Dragon Age: Inquisition Sees Morrigan's Return

RJ 17

The Sound of Silence
Nov 27, 2011
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cursedseishi said:
With the whole "Udina/Anderson" thing, I can see their point.


People who chose Anderson in ME1/ME2 did so because you can practically tell Udina is a major snake in the grass, and its only made even more painfully obvious in Mass Effect 3. And it's something Anderson is well aware of as well, considering the only real use Udina serves is when he needs something done politically.

So the idea of Anderson just giving Udina the position is weak. If anything, Bioware missed a good chance to have Udina undermine Anderson's post and somehow take it for himself.
Oh believe me, one of the first things I said during the first 3 minutes of the game was "Ummmmmm, wtf? Anderson, what the hell are you doing here? Shouldn't you be on the Citadel?" And yeah, I was pretty pissed off to see that they had just retconned Udina into the council. However unlike a lot of players, after I read the codex entry explaining that Anderson never liked being a Councilor and thus he stepped down to give his seat to Udina, I said "Meh, fair enough."

Because to be fair, Anderson doesn't really want the job when you pick him at the end of ME1, but you say he's exactly the type of person you need on the Council so he accepts. But then in ME2 when you meet up with him, he talks about how much he hates his job and doesn't really want to be a councilor dealing with all the beaurocratic BS that comes with it. So it's not like the pulled the retcon completely out of their ass. That said, it's still a retcon. :p

But at least they actually give an excuse for it (and an understandable/acceptable excuse at that if you really think about it)...unlike Lelianna who somehow magically reattached her head after I chopped it off in Origins. Yeah, they just up and said "Nope, that never happened."

As for Udina, I think people have him pegged wrong, buuuuuuuuut that's a discussion for a completely different topic.
 

RJ 17

The Sound of Silence
Nov 27, 2011
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Infernai said:
But there is one very big flaw that hangs over the entirety of Dragon Age 2 which i hope inquisition fixes if i ever decide to get it: It's Pointless.
I hear this a lot from the people that had major problems with the story of DA2, and I have to disagree with it. Really you have to look at it for what it is: the sequel in a trilogy. The middle chapter always feels pretty bland with no satisfying "end". Basically all you do is advance the plot and usually make some big revelation, nothing is really accomplished though. I mean look at The Empire Strikes Back. What REALLY happens in that movie? Luke gains better mastery of the force, Han gets frozen, Luke gets his hand chopped of, and Vader reveals that he's Luke's father. What was accomplished though?.......the rebel base on Hoth was destroyed? All Empire does is advance the plot and set up the story for Return of the Jedi to wrap up the trilogy. Same thing with Matrix Reloaded and Pirates of the Caribbean 2 (regardless of what you thought of those movies, I'm using them to illustrate what I'm talking about with the 2nd chapter in most trilogies).

In the case of DA2, it was to show the series of events that sparked a war that would engulf all of Thedas as the Mages revolted against their Templar keepers. Really the only thing having to do with the Veil in DA2 was the fact that due to it's bloody and violent history, the Veil in Kirkwall was incredibly thin, rendering the place as pretty much a cursed city where bad things will ALWAYS happen. Because the veil was so thin, the Mages were more prone to consorting with demons. Because of this, the Templars were more prone to become even more strict. And to be fair you really can't blame them...you can't say that Meredith was ENTIRELY crazy for seeing blood mages everywhere she looked when....there's blood mages everywhere YOU look. Seriously, damn near every mage you meet in that game turns out to be a blood mage, even the First Enchanter himself knows demonic magic, so clearly Meredith's suspicions at least started out as being justified. It brings into question whether or not the idol she forged into a sword was really driving her mad.

But I'm getting off track here, like I said: the point of DA2 was simply to advance the plot and provide a big revelation. The plot advancement being how Hawke rose to power and became a key figure in the events that sparked the magic civil war. The big revelation being the fact that a magic civil war has just started.

That said, however, you are perfectly justified in saying that DA2 could have/should have been just a miniseries of comics or something that showed Hawke's life and how the magic civil war started. It wasn't nearly as grand or epic a story to play through as DA:O's story was, seeing as how it's just a slice-of-life story showing someone's rise from refugee to being one of the most important people in the city. Really all you do is wander around fighting gangs and killing blood mages. :p

So while I can definitely see your point of "not doing anything", I'd argue that saying that is different than labeling the story "completely pointless".

P.S. I don't really see how they could do a cross-over fight between The Warden and Hawke. For that matter, I don't see how The Grey Wardens will be playing a large part in the story at all. It's made clear in the first game that they remain completely neutral in the affairs of the world at large, their only concern is fighting against Dark Spawn and preventing or at least ending Blights. That's why they're welcome where ever they go: they're a neutral party that doesn't take sides. I doubt they'd pick a side in the Mage/Templar civil war.
 

Infernai

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RJ 17 said:
P.S. I don't really see how they could do a cross-over fight between The Warden and Hawke. For that matter, I don't see how The Grey Wardens will be playing a large part in the story at all. It's made clear in the first game that they remain completely neutral in the affairs of the world at large, their only concern is fighting against Dark Spawn and preventing or at least ending Blights. That's why they're welcome where ever they go: they're a neutral party that doesn't take sides. I doubt they'd pick a side in the Mage/Templar civil war.
A couple of ways i can see it happening:

Given the Veils coming apart, i imagine they might just decide to lend a hand to the Inquisition. Even if their primary duty is slaying Darkspawn, that Duty ain't gonna be worth much if reality get's invaded by eldritch abominations from beyond the Veil and murder everything. Plus, given the Grey Wardens are kind of well versed in hunting monsters i can imagine they'd probably be forced to get involved in hunting monsters down because things have gotten so bad. And seeing how, as you said, practically everyone in Kirkwall was a blood mage, who's to say they don't end up getting into a quarrel with at-least one mage that, perhaps, Hawke might want to keep alive for questioning/info etc...thus forcing a fight.

Or alternatively.

Crazy Blood mages attack wardens because...they're fucking blood mages currently on a high from the Veil breaking aprt, forcing them into fighting out of sheer self defense

But, that's just the wardens themselves, not our Warden Commander.

Well, even that has a number of possibility's: Perhaps Hawke is out to hunt Morrigan and the Warden (Who became her lover) opts to defend her for the sake of his love and his/his friends child. Could just be a simple misunderstanding or clashing goals that causes them to duke it out. Could even play into the Warden being posessed/influenced by a demonic influence that clouds their judgement and forces a conflict that ends up playing right into his enemies hands (The same reason Raziel fought Kain in Defiance).

...Or they could simply both be blind drunk and cause one helluva bar brawl.
 

Gormech

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She's back ...
Turns out -__removed via spoiler stuff__- qualify for child support.

Great ...
 

RJ 17

The Sound of Silence
Nov 27, 2011
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Infernai said:
Suffice to say I just don't see it happening. I'm sure the Wardens would defend themselves if a roaming band of mages attacked them, but they wouldn't pick sides unless the Darkspawn are involved. Keep in mind that the Mages are fighting against the injustices that have been inflicted upon them, not because every single one of them is a blood mage/abomination...that was just the case in Kirkwall because like I said: it was a "cursed city" with a horrifically bloody past where the Veil was extremely thin (not completely torn to shreds...I'm afraid I don't know where you're getting that from). And besides, when it comes down to hunting mages and demons, the Templars are much better suited to the task than the Wardens who are specifically specialized to hunt down Darkspawn, nothing more.

Beyond the neutrality of the Wardens, there's more reasons that could exist for Hawke and THE Warden to not fight than there are for them to fight. What if both were Mages that were both very Anti-Templar to begin with? What if both were warriors or rogues that were very Anti-Mage to begin with?

Sure it'd be neat to have my Blood Mage/Arcane Warrior duke it out with my Blood Mage/Force Mage, but in the end it's most likely just a pipe dream.
 

Infernai

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RJ 17 said:
Infernai said:
Suffice to say I just don't see it happening. I'm sure the Wardens would defend themselves if a roaming band of mages attacked them, but they wouldn't pick sides unless the Darkspawn are involved. Keep in mind that the Mages are fighting against the injustices that have been inflicted upon them, not because every single one of them is a blood mage/abomination...that was just the case in Kirkwall because like I said: it was a "cursed city" with a horrifically bloody past where the Veil was extremely thin (not completely torn to shreds...I'm afraid I don't know where you're getting that from). And besides, when it comes down to hunting mages and demons, the Templars are much better suited to the task than the Wardens who are specifically specialized to hunt down Darkspawn, nothing more.

Beyond the neutrality of the Wardens, there's more reasons that could exist for Hawke and THE Warden to not fight than there are for them to fight. What if both were Mages that were both very Anti-Templar to begin with? What if both were warriors or rogues that were very Anti-Mage to begin with?

Sure it'd be neat to have my Blood Mage/Arcane Warrior duke it out with my Blood Mage/Force Mage, but in the end it's most likely just a pipe dream.
The torn apart veil thing was about something else, not kirkwall. Apparently part of the plot of Inquisition is that the Veil was literally torn open, which sparks off the plot and the need for the inquisition to be reformed: That's what i was talking about, not the veil being thin in Kirkwall. That was mostly my shitty writing's fault though so sorry for not making that clear.
The Mage/Templar war is still a very big part of things but the Veil being torn open in Thedas is also something that's been added to the chaos.

I admit Hawk vs The Warden is probably not going to happen but, hey, i can dream can't I?
 

Combustion Kevin

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RJ 17 said:
only if the child is never acknowledged, or lazily written away, actually having two seperate villains, even superficially, would be a good trade-off, I think.

Though, seeing the way they've written themselves into a corner like this, there's no pleasing everyone at this point.
 

bug_of_war

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Infernai said:
I admit i partially agree: I do like that they're making us play new protagonists as it does seem to allow us to experience more of Thedas. However, DA 2 I do disagree on a bit. I admit i didn't openly hate it but i did feel it was a pretty big mis-step in alot of ways both in plot and gameplay elements. But there is one very big flaw that hangs over the entirety of Dragon Age 2 which i hope inquisition fixes if i ever decide to get it: It's Pointless.

I understand it's a more personal story, and alot of this has to do with the gameplay and the rushed nature of the game, but at the end of the game i really felt like i accomplished about as much as a character as i would have if i'd just sat in the manor all day. I felt that it would have been better to just make Dragon Age 2 a kind of mini-series not unlike the "Episodes" ubisoft made for Assassins Creed 2 just before it's release as it would have helped explain how the whole mage/templar war happened. And more to the point it seems this game appears to be more focused on the Veil being torn open rather then the Mage/Templar war, which i do imagine still being an important part of the game, but again the fact remains: Dragon Age 2 just felt more like nothing i did mattered, even more so then ME 3 did, which is why i felt it was better suited as a movie then a game.
I agree, the decisions didn't exactly carry over much (Zeveran doesn't die, neither does Flemeth) maybe a few offhand remarks, but nothing major. Still though, until Inquisition comes out we wont really be able to determine HOW useful DA2 was for the story, so I'mma stay optimistic because I'm sick of the amount of pessimism on these forums.
 

RJ 17

The Sound of Silence
Nov 27, 2011
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Infernai said:
The torn apart veil thing was about something else, not kirkwall. Apparently part of the plot of Inquisition is that the Veil was literally torn open, which sparks off the plot and the need for the inquisition to be reformed: That's what i was talking about, not the veil being thin in Kirkwall. That was mostly my shitty writing's fault though so sorry for not making that clear.
The Mage/Templar war is still a very big part of things but the Veil being torn open in Thedas is also something that's been added to the chaos.

I admit Hawk vs The Warden is probably not going to happen but, hey, i can dream can't I?
Ahhhh, I hadn't heard about that bit for Inquisition yet, so that's where my confusion was coming from. :p

And yeah, everyone can dream. I'd imagine after the general reception that DA2 received, there's a LOT of players that would like to see their Warden disembowel Hawke. :3
 

antidonkey

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I found DA:O rather boring. The only thing the kept me going was the characters. Everyone was pretty cool in their own right and I loved the interactions between them all. I didn't bother with DA2 so I don't know how much excitement I'll have for 3. At the moment, it's not much.
 

hazydawn

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That b*tch left me! And I still love her 。゚(゚ノД`゚)゚。

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