Finer Points Part Three

Encaen

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Finer Points Part Three

Reviewing the concept of Layers for the interaction of continuous effects.

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TechTim

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all this clarification is making my head spin.... or maybe it's the Bourbon
 

vxicepickxv

Slayer of Bothan Spies
Sep 28, 2008
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Most confusing, let's see here...
[mtg_card=Humility] and [mtg_card=Opalescence] with a second Opalescense. Of course, that was before layers were in effect.
 

Zen Toombs

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Encaen said:
I'm not sure if it's just the fact that I'm currently using Internet Explorer (school computer! Don't shoot me!), but it appears that you aren't using the mouseover text the Escapist totally added. If it's just my browser, then just ignore me while I place my pants on my head.

Anyways, thank you for the clarification! I still don't totally understand it though (I hear these things are complicated), and will have to continue to defer to my judge friends when playing EDH.
 

zeekyle

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unless I'm wrong here, you wouldn't be able to cast Turn to Frog on Dungrove Elder because of the hexproof... right?
 

Encaen

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zeekyle said:
unless I'm wrong here, you wouldn't be able to cast Turn to Frog on Dungrove Elder because of the hexproof... right?
Touche! Let's say you cast [mtg_card=Turn to Frog] on their creature and they [mtg_card=Redirect] it instead. :D Good catch!


Zen Toombs said:
Encaen said:
I'm not sure if it's just the fact that I'm currently using Internet Explorer (school computer! Don't shoot me!), but it appears that you aren't using the mouseover text the Escapist totally added. If it's just my browser, then just ignore me while I place my pants on my head.

Anyways, thank you for the clarification! I still don't totally understand it though (I hear these things are complicated), and will have to continue to defer to my judge friends when playing EDH.
That's weird, it's working for me in both IE and FF. I suspect I'd have an angry tech team on my hands if I didn't utilize the mouseover images after they put in all the work to implement them!
 

Zen Toombs

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Encaen said:
That's weird, it's working for me in both IE and FF. I suspect I'd have an angry tech team on my hands if I didn't utilize the mouseover images after they put in all the work to implement them!
*places pants on head*

Anyways, thank the tech team for the mouseover text! Even though it doesn't seem to be working for me at the moment, it was a great addition to the site. ^_^
 

Mike Kayatta

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Hexellent!

Edit: Sorry for the low content post, folks. Sometimes even the staff forgets ... :-D
 

Encaen

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Draconalis said:
Have you been keeping up with the M13 spoilers?
Yessir. I keep an eye on the MTG Salvation Spoiler feed [http://mtgsalvation.com/magic-2013-m13-spoiler.html] once things start getting revealed. I'm really liking the Blue Legend, and the whole cycle of mono-colored legends for that matter. Really excited to see [mtg_card=Nicol Bolas, Planeswalker] in Standard, too!

Also, Exalted is back which makes me happy. I played a Bant Exalted deck for a while with Alara and it was a ton of fun. They've put it into Black now, though, which seems weird.

What about yourself? Anything catch your eye?
 

Draconalis

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Mike Kayatta said:
Hexellent!
Oi! No hypocrisy! Give yourself a warning!

Encaen said:
What about yourself? Anything catch your eye?
Sublime Archangel. That ***** is NUTS! She's a "Gives everything exalted" lord that has exhaled... so by herself she's a 4/3 flyer that attacks for 5 for 4 mana.

I want to make a white beat down that goes like this.

Turn 1 champion of perish
turn 2 shrine of loyal legions
Turn 3 gather the towns folk, insert white one drop here
turn 4 Sublime Archangel
turn 5 gather the towns folk, pop the shrine attacks with the angel for 16 in the air.

If they make a white 1 drop exalted, that's what I would replace champion with... because then she can hit for 17 or 18 if I can get the other one drop to be him too.
 

CounterAttack

A Writer With Many Faces
Dec 25, 2008
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I have a question about [mtg_card=Turn to Frog]... I've always been confused by it. Does the target creature lose all abilities permanently, as indicated by taking a literal approach to the rules text? If not, it should read, "Until end of turn, target creature loses all abilities and becomes a 1/1 blue Frog". The wording makes all the difference, at least to me... =/

zeekyle said:
unless I'm wrong here, you wouldn't be able to cast Turn to Frog on Dungrove Elder because of the hexproof... right?
You can cast it on your own Dungrove Elder because hexproof only applies to spells and abilities that your opponents control. If Turn to Frog is a spell you cast yourself, the Elder will be affected normally.
 

Encaen

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CounterAttack said:
I have a question about [mtg_card=Turn to Frog]... I've always been confused by it. Does the target creature lose all abilities permanently, as indicated by taking a literal approach to the rules text? If not, it should read, "Until end of turn, target creature loses all abilities and becomes a 1/1 blue Frog". The wording makes all the difference, at least to me... =/

zeekyle said:
unless I'm wrong here, you wouldn't be able to cast Turn to Frog on Dungrove Elder because of the hexproof... right?
You can cast it on your own Dungrove Elder because hexproof only applies to spells and abilities that your opponents control. If Turn to Frog is a spell you cast yourself, the Elder will be affected normally.
As to the Dungrove, I edited that after [user]zeekyle[/user] pointed out the error. :) The original had the Opponent targeting the Dungrove, which is bad.

As to [mtg_card=Turn to Frog], the entire effect lasts until End of Turn. Grammatically speaking, you may be correct but the intent certainly seems to be simply applying the whole of the spell's effect until EOT.

Draconalis said:
Sublime Archangel. That ***** is NUTS! She's a "Gives everything exalted" lord that has exhaled... so by herself she's a 4/3 flyer that attacks for 5 for 4 mana.

I want to make a white beat down that goes like this.

Turn 1 champion of perish
turn 2 shrine of loyal legions
Turn 3 gather the towns folk, insert white one drop here
turn 4 Sublime Archangel
turn 5 gather the towns folk, pop the shrine attacks with the angel for 16 in the air.

If they make a white 1 drop exalted, that's what I would replace champion with... because then she can hit for 17 or 18 if I can get the other one drop to be him too.
Yes! I'd love to see an Exalted 1-drop for this set, maybe they'll reprint [mtg_card=Akrasan Squire]! A token strategy with Sublime Archangel definitely seems like the way to go. [mtg_card=Increasing Devotion] on turn 5 seems pretty good here as well.
 

Draconalis

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Encaen said:
Yes! I'd love to see an Exalted 1-drop for this set, maybe they'll reprint [mtg_card=Akrasan Squire]! A token strategy with Sublime Archangel definitely seems like the way to go. [mtg_card=Increasing Devotion] on turn 5 seems pretty good here as well.
You wouldn't have the mana to pop the shrine, which by that point would have 6 charge counters on it making 6 Myrs. For max bang for your buck, the shrine is the way to go. Increasing Devotion might be a decent mid game plan though for instant buffs later, or an alternative when Scars drops.
 

Eleuthera

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Sep 11, 2008
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I always (well mostly) enjoy reading these articles, but every time they make me want to play magic again less. Either we never bothered with rules back in '97, or things were much simpler.
 

Slycne

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Feb 19, 2006
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Draconalis said:
She isn't legendary either, so you drop another and your power doubles.

Odric, Master Tactician is also looking really good for my white deck.
 

Skarlette

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Just when I think I'm coming to terms with the rules of Magic, I learn about something like this and that notion flies right out the window.

Excuse me while I go try and work this out. *insert brain pain here*

Actually, that's not true; you explain the concept VERY well, I just don't know HOW I'm going to remember this come game time. Anyone found an easy mnemonic or something?
 

Farthing

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Ring of Kalonia is close to a reprint of rancor/loxodon warhammer. Of all the rings, probably most worth running outside its color. Hello Exalted.

Speaking of which. Exalted in black. I believe that's a new one.
 

Draconalis

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Slycne said:
She isn't legendary either, so you drop another and your power doubles.

Odric, Master Tactician is also looking really good for my white deck.
Oh believe me... that little fact did not elude me :D

I like Odric... but he seems better for white and green decks that can be more tricksie

Case in point, you can get deathtouch in green.