Finn Jones cast as Iron Fist, people inexplicably take offence to his race

[Zontar]

Casting: http://www.ew.com/article/2016/02/25/finn-jones-iron-fist

Offence: https://twitter.com/skrishna/status/702944933284593664 (EDIT: the status has been changes from public to private)
EDIT II: found an archive to the tweet: https://archive.is/Nb5hN)
https://archive.is/aU3L1

So it seems Finn Jones has been cast as Iron Fist after quite a bit of time of us all wondering who would get the gig. I personally like it, the actor has shown he can pull it off and he'd got the appearance the role requires for the in-between of John Everyman and Kong Fu master the role would logically require.

However, in an act I can only call race based stereotyping (because if we're being honest that is the entire logic behind it) people are genuinely taking offence to the fact that a white character in the comics is being played by a white man in television. Because apparently only Asians can learn Kong Fu and segregating our society on cultural lines is good in their minds.

If someone can find a rational explanation for why casting a white guy for the role of a fictional character who not only is white but had his race be a part of his story, I'd like to hear it, because no one I've seen has yet stated one good reason outside of tokenism based on stereotypes.

 

[Zhukov]

*reads*

It would seem they are opposed to what they call "the white saviour story", AKA Mighty Whitey. Y'know, where the white guy hero goes off to some exotic culture, learns their ways and promptly becomes the best ever at those ways. Maybe saves them using his white person power for bonus points.

So think Avatar with Asians instead of blue alien cat people.

I have no idea if "Iron Fist" was or will be that kind of story.

Also, representation, diversity, "wouldn't it be nice" etc etc.

Fortunately I have no stake in the casting of some Marvel Netflix crap. Imma sit this one out.

Have fun folks!

 

[WolfThomas]

A better discussion can be found here:
http://comicsalliance.com/iron-fist-asian-american-or-white-savior/

Iron Fist plays to unfortunately outdated White Savior tropes. But is a great character. There are practically no Asian characters in the marvel universe (Hogun, A Howling Commanda, Wong in Dr Strange), people think that making Iron Fist an Asian-American (important not just Asian) would dispell those problematic features and give us a prominent Asian Superhero.

Edit: Marvel Cinematic Universe.

 

[Zontar]

"people"

Okay, while I was away did the meaning of the word "people" change? Because as it stands it appears to be one person. Person, as in one. Before we make threads about people making arses out of themselves on Twitter could we first make sure that at least its actually "people" and not "person" first?

And maybe before going on a short rant about singular and plural you can actually look at the comment to see if there's any agreement, and thus support from other people.

The comment has now been made private and unfortunately I didn't archive it, but it had a triple digit level of retweets and likes, which implies a triple digit number of people agreeing with it, thus making it "people" not "person". Even if we assume all the retweets are stating how crazy the person is, the likes are a much harder thing to explain.

Whitewashing has been discussed on this forum at least a dozen times in the past year.

You can't whitewash what's already white. This is literally by definition impossible to be used as an explanation for what's going on. This is just as stupid as people complaining about the new Spider-Man being white instead of black.

 

[WolfThomas]

I'm really indifferent either way. I like faithful adaptions but also most older superheros are white straight males. Often blonde (because of the limited ink options). You put Captain American, Hawkeye, Quasar and Hank Pym in a room in civilian attire and it's difficult to tell them apart.

I think Race should only be rigidly adhered to when it is an important part of their character/origin/story. Steve Rogers is white because America wouldn't have an official Captain America who was black in the 1930s (There was Isiah Bradley of course on the side though). Likewise Superman who grew up being treated with racism in the midwest might be less optimistic. Black Panther is King of an African Nation, Luke Cage grew up in harlem etc.

Spider-man on the other hand could be anyone. Miles Morales is for all intents and purposes Peter Parker 2.0.

Edit: A progressive casting movie is Jason Momoa as Aquaman. If anything making Aquaman ethnically Hawaiian enhances his characters.

If someone can find a rational explanation for why casting a white guy for the role of a fictional character who not only is white but had his race be a part of his story, I'd like to hear it, because no one I've seen has yet stated one good reason outside of tokenism based on stereotypes.

Technically being an outsider is part of his story. An Asian-American who spoke only English would be an outsider in the Immortal Cities.

 

[Kenbo Slice]

A better discussion can be found here:
http://comicsalliance.com/iron-fist-asian-american-or-white-savior/

Iron Fist plays to unfortunately outdated White Savior tropes. But is a great character. There are practically no Asian characters in the marvel universe (Hogun, A Howling Commanda, Wong in Dr Strange), people think that making Iron Fist an Asian-American (important not just Asian) would dispell those problematic features and give us a prominent Asian Superhero.

You're forgetting Shang Chi.

OT: People are dumb, and need to get over it.

 

[Fappy]

I was kind of hoping they'd make him Asian simply because we don't have any asian heroes in the MCU yet, but whateves. Danny Rand is an awesome character and I like the guy they picked for him.

 

[Parasondox]

Have we gone full circle now in terms of "outrage"? "White guy is playing a white character"...

...

...

... I'm getting too old to keep up with internet rage and internet controversies anymore.

 

[WolfThomas]

A better discussion can be found here:
http://comicsalliance.com/iron-fist-asian-american-or-white-savior/

Iron Fist plays to unfortunately outdated White Savior tropes. But is a great character. There are practically no Asian characters in the marvel universe (Hogun, A Howling Commanda, Wong in Dr Strange), people think that making Iron Fist an Asian-American (important not just Asian) would dispell those problematic features and give us a prominent Asian Superhero.

You're forgetting Shang Chi.

I'm sorry I'm not forgetting Shang Chi. I meant Marvel Cinematic Universe. Of which he hasn't appeared in.

And Shang Chi was born and raised in China and is ethnically Chinese. Different to what they were often suggesting which is an Asian-American. Something 2nd or 3rd generation immersed in American Culture.

 

[Something Amyss]

Same tempest, different teacup?

I have no idea if "Iron Fist" was or will be that kind of story.

It kinda is. And I know you said you don't care, but I just wanted to point out that I'm not horribly bothered if it makes it into the Netflix series. I mean, Netflix already has two SJW-fueled series, one that preaches the superiority of the disabled and one that makes a woman into a Mary Sue with no flaws who villifies all white men, something something cuckoldry, so why not give the white dudes this one?

I'm being facetious, mind. However, those were real histrionics I was playing off of.
]
Though I will say that as with most cliches and tropes, the problem isn't with any one instance. It's how common white saviours are.

"people"

Okay, while I was away did the meaning of the word "people" change? Because as it stands it appears to be one person. Person, as in one. Before we make threads about people making arses out of themselves on Twitter could we first make sure that at least its actually "people" and not "person" first?

Well, if we say "person," it correctly makes it sound like there are more people offended by this person than there are people offended by Iron Fist.

Now, if you'll excuse me, I have to go write lengthy blog entries about that black girl playing Hermione, how Rue was made black for the movies, and why the Human Torch being black is still the big tragedy of Fant4stic. Oh, and about how SJWs always blow things out of proportion.

 

[WolfThomas]

Wow, anti-white racists really have been busy in film haven't they? First the outrage that the oscars are awarded for acting and directing merits instead of based on race, now this... Also, while I realise that to the kind of racists who raise this as a serious issue, "Asia" is just a big homogenous blob where every person inside it is the same, but treating 'asian' as a race or ethnic group really annoys me.

Either name people by where their ancestors are from or by where they live now, but this idea that "Europ", Africa and Asia are countries and everybody from there is the same group, needs to stop. Beat them over the head with a globe or something, I don't know, but make it stop.

The frequent suggestion before this announcement was an "Asian-American" rather than "Asian" which you know is also problematic but used in a way like "African American" is commonly.

 

[inmunitas]

"people"

Okay, while I was away did the meaning of the word "people" change? Because as it stands it appears to be one person. Person, as in one. Before we make threads about people making arses out of themselves on Twitter could we first make sure that at least its actually "people" and not "person" first?

Ssssh, don't interrupt the circlejerk. People need to look for things to get offended about and nothing sets this forum off more than a post about poor persecuted white people.

Anyway OP your 3rd link was archived but the actual website link is still working, so I fixed it for you here so you can replace it in your OP: Working Link [http://thenerdsofcolor.org/2014/03/11/marvel-please-cast-an-asian-american-iron-fist/].

Reading it, it seems very tame. There actually doesn't seem to be anything I'd even describe as outrage there, it's just a guy talking about why he thinks Iron Fist should be changed to Asian and it's basically just because it'd be another "white saviour story" like Zhukov said.

How would changing the character to Russian not be "just another white saviour story"?

 

[inmunitas]

How would changing the character to Russian not be "just another white saviour story"?

If you wanted to play off technicalities and pretend you don't know we're talking about ethnicity then you're going to have a hard time choosing a country where 77% of the population, its seat of government and its capital, are in Europe.

I will play that game with you if you want though.

Asia is a continent of which Russia is the largest country, that's not exactly a small detail.

 

[StreamerDarkly]

Ssssh, don't interrupt the circlejerk. People need to look for things to get offended about and nothing sets this forum off more than a post about poor persecuted white people.

Anyway OP your 3rd link was archived but the actual website link is still working, so I fixed it for you here so you can replace it in your OP: Working Link [http://thenerdsofcolor.org/2014/03/11/marvel-please-cast-an-asian-american-iron-fist/].

Reading it, it seems very tame. There actually doesn't seem to be anything I'd even describe as outrage there, it's just a guy talking about why he thinks Iron Fist should be changed to Asian and it's basically just because it'd be another "white saviour story" like Zhukov said.

Original poster has clarified that the tweet in question received a significant number of likes and retweets. There's also an ongoing petition with ~4000 signatures started on another site to try to bully Marvel into casting an Asian-American actor. So yeah, it's fair to say that this on the radar of quite a few people.

As for your "circlejerk" comment, I've noticed a pattern in a lot of these threads where a certain clique posts in rapid succession on the first page, ostensibly trying to "correct" the misconceptions in a thread topic they don't like, but in practice just making lame jokes among themselves while hilariously accusing some nebulous third party of circle jerking. It's irritating.

On the topic at hand, what's problematic here is how the author starts with an assumption that Marvel really ought to cater to his sense of social justice by discriminating against whitey instead of choosing who they believe is the best actor for the job, and then tries to shoehorn an argument to support it. When you start with a conclusion that "this character should be a minority because I said so", there's a clear agenda there and it becomes difficult to take the rationalizations seriously. No surprise that an online petition is now being endorsed by the author as a means to shame Marvel.