Games as art? Settled!
- Thread starter bkd69
- Start date
I thought people like Psychonauts because it was funny and charming, not because it gives an insight into the inner workings of Milkmen's minds.
I always use Shadow of the Colossus as a paragon of the "games as art" argument. It's one of the few games that's actually made me run around just looking at scenery. All of the areas were beautifully created, and the art style was so full of details and minuscule things that just added to the richness of the game. There were several times I didn't want to kill the colossi because they were just so wondrous to look at.
Hilariously enough, everything there could easily be taken in the context of any trend in "art appreciation." The art world is riddled with fads, where if one person of any merit or clout says something is great, it becomes the status quo to just agree with them and call it art. How do you think just about anything Andy Warhol did became "art?"johnx61 said:
Part of the problem is that art is completely subjective. What is art to one person is just a bunch of color on canvas or noise on a track to another person. Unfortunately, people have a hard time holding individual opinions, which leads to public opinion, which is easily swayed.
Hell, I think this thread right here is proof enough of games as an art form, since it's being argued over in the same way.
If most of these games where popular they wouldn't be considered art.
I love Psychonauts for instance but I wouldn't consider it arty in the slightest, not in the traditional sense.
The whole games are art discussion is rediculous. Any movie can be art, any album can be art, any scribble on the corner of a page can be art. All you have to do it put it on a pedistal in the middle of a gallery and DAM! Its art.
Of coarse games can be art. The view on what art is is so twisted and subjective now a days its really is impossible to define.
Ask youself this. Lets turn the world its head for a moment. There isn't a man alive who hasn't played Psychonauts or ICO, both of which have sporned numous sequels and several wii party games and spin off called Colossus Kart. If this was true, would Halo be on this list of arty games?
I love Psychonauts for instance but I wouldn't consider it arty in the slightest, not in the traditional sense.
The whole games are art discussion is rediculous. Any movie can be art, any album can be art, any scribble on the corner of a page can be art. All you have to do it put it on a pedistal in the middle of a gallery and DAM! Its art.
Of coarse games can be art. The view on what art is is so twisted and subjective now a days its really is impossible to define.
Ask youself this. Lets turn the world its head for a moment. There isn't a man alive who hasn't played Psychonauts or ICO, both of which have sporned numous sequels and several wii party games and spin off called Colossus Kart. If this was true, would Halo be on this list of arty games?
The article has one problem: most of the main reasons that they considered a game "art" was based on visual or aural assets.
While visual & aural assets are important they are not (by themselves) the most important assets of a game. The difference in gaming to other mediums (as been discussed in Escapist articles) is interactivity.
The problem is that many do not have an accurate vocabulary or consideration for the games medium. For visual example: American McGee's Alice could be described as "trippy" (less exact & less descriptive) and/or described as "gothically surreal" (more specific & descriptive).
While visual & aural assets are important they are not (by themselves) the most important assets of a game. The difference in gaming to other mediums (as been discussed in Escapist articles) is interactivity.
The problem is that many do not have an accurate vocabulary or consideration for the games medium. For visual example: American McGee's Alice could be described as "trippy" (less exact & less descriptive) and/or described as "gothically surreal" (more specific & descriptive).
[image src="http://www.literature-study-online.com/images/aliceshot.jpg"]
Exactly, I showed Flower to two of my friends at the weekend, one appreciated it's style and themes, the other (literally) wanted to immediately leave the room, "It's not a game!" he proclaimed. I countered that his definition of a game was far too limited.The_State said:
I agree, I did expect to see it on the list. Or at least Flower or flOw, instead there were a bunch of games that were more main stream than I expected.Remleiz said:
![[Gavo]](https://eg-forums-escapist-data.nyc3.digitaloceanspaces.com/data/avatars/l/33/33764.jpg?1620201950){kind=avatar}
Does it being main stream not make it art?Eagle Est1986 said:
People mix up arty games and cult classic games way too often for my liking.
It's funny... somewhere in this recursive conversation where we endlessly rehash what makes games 'art', we've somehow come up with an informal canon. The fact that people in this thread are bringing up games that have been repeatedly linked to gaming's forward strides into artistic territory (Braid, etc.) sorta shows that a short-list of 'art' games has formed. We trot out the same old examples every time; does this mean that these games are, indeed, 'art', if only because they are widely recognized as such?
This is one of the problems I have with the "games are art" argument. Its not that I don't agree with it, its just that people don't seem to have their own views on what game they would consider art, they simply continuely name some cult classics as if lack of sales make them special.Clemenstation said:
Well a game's popularity shouldn't have any impact on wether a game could be considered art or not, they're two independant values.SomeBritishDude said:
I guess what I really meant was that the games that I had in my mind before I read the list were no where to be seen, instead titles like Portal and Fallout were offered. Two games I really wouldn't consider art, sure they're pretty but as far as I'm concerned, how good the visuals are has nothing to do with a game being considered art.
My answer to the "is it art" question is that I really couldn't care less. I don't have a thesis to write or a gallery to promote so it's no skin off my nose either way.
They have listed some of my favourite games. If art games tend to be more like the games listed there then give me more arty farty games.
They have listed some of my favourite games. If art games tend to be more like the games listed there then give me more arty farty games.
Weather certain movie critics agree or not, most video games are art.
Beyond the fact that many artists work on the cycling aesthetic features of a game; video games (especially the newer ones) draw the player in as the artist/writer/whatever.
I know the story I played through GTA San Andreas or Fallout 3 was a bit different from the story my wife or any of my friends played through. Sure we did some of the same things but in different orders and in different ways. In a much more straightforward sense, my current Saints Row 2 character looks quite a bit different from any other while my first one looked like Dr. Girlfriend. Many games also give you a pallete of sorts: Katamari has the Katamari, Fallout 3 and Oblivion has houses which I've turned into some works of art, and Little Big Planet has the whole game open to your creativity.
Beyond the fact that many artists work on the cycling aesthetic features of a game; video games (especially the newer ones) draw the player in as the artist/writer/whatever.
I know the story I played through GTA San Andreas or Fallout 3 was a bit different from the story my wife or any of my friends played through. Sure we did some of the same things but in different orders and in different ways. In a much more straightforward sense, my current Saints Row 2 character looks quite a bit different from any other while my first one looked like Dr. Girlfriend. Many games also give you a pallete of sorts: Katamari has the Katamari, Fallout 3 and Oblivion has houses which I've turned into some works of art, and Little Big Planet has the whole game open to your creativity.