Doctor Who As Watched By Someone Who Doesn't Really Watch Doctor Who

[Qage]

Huh, seriously? So then it literally only served as an excuse to name an episode of Doctor Who [I/]Let's Kill Hitler[/I]?

Snip.

I was never a huge fan of Moffat's writing and that doesn't exactly give me hope.

Yeah, it's not very good. Let's Kill Hitler pretty much marked the start of the decline in Moffat's writing for the show. So if you weren't fond of the first half of Smith's tenure, you probably made the right choice skipping the second half.

Ah, well that's good to know.

I find it interesting that Moffat did some episodes during Tennant's run which were considered really solid episodes, but now that he's taken the helm his writing is just all over the place. I really feel like they should go back to before with another writer doing the majority of the episodes and Moffat writing the occasional one.

 

[faeshadow]

Huh, seriously? So then it literally only served as an excuse to name an episode of Doctor Who [I/]Let's Kill Hitler[/I]?

Snip.

I was never a huge fan of Moffat's writing and that doesn't exactly give me hope.

Yeah, it's not very good. Let's Kill Hitler pretty much marked the start of the decline in Moffat's writing for the show. So if you weren't fond of the first half of Smith's tenure, you probably made the right choice skipping the second half.

Ah, well that's good to know.

I find it interesting that Moffat did some episodes during Tennant's run which were considered really solid episodes, but now that he's taken the helm his writing is just all over the place. I really feel like they should go back to before with another writer doing the majority of the episodes and Moffat writing the occasional one.

It's pretty much a matter of Moffat going full George Lucas on us. Remember when Lucas wasn't revered as some god of movie-making and turned out the cinematic icon that is Star Wars? Then remember when he was, and he turned out the prequels?

Yeah.

Moffat needs people over him to do the series arcs while he sticks to individual series. He also needs strong people around him who have the backbone and the power to say no to him. I don't know how into the show you were in the RTD years, but do you remember how it wasn't just RTD, but pretty much the triumvirate of Russell, Julie Gardner and Phil Collinson? Julie especially held a tight rein on Russell, as he recounts in the book The Writer's Tale. Russell had people around him who had no qualms about turning to him and going "That's a stupid idea."

Like George Lucas in that video where his fellow producers looked uncomfortable when watching what they had of one of the prequel movies (I forget which one), but not actually saying anything to tell him how stupid it all was, I can't even tell you the name of a single one of Moffat's co-producers, except Beth and Piers, and that's only because they were the first in an embarrassingly long line (seriously, how many producers have quit now?) to run the show under him. And while I know their names, I have no idea when they quit because they were so ineffectual and so not present in the proceedings that I never even registered that they were gone.

I have had some faith rebuilt lately, though. Series 7b was immensely better once the Ponds were gone and Moffat could no longer milk that for all it was worth. While I loved Rory, the existence of that whole family in the Doctor's life only seemed to fuel Moffat's intense need to make convoluted nonsense like Amy's Schrodinger's Pregnancy, the whole River Song is now a brainwashed assassin, raised to obsess over the Doctor blah blah crap, etc. With Clara in the companion's position, it forced him to work on her instead of spirally into ever-tighter circles of BS as he was. And this first episode, while I was irritated that he'd done to the clockwork repair droids from Girl in the Fireplace what he'd done to the Weeping Angels (basically...Moffat seems to never be able to keep his own creations' purpose, origin and abilities straight), I'm cautiously optimistic.

And for what it's worth, I like Clara. I don't think she "has no personality", like someone mentioned. She has had loads of personality. Yes, beyond perky. She also is responsible, keeping to her job of watching over those kids instead of just running off with the Doctor and never looking back. AND she goes home to work as a teacher on a regular basis. She has a great interest in her autonomy and ability to travel with the Doctor and maintain a life that doesn't revolve solely around him. That's not her whole personality, but it's something that makes her stand out among other companions. Though, in their defense, she's actually older than a lot of the Doctor's companions, being in her mid-to-late twenties, rather than early twenties and late teens. Being younger and not yet deeply rooted in a career gives you a bit more freedom to just drop everything and go.

Wow, that suddenly became long-winded. Sorry.

 

[faeshadow]

Tip: next time, please include your opinion in the first bit.
I wanted to know how you liked it, to see if I should try getting into the whole thing too.
Instead you spoil every detail first...

About the first page; exactly my story (and knowledge of the show)

Considering this isn't your standard review, but an experiment to see how he manages to see the show through the eyes of someone who's never watched the show before, it's probably not the best place to avoid spoilers.

 

[Qage]

Huh, seriously? So then it literally only served as an excuse to name an episode of Doctor Who [I/]Let's Kill Hitler[/I]?

Snip.

It's pretty much a matter of Moffat going full George Lucas on us. Remember when Lucas wasn't revered as some god of movie-making and turned out the cinematic icon that is Star Wars? Then remember when he was, and he turned out the prequels?

Yeah.

Moffat needs people over him to do the series arcs while he sticks to individual series. He also needs strong people around him who have the backbone and the power to say no to him. I don't know how into the show you were in the RTD years, but do you remember how it wasn't just RTD, but pretty much the triumvirate of Russell, Julie Gardner and Phil Collinson? Julie especially held a tight rein on Russell, as he recounts in the book The Writer's Tale. Russell had people around him who had no qualms about turning to him and going "That's a stupid idea."

Like George Lucas in that video where his fellow producers looked uncomfortable when watching what they had of one of the prequel movies (I forget which one), but not actually saying anything to tell him how stupid it all was, I can't even tell you the name of a single one of Moffat's co-producers, except Beth and Piers, and that's only because they were the first in an embarrassingly long line (seriously, how many producers have quit now?) to run the show under him. And while I know their names, I have no idea when they quit because they were so ineffectual and so not present in the proceedings that I never even registered that they were gone.

I have had some faith rebuilt lately, though. Series 7b was immensely better once the Ponds were gone and Moffat could no longer milk that for all it was worth. While I loved Rory, the existence of that whole family in the Doctor's life only seemed to fuel Moffat's intense need to make convoluted nonsense like Amy's Schrodinger's Pregnancy, the whole River Song is now a brainwashed assassin, raised to obsess over the Doctor blah blah crap, etc. With Clara in the companion's position, it forced him to work on her instead of spirally into ever-tighter circles of BS as he was. And this first episode, while I was irritated that he'd done to the clockwork repair droids from Girl in the Fireplace what he'd done to the Weeping Angels (basically...Moffat seems to never be able to keep his own creations' purpose, origin and abilities straight), I'm cautiously optimistic.

And for what it's worth, I like Clara. I don't think she "has no personality", like someone mentioned. She has had loads of personality. Yes, beyond perky. She also is responsible, keeping to her job of watching over those kids instead of just running off with the Doctor and never looking back. AND she goes home to work as a teacher on a regular basis. She has a great interest in her autonomy and ability to travel with the Doctor and maintain a life that doesn't revolve solely around him. That's not her whole personality, but it's something that makes her stand out among other companions. Though, in their defense, she's actually older than a lot of the Doctor's companions, being in her mid-to-late twenties, rather than early twenties and late teens. Being younger and not yet deeply rooted in a career gives you a bit more freedom to just drop everything and go.

Wow, that suddenly became long-winded. Sorry.

O.O That's alright.

But yeah, I'm not really a Star Wars person myself, although I've heard people discussing Lucas and they pretty much said what you've said; that he needs people around him to say no and help bring him back down to Earth. So to speak.

I was really losing my patience with the Ponds around the time I stopped watching, especially since they gradually started to become the focus of the show and the Doctor shifted into the background as their wacky, time travelling vector. Like with Lucas, Moffat seems to just have the desire to make things as convoluted as he can and a part of me wonders if he does it intentionally just to see how far he can push it before someone tells him no. Although as an artist, I can relate. Occasionally I'll need to run ideas by my friends or show them a piece of work that I'm not sure about in order to get a bit more direction or to help me realise that my idea is stupid, etc.

Earlier I stated that I haven't really seen many episodes with Clara in and so I'm not really in the best position to judge her as a character - I didn't even know she was a teacher until I watched [I/]Deep Breath[/I]. But I'd be willing to go back and try and wade through season 7 to see how she fairs, since I haven't had the best first impressions I suppose. I always felt that the best assistants really added something to the show rather than just tagging along because that's how it has always been.

 

[beastro]

Tried to watch this show at times and found it suffered from the worst qualities of things like comic books where people having had grown up loving the series went on to be creative forces behind it, Dr. Who's and his world are as absorb with him being the center of it as stereotypical superhero worlds are with their main character.

It's pretty much what Star Trek would be if its shows had continuity, Captain Kirk was immortal and continuity was mended together with pure bullshit and technobabble instead of actively ignored.

 

[Addendum_Forthcoming]

Not to be finnicky, but as a diehard Doctor Who fan (with a diehard Doctor Who fanatic of a father) I cannot allow this transgression to pass! Daleks and Cybermen are not robots! They're more like cyborgs ... in the case of the Daleks it's almost like a tank ... kinda ... but technically, both of them are cyborgs.

I'm not sure why, Doctor Who was particularly so popular in Australia ... Australia has a very close history with the British, of course, and share many of the cultural and social attitudes. So it's easy to see why British tv shows resonate well enough with most of the populace.

I think it's because Doctor Who represented the first true taste of Sci Fi that was culturally accessible and understandable to those of us in the Commonwealth. This idea that a gentleman and scientist (OR at least the first two doctors) beating things purely with the power of their mind and their experience, whereas you didn't really have anything like it in various US cultural exports.

Doctor Who is, after all, the coolest superhero there is ... the capacity for violence without having to hit things ... once again, barring the third doctor, Jon 'Venusian Aikido' Pertwee. This idea of a gentlemanly superhero, a man of science, reason, and adventure.

A person who resonated so completely with the idealized imagery of the British explorers only two Generations prior. I think that's why Australians really liked him ... this idea of a civilized scientist, with the grit and tenacity to stck it out in any frontier. It was like a refined manliness, I think, for many a sci-fi fanatic.

 

[Dak_N_Jaxter]

a scene later, shows off his new duds (he looks sort-of like a stage magician who lost his hat and rabbit

Don't know if you kept up with it, but in "Time Heist" ...

Spoiler

He actually makes that observation too - "I was going for minimalism, but I think it just came out like stage magician!"

That's a tiny bit spooky. Not very. But slightly.

 

[Soulrender95]

a scene later, shows off his new duds (he looks sort-of like a stage magician who lost his hat and rabbit

Don't know if you kept up with it, but in "Time Heist" ...

Spoiler

He actually makes that observation too - "I was going for minimalism, but I think it just came out like stage magician!"

That's a tiny bit spooky. Not very. But slightly.

I don't know why but I got the quote notification from you

Spoiler

[http://s282.photobucket.com/user/Soulrender95/media/escaped.png.html]

anyone know if that's normal, because if it's not does this mean I'll end up regenerating into Bob one day... or maybe he regenerates into me.
Time Travel, great for confusing one timeline for another, now excuse me I have a chameleon arch to rebuild.