Electronic Arts Announces Dead Space 3: Awakened
- Thread starter Andy Chalk
- Start date
A game is often locked down for release up to half a year before, as it has to go through several rounds of rigorous testing and bug fixing, as well as certification for release on the consoles. You only need a skeleton crew for that period, so a common practice is to roll off the excess people from Project A into DLC for A, or onto Project B/C/etc., - or lay them off.ThunderCavalier said:
Oh. :/ So, out of curiosity, and I honestly don't know this, but is the DLC for said game allowed to be put on the disc prior to release, or does said DLC made post-game completion have to be downloaded on the market like, well, DLC.ThriKreen said:
Because I can get DLC that's made after the game is made, but Day 1 DLC that just happens to be locked disc content seems... well... shady.
It depends - the issue is the whole "content lock" part of things. When you submit your game to be certified for console release to Microsoft, Sony, Nintendo - new content, as opposed to fixed content, can be viewed as a whole new game state and usually results in the certification being restarted. The perception is that new content can affect the overall game in ways we can't see just yet, so you need to retest everything from the beginning. When the cert period can take from 2-3 months to do (report bug, week to fix, submit new game image, couple days to test, get new bugs, repeat), and you have a release date to hit, you don't want to allow that to happen.ThunderCavalier said:
Also the reset is done to avoid developers sneaking in new content under the guise of "we're done, here's the game to be test - OOPS here's some new stuff, OOPS here's some more new stuff." because they didn't hit their deadline. Another trick some have done is to leave a game breaking bug in a submission, knowing it will fail - to get more time to fix other bugs.
Not to mention the console makers might make you pay for a new cert stage instead of piggy backing off the existing one, and that can be $pricey$.
However, there's the player perception of what the DLC is, and far too often they view any and all DLC in the same category. Even though some content is smaller and thus easier to make and check and validate than others, like alternate costumes in Street Fighter vs. a whole new companion character for a 50+hr RPG.
An alternate costume or weapon: could be made in under a week or two. Check it is available, select, loads in the fight, unload the DLC, verify the menu option is disabled. Check for visual issues like clipping, testing could be done in a day. Let's be nice and say one month turn around time from conception, creation and testing to completion. But obviously you have several artists overlapping the work.
A new companion that can persist for most of a 50+hr game, like Shale from Dragon Age: Origins: takes a bit longer to make due to all the possible character interaction the designers have to script in, balancing for combat, etc. Then you have to verify the game still works with and without, so testing could mean more than a week turn around time, and a couple months to make it.
Some first parties might allow them to include those smaller content packs as part of the disc, but not the game (i.e. to ease downloading, still have to install it off the disc).
Companion characters, they might decide to cut the companion now to give time for completing other stuff. Leave the data for being a companion in the game to speed up loading (i.e. the model, animations, voice clips, combat stuff), and finishing the companion specific mission content for DLC later - example, the Prothean in Mass Effect 3.
In Capcom's case, the main reason I can see all the costumes are already on the disc is a technical one to prevent fragmentation of the player base due to who has which costumes and who doesn't. In that regard, the content was most likely done before the lockdown, so you're still totally justified in complaining over the locked costumes being for pay only vs. unable to unlock via regular play. I don't agree with that practice obviously, but the flip side is that the costumes are a cosmetic thing and shouldn't affect the base game at all.
It really boils down to how the game's resource system is designed, as version handling is a pain to juggle. Often you hear of games of the past having all sorts of hidden stuff that was cut but inaccessible. Sometimes removing the resource might cause problems elsewhere, i.e. Having generic NPC #381 reference companion #9's texture file, but if you completely remove all traces of companion #9, you end up with the NPC not having said texture and appearing all white.
So it's better to leave it in just to be safe, but that's not going to stop people from browsing the data files and complaining "it was already on the disc!"
Huh. Honestly, wasn't really aware of how the DLC process worked once the game was completed. Not many people talk about it (except probably Extra Credits, but I haven't watched them in forever so I can't remember if they've ever mentioned it or not).ThriKreen said:
Cosmetic data on the disc or skeleton data such as Javik's model and whatnot on the disc is explainable and reasonable. Alternative costumes are purely cosmetic but should be on the disc to avoid glitches during online game and whatnot, and can be an easy way to get a quick buck or not, and you've explained exactly why BioWare would include part of From Ashes but not the entire pack and instead make it downloadable content (though, with what they did with the Extended Cut, I'm suspecting that part of From Ashes's final conception was EA's idea).
What pisses me off, as you mentioned, is content locked on the disc that is just unlocked via DLC, like... uhh... a crapton of Capcom games. Such as some of Resident Evil 6's features, or the infamous thing regarding Street Fighter x Tekken (because SERIOUSLY, Alisa is on the disc and I can't use her? Screw you). That stuff is obviously included and cut so that they can make a quick buck.
That's the problem, far too many people don't know of how the dev process has all sorts of overlapping stages when making a game. But that's not going to stop them from continuing to broadcast their ignorance: "Oh I don't know how game dev is like, but if the content is done before the game ships, why can't they include it on the disc?"ThunderCavalier said:
And the whole DLC idea is a fairly recent thing - the earliest I can remember is Oblivion's horse armour and Neverwinter Night's Premium Modules back in 2005. But remember that before the benefit of the Internet for delivery, games would cut content for their release deadline that STAYED cut (hence hidden, easter egg stuff), or were salvaged for use in an expansion pack that was released a year or two later. Problem is, expansion packs aren't as viable for today's market with the slim margins and console hardware.
Thus, smaller, episodic and cosmetic type content delivered by the Internet was born. Sure it might be seen as a money grab, and while I don't have numbers off hand, you can guess that only a small % of the player base for a game would buy anything. Though that would vary by game type, a purely multiplayer centric game offering map packs would sell more than a costume skin.
Actually I wonder WHAT are the stats - depending on the DLC it might have achievements associated with it, so it wouldn't be hard to get the numbers based on that and compare to how many have bought the game.
Yeap, but like I said, people would browse the resource files and see some things, and draw erroneous conclusions, like it was deliberately cut (well yes, gotta hit the deadlines after all) and purposely cut for DLC - depends, most of the time devs don't like to do that as it means content that only a small % would ever see. There are various articles about how only 10-20% ever even FINISH a game, so how many out of that continue to play the game afterwards to justify buying DLC to extend the play time?
Then how would you feel if you were to submit a painting for an art gallery, but the wing it was in was in the basement, no signs pointing to it, then required another admission price?
But making a game is about balancing features they'd thing is fun for the player base vs. workload vs. compensation.
Yeah, I don't mind the "pay $ and unlock everything, or grind to unlock them" aspect of a game (see BF3 weapons). Granted I can't be bothered to try to unlock all the costumes, it's all cosmetic and doesn't affect me, so pay locked stuff like that I can ignore.
The flip side is that as the game makers, it's up to them for how they want to offer the game to you. 'Course I could go on about the perception of property and owning something vs licensed. You still have the option to pay with your wallet though, nothing is forced.
So we went from announcing, and sometimes creating, DLC After the actual game came out. To a dlc announcement the very same day.
In a few years we will have the dlc BEFORE the actual game.
In a few years we will have the dlc BEFORE the actual game.