Emulators

[JPH330]

Okay, I remember awhile ago reading through a thread that asked people to give their definitions of what a "real gamer" is. Now, that argument is one I think is a bit silly, but that's not the argument for today. I bring this up because I want to show you a comment I read in that thread:

"Someone who knows that you have to play the classics on their consoles, emulation is never as good as the original"

Okay, I've heard this before and it pisses me off. Elitists like to show off that they play NES and SNES games on the actual consoles, and I don't understand why. If you prefer playing it on the console, then that's fine, but I don't see why playing it on an emulator should be considered a bad thing, especially not something that stops you from being a "real gamer."

Here are some reasons why I think playing on an emulator makes perfect sense and in some cases can be a much better way to play the classics than playing them on their original consoles.

• -For the most part, emulations work exactly like the original games, just on a computer instead of on a console
  -Old consoles like the NES can be very hard to find
  -Some people, myself included, find keyboard controls more comfortable than using a controller, especially the piece-of-shit retro controllers they made for the older consoles like the NES
  -You get plenty of added perks, like save states and fast-forward

I know that people say utilizing save states to beat a game is basically cheating, and in some cases, it kind of is. If you just use save states to save at the beginning of a level, then that's like writing down passwords, except it saves you time. Using save states to save every time you make a bit more progress in a level, yeah, that's pretty much cheating. But old consoles had Game Genies and stuff like that, you know. Here's the way I see it. Using save states in the cheating-type way should be treated like using cheat codes, or looking up passwords in order to skip levels. You can do it just for the sake of doing it, just so you can see what the final boss is like or get to watch the ending or whatever, but you can't say that you legitimately beat the game unless you do it without save states, or like I said before, only using save states at the beginning of continue points or whatever.

So yeah, there's my two cents. I don't see why using emulators stops you from being a legitimate gamer. The games don't change, only the controls do. Now I leave it to you to discuss whether you think using emulators is reasonable or not.

Oh, and if you're against it because of legal issues, then that's a different story entirely, and please don't turn the thread discussion into an argument about legality. Make your own thread about that or something.

 

[oplinger]

..I use rewind a lot in some games, but I don't technically count that as cheating, because I know for a fact I'd be doing the fight over and over and over and over and over until I did it to my satisfaction. even if I complete it. Also in in a game like Super Punch-Out, it turns 3 minutes into an hour (But I was training myself then.) Overall the more I use rewind the better I get. For games I use rewind a lot, I'm better at them now and don't need to use it. Unless something really retarded happens.

I don't think emulation makes you less of a gamer though. Gamers play for the games, not for the ego stroking. Emulation helps us play for the games, and let's us have fun.

It's all about the games man.

 

[suhlEap]

i don't really have a problem with emulators apart from one. the few times i've got one, i've found a package that has like 200 games with it. and then i tend play one game after another, never concentrating on one and only sticking to them for a few minutes at a time. it stops me from appreciating the games and kinda cheapens them.
apart from that i don't see any problem with emulators.

 

[Bryan Jue]

I can respect if someone wishes to preserve the "authenticity" of playing on the "real thing" but the reasons that I play on an emulator are purely for convenience's sake. All my NES/SNES games and the consoles are in a box somewhere in the attic, and I have no motivation to find out whether they'll even work on my 2 year old LCD TV without much fuss. So if I want to play Super Metroid, instead of pulling out the cartridge and setting up the console, I'll just fire up my SNES emulator of choice with my wireless USB gamepad. Did I mention my gamepad is wireless? I can't do that on my real SNES.

You make good points about the extra features of emulators. If I had save states as a kid things would've been much nicer. You see, as a kid my parents only let me play games for 30 minutes a day, and even that was only on weekends. I almost never was able to finish a full game all the way through (barring a save, password, or cheat/stage select system). House rules that the console goes off right when the timer rings. Yes, yes, being kid, of course I tried to eke just a few more minutes out of it, but hey, it would've been handy to have a save state to resume from the next time.

And what about the games that stopped working? No matter how many times you blow into them? And finally there are the graphical filters/blitters. They can make old crappy graphics in games look smooth and 2010-retro-like.

As far as cheating goes, well, yeah, I mean it depends on your view of cheating. I think most games these days (I'm talking single player) can be completed without codes or cheating, but many games from back then, especially in the NES era, were just FRAKKING hard. My opinion is one of "who cares if you beat the game legitimately?" As long as you had fun, that's what matters. I could never beat Mega Man 3 without Game Genie or that password that gave you 9 energy tanks. I just didn't/don't have the skill or patience. I still loved the heck out of that game back in the day and played it over and over. Does that make me not a "real Mega Man 3 player?" Hell no.

I've never talked to my friends who play games about what a "real gamer" is. All of them have played games on emulators, but they've also played their share on the real thing. I don't think it matters.

 

[QuadrAlien]

I don't think the statement really means that the emulated version is worse, it's just to get the full experience you need to play the actual console. I believe nostalgia has something to do with this.

Then again, it's best not to get too involved in these "real gamer" discussions, I find - I suspect that asking enough people would result in absolutely everyone being denied the status.

 

[Danzaivar]

Screw authenticity. I wanna play games using a 360 pad, on a decent sized monitor, with the graphics sharpened and some anti-aliasing.

I also want to quick save. Old games with infrequent save points or (gasp!) no save points become a lot less frustrating and a lot more fun when you can just play through happily without fretting over your potential impending doom setting you back half an hour.

 

[Imbechile]

Of course it doesn't stop you from being a real gamer simply for the fact that you WANT to play those old games even thou most of them are 2D and with bad graphics, something that most of today's gamers go pale at the sight or mention

 

[Jonluw]

By playing the game on the original console you are saying that you want to play it in the original way because of the nostalgia it induces in you. This is a way of showing that you have been around since the beginning; you're a veteran gamer.

 

[demoman_chaos]

I dont have a problem with them, but I prefer the console versions. The "piece of shit" retro controllers are quite the opposite. My NES controller has lived through hell but many many PS2 controllers broke easily. The games themselves also last a lot longer than CD based games. If you have any problems, a Q-tip and some Windex will fix them.

 

[Draithx]

I prefer to play gameboy games on an emulator. Bigger screen size and the ability to speed it up to make it play around 5-10x as fast is wonderfull.

Emulating actual consoles however, I don't like. I really miss the analog stick and controllers have a lot more buttons then a gameboy which is a pain to remember when playing on a normal keyboard.

 

[SovietSecrets]

I have a Gameboy, SNES, and Genesis emulator on my iTouch. I love being able to play all those old games that I used to play on those consoles. Really doesn't matter to me that I am playing on my touch and not the console itself, I am just enjoying the game.

 

[Erana]

People here are right- its not about "better" its about authenticity.
Console games don't just feel different on a console, they were designed to be played on a console. LordKat in his Dick Tracy [http://www.lordkat.com/until-we-win-dick-tracy.html] video explains how his playthrough is affected by his using an emulator very well. One could say he's cheating because of it.
Also, they're meant to be played without savestates. Again, that's just a matter of playing the game as attended. You can see the difference in this "Intention" by comparing romhacks designed for savestates to games that were made for the console. (Just look at Kaizo mario compared to the original game)

My n64 recently busted, making the picture in black and white with no sound. Still, I'd just prefer to play it on console because I don't like the feel of PC... *Looks at Macbook* Computer gaming. And there IS a difference, no matter how much some people don't want to admit it. I just feels different.
(And, honestly, I know the songs and colors of my N64 games by heart... ^^

 

[Rakkana]

To rectify that I just save where your able to save, then nobody has any right to complain! And the controls can only be considered harder over a keyboard.

When it comes to legality you shouldn't have anything to worry about so long as the copyrights expired or the company have stopped producing the product. I don't get any of those kinds because of legal issues.

 

[Altorin]

I'm not touching this with a 10-foot pole.

 

[oplinger]

People here are right- its not about "better" its about authenticity.
Console games don't just feel different on a console, they were designed to be played on a console. LordKat in his Dick Tracy [http://www.lordkat.com/until-we-win-dick-tracy.html] video explains how his playthrough is affected by his using an emulator very well. One could say he's cheating because of it.
Also, they're meant to be played without savestates. Again, that's just a matter of playing the game as attended. You can see the difference in this "Intention" by comparing romhacks designed for savestates to games that were made for the console. (Just look at Kaizo mario compared to the original game)

My n64 recently busted, making the picture in black and white with no sound. Still, I'd just prefer to play it on console because I don't like the feel of PC... *Looks at Macbook* Computer gaming. And there IS a difference, no matter how much some people don't want to admit it. I just feels different.
(And, honestly, I know the songs and colors of my N64 games by heart... ^^

If you look at a macbook. I've found your problem.

 

[Erana]

People here are right- its not about "better" its about authenticity.
Console games don't just feel different on a console, they were designed to be played on a console. LordKat in his Dick Tracy [http://www.lordkat.com/until-we-win-dick-tracy.html] video explains how his playthrough is affected by his using an emulator very well. One could say he's cheating because of it.
Also, they're meant to be played without savestates. Again, that's just a matter of playing the game as attended. You can see the difference in this "Intention" by comparing romhacks designed for savestates to games that were made for the console. (Just look at Kaizo mario compared to the original game)

My n64 recently busted, making the picture in black and white with no sound. Still, I'd just prefer to play it on console because I don't like the feel of PC... *Looks at Macbook* Computer gaming. And there IS a difference, no matter how much some people don't want to admit it. I just feels different.
(And, honestly, I know the songs and colors of my N64 games by heart... ^^

If you look at a macbook. I've found your problem.

Why would you honestly think you're justified in this comment? You have absolutely no idea about my own personal situation and why I use a Mac. Even if you don't find my reasoning right, You have no right to judge people based on your own one-sided opinion.
Do you honestly think that your opinion is THE ABSOLUTE TRUTH? Enough to ridicule people who have a different opinion? This is the 21st century, with almost all modern cultures based on the mutual respect of peoples' views.
If this is the kind of off-topic, disrespectful post you're going to make, I strongly suggest you find a website of more like-minded people.

 

[PureChaos]

the only way i can see a console game is inferior by being played on an emulator is due to the controls, having to use a keyboard when it's designed for a controller. even so, i had a SNES, Mega Drive (Genesis in the US) and N64 emulator and the games were great. a little tougher on the control but it certainly didn't ruin the game. Super Mario 3 was as awesome as it's always been

 

[oplinger]

People here are right- its not about "better" its about authenticity.
Console games don't just feel different on a console, they were designed to be played on a console. LordKat in his Dick Tracy [http://www.lordkat.com/until-we-win-dick-tracy.html] video explains how his playthrough is affected by his using an emulator very well. One could say he's cheating because of it.
Also, they're meant to be played without savestates. Again, that's just a matter of playing the game as attended. You can see the difference in this "Intention" by comparing romhacks designed for savestates to games that were made for the console. (Just look at Kaizo mario compared to the original game)

My n64 recently busted, making the picture in black and white with no sound. Still, I'd just prefer to play it on console because I don't like the feel of PC... *Looks at Macbook* Computer gaming. And there IS a difference, no matter how much some people don't want to admit it. I just feels different.
(And, honestly, I know the songs and colors of my N64 games by heart... ^^

If you look at a macbook. I've found your problem.

Why would you honestly think you're justified in this comment? You have absolutely no idea about my own personal situation and why I use a Mac. Even if you don't find my reasoning right, You have no right to judge people based on your own one-sided opinion.
Do you honestly think that your opinion is THE ABSOLUTE TRUTH? Enough to ridicule people who have a different opinion? This is the 21st century, with almost all modern cultures based on the mutual respect of peoples' views.
If this is the kind of off-topic, disrespectful post you're going to make, I strongly suggest you find a website of more like-minded people.

Wasn't what I was getting at. Macs don't have alot of support for many things, it would be hard to get it right (I cant think of many emulators that work on mac) So for liking consoles it is understandable if you have a mac, Nostalgia is more readily available on a PC when you have drivers programmed to be used specifically with those sorts of things, like me, I use a PS3 controller for my SNES games, because its about the same layout, the drivers I use have no mac version.

It wasn't an opinionated post. Be a bit daft to hate macbooks when I use one everyday :x

 

[Hairetos]

People here are right- its not about "better" its about authenticity.
Console games don't just feel different on a console, they were designed to be played on a console. LordKat in his Dick Tracy [http://www.lordkat.com/until-we-win-dick-tracy.html] video explains how his playthrough is affected by his using an emulator very well. One could say he's cheating because of it.
Also, they're meant to be played without savestates. Again, that's just a matter of playing the game as attended. You can see the difference in this "Intention" by comparing romhacks designed for savestates to games that were made for the console. (Just look at Kaizo mario compared to the original game)

My n64 recently busted, making the picture in black and white with no sound. Still, I'd just prefer to play it on console because I don't like the feel of PC... *Looks at Macbook* Computer gaming. And there IS a difference, no matter how much some people don't want to admit it. I just feels different.
(And, honestly, I know the songs and colors of my N64 games by heart... ^^

If you look at a macbook. I've found your problem.

Why would you honestly think you're justified in this comment? You have absolutely no idea about my own personal situation and why I use a Mac. Even if you don't find my reasoning right, You have no right to judge people based on your own one-sided opinion.
Do you honestly think that your opinion is THE ABSOLUTE TRUTH? Enough to ridicule people who have a different opinion? This is the 21st century, with almost all modern cultures based on the mutual respect of peoples' views.
If this is the kind of off-topic, disrespectful post you're going to make, I strongly suggest you find a website of more like-minded people.

Actually, it's pretty objectively true that PC's game "better" than Macs, mostly because of availability.

Mac's use OpenGL graphics API, PC's use DirectX. Not only is DirectX better, but it can emulate OpenGL for older games, making OpenGL obsolete. Some game developing companies program games to work only with DirectX, leaving Mac's out to dry.

I could go into Mac OS vs. Linux as well, but...you know. My advice to you would be to just chill. This is a forum, people disagree on it. Hell, I'm pretty sure his response was just in jest anyway.

As far as the topic, most people don't take the time to rip ROM's from their cartridge, so playing emulators for the vast majority of people is illegal. That's probably the most poignant point against their legitimacy, aside from the whole emulating current releases that costs game companies money.

 

[FinalHeart95]

Some old games are really, really expensive (and it's not like the developer is getting money from it) or hard to find. It's not simply a case of preferring the emulator over the console, it's more that the version of the game for the console is out of reach.

The virtual console and PsOne classics have both made finding old games easier. There are even some classics on XBLA (Symphony of the Night comes to mind). Not every game is on there though. If it is, I'm more than happy to pick it up though, hence my large collection of Mario and Zelda games I missed as a child hanging out on my Wii. They're also a hell of a lot cheaper than the physical copy at times. For example, FFVII is $10 on PSN, but the CD for the Ps1 can go for $50+.