Fallout 3 not a 'proper' Fallout game?
- Thread starter Hotshots
- Start date
Funny, I have the opposite opnion. Oblivion was meh. Haven't played it in forever. Fallout 3 is a lot more interesting.Hotshots said:
Also, I wonder how anyone can think a game with characters (in multiple meanings of the word) such as Dukov, the Mechanist, the AntAgonizer, and Sticky could be said to be taking itself too seriously.
I always thought that the lone wanderer was pretty well written. Maybe because of the interactivity? I dunno.evilneko said:
God I fucking love Dukov... But still four characters in a world of hundreds. Not very impressive. I will say this though, 4 is a massive improvement on oblivion's negative 36 of interesting npcs.
I'd say that's /thread. Super Mutants are not orcs. Ghouls are not zombies, not matter how many Romero references you make. And that isn't what happened to Harold.A-D. said:
Still a good game.
The Gary vault was more disturbing than funny, but it was KINDA funny too in it's absurdity.FalloutJack said:
Fallout 3 is still a proper Fallout game. Yes, it's writing is weaker, but that doesn't make it any less a game in the lineage. Brotherhood of Steel was not a proper game as many have pointed out, as all it retained was a sembleance of the world, and not even much of that.
There is a perfectly fine reason given why the Mutants are more yellow in FO3. And the ghouls are done almost exactly like they were in the previous titles. Ghoul colonies existed, and feral ghouls were always around, just under different names. (Mindless Ghoul in FO, Ghoul Crazies in FO2) As for Harold, I don't mind what they did. I like the concept of Bob growing into a full blown tree around Harold.blindthrall said:
I don't care what color the mutants are, what bothers me is that they're all idiots, without exception. I'd say maybe 3/5 of the mutants from the original game are dumb-dumbs, and some are smarter than normals. Why are DC mutants dumb? Never explained! What is their purpose in the city? Who knows! Just lazy writing resulting in another generic RPG monster race.Jennacide said:
As far as ferals, in 1+2 that was a random encounter you might not even see. In 3, 75% of the ghouls in the game are feral. Ghouls are supposed to make you feel pity or disgust, not just be random shotgun fodder. As far as Harold, at least tell us what he's doing on the other side of the country.
And now for a change from Fallout-fanboys flinging poo at Bethesda: I liked Fallout 3 best, the dark wasteland feeling is brought out further with some mods, and it feels like an actual struggle for survival. Yes, humour can be good every so often, but if I wanted a comedy, I'd watch Two and a Half Men or something. I'm personally glad that Bethesda made Fallout 3, without it, I never would have played any of the other Fallout games, and I would have missed out on a game I consider in the top 5 for my favourite games of all time.
Honestly, canon-obsessed fanboys are my worst enemy, when it comes to releasing my mods. Always wanting to "correct" me on how radiation differs in the "Fallout Universe", and how energy weapons are totally plausible, along with cars powered by mini nuclear reactors. They don't seem to realize that I don't care. Enjoy the game for what it is, not for what you think it should be, down to the last tiny detail, such as what colour super-mutants should be, etc.
Honestly, canon-obsessed fanboys are my worst enemy, when it comes to releasing my mods. Always wanting to "correct" me on how radiation differs in the "Fallout Universe", and how energy weapons are totally plausible, along with cars powered by mini nuclear reactors. They don't seem to realize that I don't care. Enjoy the game for what it is, not for what you think it should be, down to the last tiny detail, such as what colour super-mutants should be, etc.
Fallout 3 has a story that was made to force the player to explore the places they were told not to by NPC's. It works, but it's not great, it's average for most games. Dialogue was crappy, they've gotten better since Oblivion, but it still feels forced, though it is nice to not have to read cramped blurbs of text like the first 2.
It is a good game, but the focus was differant and it was a differant style of gameplay altogether. It was also a differant team, so the approach to many things was going to be differant. Humor was absent for the most part, but the game nailed the bleak, unforgiving landscape they were going for, it really drove home the fact that the world was destroyed, in comparisson the first two games feel like wandering a desert (yeah you were, but it was far to empty).
If you want to see a bad Fallout game look at BOS, or the cancelled Fallout: Extreme...
http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Fallout_Extreme
It is a good game, but the focus was differant and it was a differant style of gameplay altogether. It was also a differant team, so the approach to many things was going to be differant. Humor was absent for the most part, but the game nailed the bleak, unforgiving landscape they were going for, it really drove home the fact that the world was destroyed, in comparisson the first two games feel like wandering a desert (yeah you were, but it was far to empty).
If you want to see a bad Fallout game look at BOS, or the cancelled Fallout: Extreme...
http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Fallout_Extreme
It was a title that tried to reinvigorate it's franchise to bring in new people, so it simplified some of the gameplay mechanics and made sure it wasn't bogged down by too much series canon. After the huge sucess, they made New Vegas, which is practically a handjob for the old fans.
The Super Mutants of Vault 87 were created with a differant strain of the FEV Virus, it has a 99% chance of creating the feral mutants that wander DC. It's all there in the terminals of Vault 87, growth in physical prowess, but degeneration in mental faculties. You did a lazy job of exploring.blindthrall said:
Ferals were always cannon fodder, you couldn't talk to them, they were essentailly zombies without the black magic (actually radiation practilly works like magic in that game). The ones you could talk to envoked mostly pity, you had to be a heartless bigot or learn from one to hate them. And don't give any bull about Fallout 3's normal ghouls envoking niether pity or disgust. Gob, Carol, Michael Masters and even Bessie Lynn could envoke pity in a player, while Roy Phillips, Ahzurkhal, Crowley, Griffin and few others reinforced the idea that ghouls weren't always these poor oppressed souls and could be bastards too. The only ghoul to do that was in Fallout 1 and that guy was Set.
Fallout 3 was a big mistake because it was Bethesda taking a loved series and turning it into whatever the hell they wanted. The original Fallout games were about humanity rebuilding civilisation after they destroyed it because they got greedy and couldn't get along. The Fallout games delved into human nature and how we would react to living in a life where civilisation was gone and now a new one was going to be born out of the ashes of the old world.
Fallout 1 and 2 (to a much lesser extent) both included these aspects. In Fallout 1 the Master was aware that people had caused their own downfall and that as humans we could not properly take care of ourselves, therefore he saw Super Mutants, which he could create, as the next step in human evolution. He wanted to create an army of mutants that would unify the human race and make all of their goals the same so we could live together and be more equal. However, there were many flaws such as people who had been living in the wasteland were not fit for transformation nad became dumb and brutish, whereas more "cleaner" humans became intelligent and strong beings. More imprtantly all female Super Mutants are sterile, which means that eventually the Super Mutant race will no longer be able to continue and they will die out.
Basically, Fallout 1 dealt with getting rid of human?s problems by getting rid of humans themselves.
Now let?s skip to Fallout 3, what was that about? Oh yeah some whiny kid whose Dad goes missing and now he wants to go find him. Then said dad wants to purify the water (which should've mostly cleared by now anyway) to give all the people of the East Coast fresh water, because apparently they don't know how to make wells or filter water like those of the West Coast.
Fallout 3 just didn't have the political or societal messages of the original Fallouts and instead sacrificed that for stupid quests that you only take part in to see what cool loot you will receive. Fallout 3 was filled with stupidity and nonsensical things, such as the Experimental MIRV and Mothership Zeta. Bethesda did away with rebuilding civilisation and decided they would focus more on petty survivors trying hard to create communities where they can survive the harshness of the apocalypse, 200 years after it has happened, made even more pathetic by the existence of the NCR in the West who by that time had made a large republic of more than 300,000 people with a fully working government and military.
Fallout: New Vegas thankfully went back to original messages of Fallout and continued civilisations rebirth with the NCR and Caesar's Legion, a force dedicated to fixing the mistakes of the old world by taking one of the most successful empires in history and getting rid of the negatives of it, mainly the senate and democracy.
Would an empire led by one man's ideals work in the long run? Most likely not.
Would the NCR, who can barely hold onto Hoover Dam and Vegas be able to continue to spread? Not at all if they continue to be lead by inept commanders.
Can Mr House control all of Vegas by himself, or will he eventually turn into the real life Howard Hughes and become obsessed with himself and eventually become cut off from the real? Of course, because it has already happened.
Independent New Vegas? People free to do what they? Yeah, not a chance.
Not to mention New Vegas felt much more like a role-playing game. In Fallout 3 you were forced to be someone who grew up in a Vault, you were told who your mother and father were, you had to be friends with Amata, Butch always hates you, you can?t join the Tunnel Snakes, all of the character have a set personality as to how they like or hate you, your age is pre-determined and you?re forced to love your dad and find him, also you?re forced to join the BoS and you can?t even join the Enclave, yeah sure you can put their FEV into the purifier but it doesn?t really change much. Also there just wasn?t enough choice in how you finish the main quest, you get two choices that barely differ from each other, you should?ve been able to destroy the purifier completely.
In New Vegas, however, you play a person who works for the Mojave Express, delivering a package and then unfortunately get shot in the head. That?s it, that?s all we know, that, and some guy called Ulysses apparently has some history with us and is now looking for the Courier.
________________
Just my two cents.
Fallout 1 and 2 (to a much lesser extent) both included these aspects. In Fallout 1 the Master was aware that people had caused their own downfall and that as humans we could not properly take care of ourselves, therefore he saw Super Mutants, which he could create, as the next step in human evolution. He wanted to create an army of mutants that would unify the human race and make all of their goals the same so we could live together and be more equal. However, there were many flaws such as people who had been living in the wasteland were not fit for transformation nad became dumb and brutish, whereas more "cleaner" humans became intelligent and strong beings. More imprtantly all female Super Mutants are sterile, which means that eventually the Super Mutant race will no longer be able to continue and they will die out.
Basically, Fallout 1 dealt with getting rid of human?s problems by getting rid of humans themselves.
Now let?s skip to Fallout 3, what was that about? Oh yeah some whiny kid whose Dad goes missing and now he wants to go find him. Then said dad wants to purify the water (which should've mostly cleared by now anyway) to give all the people of the East Coast fresh water, because apparently they don't know how to make wells or filter water like those of the West Coast.
Fallout 3 just didn't have the political or societal messages of the original Fallouts and instead sacrificed that for stupid quests that you only take part in to see what cool loot you will receive. Fallout 3 was filled with stupidity and nonsensical things, such as the Experimental MIRV and Mothership Zeta. Bethesda did away with rebuilding civilisation and decided they would focus more on petty survivors trying hard to create communities where they can survive the harshness of the apocalypse, 200 years after it has happened, made even more pathetic by the existence of the NCR in the West who by that time had made a large republic of more than 300,000 people with a fully working government and military.
Fallout: New Vegas thankfully went back to original messages of Fallout and continued civilisations rebirth with the NCR and Caesar's Legion, a force dedicated to fixing the mistakes of the old world by taking one of the most successful empires in history and getting rid of the negatives of it, mainly the senate and democracy.
Would an empire led by one man's ideals work in the long run? Most likely not.
Would the NCR, who can barely hold onto Hoover Dam and Vegas be able to continue to spread? Not at all if they continue to be lead by inept commanders.
Can Mr House control all of Vegas by himself, or will he eventually turn into the real life Howard Hughes and become obsessed with himself and eventually become cut off from the real? Of course, because it has already happened.
Independent New Vegas? People free to do what they? Yeah, not a chance.
Not to mention New Vegas felt much more like a role-playing game. In Fallout 3 you were forced to be someone who grew up in a Vault, you were told who your mother and father were, you had to be friends with Amata, Butch always hates you, you can?t join the Tunnel Snakes, all of the character have a set personality as to how they like or hate you, your age is pre-determined and you?re forced to love your dad and find him, also you?re forced to join the BoS and you can?t even join the Enclave, yeah sure you can put their FEV into the purifier but it doesn?t really change much. Also there just wasn?t enough choice in how you finish the main quest, you get two choices that barely differ from each other, you should?ve been able to destroy the purifier completely.
In New Vegas, however, you play a person who works for the Mojave Express, delivering a package and then unfortunately get shot in the head. That?s it, that?s all we know, that, and some guy called Ulysses apparently has some history with us and is now looking for the Courier.
________________
Just my two cents.
I actually thought the Prototype medic power armor was fucking Fallout style/ace_of_something said:
Listen up you God-damned puke! You are now wearing prototype medic power armor. You take care of me, and I'll take care of you!"'
"Take some Vitamin-M and Get back in the fight you pansy!"
"You're a soldier, not a civie! Have some juice and suck it up!" "Let'em eat lead!"
"Time to kick some ass
Well, I've already said something about humor and the eye of the beholder, but uhh...proper creepy would have to be the Dunwich Building, given that it's a nod and a wink to HP Lovecraft, filled with feral ghouls and a man slowly dehumanizing and going crazy.Jennacide said:
Even still, me likey Three Dog, the comments made by super mutants, Uncle Leo, Harold, and...
...just because I like radio shows. (Red Panda and Blackjack Justice for the win!)