You need to watch more Champloo and bebop. That's your problem, you have been watching to much crap...saltychipmunk said:
Everything You Know about Anime Is Wrong
- Thread starter FireAza
- Start date
I'm inclined to agree with the above. More to the point, it seemed angry at people who don't like what the topic creator likes.SmashLovesTitanQuest said:
I'm kosher with "it's not what you think," but it seemed like there was a subtext of "so screw you!" in there.
Reminding you of Seed Destiny being a bad thing I could understand (I stopped watching that series after, like, two episodes of the original Seed), but what do you have against Zeta Gundam? That's where the franchise really grew the beard, the TNG to 0079's TOS[footnote]not to start a TOS vs TNG war here, it's just that TNG is less likely to get dismissed out of hand for the cheesiness[/footnote].Kitsuna10060 said:
Edit: Also, are you sure you weren't thinking of Gundam ZZ, which was like Zeta's version of Destiny? I haven't seen it (never released in the US, along with F91 and half of the other UC stuff), but from what I've heard, that one has a lot of haters because it starts out with a very light mood. I've never heard of anyone who didn't like Zeta, or at least not a fan of Gundam who didn't like it.
Truth. The whole "it's not a cartoon, it's anime!" thing smacks of a middle school kid defending the fact that he still watches cartoons (and then by high school or college at the latest, if they're still watching they don't care.) I should know because I was in middle school at the time Toonami was first getting big, and that's pretty much exactly what was going on with that statement; that's an age where kids are concerned with wanting to grow up and be mature, it's that stage in development that C.S. Lewis pointed out as actually being healthy to spend wanting to "appear very grown up." But if you're an adult and still bothering with the distinction in a defensive manner, you may have a problem. I'll be 22 in about two weeks, I like cartoons, and I don't really care what country they come from. The avatar is because UC universe Gundam is one of my favorite Science fiction franchises (right up there with Stargate, and just below Star Trek and Star Wars), not because I'm an anime fan.rob_simple said:
That's what I'm saying it's not a genre it's just a cartoon that happens to come from Japan, no better no worse by default maybe different due to culture views, although several studio are catering to whats considered western taste, it's just another movie/show/comic.Palademon said:
Your comparison used somewhat subtle differences in the beginning of your post to illustrate a division of concepts most seem to subconsciously overlap with their arguments while explaining the correct application of the definitions for each. The points that you followed with were easy to understand and accompanied by examples afterward, you did all of this from an admittedly biased perspective (I feel the same as you do) yet this was objective enough that I haven't seen anything like it on the net in a long time... Maybe I've just been in the wrong places ?FireAza said:I guess we could settle for half and call it a "genrium"?OniaPL said:
Thanks, glad to hear you're open-minded!MPerce said:
Just curious, do you consider yourself a "fan" or are you more casual? I mean, I know I love really niche anime, but if you consider yourself a "fan" and you don't know half of the anime I mentioned... Well, I'm pretty far down the rabbit holeJestertrance said:
I have tried pitching stuff to The Escapist before, but I never thought of ANN... Though, this article would be preaching to the choir for themSandytimeman said:
OH GOD I LOVE SHAFT SO HARD. Wait, that sounded kind homoerotic... Anyway, I love studio SHAFT's work so much, while other studios are content to do what's been done before, SHAFT is all "you know what? The hell with it, we're doing something new!" and they continue to do so in everything they work on. I'll even watch series based on eroge if SHAFT worked on it.Sandytimeman said:
Just as a general question for you guys, how many of you were able to read my OP in it's entirety? I know it's long, but I'm curious if I was able to hold your attention all the way though, and why. Thanks!
Eh, I knew all this already. But very impressive post, especially with someone of your post count, i'm impressed. Very nice read! 
no, its Zeta, not seen ZZ yet.Owyn_Merrilin said:
the reason i hated Zeta is the same reason i hated Destiny (mostly, the other problem with Destiny was it was Seed all over again)
the whiny little prick the spent to much time focused on, in Destiny it was that whiny loser Shinn Asuka.
and Zeta had Kamille Bidan.
what sucks is that Zeta had more going for it, a squeal with out feeling like a rehash, but Kamille didn't have a character arc, he started off, a jerk, and ended an unlikeable jerk that got what he deserved imo, not to mention nothing he did seemed to matter to much. yay he designed the Zeta Gundam, yay, he stole the MK2s (for pretty much no real reason as i recall) I mean Char fuck-mothering Aznable was around, so was Amuro, (didn't really like him much in the original series, but he got better as time went on) why couldn't have been about them instead, they where way more interesting. (plus, would have be awesome seeing Char and Amuro fighting back to back)
but that pretty much the reason, Kamille fucked it up for me :/
and what was wrong with Seed? Destiny should be deleted from existence no argument there, but Seed it self was pretty good and the characters had an actual arc, beliefs called into question, sides switched, (i don't remember anybody swapping sides part way through in any of the others i've seen) which is kinda rare in the series as a whole. yeah it was the G1 Gundams story basically, but that was hardly a deal breaker for me
Wing, Seed, 8Th, War in the Pocket, Star Dust Memory, Char's Counter Attack, 00, G, X, Zeta, Destiny
Because those ignorant people have something called a vote, and votes make laws...rob_simple said:
A nice example of a discussion that was over before it even began. Well said.SmashLovesTitanQuest said:
As for the original post's inquiry about whether it was able to hold my attention throughout: No. We're all biased, sure, but you could at least try to be objective. You're making yourself out to be an authority and that you're educated the unwashed masses, but you're really just a fan criticizing people who aren't. I hate to break it to you, but people who don't like a given thing aren't immediately hateful maniacs who desire nothing more than the death of all that's different from what they're accustomed to. Your thoughts, while having good intentions, I'm sure, are presented as being ridiculously arrogant.
...Which has fuck all to do with someone not watching a television show. Horrendous analogy.A Shadows Age said:
Okay, I can understand that. It didn't bug me as much (for the same reason Amuro didn't; Amuro started out whiny, but eventually realized he had to do what he had to do. Kamille seemed to be getting better at the point I stopped watching), but then I got through most of the first season before college suddenly got a lot harder and I no longer had time to watch much TV, so I guess it's possible that it got worse again. As for Seed: I dunno. It just didn't click with me. The problem may have been that I was watching the dubbed version on Toonami, though[footnote]Seriously, has there even been a single good dub since Cowboy Bebop? There's a lot of well dubbed stuff from the 80's and 90's, but you can tell the voice actors are just looking for a paycheck in most of the recent series. Zeta< Gundam is a good example of that, actually. If the dub were any good at all, I'd watch it just because it's in 5.1 and the original track is in mono, but the voices are so horrendously bad it's not worth it -- which is sad, because Mobile Suit Gundam actually had a very good dub.[/footnote].Kitsuna10060 said:no, its Zeta, not seen ZZ yet.Owyn_Merrilin said:
the reason i hated Zeta is the same reason i hated Destiny (mostly, the other problem with Destiny was it was Seed all over again)
the whiny little prick the spent to much time focused on, in Destiny it was that whiny loser Shinn Asuka.
and Zeta had Kamille Bidan.
what sucks is that Zeta had more going for it, a squeal with out feeling like a rehash, but Kamille didn't have a character arc, he started off, a jerk, and ended an unlikeable jerk that got what he deserved imo, not to mention nothing he did seemed to matter to much. yay he designed the Zeta Gundam, yay, he stole the MK2s (for pretty much no real reason as i recall) I mean Char fuck-mothering Aznable was around, so was Amuro, (didn't really like him much in the original series, but he got better as time went on) why couldn't have been about them instead, they where way more interesting. (plus, would have be awesome seeing Char and Amuro fighting back to back)
for instance
but that pretty much the reason, Kamille fucked it up for me :/
and what was wrong with Seed? Destiny should be deleted from existence no argument there, but Seed it self was pretty good and the characters had an actual arc, beliefs called into question, sides switched, (i don't remember anybody swapping sides part way through in any of the others i've seen) which is kinda rare in the series as a whole. yeah it was the G1 Gundams story basically, but that was hardly a deal breaker for me
Wing, Seed, 8Th, War in the Pocket, Star Dust Memory, Char's Counter Attack, 00, G, X, Zeta, Destiny
Also, you win points for having seen 0080. That show embodies one of my favorite things about Gundam: it's a story about two sides going to war, with each side having a pretty good reason to believe they're in the right. There's good and bad people on both sides, and it's rare that one side or the other is truly evil.
I like some anime, and chose orders to japan, and after being here for a while, i'd say everything that OP has said is somewhat true. But he has a misconception about why people don't like it. People don't like anime because they don't like it's fans, rabid weaboos who want so desperately to be a part of a culture they truthfully know nothing about. They feel the need to defend it as some sort of higher art form of a superior culture, and while the point can be made for some of them, most anime is in fact complete and utter tripe. The central conceit of what i'm trying to say then, is that like any kind of niche things it's the fans that push people away from a particular thing. Whether that be football, WH40k or anime, nobody likes somebody who acts like a complete tool about the thing they love. People tend to assign guilt by association, so they think to themselves, "boy what a goddamn loser that guy is" so they won't have any kind of interest in whatever it is you might, simply because they associate it with you and people like you no matter how good the particular thing you love so dearly may actually be.
I just came here to say that what they were eating in the picture of Princess Jellyfish is a very, very nice snack. I don't want to comment on anime, sorry, because I'm more of a manga guy. An interesting read though, I'm sure I'll understand it much better later in my life.
more a reply to thisOwyn_Merrilin said:
"Seriously, has there even been a single good dub since Cowpony Bebop? There's a lot of well dubbed stuff from the 80's and 90's, but you can tell the voice actors are just looking for a paycheck in most of the recent series. Zeta< Gundam is a good example of that, actually. If the dub were any good at all, I'd watch it just because it's in 5.1 and the original track is in mono, but the voices are so horrendously bad it's not worth it -- which is sad, because Mobile Suit Gundam actually had a very good dub."
in my experience, Bandia had always done a good job with their dub work, so it didn't bother me to much, it is kinda dodgy in spots in Seed though I'll give you that. to bad Bandia's gone now :/
as for 0080, sir i have made it a POINT to see every Gundam to cross over to our shores (and in the case of X, hunting down a funsab), Gundam Wing blew my mind when i first saw it. Gundam is what got me into anime, so i try to keep an eye out for it.
but your right, it's a really good cross section of Gundam on the whole, the 'gray area' is front and center in that one. the ending was a nice 'twist of the dagger' to i thought, it really was a pretty sad ending for all the main cast, lest the female fedi pilot got off easy with think she was just stood up :/
Sorry, dude. You haven't brought up anything I haven't heard dozens of times in the past ten years about why anime is so unique and diverse and deserves everyone's admiration and respect. Only maybe one of those images you posted in the thread doesn't look absolutely retarded and artistically ugly to me. I honestly doubt I'm the target audience for any of that stuff. The aesthetics and storytelling styles are so far from what appeals to me, I just have no interest in watching it. Cartoons in general and Japanese entertainment just aren't a big part enough of my life (or part at all) for this to matter at all.