Doctor Who Series 6.13: "The Wedding of River Song' [SPOILERS] + Series wrap up

[Aetera]

*snip*

I love you right now. I've been trying to pin down what I hate about this series compared to 9 and 10's run, and you nailed it. With 9 and 10, each episode was its own adventure; each episode was something new and exciting rather than a single storyline stretched across the season, dangling breadcrumbs of the next bit of info continuing the story. The link between them with 9 and 10 was subtle, and once revealed at the end caused a "holy shit!" reaction more than a "oh, finally. They're wrapping up the loose ends." Bad Wolf, Vote Saxon posters, etc.

The central character with 9 and 10 was the Doctor. The main characters with 11 are the companions.

The runs with 9 and 10 just seemed more... personal. The show focused on the relationships, experiences, and evolution of the characters themselves. With 11, the focus is completely on this broad, bigger-than-them overarching plot.

The closest that 11 got to the feel of 10's run, in my opinion, was the Van Gogh episode. That one was fantastic. The Doctor's Wife, too.

EDIT: Also, there is no dramatic tension anymore. We KNOW that the Doctor isn't going to die. The show is Doctor Who. He is not going to be killed off. Before 11, the companions were in danger. We didn't know what would happen with the Master. The people that the Doctor was trying to save wouldn't always make it. They often didn't. Now, the one in the most constant danger is the Doctor, and we know for a fact that he isn't going to be killed off.

 

[Frozengale]

While I wouldn't say this episode makes up for the terrible series, I think that it was a very fun way to end this series. Out of all the episodes this series, the only really good ones were The Doctor's Wife, Good Man Goes to War, Let's Kill Hitler, and this one. I hope next Series is much better.

Also I'm can't quite put my finger on it but I have this nagging feeling that there are some plot holes that this episode brings up and doesn't fill. So either I'm imagining things or we still have some questions to answer.


...Oh I just thought of one. If the Doctor wasn't going to die from the blast anyways why did time rupture when River didn't shoot the Doctor at all. I'm a bit confused on that bit.

 

[Flight]

1: Rory is confirmed, once again, as by far the best character of the show.

2: Unfortunately, I was just not thrilled by this episode. I would say an anticlimax, but there was no climax to 'anti'. The whole season has been a bit of a sad flop, in my opinion.

I agree with all of this. And it's a shame, because I absolutely loved the last season.

 

[mesoforte]

<- Already knew he wouldn't actually die.

We still need to get the Valeyard out of him, and that comes in the next regeneration.

In series 4, just before River dies, Tennant's Doctor says;

"River, you know my name. You whispered my name in my ear. There's only one reason I would ever tell anyone my name. There's only one time I could..."

It's probably just a different time under a different circumstance.

It's all very vague.

 

[mesoforte]

\

...Oh I just thought of one. If the Doctor wasn't going to die from the blast anyways why did time rupture when River didn't shoot the Doctor at all. I'm a bit confused on that bit.

The shooting was an established event, time locked.

The actual death was not.

History records him as dying, but in the original occurrence he didn't really die. He had already planned not to. Thus the "time-locked" version is the android/robot version dieing while the original lives on.

 

[DarqueMage]

...Oh I just thought of one. If the Doctor wasn't going to die from the blast anyways why did time rupture when River didn't shoot the Doctor at all. I'm a bit confused on that bit.

The time rupture was a result of drastically changing the events that happened in those moments. The Teselecta had to be shot and burned. We know that it's believed by many that the Doctor died that say, so that ruse was important and set a lot of things into motion. The fixed point in time was never that the Doctor died that day, it was that everyone believed he died that day.

 

[ZeoAssassin]

well i enjoyed it. It may have been a little rushed but no where near as bad as i was afraid it could be.

Typical Moffat fashion to give us some answers but then ask more questions but i felt satisfied with the plot threads that he tied up. I saw the Teselecta bit coming for the most part. But at least we know WHY the Silence want the Doctor dead. The reference to the Dickinson episode from the Ecelston era was a nice touch and the actor who played Churchill was very entertaining. An of course the Brigadier mention was VERY well done.

So lets see what questions await us in season 7 that haven't been answered yet....

1. What caused the 'Church" military to be loyal to the Silence once but then become more or less good in season 5?
2. Now that a TON of Rivers background is pretty much all cleared up does she have a "normal" continuity until the Silence in the Library in season 4? (also SILENCE in the Library?)
3. What was in the Doctor's room in God Complex? (Dream-Lord/Valeyard maybe?)
4. What happened in the Gamma forests with the girl from A Good Man goes to War?
5. What role does the "time police" guys in the Teselecta have in the future now?
6. Does "the fall of the 11th" mean Matt Smith's days are numbered (Regenerate in season 8 or the 50th anniversary?)
7. Doctor who?

anyway Season wise....5 > 6
like Timelord said this 2nd half of the season was kind of dull (finale was my favorite episode of this 1/2) the 1rst 1/2 was alright and the Doctors Wife is STILL the best of the season but Season 5 Overall had MUCH better episodes and a better over arcing plot. This season tried to juggle a few too many plot threads that weren't addressed all that much during the season. The 2nd Half of the season was particularly guilty of pretty much having Fuck-all to do with the main plot of the season. It got some of the themes right but aside from that...

Also anyone else think the Doctors character this season basically turned from a "Superman' hero to a 'Batman' hero? what with the need to lay low and help from the shadows more often and all? I dunno maybe i am just seeing things.


Also. Am i the only one who thought during the episode that perhaps the fixed point in time that was the Doctor's death would be broken by River and kept broken by the TARDIS which would result in an explosion that would put cracks in the skin of the Universe?

I don't entirely mind the Teselecta thing but i think THAT could have worked better you think?

 

[DalekJaas]

The episode was absolute rubbish, just like the entirety of this season. Moffat is really driving Doctor Who into the ground, the good thing about RTD's revival was that it wasn't like the classic series, it was actually good. Now it is basically the same, it even has the crappy costumes to match (fat blue head in a box and lizard people, seriously?)

So disappointed with Doctor Who, especially when watching Supernatural at the same time. I think it is time they took out of the hands of the Brits and gave it to some Americans who understand how sci-fi should work. They need to drop this whole River Song/Silence arc, regenerate the Doctor and start fresh, if they want the show to actually be liked by normal people again (not just nerds and British people).

 

[Lancer873]

I just started watching series six a week ago and I caught up just in time for this and I loved it. ^_^ I just knew /something/ had to happen after the last commercial, and I knew it'd be big!

Oh, and has anyone mentioned "DOCTORCEPTION" or "Yo dawg" yet?

 

[DarqueMage]

The episode was absolute rubbish, just like the entirety of this season. Moffat is really driving Doctor Who into the ground, the good thing about RTD's revival was that it wasn't like the classic series, it was actually good. Now it is basically the same, it even has the crappy costumes to match (fat blue head in a box and lizard people, seriously?)

I see your blue fat guy and raise you a fat farting alien shouting that he must be naked to witness his plans coming to fruition. Oh, and those Daleks who are seriously dead forever and never coming back were always a treat. ^_^

 

[ctrl]

the only problem is by this point im being throttled by all the loose plot threads

also is that really the question? how about doctor who gives a shit

 

[DalekJaas]

The episode was absolute rubbish, just like the entirety of this season. Moffat is really driving Doctor Who into the ground, the good thing about RTD's revival was that it wasn't like the classic series, it was actually good. Now it is basically the same, it even has the crappy costumes to match (fat blue head in a box and lizard people, seriously?)

I see your blue fat guy and raise you a fat farting alien shouting that he must be naked to witness his plans coming to fruition. Oh, and those Daleks who are seriously dead forever and never coming back were always a treat. ^_^

Hell at least the farting aliens didn't have human faces like the Silurians do now, I would take a farting alien any day over a monster with a human face, it doesn't even look believable. I honestly think the original Silurians look better than the new ones.

I thought all of the Dalek episodes from season 1 and season 2 of the revived series were really good, after that it got bad.

 

[Soeroah]

I think it is time they took out of the hands of the Brits and gave it to some Americans who understand how sci-fi should work.

LOL



Goddamn, you have tickets on yourself, huh? Fact is, it's a British show that's enjoyed by a majority of people who watch it. It...the idea of giving it to the Americans to "make it enjoyable for normal people" is so mind-boggingly stupid, considering the new series seems more Americanised than the original series. Plus, saying Americans are normal? Either everyone on the planet is normal, or there are no normal people. You can't say one race is any more normal than the other, there's no benchmark.

So many times the Americans have attempted to remake classic British sitcoms and such, sometimes managing to stagger past a failed pilot episode, and then they wind up with something like The Office. Many people in America probably enjoy it, and that's entirely their call. I won't complain that the American version of The Office is terrible compared to the original version, if Americans don't act like they know better than everyone else.


Please, please tell me you were just trolling. I'll admit you got me.

 

[DalekJaas]

I think it is time they took out of the hands of the Brits and gave it to some Americans who understand how sci-fi should work.

LOL



Goddamn, you have tickets on yourself, huh? Fact is, it's a British show that's enjoyed by a majority of people who watch it. It...the idea of giving it to the Americans to "make it enjoyable for normal people" is so mind-boggingly stupid, considering the new series seems more Americanised than the original series. Plus, saying Americans are normal? Either everyone on the planet is normal, or there are no normal people. You can't say one race is any more normal than the other, there's no benchmark.

So many times the Americans have attempted to remake classic British sitcoms and such, sometimes managing to stagger past a failed pilot episode, and then they wind up with something like The Office. Many people in America probably enjoy it, and that's entirely their call. I won't complain that the American version of The Office is terrible compared to the original version, if Americans don't act like they know better than everyone else.


Please, please tell me you were just trolling. I'll admit you got me.

Nope not trolling, and I was basing my opinion on Supernatural, which has been getting better and better as Doctor Who gets worse and worse, by Americans I (kind-of) meant the supernatural writing team.

American does have a good history with sci-fi though, look at all of the movies and TV shows. The Doctor Who movie before the revived series was co-produced with America and it was decent (better than anything from the last 2 seasons). So I stand by statement. The Office isn't sci-fi, and America's attempt at Red Dwarf failed because that is comedy. When you get down to action and story American shows generally provide.

I dislike American egotism as much as the rest of the world, but I honestly think American writers would do a better job then what the current writers are doing, especially if they were fans of the show.

I am not American by the way.

 

[bootz]

I found it enjoyable. It really should have been 2 episodes. I thought he was going to be a plastic person to get out of it, I was close. This Seasons best part were when the episodes weren't focused on the over arching plot.

 

[Soeroah]

I think it is time they took out of the hands of the Brits and gave it to some Americans who understand how sci-fi should work.

LOL



Goddamn, you have tickets on yourself, huh? Fact is, it's a British show that's enjoyed by a majority of people who watch it. It...the idea of giving it to the Americans to "make it enjoyable for normal people" is so mind-boggingly stupid, considering the new series seems more Americanised than the original series. Plus, saying Americans are normal? Either everyone on the planet is normal, or there are no normal people. You can't say one race is any more normal than the other, there's no benchmark.

So many times the Americans have attempted to remake classic British sitcoms and such, sometimes managing to stagger past a failed pilot episode, and then they wind up with something like The Office. Many people in America probably enjoy it, and that's entirely their call. I won't complain that the American version of The Office is terrible compared to the original version, if Americans don't act like they know better than everyone else.


Please, please tell me you were just trolling. I'll admit you got me.

Nope not trolling, and I was basing my opinion on Supernatural, which has been getting better and better as Doctor Who gets worse and worse, by Americans I (kind-of) meant the supernatural writing team.

American does have a good history with sci-fi though, look at all of the movies and TV shows. The Doctor Who movie before the revived series was co-produced with America and it was decent (better than anything from the last 2 seasons). So I stand by statement. The Office isn't sci-fi, and America's attempt at Red Dwarf failed because that is comedy. When you get down to action and story American shows generally provide.

I dislike American egotism as much as the rest of the world, but I honestly think American writers would do a better job then what the current writers are doing, especially if they were fans of the show.

I am not American by the way.

Obviously everyone has their own opinion, which I am willing to allow. For me, personally, though...American sci-fi I've enjoyed includes Stargate SG-1 and Stargate Atlantis. Battlestar Galactica and Stargate Universe were just terrible to me, as Doctor Who must be getting for you. I can't immediately think of any American sci-fi I've enjoyed. Doctor Who isn't perfect, obviously, but I've enjoyed it more than most sci-fi.


Honestly, my faith in America's writing has gone down so much that when I enjoy something, I classify it as British-style writing. Moffatt has traditionally been a great writer for numerous British shows, but after Blink it's easy to compare his recent works to his great stuff and decide he's lost his edge; not exactly fair.

Mabye I'm hypocritically intolerant, but for me, 'American' media to me generally means focusing on relationships rather than the plot- for example, Stargate Universe had a wonderful premise, but it came down to a soap opera set on a space ship. The episodes of Doctor Who I hate most are the emotions-conquer-all centric episodes. Nothing, for me, is as big a buzz kill as a great series becoming "Americanised", and as I said earlier, I already feel that the new Doctor Who series has become at least partially Americanised.


Now, you say specific writers may be able to do a better job. I'd be willing to accept that. Sadly, my opinion on American writing is because what crap I've seen outweighs the stuff I've enjoyed. If the writers of, say, The Lost Room were to do some Doctor Who episodes, I'd likely love it. That series was short, but it had a concept and plot that rivaled some of Moffatt's better works in my opinion.

Pretty much comes down to opinions anyway. Some people will like it, some people won't. Sorry I overacted there, but what I quoted is a bit of a beserk button for me.

 

[TimeLord]

So...yeah. Politics & funding issues are why there was an inexplicable break in the middle (also, there's no trailer for the X-mas special because the filming has been delayed by 3 months or so).

The break was so Steven Moffat could work on things like Sherlock and so the series could be spread out and get a "summer break" to keep it going longer. I'd like to see your figures on how and why there were funding issues, since the BBC released figures a few months ago stating that Doctor Who was one of their top 5 grossing franchises. I doubt they'd have trouble piling money into it.

Also, the Christmas special filming was delayed for 24 hours due to a strike protest because of the the BBCs cost cutting measures (which include, but are not limited to, Doctor Who Confidential)

 

[tomtom94]

The break was so Steven Moffat could work on things like Sherlock and so the series could be spread out and get a "summer break" to keep it going longer. I'd like to see your figures on how and why there were funding issues, since the BBC released figures a few months ago stating that Doctor Who was one of their top 5 grossing franchises. I doubt they'd have trouble piling money into it.

Also, the Christmas special filming was delayed for 24 hours due to a strike protest because of the the BBCs cost cutting measures (which include, but are not limited to, Doctor Who Confidential)

Read Private Eye, and Steven Moffat's Twitter (where he categorically denied any delays to Doctor Who were to do with Sherlock)
As well as the fact that EVERYTHING at the BBC is undergoing cuts at the moment.
There's a reason the next series might not start till Autumn next year and carry on into 2013, and it isn't for lack of external gross...

 

[TimeLord]

Apologies for the double-post, but in the last few minutes, I thought of an arse-load of unresolved stuff and things which don't make any sense from this series.

How did Kovarian take River back to Lake Silencio from 2153?
For that matter, how was Amy kidnapped, when there's no evidence of humans having access to time-travel at that point?
If Kovarian could time-travel, why not just kidnap Melody after she was born, and save 9 months of sitting around waiting for Amy to give birth?
Is Kovarian a midwife, or what? Pick a bloody job.
Why was Kovarian's eye drive electrocuted by The Silents?
How did the Teselecta start to regenerate in Day of the Moon?
How come the Silents survived a laod of gunshots unharmed, then were killed easily by Amy?
Why did The Silence want the Doctor to die?
What did they do with Amy when she was captured in DOTM, if she was already pregnant?
What is the point of building a functional car, then attaching a balloon to it?
If the Silents are scavengers, and they needed human technology, how did they make a semi-sentient spacesuit?
What was that Silent doing in Utah in 2011?
Why would a 17-year old be awake at 3 in the morning ranting about Doctor Who on an internet forum?

It makes no sense.

-There are many ways of time travel bar TARDIS. Vortex manipulator?
-Amy was kidnapped in 'Day of the Moon' by the Silence when she was exploring the old house. The Silence have time capsules ('The Lodger') seen in DotM.
-Don't know about that one. Maybe it was just easier to worry about capturing Amy before she had given birth.
-Who knows
Kill all witnesses? Don't need her anymore? Who knows how back-stabby the Silence may or may not be.
-I mentioned this in another post, the Teselecta can grow bits out of it (motorcycle appears literally out of it's arse in 'Lets Kill Hitler'), I'm assuming it would be easy enough for them to simulate energy discharge.
-I did think that too during the episode, maybe they were trying to show that while the eye drives were killing off people and there was a good hundred of them that it was a hopeless battle?
-"Silence will fall when the question is asked" They were trying to "Save" the future.
-If you're asking why they had her strapped to a chair when the Doctor rescues her? I'm guessing that the ganger-Amy needed to be reunited with the Doctor somehow and they knew that he would never give up on finding her. Thus he would track down "Amy" and rescue her as a ganger, avoiding the question of "Where is she?" if she had simply disappeared.
-Us British are crazy like that.
-Think in DotM, River points out that the suit is not just human tech, but different types of alien tech.
-Overseeing that the Doctor died as planned? Also, they are everywhere!
-That's not a question I can answer

 

[TimeLord]

The break was so Steven Moffat could work on things like Sherlock and so the series could be spread out and get a "summer break" to keep it going longer. I'd like to see your figures on how and why there were funding issues, since the BBC released figures a few months ago stating that Doctor Who was one of their top 5 grossing franchises. I doubt they'd have trouble piling money into it.

Also, the Christmas special filming was delayed for 24 hours due to a strike protest because of the the BBCs cost cutting measures (which include, but are not limited to, Doctor Who Confidential)

Read Private Eye, and Steven Moffat's Twitter (where he categorically denied any delays to Doctor Who were to do with Sherlock)
As well as the fact that EVERYTHING at the BBC is undergoing cuts at the moment.
There's a reason the next series might not start till Autumn next year and carry on into 2013, and it isn't for lack of external gross...

Private Eye is unreliable. To my knowledge, most sources on the series break denied and/or refused to comment on what Private Eye had said.