Forever Alone (And Why Therapy Doesn't Seem to Get It)
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OP, don't fear the lonliness, embrace it, it will make you a more compitent and capable person. or get yourself two bottles of whiskey and 12 guage and see what happens from there. other than that, just stop giving a damn, life is so much better when you stop caring about others think
If you refuse to answer questions that your therapist asks you, how exactly do you expect them to be able to help?
Concerning you and the opposite gender:
Could you narrow down the reasons, why you prefer anime women to real ones?
Is it:
a, just the looks. Smooth skin, nice dresses etc?
b, the behaviour? Extroverted, tough women to compensate for social passiveness?
or c, just the fact that the encounter with anime women is determinable, so there's no need for smalltalk, no risk of awkward situations etc?
You need not answer this question in public, a little self-reflexion can be helpful, as long as you don't get self-conscious.
General advice:
Try to make contact with other students at your college studying the same subject. This gives you a reason to talk to them without revealing that you are looking for friends. Also it's in an environment more comfortable for you than a party and you will have something to talk about considering you don't like smalltalk.
Most likely there are other people like you around. The hard thing is to find them, as they might be as introverted as you are, so you don't perceive them very well.
Could you narrow down the reasons, why you prefer anime women to real ones?
Is it:
a, just the looks. Smooth skin, nice dresses etc?
b, the behaviour? Extroverted, tough women to compensate for social passiveness?
or c, just the fact that the encounter with anime women is determinable, so there's no need for smalltalk, no risk of awkward situations etc?
You need not answer this question in public, a little self-reflexion can be helpful, as long as you don't get self-conscious.
General advice:
Try to make contact with other students at your college studying the same subject. This gives you a reason to talk to them without revealing that you are looking for friends. Also it's in an environment more comfortable for you than a party and you will have something to talk about considering you don't like smalltalk.
Most likely there are other people like you around. The hard thing is to find them, as they might be as introverted as you are, so you don't perceive them very well.
Is there an all of the above option?Timotheus said:
That is....absolutely terrible advice.Weskerbot3000 said:
No I don't.jadias said:
At the end of the day, you just have to live your life according to what feels right. A therapist is only going to help so much. Finding an outlet might help, such as drawing, painting, or building. I heard somewhere that journal/diary keeping is one of the most beneficial ways to reduce stress and negative feelings. That might help.
As a graduate of a Psychology Department, I have to say that, from the information you've given out, the therapist you went to was not professional enough to help you; that combined with your general defensive attitude made the therapy fail. From what you've described, I'm pretty sure she was a psychoanalysist (someone who specializes in psychoanalysis). Don't think about it and say "it was my fault", but rather "it simply didn't work, best to move on".
I strongly recommend starting therapy again, however this time try cognitive therapy or behaviorism (it's a bit difficult to translate these in english from my native language, but give me a private message if you need more advice).
Let me make one thing perfectly clear: when it comes to the human mind, nobody is healthy. There is no "good" or "bad" way of growing up, there are just circumstances that appear and resources witch one has to solve them or get past them.
What you're going through now is not that major and actually quite common in modern days. The trick is to get past it before it can majorly affect your life.
I strongly recommend starting therapy again, however this time try cognitive therapy or behaviorism (it's a bit difficult to translate these in english from my native language, but give me a private message if you need more advice).
Let me make one thing perfectly clear: when it comes to the human mind, nobody is healthy. There is no "good" or "bad" way of growing up, there are just circumstances that appear and resources witch one has to solve them or get past them.
What you're going through now is not that major and actually quite common in modern days. The trick is to get past it before it can majorly affect your life.
I don't read the words "it's been proven" in any of that dialogue, and I have already cited my sources in previous posts.Elcarsh said:
And btw I was responding to a comment, not trying to say that there is any problem with agreeing with me. Please don't take what I say out of context. The conversations go much faster when I don't have to type extra dialogue to say the obvious.
Ammokid, forgetting all of your very flawed arguments and very biased opinion, I'm still waiting for a reliable, unbiased and peer-reviewed study that shows porn is 're-wiring' anyone's brain.
Until anyone produces that, we're lust waxing lyrical on our different views. I'm very, very happy for you and your non-porn-watching life. Just please, don't claim science when you mean 'biased religious book'. Some of us are like, scientists with degrees in this stuff.
Until anyone produces that, we're lust waxing lyrical on our different views. I'm very, very happy for you and your non-porn-watching life. Just please, don't claim science when you mean 'biased religious book'. Some of us are like, scientists with degrees in this stuff.
AMMO Kid said:
AMMO Kid said:
AMMO Kid said:
The vast majority of your post is opinion, but these are statements of fact and I'll be needing proof. Please point me to these studies. Even just the abstract if you cant get access to any trade journals. Hell, their references will do and I'll find them. I'd honestly like to read them.AMMO Kid said:
Well, I don't think your attitude is weird, unless you assess real women with these standards. All three aspects are not essential, because indirectly you just want the contact to women to be simplified and eased for you.Paragon Fury said:
Just stay calm and natural in social interaction with them. If you fit together, you will appreciate a woman's personality traits. Also be willing to make the first move, if you feel like it is time for it.
Depending on how you look at it, either these are the same, or the latter is something like a nurse practitioner-- or my experience with therapists and prescription medication has been very unusual.Paragon Fury said:
Oh hi, are you new here?Paragon Fury said:
This sounds like a real therapy-type issue.Paragon Fury said:
You should get over yourself-- there are people of all genders and persuasions who look worse than you, and plenty of women honestly don't care about looks.Paragon Fury said:
Sounds pretty much like a typical therapist, but you should consider that she might have been trying to make a different point than you thought.Paragon Fury said:The therapist asked if I still had regular dreams/desires about women and such, and though I didn't really want to go into detail about them, I did at least describe some of the women that occur in them frequently. I'll save you my long wordy description, and instead say that the most common one looks like a combination of these two women:
See, pretty pictures. Just like I promised.
Tsukimi - Sekirei
Yoko - Gurren Lagann
Though I don't exactly remember what the therapist said, it was something along the lines of "unrealistic and deficient ideas about women causing issues with normal socialization". I do remember getting into a fairly long debate about reality vs. fantasy and their affects on each other with her, though it didn't really get anywhere.
Again, time to get over yourself-- if you live long enough, keep yourself open, and keep a positive view of it, you'll find someone-- it may take some effort and they might not be "the one", but I can almost guarantee you'll find someone that you can at least be comfortable around and take solace in.Paragon Fury said:
The part about life sucking deserves some elaboration, specifically the kind that involves starving children, cancer patients and the like-- not to tell you how your life doesn't suck, but to remind or inform you that it always sucked and probably will as long as we're bound to this thing we call human life. There are four options once you know this: deny it, forget about it, find a way to live with it, or kill yourself. I've contemplated each and tried the first three, probably only having limited success with #2 (forget about it) because I have a bad memory-- I've had the most success with #3 (deal with it).
The whiskey + shotgun part, probably, but if you can be happy without a significant other you should go for it-- I think you should be ready for someone to come along that you'd like in that way and that much, but if you really feel you don't need them, that's OK.Paragon Fury said:
Speaking as someone who Asperger's himself (diagnosed about three years ago) and has spent a good amount of the last three days reading academic papers on the autistic spectrum (for a college paper), there's a pretty good chance you do. People say it's not serious (or even not real) and there are people that use it as an excuse and other things, but if you never get help for it it can really mess you up-- even just knowing what it is can make it that much easier to adjust your thoughts and actions so you don't clash as much with people.Paragon Fury said:
I know what Asperger's is. The only defining trait/symptom I share with someone who has Asperger's is lack of "normal" social ability. I don't have any of the other traits/symptoms, like inappropriate affect, for example.
There will always be some shizzle that we won't understand about other people. Whether that's your problem or their problem is down to you. It's difficult because if you don't build your interpersonal skills when you're younger, it's harder to do it when you're in your late teens or adulthood.
Talking helps figure out who you are, what you know, and how to help you as a person. You have to figure out what you want to get from seeing your therapist, tell them, and make sure they do what they can to help you achieve that. Do you want to think of normal girls as pretty? Do you want to be attracted to the girls from your college? Do you just want to fit in?
You are not alone. You may feel lonely, but that's different. Everyone struggles with connecting to people, and figuring out what they want from them. It's a part of growing up, and discovering who you are. Not everyone finds girls sexually attractive. Not everyone is out to hurt you or beat you up (despite how much this has happened in the past).
Well done for getting help, anyways
I hope everything works out okay! Hang out at comic-cons and expos and stuff to meet people with similar interests. Find a girl who you think in time you might call her a friend. Friends are better anyhow, but you don't always know who exactly is your friend straight off the bat.
[Insert concluding statement with a heart-warming tone]
Good luck
Talking helps figure out who you are, what you know, and how to help you as a person. You have to figure out what you want to get from seeing your therapist, tell them, and make sure they do what they can to help you achieve that. Do you want to think of normal girls as pretty? Do you want to be attracted to the girls from your college? Do you just want to fit in?
You are not alone. You may feel lonely, but that's different. Everyone struggles with connecting to people, and figuring out what they want from them. It's a part of growing up, and discovering who you are. Not everyone finds girls sexually attractive. Not everyone is out to hurt you or beat you up (despite how much this has happened in the past).
Well done for getting help, anyways
I hope everything works out okay! Hang out at comic-cons and expos and stuff to meet people with similar interests. Find a girl who you think in time you might call her a friend. Friends are better anyhow, but you don't always know who exactly is your friend straight off the bat.[Insert concluding statement with a heart-warming tone]
Good luck
Perhaps you give off the desperate and angry at the world vibe which may keep others at bay. Many self equated nice guys tend to end up looking clingy and desperate due to low self esteem. Also there is an attitude of being better than everyone else which is probably a self defense mechanism (maybe the game club things wasn't about you winning all the time but people thinking not a good sport). Also the focus on anime is probably you trying to save yourself from potential hurt of interacting with others. I don't mean to sound like I'm being antagonistic, because in some ways we are similar (I'm the girl version).
I've moved around so much growing up and being transgender, I had a hard time making friends and dealt with a lot of bullying even from some teachers. I was terrified of speaking in front of ten people, but I worked through that by doing things that put me in front of crowds (was a ddr tournament player in high school, played piano at my dorms lounge area, was on a cast for a college vagina memoir like event in front of over a hundred people and cameras). Learning to not care what others may think is a big step. I'm now teaching English in Asia which is something I would never have been able to do if I didn't realize that you need to step out of your comfort zone to expand it.
I also (still working on this) need to improve my self esteem because I was a lot like shinji keeping others away and miring in my self pity. My first reaction to a compliment is to say something horrible about myself. This reinforces the belief which then becomes my reality. So if your self worth is low then it makes it harder to meet others, because you are a) driving people off b)may even sabotage something good unknowingly to preserve the familiar depressive norm c)predict only bad so never even try d)not notice opportunities.
Someone earlier mentioned quirks and interesting traits are important to set yourself apart and to just celebrate those quirks. I only had one non net relationship prior to finishing college and that was in 8th grade. Now I have a caring bf of 3 years (even nerd girls struggling with being lonely). He, previous gfs (I'm bi), and friends crushing on me adore me for all my odd little quirks and mannerisms because I don't try to curtail myself to be like everyone else.
It might help to find a therapist you connect with. Though it requires work on your part. I can explain in detail the workings of cbt therapy, but doesn't matter if it's not put into practice. It took my a long time to find one, but it helped immensely. A few other things that might help. This might sound silly but try dating websites (how I met my bf) or making female friends online maybe through games to get you comfortable to talk to girls. Drink water if you usually don't... lol I know sounds silly but some of my life long depression and anxiety is connected to never drinking water and relying on caffeine which is an endless cycle of crashes that are connected to mood disorders.
My post seems to focus a lot on personal improvement.. and you know what? That's the key. Focusing on getting a gf will only have the opposite effect. If you feel confident about youself, be passionate about a particular hobby esp one that revolves around self expression/creation then it attracts people. Also you will need to do stuff that feels out of your safety zone and thus uncomfortable/unnatural like talk to people more especially girls, go to events/places with a friend (doesn't need to be a bar, maybe check out a ren fair those are pretty cool^^).
I've moved around so much growing up and being transgender, I had a hard time making friends and dealt with a lot of bullying even from some teachers. I was terrified of speaking in front of ten people, but I worked through that by doing things that put me in front of crowds (was a ddr tournament player in high school, played piano at my dorms lounge area, was on a cast for a college vagina memoir like event in front of over a hundred people and cameras). Learning to not care what others may think is a big step. I'm now teaching English in Asia which is something I would never have been able to do if I didn't realize that you need to step out of your comfort zone to expand it.
I also (still working on this) need to improve my self esteem because I was a lot like shinji keeping others away and miring in my self pity. My first reaction to a compliment is to say something horrible about myself. This reinforces the belief which then becomes my reality. So if your self worth is low then it makes it harder to meet others, because you are a) driving people off b)may even sabotage something good unknowingly to preserve the familiar depressive norm c)predict only bad so never even try d)not notice opportunities.
Someone earlier mentioned quirks and interesting traits are important to set yourself apart and to just celebrate those quirks. I only had one non net relationship prior to finishing college and that was in 8th grade. Now I have a caring bf of 3 years (even nerd girls struggling with being lonely). He, previous gfs (I'm bi), and friends crushing on me adore me for all my odd little quirks and mannerisms because I don't try to curtail myself to be like everyone else.
It might help to find a therapist you connect with. Though it requires work on your part. I can explain in detail the workings of cbt therapy, but doesn't matter if it's not put into practice. It took my a long time to find one, but it helped immensely. A few other things that might help. This might sound silly but try dating websites (how I met my bf) or making female friends online maybe through games to get you comfortable to talk to girls. Drink water if you usually don't... lol I know sounds silly but some of my life long depression and anxiety is connected to never drinking water and relying on caffeine which is an endless cycle of crashes that are connected to mood disorders.
My post seems to focus a lot on personal improvement.. and you know what? That's the key. Focusing on getting a gf will only have the opposite effect. If you feel confident about youself, be passionate about a particular hobby esp one that revolves around self expression/creation then it attracts people. Also you will need to do stuff that feels out of your safety zone and thus uncomfortable/unnatural like talk to people more especially girls, go to events/places with a friend (doesn't need to be a bar, maybe check out a ren fair those are pretty cool^^).
Yeah. I used to have some pretty nerdy pastimes and was probably in a similar boat with women etc.
I still have my nerdy pastimes but I am getting married this autumn and am so much less messed up than I was in my 20's. I suppose at some point I would have thought something similar which is why I am posting.
First thing I'll say is it's premature to think of yourself as "forever" anything at this point. Life is really unpredictable. You're probably still going to change a bunch (some people don't, but that's their problem) from this point on so don't be thinking anything about you now is "final".
Also I have to say, I don't think spending all your time immersed in pretend animu ladies is at all healthy. If that's your only contact with women you need to get as far away from that stuff as possible because it's made for Japanese nerds with even less healthy attitudes than you towards women than you.
Women in those things are basically designed to appeal to really sad otaku. Given that those guys are kind of human lady repellent I worry that it could become a bit of a vicious circle. Get the stench off you before you too own body pillows and mouse-mats with boobs.
I'd suggest you need some hobbies that engage you with other people more.
Maybe you could join an animu club but I'll only permit this if there are girls there (girls do like animu, possibly even more than dudes).
Is there anything else you like that would get you interacting with people a bit more? Anything you could get into? Photography? Music? A sport?
I think having to go out into the wonderful world of gainful employment did me a lot of good too because however much of a unique snowflake you might think you are, you kind of have to fit in with society at large in an office or wherever it is you might work. Can you get a job?
Hats off to you for not self diagnosing ass burgers over the internet. There's probably hope for you.
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Er... am I allowed to swear in here? I forget.
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I've really seen therapy work for one of my friends. He had not dissimilar issues to yours. He really had to commit in a big way though.
I still have my nerdy pastimes but I am getting married this autumn and am so much less messed up than I was in my 20's. I suppose at some point I would have thought something similar which is why I am posting.
First thing I'll say is it's premature to think of yourself as "forever" anything at this point. Life is really unpredictable. You're probably still going to change a bunch (some people don't, but that's their problem) from this point on so don't be thinking anything about you now is "final".
Also I have to say, I don't think spending all your time immersed in pretend animu ladies is at all healthy. If that's your only contact with women you need to get as far away from that stuff as possible because it's made for Japanese nerds with even less healthy attitudes than you towards women than you.
Women in those things are basically designed to appeal to really sad otaku. Given that those guys are kind of human lady repellent I worry that it could become a bit of a vicious circle. Get the stench off you before you too own body pillows and mouse-mats with boobs.
I'd suggest you need some hobbies that engage you with other people more.
Maybe you could join an animu club but I'll only permit this if there are girls there (girls do like animu, possibly even more than dudes).
Is there anything else you like that would get you interacting with people a bit more? Anything you could get into? Photography? Music? A sport?
I think having to go out into the wonderful world of gainful employment did me a lot of good too because however much of a unique snowflake you might think you are, you kind of have to fit in with society at large in an office or wherever it is you might work. Can you get a job?
Hats off to you for not self diagnosing ass burgers over the internet. There's probably hope for you.
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Er... am I allowed to swear in here? I forget.
edit of edit
I've really seen therapy work for one of my friends. He had not dissimilar issues to yours. He really had to commit in a big way though.
Yeah.....about the mousepad and pillow.......
I swear, they came with Record of Agarest War. I don't actually use them either; I had to get them out of the box and packing to take that picture.
I swear, they came with Record of Agarest War. I don't actually use them either; I had to get them out of the box and packing to take that picture.
Errr....no?spm1138 said:LOL. Oh dear. Well, ebay them quick. Burn them. Put them in a sack with a brick and toss em in a river.
And as far as other things are concerned, I have no musical talent at all (or artistic talent for that matter), and the only sport I'm good enough to play is paintball, but that is hella expensive to constantly play.
Like I said, there is also no anime club or anything like that at my college for me to get into.
Like I said, there is also no anime club or anything like that at my college for me to get into.