Driving Me Toward Madness

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NewClassic_v1legacy

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Jul 30, 2008
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http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a395/NewClassic/Forum%20Stuff/Driving.png

Alright, this rant will be broken down into two parts, each having its own discussion prompt. You're welcome to respond to one, the other, or both. The choice is yours.

[HEADING=2]Don't Teen And Drive[/HEADING]

Here's something I've never understood about people. Statistically speaking, Caucasian male teenagers between the ages 16-23 are statistically more likely to cause, influence, or be a part of traffic accidents. I'm alright with this, and have come to terms with that fact (Although, I'm admittedly very bitter about paying nearly a hundred a month extra simply because I am below the age of 24). What boggles me is that the age group carries an un-spoken undercurrent of bad and/or reckless driving. My friend of some number of years, roughly 5 years (Late Elementary/Primary and early Middle/Secondary school) ended up spending the day with me some period of time ago. After the time had elapsed, I offered a ride, and got a skeptic look in return. It was a gauging stare, the kind you level at a rope bridge swaying dangerously over a cliff-face, or a sleeping wild animal that could awaken and slaughter you.

http://blogs.cars.com/photos/mother_proof_may_08/teendriver.jpg
The moral of the story is, he ended up demanding to see my license, examine it for signs of being fake, and ended up not getting into my car anyway. Why? Because, dear NewClassic, you are between the ages of 16-23, and male.

This bothers me, though because it is a standard that has some grounds in reality, but no understanding for a case-by-case. The worst part of it is it's very much dismissible. If I were to claim every black man is also a drug dealer, thug, and "gangsta, homey," I would be labeled racist. If I were to label every teen a bad driver, I would be commended for my good judgment and forethought.

And should any teen make mention of this standard, even if they're a better driver, logically and historically, than the older person leveling it, it's still invalid due to age. This phenomenon positively boggles me. It's a societal double standard.

The reason, I think, is because it isn't a factor of driving ability or driving history, but rather a function of age. Your ability to drive is hinged entirely upon your age, not your personal record or history. I can understand using it as a good rule of thumb in a pinch, but accepting it as fact in every single case? C'mon now, guys.

Why not adopt a new standard? Like how many wrecks one has caused, or how many cars one has totaled, or whether or not the person puts on their seatbelt on when they enter the vehicle? It boggles me that Socrates, or or Alexander the Great, or Caesar would immediately get picked out as better drivers than I, when they existed before the automobile, for age alone.

Does this bother anyone else, and is it a standard that you think is fair? If not, what would you do to fix it?

[HEADING=2]Drunk Driving, Stupid Driving, and Your Driving[/HEADING]

I'm something of a recreational driver. There's something about the open road, a nice ambient track playing softly in surround sound, and the whisper of tire on asphalt that just makes driving an occasionally very relaxing hobby. Albeit, somewhat expensive. (Something that's been changing as of late, which is good.)

During my vehicular ramblings, I notice a lot of bad drivers. A consistent failure to follow the letter, intent, purpose, and even general area of the law. I see people change lanes completely blindly, cruising across an intersection with neither hand on the wheel, tourists with maps splayed across the steering wheel, and other such things.

http://www.funtoosh.com/f_images/girls_after_car_accident.jpg
The problem is this is exactly the sort of driving that causes so many accidents? So why the hell is it so common? I'll accept the occasional phone conversation, as I have answered my phone on the road on a few occasions, or maintained a conversation while driving. The problem, though, is when people fail to maintain a decent equilibrium for the concept of the fact that driving is a muscle-memory driven thing and can be done, on occasions, without absolute focus, but is also a very heavy, very fast piece of machinery that will kill you just as hard as any weapon, and will do so instantly, relentlessly, and leave you no other alternative but death.

So, breathe deep, folks, and pay attention on the road. Driving is a responsibility as well as a travel method. The standard where you will expect so much from others, yet so little of yourself needs to change. When you're driving, you're putting the life of everyone around you on the line. Pedestrians, other drivers, yourself, your passengers. In a situation of life or death, you need to pay attention.

I understand that it's important that you get directions, or that you need to eat before getting to work, just be smart about it. If you can, pull over while you finish the conversation or eat, slow down when road conditions require. Driving isn't just a method of getting from point A to point B, it's a journey. Treat it like one, and don't busy yourself so much you forget that you're a small, squishy little ant in a large metal box screaming down the road and incredibly fatal speeds.

http://www.audacityteam.org/wiki/images/6/60/AudacityNeedsYou.jpg
Don't have the audacity to pretend you're above the law simply because you believe yourself to be, but also don't be so stuck-up that you can't see that no one is a perfect driver.

At the same vein, take yourselves and the laws more seriously. No matter how arbitrary they may seem, the laws exist because they serve a function, and that function is to minimize damage, injuries, and fatalities, and maximize the efficiency of driving. Don't forget that you're not just driving for yourself, but every other car on the road as well. Pay attention when you're on the road. It's not hard, and it may very well save your life, your wallet, and/or your family. Remember, if you get in a car wreck, the terrorists win.

So, what do you think, Escapist? Do you think more drivers should focus or their driving, or that those who say we're becoming too distracted should can it, and that we're doing well on our own? Any thoughts about laws disabling people from using cell phones on the road?
 

Dramatic Flare

Frightening Frolicker
Jun 18, 2008
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I am amused by the fact that your opening argument rants against the injustice of the driving system against men, but then the pictures both depict women.
honestly, it irks me too. I may not be able to own the car I am going to be getting because insurance just costs so damn much.
 

Lord Krunk

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Mar 3, 2008
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Mobile phones illegal in cars... yes. VERY YES.

Anyway, there are idiots on the road, and there always will be idiots on the road. It's not going to change, and it doesn't only apply to younger drivers.
 

Dramatic Flare

Frightening Frolicker
Jun 18, 2008
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Lord Krunk said:
Mobile phones illegal in cars... yes. VERY YES.

Anyway, there are idiots on the road, and there always will be idiots on the road. It's not going to change, and it doesn't only apply to younger drivers.
But the younger ones get penalized for it.
It's liek the voting age. I think it should be lowered. People say 16 year olds don't know how to handle that responsibility, but then I point out that a 40 year old alcoholic who's been in and out of the penitentiary four times isn't exactly someone a country should trust with voting either, and the 16 year old has a school with government classes they are attending.
 

TheBluesader

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Mar 9, 2008
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If all the cars were robots with advanced AI like they were SUPPOSED to be by 2008, we wouldn't have to worry about any of this. 22 year old males could get as wasted as they wanted and still get home safely, not endangering anyone.

"Hello, Mr. Robot Car. I'm blasted out of my frickin' mind."
"Would you like to go home, sir?"
"Uh...no. Take me to my ex's house. I'ma tell that skank off!"
"Home it is, sir. And may I say, you look fantastic today."
"Your a good guy, Mr. Robot Car. I love you so much right now..."
 

rossatdi

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Aug 27, 2008
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I'm 23, white, male and I've been driving for coming up to 5 years. I'm good at it. Just confident enough to handle the car properly but responsible enough not to take stupid risks/drive drunk.

My friends have told me that of our age group they trust my driving over everyone else. However at least two of my friends who drive are awful. Too nervous and without a good sense of space. One wrecked his first car by not paying attention, the other one is bound to soon.

Speeding is essentially not a big deal, the number of times I've almost gotten wrecked by an idiot speeding compared to an idiot driving moronically is negligible. The worst offenders are, and all of those who live in suburban Britain will understand, middle class mothers with huge mercs or 4x4. These people have no concept of the size of their car, will act more or less randomly on any given road.

They say that men are more likely to be in accidents but I think it's not just a punchline to say that a great number of these are due to the idiot driver in front of them who gets away scot free.

TheBluesader said:
"Hello, Mr. Robot Car. I'm blasted out of my frickin' mind."
"Would you like to go home, sir?"
"Uh...no. Take me to my ex's house. I'ma tell that skank off!"
"Home it is, sir. And may I say, you look fantastic today."
"Your a good guy, Mr. Robot Car. I love you so much right now..."
Brilliant. Have actually had to be Mr Robot Car to a friend a couple of times!
 

TheBluesader

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Mar 9, 2008
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rossatdi said:
Brilliant. Have actually had to be Mr Robot Car to a friend a couple of times!
Me too. And Mr. Robot Make Sure She Doesn't Swallow Her Tongue several more.

Remember, kids. The only thing more fun than driving badly is nearly killing yourself with alcohol!

:D
 

Labyrinth

Escapist Points: 9001
Oct 14, 2007
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I have yet to get my learner's licence, mainly because I have yet to be bothered. The only real reason I'm getting it is because I'm the ideal designated driver. I don't drink by choice, rather than by obligation. A secondary point is that I'd like to know the road from a slightly more protected standpoint before I get my bike licence.

In responce to the OP, I agree for the most part. However, I work my drivers based on experience and demonstrated capability. It tends to be the case that someone say, 28, has more experience behind the wheel that one of my younger friends, but as you said I don't let that remain a steadfast rule. And I've been known to request people to slow the fuck down on a regular basis.
 

rossatdi

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Aug 27, 2008
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TheBluesader said:
Me too. And Mr. Robot Make Sure She Doesn't Swallow Her Tongue several more.

Remember, kids. The only thing more fun than driving badly is nearly killing yourself with alcohol!
:D
"Okay, time to go home."
"Nah, we need to stop by my ex's place."
"Er, no we don't, why?"
"I just want to post a letter! Please" *Shows me drunkenly scrawled letter*
"You sure? OK, one time." *I pull over, he gets out.*
5 minutes pass
"Go, go, go!"
"What, why, what took so long?"
"I think she called the police, I kind of threw up on her doorstop."
"Oh, for fucks sake."
 

TheBluesader

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Mar 9, 2008
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rossatdi said:
"Okay, time to go home."
"Nah, we need to stop by my ex's place."
"Er, no we don't, why?"
"I just want to post a letter! Please" *Shows me drunkenly scrawled letter*
"You sure? OK, one time." *I pull over, he gets out.*
5 minutes pass
"Go, go, go!"
"What, why, what took so long?"
"I think she called the police, I kind of threw up on her doorstop."
"Oh, for fucks sake."
...And kids, the only thing more fun than almost killing yourself with alcohol is drinking so much you think it's a good idea to go to your ex's, throw up on her stoop, then have to run before the cops show up.

See? Learning is a life-long joy.
 

iamnotincompliance

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Apr 23, 2008
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I approve of your Lotus. The Exige if I'm not mistaken.

...

Right! There's a topic, too! I fall into that white male early 20's category that earns so much ire from other drivers, and I confess freely that some of that stigma is justified in my case. Aimlessly cruising down a empty road is nice, I agree, but there's something about lighting up a set of ancient whitewalls after a long day that's equally cathartic. Aside from that, I have given my insurance company very little to be concerned about, and yet, by virtue of being who I am, I pay exorbitant rates like so many others so that I may earn a living. Now, would I call myself a bad driver? Like anyone else who will ask themselves that, absolutely not. Aggressive, certainly, with the occasional dalliance into asshole, but nothing so bad as those middle pictures (I put on my makeup and call my friends before I leave the house, dammit).

Self depreciating sarcasm aside, I believe the statistics will show (at least in America) that the women in that age group, while not as bad as men yet, are indeed catching up in accidents, wrecks, and tickets. I also believe that segues into the other half of the rant. There are assuredly bad drivers out there (I reference your pictures again, so I don't have to think), and aggressive though I may be, I am in control of my vehicle at all times. My eyes are ever on the road, at least one hand with a firm grip on the wheel. I see people eating, drinking, dialing, texting, reading... not just maps, but newspapers and books, and I am genuinely frightened. These people I see are usually whizzing past me at blatantly extralegal speeds, and I seriously doubt they have a single fucking clue what's going on around them. While laws against cell use from the drivers seat are sorely needed in my opinion, I don't imagine them making too much of dent in the number of people doing it.

Robo-cars have been promised time and again on and off for the past half century (I may be thinking about flying cars), and with the sheer number of idiots out there, it's high time they arrived, because people behaving responsibly doesn't seem quite as possible as AI does. So long as my KITT listens to me when I tell it to lay some rubber, I'll be happy turning over the controls.

Ahh, Lotus...
 

Ronwue

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Oct 22, 2008
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rossatdi said:
TheBluesader said:
Me too. And Mr. Robot Make Sure She Doesn't Swallow Her Tongue several more.

Remember, kids. The only thing more fun than driving badly is nearly killing yourself with alcohol!
:D
"Okay, time to go home."
"Nah, we need to stop by my ex's place."
"Er, no we don't, why?"
"I just want to post a letter! Please" *Shows me drunkenly scrawled letter*
"You sure? OK, one time." *I pull over, he gets out.*
5 minutes pass
"Go, go, go!"
"What, why, what took so long?"
"I think she called the police, I kind of threw up on her doorstop."
"Oh, for fucks sake."
This made my day. :D It is not just driving that is held against teens these days. There are many other things like being influenced by peer pressure and so on, but as you say, it should be track record that counts rather than age. However, I think probabilistically speaking a 40yo male who hasn't had an accident by his fault is less probable to have an accident than a 18yo male who didn't have an accident by his fault.
 

rossatdi

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Aug 27, 2008
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Ronwue said:
This made my day.
The shocking this is the regularity we get into that situation, normally at his fault/expense:

*Phone rings whilst I'm driving to pick up friend*
"Hey man, you still coming to get me?"
"Yeah. Of course."
"Well pick me up at the bus stop near my house, favour."
"Sure..."
I turn up at the bus stop and my friend is there with two drunk, 15-16 year old girls, obviously drunk.
"Hey man, can we give them a lift to the station."
*Sigh*
"Of course, you will be explaining later."

Needless to say, its kind of difficult to drive with a 16 year old (please god say she was 16, legal in UK, yanks) trying to ram her tongue down your throat and intermittently trying to undo your fly. Admittedly my life would be more boring without said friend.
 

Riicek

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Oct 24, 2008
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I'm a 23 year old male, and as such my insurance rates still have not undergone the "25 year old drop". This doesn't make me upset in the least. The fact is, young males do cause more accidents than the other age groups / gender. This isn't speculation, it's just a fact. If you're going to argue that this shouldn't affect insurance rates, the same could go for every other factor affecting rates. (Why should I pay more just because my car has a higher rate of theft?)

rossatdi said:
They say that men are more likely to be in accidents but I think it's not just a punchline to say that a great number of these are due to the idiot driver in front of them who gets away scot free.
Are you saying that men are more likely to be in an accident caused by the person in front of them, or that a large number of accidents in general are caused by the person in front? If it's the latter, I'd probably agree, if it's the former, I kind of have a hard time believing there are that many people out there looking in their rearview mirror, seeing a man behind the wheel, and purposely causing them to crash.
 

rossatdi

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Aug 27, 2008
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Riicek said:
Are you saying that men are more likely to be in an accident caused by the person in front of them, or that a large number of accidents in general are caused by the person in front? If it's the latter, I'd probably agree, if it's the former, I kind of have a hard time believing there are that many people out there looking in their rearview mirror, seeing a man behind the wheel, and purposely causing them to crash.
The only times I've come close to crashing have been when someone cut across me (hugely illegally) at a junction. I had to slam on the breaks and skid to avoid them. It was only my control of the car that stopped me slamming into a lamppost. If I had I could have died and there would have been no evidence the other car was even there.

Another time, clear road. 60 mph speed limit. Car in front of me slams on the breaks for no reason I could work out (was going downhill so I could see the road clearly). I had to swerve onto the wrong lane to avoid him (my brakes are a bit weak), if it hadn't of been clear the options were rear-end him or off the road.
 

cuddly_tomato

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Nov 12, 2008
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NewClassic said:
So, what do you think, Escapist? Do you think more drivers should focus or their driving, or that those who say we're becoming too distracted should can it, and that we're doing well on our own? Any thoughts about laws disabling people from using cell phones on the road?
Some studies in the UK - Texting [http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/driving/news/article4776063.ece] and talking on a mobile [http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/1885775.stm] are as dangerous as drink driving. I have never really understood the hostility towards driving laws. Here in the UK the general media go balistic when a council decide to erect speed cameras at junctions and such, almost like people aren't doing anything wrong by driving recklessly.

When you get behind the wheel of a car you are effectively taking a 1-2 ton piece of steel and hurling it down the road at a massive speed. The law should reflect the inherent danger in this and punish any who endanger the lives of others through carelessness.
 

Riicek

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Oct 24, 2008
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rossatdi said:
Riicek said:
Are you saying that men are more likely to be in an accident caused by the person in front of them, or that a large number of accidents in general are caused by the person in front? If it's the latter, I'd probably agree, if it's the former, I kind of have a hard time believing there are that many people out there looking in their rearview mirror, seeing a man behind the wheel, and purposely causing them to crash.
The only times I've come close to crashing have been when someone cut across me (hugely illegally) at a junction. I had to slam on the breaks and skid to avoid them. It was only my control of the car that stopped me slamming into a lamppost. If I had I could have died and there would have been no evidence the other car was even there.

Another time, clear road. 60 mph speed limit. Car in front of me slams on the breaks for no reason I could work out (was going downhill so I could see the road clearly). I had to swerve onto the wrong lane to avoid him (my brakes are a bit weak), if it hadn't of been clear the options were rear-end him or off the road.
Hey, like I said, I completely agree with you that a large portion of accidents are undoubtedly caused by operators that in the end, aren't involved. I just thought you were insinuating this would be a cause for male drivers to get the short end of the stick, so to speak. My apologies if I misunderstood.

But yeah, bad drivers make me annoyed too :(
 

Di22y

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Oct 20, 2007
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In this age of political correct(ness) I would point my finger towards ageism and sexistness! See if that gets me anywhere?
 

gamebrain89

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May 29, 2008
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I agree with you. I am a 19 year old male and I pay about 125$ US a month for car Insurance. My sister is 21, and pay 50 dollars less than me. However, If I were to run out and get married to some girl right now, my insurance rates would immediately drop. How retarded is that??

Also, in my experience, its always the crazy girl drivers who have the most accidents. In my hometown, 8 of the 10 car wrecks that occur amoung the teen population are caused by female drivers. Its an incredibly sexist and biased system, that needs to change. However, it will most likely not.

I quite like the law recently passed in california, that if you have a phone in the car, it either has to be off, or you have to have a hands free set up. I think that is a great idea that needs to be implemented in other areas.
 

CIA

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Sep 11, 2008
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Not many teenage drivers complain to any public official about anything. Political apathy has left the younger people with little power. If you don't pay attention you won't see your rights slowly deteriorating.

To the second part, some people just don't know how to drive.