EFF Campaings to Legalize Console Modding
- Thread starter Andy Chalk
- Start date
I'm all for this, but publishers and developers might be hesitant about the idea. Nintendo's 3DS is a great example of wanting to keep their system non-modded, otherwise they'll brick your device for messing with their "Terms of Service." If people were free to jailbreak the 3DS, the flash cards will just flood back onto the 3DS, possibly.
No it doesn't and I'll tell you why.Ashistheking said:
As someone who used to pirate (rather, I used to download pirated games; no I'm not proud of it, I was just poor), I can definitely tell you that if pirating games was somehow made completely impossible to do, most of the people who do it, wouldn't just go out and buy games legitimately. They would find other things to do for free. That's what I would've done and if that was the case I wouldn't be into gaming now and buying new games as I do now. Get my drift? The hardcore gamer userbase would shrink even more than it has this generation.
I fully support this but not so people can pirate more easily. I just want Sony to start making firmware for their products that does more than fend off the latest hacks. The firmware they've given the psp, ps3, and the Vita (which isn't out yet but I have no reason to believe that it will be supported any better) has always just been a huge waste of time and bandwidth for us and a huge waste of time and resources for Sony.
Something like this might force them to get their priorities in order.
While this might not be the most graceful way to react to this news I can only think of one way to say it:
They have my support. Power to the modders!
They have my support. Power to the modders!
You know how ocassionally you find people online selling hacked consoles or modded controllers, even though it isn't strictly "legal"? This would turn into a real business. You think that the game industry gets up in arms about the used games industry, wait until they get a whiff of the "$150 Xbox 360 that can also play torrented PS3 and Wii games" industry.Xanthious said:
As much as I would love this to happen it's not going to because teams of lawyers from every major player in the console market is going to destroy our dreams with unholy legal fire.
Law does not work backwards in time, or like friends Romans used to say lex retro non agit. If jailbraking consoles would become legal now, it would have no effect on past cases whatsoever.TimeLord said:
And yes, modding a piece of hardware You legally own should not be considered a crime, and it being illegal is mostly dead law anyway. You only hear about big cases when one or the other hardware hacker does something newsworthy and the big companies go into damage control mode.
It wouldn't change anything in terms of piracy, because whoever wants to pirate on their console does it already, without any real threat from the law-system.
It does, however, stop people who want to tinker with stuff however, because the moment They go public with their fancy inventions they put themselves at risk of lawsuits from the manufacturers.
i dont mind if they hack consoles or phones. or anything else, for that matter. what i do care about is that now, with multiplayer being an internet thing, their cheating could break great experiences. so i say; allow mods. but if they are found to be using them for competitive play, and therefore ruining the experience of everyone else in game, ban hammer time. oh, and take away achievements if your going to be doing that. that way i wont feel cheated out of my 53k g score that i toiled all day for.
As a Canadian I gotta say please let this succeed. Seems like every year we get a 'made in Hollywood' piece of DMC legislation placed in the hands of our government, but so far through popular public protest, petition, and consumer interest groups (as well as having a minority government... which we don't anymore) we've been able to shoot it down. It's not like we don't need to update our laws, but the key sticking point always comes down to making it illegal to alter digital locks and/or provide knowledge instruction & software to do so. We tell them this is unacceptable, they so okay let us take it back and revise it... next year there will be a few small changes but the digital locks caveat always remains.
So it would be nice if my neighbours to the south can clean up their own laws before 'trickle up' politics takes effect on this matter.
So it would be nice if my neighbours to the south can clean up their own laws before 'trickle up' politics takes effect on this matter.
Ok sure, people sell modded consoles that can play pirated games. Hell in my area on craigslist there is a game shop that advertises it can mod your 360 while you wait for the bargain price of a twenty spot.Ordinaryundone said:
However, (and here is where you jumped right off the ledge of reason into the olympic size swimming pool o' nonsense), the presumption that modded systems are magically going to be able to play any current gen games other than those already made for the system at hand after this law is passed it totally and utterly rubbish.
First off we've pretty much reached the peak of what can be done with modded systems right now. The fact it's illegal means fuck all to the people doing it. It's not as if once this law is passed somehow the systems are going to somehow be able to do more. Furthermore it's not as if once modding becomes legal you will all of a sudden just be able to mozy on over to the local electronics hut pick up a basket of parts and turn them into an PS3.
Secondly, and most importantly, the industry's opinion on this matter means fuck all. Again, they are SELLING these consoles. Not renting them. Once you sell something you lose the right to decide what gets done with it. I couldn't be paid to care about their opinion if I were to ever mod one of my own consoles (although I'd nevvverrrr do that nope not me that's just wrong. No sir I don't have a J-Tagged Xbox 360 with a terabyte hard drive thats filled to bursting (with public access ebooks) . . . nope I sure don't). When they want to start renting their systems out to people for a few quid a week then I will start to care about their opinions on how I should operate the hardware. However, while they are still SELLING it they can go bugger each other with broken bottles for all I care about their opinion on the matter.
You are thinking about this the wrong way. They are not making a case for people to be allowed to steal games. They are simply making a case that people should be allowed to use the consoles as they see fit, which includes things like Homebrew.Ashistheking said:
The EFF is not making a case that says this is ok.GreatTeacherCAW said:
OT: Everyone looks at the worst possible outcomes of these types of things. A modded console can do things a restricted console cannot. Which could include alternate OS's, homebrew, user made content. Imagine being able to download player made mods for Skyrim. Get your heads strait. Will people use this illegally. Yes. Can this be used in a legal manner to enhance the lives of gamers who aren't interested in cheating or pirating? Hell yes!
TOS agreements and EULA have a pretty flimsy basis under the law and as it stands now can only stand up in certain US states and a couple countries in the EU. They have been dubbed shrink wrap contracts on the basis that they are usually included in such things that require you to open a package to read the agreement voiding your ability to return it.Eve Charm said:
Lets say hypothetically a company lets call them "sony" releases a product in the states. they later releases an update to their software that prevents someone lets call him "George" from using software that the product was originally designed to run, but George has agreed not to alter the product. George decides "to hell with it" and modifies it anyway. So Sony takes him to court.
The case would be decided based on the states individual preference between the DMCA which upholds Sony's right, and fair trade contract law which bars companies from making a sale with what is essentially a blank contract.
Oh and also "George" previously modded his iPhone and successfully won the right for everyone in america to do the same regardless of TOS agreements.
Considering he chickened out and settled, I can't see him doing it either. Mostly because I can't see Sony not having covered themselves from action in that settlement.TimeLord said:
Now now, we all know being fair has nothing to do with it....Amnestic said:
Which is still a lot better than it being flat-out a crime.Eve Charm said:
Well yeah, that's why Sony pulled out of the console market before the much-anticipated Playstation 2 was released.Crono1973 said:
XD
I don't get why everyone has their panties in a twist. You can mod your console all you want, you just can't go online with it. Why? Because while the console itself is a physical thing you own, the whole internet/online portion is a service given by Sony/Microsoft/Nintendo. You aren't automatically entitled to the service just because.