Games Workshop Stock Plummets By 24 Percent

[Thaluikhain]

Seriously an amazing person. Im very sad his work might be getting scrapped.

Yeah, I can imagine why GW wanted him back in the day, and why they don't anymore.

But...hopefully Khemri won't be scrapped, it'd be rolled back into the Vampire Counts.

When I started, there was just one undead book, "Undead", which lumped things all in together, Sylvania, Khemri and Nagash's stuff. This got replaced by "Vampire Counts", the Tomb Kings got in WD (later their own book) and stuff on Nagash;s stuff was promised, but never happened.

I suppose they could go back to doing that. Likewise, Beastmen were once lumped in with Chaos Warriors and Daemons, way back in the day.

OTOH, I can't see them doing that to Bretonnia, unless they make them, like Kislev, appendices to the Empire. Which is a real shame, since they've been a big part of WHFB since I can remember.

 

[Batou667]

yes 3D printing will be the end of shops like theirs but that isnt moving in THAT fast yet. Also licensing and other stupid laws will allow them to hold a stranglehold for a while still.

How so? 3D printing is going to kill the miniatures division of GW stone cold dead. If bootlegged resin recasts were a problem for Forge World, imagine the free-for-all 3D printing represents. You could spend £18 on five models (or whatever they charge these days), but if you can print them, who in their right mind wouldn't take the cheaper option?

And I suspect GW would rather you buy the models, and the paints, and the brushes, and the terrain, and the books from them, rather than have their one-man stores waste time on setting up demos and teaching people how to play.

Yeah, I think we can safely conclude that a switch to a one-man model means participation games, painting demos, modelling and hobby advice are going to fall by the wayside. So much for "hobby centres", the new GW stores will basically be kiosks selling overpriced models. For a hobby that requires enthusiastic word of mouth to get new people interested, it's a bewildering decision. GW are famously apathetic about customer retention, so where's the new blood supposed to come from?

 

[Thaluikhain]

Just look at the state of the Tyranid Codex and note that the reason a few models were took out was because they lost a count case over units they wrote rules for, but decided not to make models for.

Wait what? Court case over units they didn't make model for? GW has done that before in the past, and why should it be that big a deal?

 

[Moktor]

Just look at the state of the Tyranid Codex and note that the reason a few models were took out was because they lost a count case over units they wrote rules for, but decided not to make models for.

Wait what? Court case over units they didn't make model for? GW has done that before in the past, and why should it be that big a deal?

If I understand correctly, the reference is about Doom of Malan'tai and the Myocetic Spore. GW had both in the Nid codex but another company made the model. A judge (presumably in Europe, this probably wouldn't have happened in the US with our copyright laws) allegedly ruled that since the other company made the miniatures first, GW no longer had a claim to them, even though they had obviously created the IP first. Again, this is what I've heard, feel free to correct me if my RUMINT is wrong.

 

[Batou667]

Also, I'm never, ever, EVER going to forgive them for replacing Necrons with 'Tomb Kings In Space".

Wellll.... that's all they ever were, to be fair. Just about every 40K race is "XXXXXX in space" (knights, orcs, elves, dwarfs WAITNOTHATNEVERHAPPENED). I remember when Necrons first came out they had a slightly Terminator vibe to them, but had blatant Egyptian influences even then. Then for a bit it looked like Necrons were going to become "Tyranids, only metal, because insectoid stuff with blades is cool by default". If anything the current Necron range is the most well-developed and fleshed-out (ironic pun unintended) it's ever been, and if that means dropping the charade and admitting that, yes, they're Undead In Space, then so be it...

 

[Thaluikhain]

Also, I'm never, ever, EVER going to forgive them for replacing Necrons with 'Tomb Kings In Space".

Wellll.... that's all they ever were, to be fair. Just about every 40K race is "XXXXXX in space" (knights, orcs, elves, dwarfs WAITNOTHATNEVERHAPPENED). I remember when Necrons first came out they had a slightly Terminator vibe to them, but had blatant Egyptian influences even then. Then for a bit it looked like Necrons were going to become "Tyranids, only metal, because insectoid stuff with blades is cool by default". If anything the current Necron range is the most well-developed and fleshed-out (ironic pun unintended) it's ever been, and if that means dropping the charade and admitting that, yes, they're Undead In Space, then so be it...

Yeah, second that, they were flat out stated to be space Egyptian undead from the very beginning. With obvious Terminator influence, though I think there was a large slab of Cybermen in there. Having said that, the Cybermen also had their space Egyptian undead thing for a bit.

Personally, I think they made a mistake fleshing them out, they used to be characterless and limited, true, but they were made very generic.

(I don't remember them ever being much like nids, though)

 

[Strazdas]

yes 3D printing will be the end of shops like theirs but that isnt moving in THAT fast yet. Also licensing and other stupid laws will allow them to hold a stranglehold for a while still.

How so? 3D printing is going to kill the miniatures division of GW stone cold dead. If bootlegged resin recasts were a problem for Forge World, imagine the free-for-all 3D printing represents. You could spend £18 on five models (or whatever they charge these days), but if you can print them, who in their right mind wouldn't take the cheaper option?

if they hold copyright stranglehold on the figures they can essentially sue everyone trying to spread 3D printer schematics.
And if you can print them cheaper and easier who would pay for them? Well, thats like asking why does anyone buy videogames when piracy exists.

 

[Batou667]

if they hold copyright stranglehold on the figures they can essentially sue everyone trying to spread 3D printer schematics.
And if you can print them cheaper and easier who would pay for them? Well, thats like asking why does anyone buy videogames when piracy exists.

I was thinking about this a while back and I was musing over the fact that if GW want to survive in a world with 3D printing/photocopying, they'd be best off distributing rulebooks and models mainly electronically - they've already started using iTunes to sell downloads of Codexes and painting guides (much lower overheads and as a bonus goes some way to circumventing the practice of one guy buying an Imperial Armour book and promptly uploading scanned pages), so selling licenses to print their figures (or more accurately, X-amount of their figures) would be a logical next step. No manufacturing, packaging and distribution costs their end - they'd just need to enforce a time-limited and/or print-limited download of their model schematics for people to print their copyrighted models. Perhaps when 3D printers become mainstream enough to be compatible with personal devices these schematics could be embedded in the relevant Codex or army book, in an equivalent to on-disc DLC:

"Codex Space Marines - full army list and painting guide - licensed schematics for all figures, more downloadable subject to notice - E-Codex license includes free one-use print license for 1 Space Marine Captain and 20 Tactical Marines!"

Hell, when colour 3D printing is developed, it'll make painting your own minis a thing of the past too - or at least as rare as it is to find people who scratchbuild minis today.

I'm not sure whether that's a utopic or dystopic vision, but anyway, it's probably moot just because any 3D printer with a scan function (i.e. a photocopier rather than a straight printer) would be able to produce unlimited numbers of unlicensed models that would be completely indistinguishable from the "genuine" (paid-for) article. I can only assume the future of tabletop gaming is going to favour indie and fan-created games, as there'll be increasingly little place for the kind of monopoly GW has been relying on for the last few decades.

 

[Thaluikhain]

if they hold copyright stranglehold on the figures they can essentially sue everyone trying to spread 3D printer schematics.
And if you can print them cheaper and easier who would pay for them? Well, thats like asking why does anyone buy videogames when piracy exists.

Depends...people copying GW models as is, yeah...though GW has had problems with that for years.

OTOH, though, there's nothing to stop people 3D printing almost, but not quite, exactly the same stuff...that's going on to an extent now, and GW sort of has to put up with it.

http://www.heresyminiatures.com/shop/ For example, rips off all sorts of stuff GW and otherwise. I particularly like the brazenness of the "Doctor Hugh" model.

 

[Atomic Spy Crab]

In all these comments I don't see anyone complaining about how forge world priced a book at 100 money dollars (though it was worth every penny) and adding an extra 0 to the end of each price.

 

[Atomic Spy Crab]

Hell, when colour 3D printing is developed, it'll make painting your own minis a thing of the past too - or at least as rare as it is to find people who scratchbuild minis today

I would hate that as painting is my life

 

[Strazdas]

I was thinking about this a while back and I was musing over the fact that if GW want to survive in a world with 3D printing/photocopying, they'd be best off distributing rulebooks and models mainly electronically - they've already started using iTunes to sell downloads of Codexes and painting guides (much lower overheads and as a bonus goes some way to circumventing the practice of one guy buying an Imperial Armour book and promptly uploading scanned pages), so selling licenses to print their figures (or more accurately, X-amount of their figures) would be a logical next step. No manufacturing, packaging and distribution costs their end - they'd just need to enforce a time-limited and/or print-limited download of their model schematics for people to print their copyrighted models.

I'm not sure whether that's a utopic or dystopic vision, but anyway, it's probably moot just because any 3D printer with a scan function (i.e. a photocopier rather than a straight printer) would be able to produce unlimited numbers of unlicensed models that would be completely indistinguishable from the "genuine" (paid-for) article. I can only assume the future of tabletop gaming is going to favour indie and fan-created games, as there'll be increasingly little place for the kind of monopoly GW has been relying on for the last few decades.

The problem is they claim they dont want digital distribution for any of their figurines. I do agree that this woudl definatelly be a solution.

crapTunes security is pretty much nonexistant as far as i know. i never saw them labeled as some form of DRM that cant be circumvented by anyone, thought i never saw a person buying a book via crapTunes before either. Either way, as long as they allow you to read it they allow you to scan it. OCRing screenshots solve all DRM here.

I do hope 3D printing will bring the end of such monopolies. The way GW has been acting they certainly deserve to go out of business. And fans are willing to throw a lot of money for things they love either way. Just look how much the donation drives garner.

Depends...people copying GW models as is, yeah...though GW has had problems with that for years.

OTOH, though, there's nothing to stop people 3D printing almost, but not quite, exactly the same stuff...that's going on to an extent now, and GW sort of has to put up with it.

http://www.heresyminiatures.com/shop/ For example, rips off all sorts of stuff GW and otherwise. I particularly like the brazenness of the "Doctor Hugh" model.

Yes but as you say this is already happening, so it wouldnt be some sort of new thing for the.

P.S. i was so used to you being an owl i had to doublecheck.

 

[Thaluikhain]

P.S. i was so used to you being an owl i had to doublecheck.

Taking me a little time to get used to it before, but I've been chanign my av's around New Year's for a while now.

 

[Strazdas]

P.S. i was so used to you being an owl i had to doublecheck.

Taking me a little time to get used to it before, but I've been chanign my av's around New Year's for a while now.

i noticed you have been changing. For some reason i think the owl fit your posts very well. oh well, whatever works best for you. I planned to change mine for half a year or so now but its probably going to take another half a year, new avatars are really low on my priorities list now.

 

[Thaluikhain]

P.S. i was so used to you being an owl i had to doublecheck.

Taking me a little time to get used to it before, but I've been chanign my av's around New Year's for a while now.

i noticed you have been changing. For some reason i think the owl fit your posts very well. oh well, whatever works best for you. I planned to change mine for half a year or so now but its probably going to take another half a year, new avatars are really low on my priorities list now.

Yeah, the wallaby hasn't quite worked so well, but I think I'll stick with it for the meantime.

 

[Riot3000]

Lord I do agree I was excited for the new Codex and rules but after looking at the prices and seeing the local shop go under it is just sad. I mean the prices are just ridiculous but the other stuff I learned about on this board I am making my decision to move on to new tabletop games. Warmachine and wreckage sound pretty good right now.

Also my god Matt Ward I knew that the GW gave the Sisters of Battle no love but my god that whole Grey Knights is just real stupid. I mean i rarely call misogyny because I believe its thrown around to haphazardly on the net but this I am calling misogyny. Really the grey knights use the sister blood to ward off chaos corruption when in their codex and game lore wise grey knights hate chaos so much they CANT corrupted by it. So they don't need to bathe in blood to protect themselves and since they make up 2 of the 3 branches of the Inquisition so they would of teamed up. And don't get me started on that nonsense on how a single chaos dreadnaught can nearly kill a whole planet of sisters.

But yeah unless GW does some complete 180 I am closing the chapter on me and 40k.

 

[Wargamer]

Issues with GW generally fall into two categories; the price of their stuff, and the pay to win attitude. It's no coincidence that the units with the best stats are always the stuff that are brand new and never existed before now. Their aim is to make people keep having to rebuy their army every time a new Codex comes out, rather than making armies affordable and useable for long periods and then garnering good faith so people want to own more than one.

 

[Kittyhawk]

The path of Games Workshop has been warped for a number of years, because they are U.K based, they can be a bit too draconian in their control. Their audience is limited and in a changing world, next to more popular stuff like video games, films and comics, they aren't doing themselves any favours.

Can't say what the future holds for them, but good luck to them. Frankly, I think that they should lean more onto video games. The THQ Warhammer game on 360/PS3 was pretty good fun. The Dawn of War games were also good but few know of them unless you are a PC owner. Video games gives them a chance to expand the audience, than the usual male kids/adults demo, and they will need them more with the likes of Pokemon around to eat up time.

 

[Thaluikhain]

The path of Games Workshop has been warped for a number of years, because they are U.K based, they can be a bit too draconian in their control.

Hey? What does being UK based have to do with it?