No surprise really. Origin was never an evil too many saw it to be, merely a victim of people who are really shitty at wording sentences in the English language. Spend 5 minutes with EA support. You'll start realising that behind the Origin EULA is not an evil mastermind, but a simple group of idiots who couldn't form an English sentence if their life depended on it.
EA Germany: "Origin Is Not Spyware"
- Thread starter Hevva
- Start date
Recommended Videos
In reality though, you have to agree to every bit of data you upload and they tell you exactly what they do.A Pious Cultist said:
That was mentioned on page one so if you have proven education resitant before this might not help you.
People dont have a problem with knowingly sending data if they want too.
(and you have to agree every time, if you dont no problem)
origin doesnt ask you when it scans a file before and notifys you. If you disagree with the eula you dont get to use products bought by you.
With steam you just click no once every year.
By creating a virtual machine you can do exactly that, which is something I plan to do for Mass Effect 3, my brother in-law is a professional computer programmer who is also looking forward to ME3 but Not Origin, so we are going to setup VM's to block EA's illegal spying.Spy_Guy said:
I think this sums it up. People are acting like EA is being a sinister figure here, when instead they are more just behaving like beginners to the big world of the digital marketplace, which they are. This is why I don't plan to have any dealings with Origin until it has finished teething.Awexsome said:
I just hope that in time they throw out SecuROM since it shouldn't even be necessary for those using Origin. Can anybody tell me if BF3 or other current Origin titles comes with that garbage malware? (Even if it is the toned down version of what came with Spore?)
Ask yourself, would a sentient program find your wife hot? Watch Saturn 3 [http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0079285/] and you may have found the answer.Hank Wants Pie said:
Awesome. Why get spyware from those nasty software pirates out there when you can buy some from EA instead?
Jesus' balls, man. At least pretend that there are some risks that are exclusive to stealing software off the internet or even make up some new ones. This is like adding extra lead in designer childrens' vitamins as a bonus feature.
Jesus' balls, man. At least pretend that there are some risks that are exclusive to stealing software off the internet or even make up some new ones. This is like adding extra lead in designer childrens' vitamins as a bonus feature.
Thanks for the clarification, and thanks for looking into it.Frehls said:
It is important to realise that the EULA is the point of contention here. The argument that 'Steam do it too' is not valid.
I am not here to argue whether or not Steam or Origin is better, I don't care. My main concern is that it is becoming 'acceptable' for companies to create applications collect information that is of no relevance to their product.
Although it doesn't make Valve saints, the big Hardware & Software surveying done is optional. If you choose to opt out, not only will the information be kept aware from 'partners', the information will never be collected. I think that is a big deal. The rest of the information that is given to them is deliberate at registration and at a minimum is a username, password, email (EA master account asks for a DOB in addition).
It needs to be acknowledged that an IP address can become identifiable information when combined with a simple timestamp. It is also of concern that EA puts your IP address as 'un-identifiable' information. I do believe Steam also take your IP addresses, but once they have resolved a general region (i.e. City/State) for demographics, the IP address itself is discarded (please correct me if i am wrong on this one).
I don't mean to split straws here, but it is the culmination of little things that make a big difference. I am in no way advocating one system over another. However, I do support the unity of the german gaming community boycotting Origin and BF3. The point can be made that we won't just stupidly agree to everything no matter how 'cool' your product might be. Maybe, then companies like EA will stop spending man hours on integrating process monitoring applications into origin, and start using their talent to make their games a more immersive satisfying experience, and maybe get rid of a few more of those bugs before launch.
Now I'm half-tempted to download and test it on an emulated PC (running Ethereal and a few other utilities), just to see how it behaves first hand.
It's no different than basic heuristics for malware, really. "What is my processor doing that I don't know about, and why?"
You can't disprove it 100% by the logic of reasonable doubt (unless you break into the client program of course), however, you can observe and measure the program's behavior while it's in operation, and you can do so without cracking one bit of data (to avoid violating copyright if that isn't your bag).Femaref said:
It's no different than basic heuristics for malware, really. "What is my processor doing that I don't know about, and why?"
Go get 'em, Germany. Destroy EA.
I'd love to read them, but when they're 50 pages long (or simply feel that way, especially in the ones where you have to scroll down to the bottom before agreeing) and written in stuffy legal terms that don't make a damn bit of sense to your average Joe, how can we be expected to read them? You can either spend 10 minutes minimum trying to read it only to not understand it and then click "agree" without knowing what it says, or you can spend 5 seconds to click "agree" without knowing what it says. The end result of both is the same: you have no idea what you just agreed to. One option gets you using the software a hell of a lot quicker than the other though, so who can really blame anyone for picking that option?Torrasque said:
Oh I know, I am the same way, "Read these 20 pages of boring things I don't care about? Fuck that". I was merely mocking the concept of highlighting certain parts of the terms and conditions, and the fact that we SHOULD read the terms and conditions.mjc0961 said:
since i know german, i read on a german game forum about origin and the links they have posted. thats why i dint get my self BF3 and from the looks of it, i will not get my self mass effect 3 either. simply because of origin. then im better off playing modern warfare 3. at least this doesnt need origin.
Yeah, these videos and pictures I've are pretty convincing evidence Origin is spyware.
Except I'm pretty sure they're faked. I've done my own monitoring with Process Monitor, and the only files origin ever uses is it's own internal files, the ones in it's folder, and a few system files like dlls. However, there are quite a few files it accesses, so an easy way to fake it accessing inappropiate files is to simply change the name of your origin files. Then, origin will look like it's reading files it has no business reading.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying you should trust EA in anyway shape or form. But I'm saying you shouldn't trust some random dude on the internet who posts a video or screenshot.
After all, no one has EVER posted fake screenshots or videos on the internet before, huh?
EDIT: I forgot to mention that I'm using the US client. So maybe the german version really does scan all those files, I wouldn't know. I'm seriously doubting it, however.
Except I'm pretty sure they're faked. I've done my own monitoring with Process Monitor, and the only files origin ever uses is it's own internal files, the ones in it's folder, and a few system files like dlls. However, there are quite a few files it accesses, so an easy way to fake it accessing inappropiate files is to simply change the name of your origin files. Then, origin will look like it's reading files it has no business reading.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying you should trust EA in anyway shape or form. But I'm saying you shouldn't trust some random dude on the internet who posts a video or screenshot.
After all, no one has EVER posted fake screenshots or videos on the internet before, huh?
EDIT: I forgot to mention that I'm using the US client. So maybe the german version really does scan all those files, I wouldn't know. I'm seriously doubting it, however.
And yet it still collects data from your computer that they give to third parties.
Read section 2 of the Origin ToS here: http://eacom.s3.amazonaws.com/EULA_Origin_9.16.11.pdf as it gives you a vague idea (including but not limited to...) of the data it collects, detailing what data they consider "non-personally identifiable". This includes:
As much as I've longed for it, I am still boycotting Battlefield 3.
Read section 2 of the Origin ToS here: http://eacom.s3.amazonaws.com/EULA_Origin_9.16.11.pdf as it gives you a vague idea (including but not limited to...) of the data it collects, detailing what data they consider "non-personally identifiable". This includes:
At the end of section 2, you will find this statement:
In EA's Privacy Policy (found here: http://tos.ea.com/legalapp/WEBPRIVACY/US/en/PC/) section VI subsection B:
Now that that is out of the way, let me put this in plain English from my perspective. EA shares information it deems anonymous or non-personal, which as detailed above is quite a lot, and given Origin's "thoroughness" in collecting data (evidenced here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6lGUOFjMuQA) the last thing I want is to have a program installed that collects that much "anonymous" data about me and then have that program's creator give that data to whom they wish. That, my friends, is spyware, the Oxford dictionary definition of which can be found here: http://oxforddictionaries.com/definition/spyware?region=us
As much as I've longed for it, I am still boycotting Battlefield 3.
"EA takes the privacy of its users very seriously"
Yes... we plan to make a serious amount of money spying on the contents of your computer. We're not joking around, we're going to run your hard-drive tit for tuesday, we'll know more things about you than you know about yourself.
PS: anyone else depressed at how many games are published by EA? All of Bioware, DICE, Bungie's new game... why. WHYY!!!?!? Why can't this company just go bankrupt and burn!
HOW!?? Please tell me this EA, How after all the shit Activision has pulled do they now look like a more trusted publisher than you? How after all that they have milked the COD franchise by your Origin bullshit MW3 is looking like a safer bet? God damn it EA, you knew we were all fed up with activision, this was a chance to earn some good will but what did you do? You took that as your queue to be even WORSE!
What happened to just making a good game and selling it, why do you want to spy on us as well? What is your possible benefit except profit?
Yes... we plan to make a serious amount of money spying on the contents of your computer. We're not joking around, we're going to run your hard-drive tit for tuesday, we'll know more things about you than you know about yourself.
PS: anyone else depressed at how many games are published by EA? All of Bioware, DICE, Bungie's new game... why. WHYY!!!?!? Why can't this company just go bankrupt and burn!
HOW!?? Please tell me this EA, How after all the shit Activision has pulled do they now look like a more trusted publisher than you? How after all that they have milked the COD franchise by your Origin bullshit MW3 is looking like a safer bet? God damn it EA, you knew we were all fed up with activision, this was a chance to earn some good will but what did you do? You took that as your queue to be even WORSE!
What happened to just making a good game and selling it, why do you want to spy on us as well? What is your possible benefit except profit?
This whole thing honestly frightens me...and I think it's on my computer because I had an EA account a while ago for ME2. I checked and now it's an Origin account.
Can I get rid of it, but still play EA games? I like Bioware, and I don't want to give up ME3 because EA is full of greedy, creepy pricks.
I don't want Origin on my computer. That...really scares me.
Please tell me it's not on my computer just because I signed up for ME2 and the Sims 3 three years ago.
Maybe if Germany has enough of a rage moment, it will get changed?
Can I get rid of it, but still play EA games? I like Bioware, and I don't want to give up ME3 because EA is full of greedy, creepy pricks.
I don't want Origin on my computer. That...really scares me.
Please tell me it's not on my computer just because I signed up for ME2 and the Sims 3 three years ago.
Maybe if Germany has enough of a rage moment, it will get changed?
I only wish North American gamers weren't such pushovers. It's sickening that they have amassed to defend EA for its lowly practices. I boycotted Battlefield 3 and anything else EA has to offer me and I haven't experienced a drop in my entertainment. There are plenty of good games to go around without us showing up at EA's doorstep and begging it to take our money.
