Does Miegakure Really Showcase the 4th Dimension?

[crotalidian]

So the Boston Indie Showcase at PAX: East had a little game that is in development called Miegakure which claims to be a puzzle game where you must expole the 4th dimension to complete the levels:

Miegakure [http://marctenbosch.com/miegakure/]

While I wasnt at PAX I do have an interest in extra dimensions and so I would like to ask if anyone played this and if it reslly does give a feel of exploring 4 dimensions or just swapping out your current 3 dimensions for a slightly different 3 dimensions?

any other science nuts who want to wade in on this also. Lest get soem intellectual debate going!

also there is another game that claims 4D gameplay and opinions/experiences of this are also welcome:

Adanaxis

 

[reg42]

I'm pretty sure the 4th dimension is either heat or sound. So no, this is not 4D

 

[BlindMessiah94]

...isn't that just 3D with transparent objects? I could have sworn the fourth dimension was time or some bullshit like that. I am not a scientist.

You are correct it is time.
I think if they added some kind of PoP:SoT or Braid esque rewind function to the game that might quantify as being 4D.

Now this game in a 3D plane would be nutsoid: [link]http://www.kongregate.com/games/scarybug/chronotron[/link]

 

[RhombusHatesYou]

...isn't that just 3D with transparent objects? I could have sworn the fourth dimension was time or some bullshit like that. I am not a scientist.

You can theoretically (and mathematically) have 4 spatial dimensions but actually representing them? A confusing mess. Google up representations of Hypercubes (4D cubes).

 

[Arachon]

Interesting... VERY interesting, I'd like to try it out.

...isn't that just 3D with transparent objects? I could have sworn the fourth dimension was time or some bullshit like that. I am not a scientist.

We're talking about the 4th dimension in our physical space, "time" is the 4th dimension in Minkovski space, which has to do with spacetime.

See this neat explation, brought to you by none other than Carl Sagan:

Exactly. Its the same as when Sony announced that the ps3 had 4D graphics. It sounds utterly retarded unless it is actually like a mini friggin tardis.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_mdd7H1wQDM at 0:25

"4D Graphics" in that case was the result of Sony making the common misstake of confusing the 4th Dimension with time, and "4D Graphics" was a rather stupid PR-label for Procedural generation [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Procedural_generation].

 

[Volafortis]

Hey, there was an XKCD comic released on this today! Actually, I was just about to look into it a bit further, hadn't heard of it until the XKCD comic, and now this.

 

[Altorin]

...isn't that just 3D with transparent objects? I could have sworn the fourth dimension was time or some bullshit like that. I am not a scientist.

actually, to attempt to fathom a 4th spatial dimension, consider this..

A 1d object is a line. it's edges are composed of 0d Dots.

a 2d Object is a square. it's edges are composed of 1d lines.

a 3d object is a cube. its edges are composed of 2d squares.

a 4d object is a.. I think it was called a hypercube.. its edges are composed of 3d cubes..

So a 4d object is to a 3d object, what a cube is to a square.

 

[Volafortis]

...isn't that just 3D with transparent objects? I could have sworn the fourth dimension was time or some bullshit like that. I am not a scientist.

actually, to attempt to fathom a 4th spatial dimension, consider this..

A 1d object is a line. it's edges are composed of 0d Dots.

a 2d Object is a square. it's edges are composed of 1d lines.

a 3d object is a cube. its edges are composed of 2d squares.

a 4d object is a.. I think it was called a hypercube.. its edges are composed of 3d cubes..

So a 4d object is to a 3d object, what a cube is to a square.

Technically speaking, those would be "points," sir, not "Dots." I'm just sayin'

 

[RhombusHatesYou]

Trying to imagine what it would look like is painful.

The 3D representation of a hypercube just looks like a jumble of cubes all interposed BUT that's about as accurate to a 4D object as a UV map is to an actual 3D object.

 

[Bob_Bobbington]

...isn't that just 3D with transparent objects? I could have sworn the fourth dimension was time or some bullshit like that. I am not a scientist.

You can theoretically (and mathematically) have 4 spatial dimensions but actually representing them? A confusing mess. Google up representations of Hypercubes (4D cubes).

Kind of like this?

 

[RhombusHatesYou]

Just like that... The confusing jumble must have been higher order hypercubes. My bad.

The point being that each new axis (representing an extra spatial dimension) must interact with all the others at right angles, which is why 3D representations are poor approximations but the best we can do.

 

[Organicbeing]

Kind of like this?

This is actually the rotation of the SHADOW of a hypercube, or tesseract. There is no way to actually represent it for us to understand.
This is the image that actually made me understand the concept of 4th dimension, so I thought I would share it here.

 

[Doc Incognito]

I believe that time is the fourth dimension, and as humans, we are incapable of envisioning this dimension: we can only make sense of the previous three. However, this concept of time being represented with 3d objects with variations in opacity is pretty much the most we can imagine.

 

[heyheysg]

Here's a helpful video, 10 dimensions + time.

http://www.youtube.com/v/JkxieS-6WuA&hl=en_US&fs=1&

 

[A Pious Cultist]

I'm pretty sure the 4th dimension is either heat or sound. So no, this is not 4D

... wat?

 

[Axolotl]

Am I the only one who thinks that beings with 3-dimensional perspectives, viewing a 4 dimensional shape via a 2-dimensional interface isn't going to end well?

 

[reg42]

I'm pretty sure the 4th dimension is either heat or sound. So no, this is not 4D

... wat?

The ability to see heat or sound

 

[Nocta-Aeterna]

Am I the only one who thinks that beings with 3-dimensional perspectives, viewing a 4 dimensional shape via a 2-dimensional interface isn't going to end well?

I think it is workable. 3d gameplay via 2d representation has already proved itself in the past. Judging by the screenshot of Miegakure, I think that instead of moving through a 4d space, you shift between several 3d planes within a 4d space, like a 3d version of Time Fcuk.

Of Anadaxis, I can't say very much.

 

[Cody211282]

Kind of like this?

This is actually the rotation of the SHADOW of a hypercube, or tesseract. There is no way to actually represent it for us to understand.
This is the image that actually made me understand the concept of 4th dimension, so I thought I would share it here.

Not only do I have no idea what that thing is but I also have to ask why would I want to?

 

[Altorin]

...isn't that just 3D with transparent objects? I could have sworn the fourth dimension was time or some bullshit like that. I am not a scientist.

actually, to attempt to fathom a 4th spatial dimension, consider this..

A 1d object is a line. it's edges are composed of 0d Dots.

a 2d Object is a square. it's edges are composed of 1d lines.

a 3d object is a cube. its edges are composed of 2d squares.

a 4d object is a.. I think it was called a hypercube.. its edges are composed of 3d cubes..

So a 4d object is to a 3d object, what a cube is to a square.

Technically speaking, those would be "points," sir, not "Dots." I'm just sayin'

You're right, but you have to admit, it's not bad.

It's the simplest possible way to describe what a 4th dimension is like.