Does anyone remember when BioWare had a legendary reputation among the gaming world?

[AstroCadet69]

I remember seeing a trailer for the next "Command & Conquer" which would end up getting cancelled and being excited despite not having been a BioWare fan at the time since they had built up a reputation for awesome narrative experiences.



But recently.






I hear Baldur's Gate 3 has captured the greatness of "Old BioWare" and former BioWare and Naughty Dog devs are developing a Mass Effect like game called "Exodus".

At first glance it looks a lot like Andromeda so it hard to get excited.



But upon finding out people who worked on the original Mass Effect games and Dragon Age Origins are involved I am cautiously optimistic.

https://x.com/DrewKarpyshyn/status/1732971635827949783?mx=2

 

[PsychedelicDiamond]

That was before my time, to be honest. The first BioWare game I played was the original Mass Effect and I didn't like it very much. People tell me it's all the way downhill from there so I didn't bother with any of the later ones.

 

[Hades]

Yeah I remember. Its just a shame they couldn't keep up that pedigree. Or rather weren't allowed to keep up that pedigree.

 

[Casual Shinji]

"EA It's in the game."

 

[Chimpzy]

Sure I do.

AND THEN EA HAPPENED

Ok, maybe that's a bit reductive. Bioware has been around for 30 years, almost 20 of which under EA. That's an eternity in this industry. Few studios actually survive multiple decades, let alone keep up a consistent level of quality. Decades during which a lot can happen that can could make a studio fall from grace. Like people coming and going, losing key creatives in the process. Or trends and/or tech changing, and the studio being unable to keep up. Or sometimes a single big gamble not working out, a common occurrence these days. Or getting bought by EA.

 

[BrawlMan]

I didn't know BioWare existed until the first Baldur's Gate game. Even then, my first and only BioWare is ME1. I never bothered with them after that, but I respect for what they did before getting worse.

 

[Drathnoxis]

 

[Worgen]

Isn't this pretty much any long running dev house that doesn't manage to go independent? You live long enough and get big enough then you will end up pissing off those who liked you early on and only want the same thing.

 

[Thaluikhain]

Isn't this pretty much any long running dev house that doesn't manage to go independent? You live long enough and get big enough then you will end up pissing off those who liked you early on and only want the same thing.

Yeah, companies usually seem to get their time in the sun (if they are lucky), then fall apart or get bought out. Not unique to games companies, of course.

 

[Worgen]

Yeah, companies usually seem to get their time in the sun (if they are lucky), then fall apart or get bought out. Not unique to games companies, of course.

People make the mistake of thinking that just because someone or a company does 1 great thing, that everything else they do will be or has been great. Its much more common that they manage to make one great thing and everything else is mid at best.

 

[Thaluikhain]

People make the mistake of thinking that just because someone or a company does 1 great thing, that everything else they do will be or has been great. Its much more common that they manage to make one great thing and everything else is mid at best.

And because of that thinking, the company name might be bought and sold a few times as the new owners go under as well, but the name at least is still worth something.

 

[Worgen]

And because of that thinking, the company name might be bought and sold a few times as the new owners go under as well, but the name at least is still worth something.

Totally. A well known name can be as valuable as a game catalog.

 

[Asita]

That was before my time, to be honest. The first BioWare game I played was the original Mass Effect and I didn't like it very much. People tell me it's all the way downhill from there so I didn't bother with any of the later ones.

Eh...opinions vary in that regard.

When you peel back the paint a bit, a lot of the affection for ME1 is built around a few core details:
1) Affection for the worldbuilding.
2) the Stat system making it more of an "RPG" than most titles (Personally, I feel that this one is actually unearned, and basically boils down to people transferring a lot of goodwill to the system from TTRPGs that make better use of the system)
3) Hype over the central promise of turning the franchise into a "Choose Your Own Adventure" series, with choices you made as early as the first game being felt all the way to the finale.

Now, from a writing standpoint, I maintain that Mass Effect 1 isn't bad. The central story is serviceable and does a good job of introducing the setting. The setting feels alive, and the characters within it are plenty likeable. From a gameplay perspective though, it's easily the weakest in the trilogy.

If we're judging the games on individual merit, Mass Effect 2 is probably the strongest. Though ironically it's probably also the weakest as part of a trilogy, as it ends up being more of a filler arc than a proper sequel that moves the story along.

Mass Effect 3 is...a lot harder to pin down. In terms of combat it's possibly the strongest, but it's a damn rollercoaster of "high highs" and "low lows" when it comes to the story composition. When it's done well, it's done really well, but when it's done poorly it can be downright painful.

This is not to say that you should play it if you didn't find that ME1 had much in redeeming features. If you don't like it, you don't like it. I just mean to clarify that "downhill from there" is a bit alarmist. If there were aspects of it that you enjoyed, then it might be worth keeping an eye out for sales. I've seen the Legendary Edition (main trilogy + all DLC) go for as low as $7 in the past.

 

[The Rogue Wolf]

2) the Stat system making it more of an "RPG" than most titles (Personally, I feel that this one is actually unearned, and basically boils down to people transferring a lot of goodwill to the system from TTRPGs that make better use of the system)

This is one of the reasons why I fell off the game hard, because to me it was making the same mistake as Morrowind had: Tying action game mechanics to a tabletop RPG back end. It can't ever feel anything but clunky and frustrating without a lot of massaging, and Mass Effect 1 wasn't interested in that. (Oblivion and Skyrim sidestepped the problem by making combat brain-dead simple.)

 

[thebobmaster]

As someone who lists the Mass Effect trilogy as my all-time favorite video game series, the first game is easily the worst gameplay wise, and is pretty much completely driven by the worldbuilding. It's serviceable in combat, but clunky is an understatement when it comes to the stat system and inventory management.

 

[Casual Shinji]

As someone who lists the Mass Effect trilogy as my all-time favorite video game series, the first game is easily the worst gameplay wise, and is pretty much completely driven by the worldbuilding. It's serviceable in combat, but clunky is an understatement when it comes to the stat system and inventory management.

Eh, I don't know if I would classify either as better gameplay wise as the others. ME1 is clunky, but it has a greater sense of freedom to its action gameplay. ME2 honestly has the least satisfying interation, since every combat encounter is pretty much identical. It's refined and more solid than ME1, but you're locked to corridors and chest-high walls. ME3 manages a bit better, but it misses the sense of force that your weapons and powers had in the previous two games.

 

[CriticalGaming]

Do you realize how many developers we could say this about? Fucking all of them pretty much.

When video games became big business, developers either sold out to the Call of Duty mines, or went under like Sierra and LucasArts. The moment business and public trading came into the video gaming world, it went from being about the passion for making games to the passion for making dollars. Unfortunately it is very rare for those too things to come together.

It still happens sometimes though, when the business and the love of the game clash and make something special. The Witcher 3, Baldur's Gate 3, Bloodborne, Astro Bot, etc. It's just rarer in the AAA space these days because they've all been chasing the live-service buttcrack for so long.

However...I think the tide is changing a bit. I think some of these companies are seeing things like BG3, Astro Bot, being hugely successful while also seeing Suicide Squad, Concord, etc fail epically. Sony has cancelled a bunch of their live service projects, and I wouldn't be shocked to see that happen across more of the industry. DragonAge Veilgarbage was originally planned as a live service thing and was changed later on.

These companies aren't going to tolerate losing hundreds of millions for much longer. They will be forced to make better shit or go out of business soon enough.

 

[BrawlMan]

They will be forced to make better shit or go out of business soon enough.

Ubisoft is looking to be out of business or be absorbed Tencent, while the Ubisoft big wigs try to bail out with golden parachutes.

 

[hanselthecaretaker2]

Ubisoft is looking to be our of business or be absorbed Tencent, while the Ubisoft big wigs ttyto bail out with golden parachutes.

Tencent is kind of like a safety net but with big enough holes to break limbs in. Not too appealing.

 

[Samtemdo8]

I was there when KOTOR 1 was out so that's my start with Bioware. Also really got into Jade Empire too.

The downfall began with the three-strike outs of Dragon Age 2, The poor launch of SWTOR, and Mass Effect 3's Ending debacle.