style with anime (and is often considered to be anime, though I would consider it BAD anime) They tend to have tell-tale signs.
-mouths being "off to the side" of faces
-very sharp chins
-"spur of the moment" emotional scenes, where characters have rather disproportional structures, often having a "O.O" face
-faces of characters are often very geometric. This can be done as a specific art style (often making it seem like an older comicbook), but in this case, it is rather bad looking, and looks rather cheap.
-Faces, and even profiles of characters, look rather the same, with any nuances being hairstyle, palette choices, and weapon variety

Now, notice that these aren't the requirements to be an "animu", but most "animu" tend to have these. Another issue is how generic bad anime tend to be, often having a very...well...wangsty storyline, with mary-sue characters and drama that fail to reach the curriculum that most western drama follows. Now, often for me, ignoring the bad anime, often the main issue with anime is they tend to be very...eastern. From rather fantastical elements that just seem to be accepted, to monsters and creatures that follow ancient Shinto religious elements, which to the western viewer, is often so alien and Other, that it looks like an Eldritch Abomination.

I hope that helps...

 

[Agayek]

Weeaboos will cause the Great Bear Rebellions.

It's understandable why people wouldn't like Japanese aesthetic.

The real question is, will these Great Bear Rebellions involve bears riding on bear cavalry? We might be able to survive just the bears attacking us, but if they bring in their bear cavalry, we're doomed.

 

[OldNewNewOld]

What I can't understand is that people play games with magic and shit, jet they can't get past the thing that a weak looking guy wields a huge sword. (Cloud for example).

And more on topic.
Visuals are important to me, but no matter how the game looks, if the gameplay doesn't feel right, I won't play the game.
But on the other side, if the gameplay is good, I will play the game even if I don't like the visuals. Unless the visuals are so damn ugly that it hurts my eyes watching at them.

And funny how many people didn't understand OP.
He never said anything close to "stop liking what I don't like". He only said to try to overlook the visuals and give the game a try. Don't be shallow to dislike something based ONLY on the looks.

There are many games for which I though look bad, but I still gave them a try. And many of those were actually so good that I could completely overlook the visuals. In some cases I even started liking the look of it.

The visuals are indeed a big part of the game. You're constantly looking at it. But if it's not so bad that it hurts, don't hate it but give it a try. You can hate it later.

Not only is the art style shitty, a lot of Jap games also have shitty gameplay and usually a shitty story.
Can I go back to Skyrim now?

HAHAHAHA...
Such a great joke.

Skyrim's story is so bad that saying "shitty" is a compliment.
The art style is more repetitive than the first Mario game and the gameplay is mediocre at best.

 

[Tohuvabohu]

snip

This is just my take on the subject, and my point of view about why Westerners may dislike jRPG's visually.

Personally, I have no issue with strong anime artsyles. In fact, I love videogames that present highly stylized art styles. From cel shaded games like Windwaker and XIII, to TF2's cartoonish appearance, to anime styles like Persona and Fear Effect.


Anime artstyles don't bother me at all, and they can be pretty awesome at times. However, we can't really talk about jRPG's without bringing up the grand ************ of jRPG's: Final Fantasy. Arguably, westerners regard Final Fantasy as the de-facto "example" of what jRPG's offer. And in Final Fantasy, there is a profound problem.

The games obviously have anime aesthetics, while delivering a non-animated art style. It's just that the aesthetics look like ass. Naturally this is my opinion, but just look at what I mean.

Here is a character from Catherine:

Spoiler: Orlando (Large Picture!)

[/spoiler]

That is also what he looks like in-game. In a total anime art style, Orlando just looks like a well-dressed dude. His appearance is fairly simple, but memorable and easy to identify.

Now let's look at Tidus from FFX:

[spoiler="Tidus(Large picture!)"] [img src="http://www.heavenlyswords.com/images/C/tidus.jpg"][/spoiler]

Jesus jumping shitballs. Where the hell do I start? How would you describe this mess?

Here we have an example of Final Fantasy's shortcomings, and that picture sums up the aesthetics of the entire game. Over-designed characters in impractical fanservice outfits. It's not just characters either. In FFX, the entire game had a clusterfucked aesthetic design. Very rarely did this art direction work in the games favor. Nor in the favor of jRPG's as a whole.

It looks like someone tried to create a character, had generated several concept arts for one character. Then ate all the concept art drawings and puked it back up. [b]It looks like visual-vomit.[/b] And if people use games like Final Fantasy X as a benchmark for what jRPG's have to offer. Then we are fucked! (And this point is proven by several previous posts.)

This however doesn't mean that wRPG's, or western games in general, aren't guilty of generating it's own visual vomit.

[spoiler][img src="http://greywardens.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/Flemeth.jpg"]

[img src="http://firsthour.net/screenshots/gears-of-war/gears-of-war-marcus-dom-cogs.jpg"]

[/spoiler]

I think there's a distinct line between "anime/anime-influenced art direction" and "really, really, bad art direction."

 

[Slayer_2]

If I want to play as a pre-puber teenage boy wielding a sword longer than a small car, and/or a 300 caliber pistol, I would play JRPG's. I don't. Honestly, I'd rather play the "gritty realistic macho US Marine". At least that is a somewhat interesting and believable character. I don't want Japanese developers to change, I just don't play their games, simple as that.

 

[DEAD34345]

People naturally avoid things that seem "weird" to them, and anime is something that simply doesn't exist for most people over here. In fact, pretty much anything to come out of Japan seems bizarre, simply because that culture is so different from our own. I often find that difference refreshing, but it's completely understandable when other people don't.

Personally, I avoid JRPGs and the like simply because every JRPG I've ever played has bored me witless. If that isn't a valid reason to dislike something, then nothing is.

 

[Tony2077]

People naturally avoid things that seem "weird" to them, and anime is something that simply doesn't exist for most people over here. In fact, pretty much anything to come out of Japan seems bizarre, simply because that culture is so different from our own. I often find that difference refreshing, but it's completely understandable when other people don't.

Personally, I avoid JRPGs and the like simply because every JRPG I've ever played has bored me witless. If that isn't a valid reason to dislike something, then nothing is.

its one of the better reasons I've heard. some people like to take the i don't like it so it must be shit route

 

[The_Critic]

Personally I love anime, but that's not what a majority of the western market is used to. That is why they don't like it? Now anime has become far more mainstream in the west in the last couple of years with hits like Naruto, Dragaon Ball, and the like. Hell we even have a western anime Avatar the last Airbender.

That is why some people in the west accept them, and that is why some people still buy them. But to ***** about a demographic that doesn't like or isn't used to anime is kinda ridiculous. What if a large majority of Japanese games suddenly switched from anime to a South African or Middle eastern art style? Would you still write an article like this defending it?

Last thing. One of the top selling games in the west is Modern Warfare. That means a majority of the demographic is playing as a large manly man, shooting big guns, at enemies. How can you expect that person to not complain when they suddenly are playing a "shooter" with Skinny lanky effeminate teenager?

 

[Pyro Paul]

there is a growing gap in artistic direction for video games pushing more realistic or proportional designs as opposed to the more asthetic or artistic designs seen in Japanese based games.

This is mostly because technology is starting to catch up with imagination so the given culture gap which is normally inherent with western vrs eastern art styles is starting to surface in the field of video games.

it comes down to the question of:
'Which side of the Uncanny Valley do you sit on?'

So.. yes, people are starting to dislike Japanese video games simply because of the character design... and considering that you're usually looking at these characters for upwords of 90% of the game, it isn't exactly all to surprising.


As to that thread this thread comments to... it points out more of a cultural divide between Western and Eastern intrests. Which in effect is like comparing and contrasting WH40k to Final Fantasy Tactics...