GameStop Sued Over Privacy Violations

[Xastabus]

Gamestop does not retain credit card numbers at physical stores. If they did I could just have them bring up my account and charge me. For very obvious reasons that isn't possible. I seriously doubt their in-store point of sale system even has fields on the customer account for credit card information.

This only happens on their website where it is done with the customer's consent for customer convenience.

I expect to see this "class-action" fail.

 

[JDKJ]

Don't Gamestop's everywhere do this? And all I get asked when I pre-order something is my phone number... and my license to show I'm 18(actually 19, but old enough to buy M rated games). When I buy I just get asked for the ID.

Yep: If you're buying something with a credit card you need to present it so the last four numbers of it can be punched in. That's everywhere though, as far as I know, so long as the purchase is $15 - $25 or more.

At gamestop however (in Maryland at least) you now also need to provide two forms of ID, anything issued by the state (well...any state really) and anything else be it a credit card or something.

Anyway: This whole things sounds stupid. It could have either been easily avoided or, it's something the customer is blowing up for no good reason. I've had people get uppity about me asking for their phone number and/or, their e-mail while trying to sign them up for power-up rewards. Sorry, I've been working retail since about 09. I have kind of a Randal outlook where customers are concerned.


Granted, that video applies more to when I was working at Blockbuster...

I think GameStop went beyond the last four digits of the card number. It looks like they record the entire card number. Which they have no need to do that I can see. When the swipe the card or enter it's number at the terminal connected to the card-issuer, all the information that the card-issuer needs to honor the debt on behalf on their cardholder is transmitted. Why does GameStop need my full card number and personal information in order for the transaction to be honored by my cardholder? They don't. They're just fishing for information they can use for their own personal purposes (mailing lists, complying customer demographic statistics, etc., etc.)

I agree, they deserve a slap on the wrist for this.

You have to agree that $1000 a person is absolutely bat fuck insane though

That depends on why GameStop wants the information and what they plan to do with it. If that use -- whatever it is -- is of great financial value to them (which I suspect it is or they wouldn't be doing it the first place), then the financial penalty for their wrongdoing needs to be greater than their financial gain from the wrongdoing or there's no incentive for them to cease doing wrong. They'll do the cost-benefit analysis and conclude that even with the slap on the wrist, there's still financial gain in continuing their illegal conduct.

If I steal $100 and get caught and fined $75, why should I stop stealing? I'm still $25 ahead of the game (no pun intended).

I wouldn't worry about that, they could be harvesting and selling the blood of each customer and they wouldn't come anywhere near $1000 a person.

How much do you think a name and phone number is worth anyway? They obviously aren't selling the credit card information to criminals otherwise this headline would look more like Angry Customers With Stolen Identities Burn Down Gamestop

I think they deserve some sort of penalty, but $1000 a person? Absolutely insane.

I dunno about that. If they're using the information to compile mailing lists and then selling or trading those mailing lists to or with other companies (which many businesses do), the financial benefit from that (either in terms of sales generated by mailing list campaigns or from the outright sale of lists) could be worth well in excess of $1000 a pop. A mailing list of consumers with credit cards who have been positively identified as willing to plop down their cards on a particular product or service can be worth its weight in gold.

No mailing list in the history of the world has ever been worth $1000 a person for a name and phone number, ever. It's clear they aren't selling the credit card numbers or else identity theft would be rampant among their customers.

If you can show any evidence otherwise I'll eat my own face.

Putting aside the fact that it isn't a mailing list if all you've got is a name and phone number and citing the following example:

A friend of mine is known to regularly lose more than $100,000 a time on his trips to Las Vegas. He's very well know by the Wynn folks, who regularly e-mail him invitations with offers of complimentary rooms, All-Star game tickets, etc., etc. They've shared his mailing information with the other casinos in town who also regularly mail him invites and comp offers. What do you think the value of a casino's mailing list of high-rollers could be?

A hell of a lot, how much do you think Gamestop could make per person though? They already shop at Gamestop after all, with the prices of videogames being more or less universally set as far as retail goes, how is an email or two going to change where they shop? Much less generate $1000 a head.

I'm not saying they shouldn't be penalized, but $1000 a person? Really?

Keep in mind that the $1000 is the maximum civil penalty allowed by the law ($250 being the minimum). Any attorney worth their salt is gonna ask for the maximum (whether or not they truly believe that's what their clients should fairly be compensated). You know the old saying: "Ask for steak. If all you get is hamburger, that ain't bad. You still got something to eat."

And think of the millions of dollars that GameStop spends on advertising every year. If the demographic information about their customers they illegally collect can help them focus the scope of that advertising and improve the dollar-spent-on-advertising to dollar-generated-by-advertising ratio by as little as 5%, that's pretty significant.

 

[SelectivelyEvil13]

Yet I can't help thinking that if you're truly uncomfortable handing out such information, perhaps instead of filing a lawsuit you should just say no.

But as evidenced in case, "No" doesn't have a dollar sign prefix and three zeroes at the end.

I've never purchased anything at a Gamestop, but I don't see any reason for them to do anything beyond identity confirmation prior to purchasing.

Stores requesting area codes to obtain a survey of where their consumers come from is not unfamiliar to me, but personal addresses is one instance of information that a retailer such as Gamestop does not need to know. I would be especially suspect of handing out my email address because unwanted spam surly would follow.

According to a recent opinion issued by the California Supreme Court, the reason that the retailers are so keen on obtaining zip code information is that they then use that information coupled with the name to search and find the customer's home address which they then use for mailings. The retailers argued that they weren't storing prohibited "personal identifying information" because a zip code is shared by a group of individuals and isn't personal to any one individual. The Court found that it is "personal identifying information" because every individual's address contains a zip code.

Thank you for the info JDKJ!

The ostensible reason of "where our customers drive from" is a pretty sneaky excuse for "where we can mail our garbage to." Now I'm at a loss of precise memory of where I've been where zip code was asked for, along with possibly other such information. As no recent retailers come to mind, I doubt I've been back! Most likely they were stores like Old Navy or Dick's Sporting Goods. I'm glad that the former hasn't barraged my home address with Gap or Banana Republic flyers; they do something along the lines of that with the email though.

 

[Danpascooch]

Don't Gamestop's everywhere do this? And all I get asked when I pre-order something is my phone number... and my license to show I'm 18(actually 19, but old enough to buy M rated games). When I buy I just get asked for the ID.

Yep: If you're buying something with a credit card you need to present it so the last four numbers of it can be punched in. That's everywhere though, as far as I know, so long as the purchase is $15 - $25 or more.

At gamestop however (in Maryland at least) you now also need to provide two forms of ID, anything issued by the state (well...any state really) and anything else be it a credit card or something.

Anyway: This whole things sounds stupid. It could have either been easily avoided or, it's something the customer is blowing up for no good reason. I've had people get uppity about me asking for their phone number and/or, their e-mail while trying to sign them up for power-up rewards. Sorry, I've been working retail since about 09. I have kind of a Randal outlook where customers are concerned.


Granted, that video applies more to when I was working at Blockbuster...

I think GameStop went beyond the last four digits of the card number. It looks like they record the entire card number. Which they have no need to do that I can see. When the swipe the card or enter it's number at the terminal connected to the card-issuer, all the information that the card-issuer needs to honor the debt on behalf on their cardholder is transmitted. Why does GameStop need my full card number and personal information in order for the transaction to be honored by my cardholder? They don't. They're just fishing for information they can use for their own personal purposes (mailing lists, complying customer demographic statistics, etc., etc.)

I agree, they deserve a slap on the wrist for this.

You have to agree that $1000 a person is absolutely bat fuck insane though

That depends on why GameStop wants the information and what they plan to do with it. If that use -- whatever it is -- is of great financial value to them (which I suspect it is or they wouldn't be doing it the first place), then the financial penalty for their wrongdoing needs to be greater than their financial gain from the wrongdoing or there's no incentive for them to cease doing wrong. They'll do the cost-benefit analysis and conclude that even with the slap on the wrist, there's still financial gain in continuing their illegal conduct.

If I steal $100 and get caught and fined $75, why should I stop stealing? I'm still $25 ahead of the game (no pun intended).

I wouldn't worry about that, they could be harvesting and selling the blood of each customer and they wouldn't come anywhere near $1000 a person.

How much do you think a name and phone number is worth anyway? They obviously aren't selling the credit card information to criminals otherwise this headline would look more like Angry Customers With Stolen Identities Burn Down Gamestop

I think they deserve some sort of penalty, but $1000 a person? Absolutely insane.

I dunno about that. If they're using the information to compile mailing lists and then selling or trading those mailing lists to or with other companies (which many businesses do), the financial benefit from that (either in terms of sales generated by mailing list campaigns or from the outright sale of lists) could be worth well in excess of $1000 a pop. A mailing list of consumers with credit cards who have been positively identified as willing to plop down their cards on a particular product or service can be worth its weight in gold.

No mailing list in the history of the world has ever been worth $1000 a person for a name and phone number, ever. It's clear they aren't selling the credit card numbers or else identity theft would be rampant among their customers.

If you can show any evidence otherwise I'll eat my own face.

Putting aside the fact that it isn't a mailing list if all you've got is a name and phone number and citing the following example:

A friend of mine is known to regularly lose more than $100,000 a time on his trips to Las Vegas. He's very well know by the Wynn folks, who regularly e-mail him invitations with offers of complimentary rooms, All-Star game tickets, etc., etc. They've shared his mailing information with the other casinos in town who also regularly mail him invites and comp offers. What do you think the value of a casino's mailing list of high-rollers could be?

A hell of a lot, how much do you think Gamestop could make per person though? They already shop at Gamestop after all, with the prices of videogames being more or less universally set as far as retail goes, how is an email or two going to change where they shop? Much less generate $1000 a head.

I'm not saying they shouldn't be penalized, but $1000 a person? Really?

Keep in mind that the $1000 is the maximum civil penalty allowed by the law ($250 being the minimum). Any attorney worth their salt is gonna ask for the maximum (whether or not they truly believe that's what their clients should fairly be compensated). You know the old saying: "Ask for steak. If all you get is hamburger, that ain't bad. You still got something to eat."

And think of the millions of dollars that GameStop spends on advertising every year. If the demographic information about their customers they illegally collect can help them focus the scope of that advertising and improve the dollar-spent-on-advertising to dollar-generated-by-advertising ratio by as little as 5%, that's pretty significant.

I understand that, and that's exactly my point. It's a ridiculous sum chosen out of greed, not out of a desire for a legitimate reasonable penalty.

 

[JDKJ]

Don't Gamestop's everywhere do this? And all I get asked when I pre-order something is my phone number... and my license to show I'm 18(actually 19, but old enough to buy M rated games). When I buy I just get asked for the ID.

Yep: If you're buying something with a credit card you need to present it so the last four numbers of it can be punched in. That's everywhere though, as far as I know, so long as the purchase is $15 - $25 or more.

At gamestop however (in Maryland at least) you now also need to provide two forms of ID, anything issued by the state (well...any state really) and anything else be it a credit card or something.

Anyway: This whole things sounds stupid. It could have either been easily avoided or, it's something the customer is blowing up for no good reason. I've had people get uppity about me asking for their phone number and/or, their e-mail while trying to sign them up for power-up rewards. Sorry, I've been working retail since about 09. I have kind of a Randal outlook where customers are concerned.


Granted, that video applies more to when I was working at Blockbuster...

I think GameStop went beyond the last four digits of the card number. It looks like they record the entire card number. Which they have no need to do that I can see. When the swipe the card or enter it's number at the terminal connected to the card-issuer, all the information that the card-issuer needs to honor the debt on behalf on their cardholder is transmitted. Why does GameStop need my full card number and personal information in order for the transaction to be honored by my cardholder? They don't. They're just fishing for information they can use for their own personal purposes (mailing lists, complying customer demographic statistics, etc., etc.)

I agree, they deserve a slap on the wrist for this.

You have to agree that $1000 a person is absolutely bat fuck insane though

That depends on why GameStop wants the information and what they plan to do with it. If that use -- whatever it is -- is of great financial value to them (which I suspect it is or they wouldn't be doing it the first place), then the financial penalty for their wrongdoing needs to be greater than their financial gain from the wrongdoing or there's no incentive for them to cease doing wrong. They'll do the cost-benefit analysis and conclude that even with the slap on the wrist, there's still financial gain in continuing their illegal conduct.

If I steal $100 and get caught and fined $75, why should I stop stealing? I'm still $25 ahead of the game (no pun intended).

I wouldn't worry about that, they could be harvesting and selling the blood of each customer and they wouldn't come anywhere near $1000 a person.

How much do you think a name and phone number is worth anyway? They obviously aren't selling the credit card information to criminals otherwise this headline would look more like Angry Customers With Stolen Identities Burn Down Gamestop

I think they deserve some sort of penalty, but $1000 a person? Absolutely insane.

I dunno about that. If they're using the information to compile mailing lists and then selling or trading those mailing lists to or with other companies (which many businesses do), the financial benefit from that (either in terms of sales generated by mailing list campaigns or from the outright sale of lists) could be worth well in excess of $1000 a pop. A mailing list of consumers with credit cards who have been positively identified as willing to plop down their cards on a particular product or service can be worth its weight in gold.

No mailing list in the history of the world has ever been worth $1000 a person for a name and phone number, ever. It's clear they aren't selling the credit card numbers or else identity theft would be rampant among their customers.

If you can show any evidence otherwise I'll eat my own face.

Putting aside the fact that it isn't a mailing list if all you've got is a name and phone number and citing the following example:

A friend of mine is known to regularly lose more than $100,000 a time on his trips to Las Vegas. He's very well know by the Wynn folks, who regularly e-mail him invitations with offers of complimentary rooms, All-Star game tickets, etc., etc. They've shared his mailing information with the other casinos in town who also regularly mail him invites and comp offers. What do you think the value of a casino's mailing list of high-rollers could be?

A hell of a lot, how much do you think Gamestop could make per person though? They already shop at Gamestop after all, with the prices of videogames being more or less universally set as far as retail goes, how is an email or two going to change where they shop? Much less generate $1000 a head.

I'm not saying they shouldn't be penalized, but $1000 a person? Really?

Keep in mind that the $1000 is the maximum civil penalty allowed by the law ($250 being the minimum). Any attorney worth their salt is gonna ask for the maximum (whether or not they truly believe that's what their clients should fairly be compensated). You know the old saying: "Ask for steak. If all you get is hamburger, that ain't bad. You still got something to eat."

And think of the millions of dollars that GameStop spends on advertising every year. If the demographic information about their customers they illegally collect can help them focus the scope of that advertising and improve the dollar-spent-on-advertising to dollar-generated-by-advertising ratio by as little as 5%, that's pretty significant.

I understand that, and that's exactly my point. It's a ridiculous sum chosen out of greed, not out of a desire for a legitimate reasonable penalty.

It's not necessarily greed. It could just as likely be good horse trading. No good horse trader starts out by asking for what they actually want. If they do, they'll almost certainly end up getting traded down to a point below that which they actually wanted. For example, if they though the case was worth exactly $300 per client and they actually ask for $300 per client and then the court tells them to work out some kind of settlement, where's the room to bargain? There is none. There's nowhere to go but down from the initial $300 request (the "fair" price). That's just the way the horse trading game gets played. You gotta start out by requesting more than you actually think you deserve or you'll get less than you think you actually deserve. That's not "greed." That's "common sense."

"I go low, you go high. I know the game." - Tony Montana, "Scarface"

 

[Danpascooch]

Don't Gamestop's everywhere do this? And all I get asked when I pre-order something is my phone number... and my license to show I'm 18(actually 19, but old enough to buy M rated games). When I buy I just get asked for the ID.

Yep: If you're buying something with a credit card you need to present it so the last four numbers of it can be punched in. That's everywhere though, as far as I know, so long as the purchase is $15 - $25 or more.

At gamestop however (in Maryland at least) you now also need to provide two forms of ID, anything issued by the state (well...any state really) and anything else be it a credit card or something.

Anyway: This whole things sounds stupid. It could have either been easily avoided or, it's something the customer is blowing up for no good reason. I've had people get uppity about me asking for their phone number and/or, their e-mail while trying to sign them up for power-up rewards. Sorry, I've been working retail since about 09. I have kind of a Randal outlook where customers are concerned.


Granted, that video applies more to when I was working at Blockbuster...

I think GameStop went beyond the last four digits of the card number. It looks like they record the entire card number. Which they have no need to do that I can see. When the swipe the card or enter it's number at the terminal connected to the card-issuer, all the information that the card-issuer needs to honor the debt on behalf on their cardholder is transmitted. Why does GameStop need my full card number and personal information in order for the transaction to be honored by my cardholder? They don't. They're just fishing for information they can use for their own personal purposes (mailing lists, complying customer demographic statistics, etc., etc.)

I agree, they deserve a slap on the wrist for this.

You have to agree that $1000 a person is absolutely bat fuck insane though

That depends on why GameStop wants the information and what they plan to do with it. If that use -- whatever it is -- is of great financial value to them (which I suspect it is or they wouldn't be doing it the first place), then the financial penalty for their wrongdoing needs to be greater than their financial gain from the wrongdoing or there's no incentive for them to cease doing wrong. They'll do the cost-benefit analysis and conclude that even with the slap on the wrist, there's still financial gain in continuing their illegal conduct.

If I steal $100 and get caught and fined $75, why should I stop stealing? I'm still $25 ahead of the game (no pun intended).

I wouldn't worry about that, they could be harvesting and selling the blood of each customer and they wouldn't come anywhere near $1000 a person.

How much do you think a name and phone number is worth anyway? They obviously aren't selling the credit card information to criminals otherwise this headline would look more like Angry Customers With Stolen Identities Burn Down Gamestop

I think they deserve some sort of penalty, but $1000 a person? Absolutely insane.

I dunno about that. If they're using the information to compile mailing lists and then selling or trading those mailing lists to or with other companies (which many businesses do), the financial benefit from that (either in terms of sales generated by mailing list campaigns or from the outright sale of lists) could be worth well in excess of $1000 a pop. A mailing list of consumers with credit cards who have been positively identified as willing to plop down their cards on a particular product or service can be worth its weight in gold.

No mailing list in the history of the world has ever been worth $1000 a person for a name and phone number, ever. It's clear they aren't selling the credit card numbers or else identity theft would be rampant among their customers.

If you can show any evidence otherwise I'll eat my own face.

Putting aside the fact that it isn't a mailing list if all you've got is a name and phone number and citing the following example:

A friend of mine is known to regularly lose more than $100,000 a time on his trips to Las Vegas. He's very well know by the Wynn folks, who regularly e-mail him invitations with offers of complimentary rooms, All-Star game tickets, etc., etc. They've shared his mailing information with the other casinos in town who also regularly mail him invites and comp offers. What do you think the value of a casino's mailing list of high-rollers could be?

A hell of a lot, how much do you think Gamestop could make per person though? They already shop at Gamestop after all, with the prices of videogames being more or less universally set as far as retail goes, how is an email or two going to change where they shop? Much less generate $1000 a head.

I'm not saying they shouldn't be penalized, but $1000 a person? Really?

Keep in mind that the $1000 is the maximum civil penalty allowed by the law ($250 being the minimum). Any attorney worth their salt is gonna ask for the maximum (whether or not they truly believe that's what their clients should fairly be compensated). You know the old saying: "Ask for steak. If all you get is hamburger, that ain't bad. You still got something to eat."

And think of the millions of dollars that GameStop spends on advertising every year. If the demographic information about their customers they illegally collect can help them focus the scope of that advertising and improve the dollar-spent-on-advertising to dollar-generated-by-advertising ratio by as little as 5%, that's pretty significant.

I understand that, and that's exactly my point. It's a ridiculous sum chosen out of greed, not out of a desire for a legitimate reasonable penalty.

It's not necessarily greed. It could just as likely be good horse trading. No good horse trader starts out by asking for what they actually want. If they do, they'll almost certainly end up getting traded down to a point below that which they actually wanted. For example, if they though the case was worth exactly $300 per client and they actually ask for $300 per client and then the court tells them to work out some kind of settlement, where's the room to bargain? There is none. There's nowhere to go but down from the initial $300 request (the "fair" price). That's just the way the horse trading game gets played. You gotta start out by requesting more than you actually think you deserve or you'll get less than you think you actually deserve. That's not "greed." That's "common sense."

"I go low, you go high. I know the game." - Tony Montana, "Scarface"

Yeah but there is such a thing as starting too high, if I was selling my old Xbox 360 and asked $1000 for it hoping to haggle down, most people would just say "Wow what a retard" and move on.

The sum they are seeking could seriously hurt their legitimacy in front of a judge.

 

[Cecilthedarkknight_234]

kind of creepy but i know the people at my local game stop by name since I went to high-school with the assistant manger there. Does this really bother me know it's like storing your credit card info on amazon or eBay they do it in order to prevent identity theft. If some steals your debt/credit card and tries to use it at game-stop they will know its stolen because your information was already recorded or that's the way I see it.

 

[JDKJ]

Don't Gamestop's everywhere do this? And all I get asked when I pre-order something is my phone number... and my license to show I'm 18(actually 19, but old enough to buy M rated games). When I buy I just get asked for the ID.

Yep: If you're buying something with a credit card you need to present it so the last four numbers of it can be punched in. That's everywhere though, as far as I know, so long as the purchase is $15 - $25 or more.

At gamestop however (in Maryland at least) you now also need to provide two forms of ID, anything issued by the state (well...any state really) and anything else be it a credit card or something.

Anyway: This whole things sounds stupid. It could have either been easily avoided or, it's something the customer is blowing up for no good reason. I've had people get uppity about me asking for their phone number and/or, their e-mail while trying to sign them up for power-up rewards. Sorry, I've been working retail since about 09. I have kind of a Randal outlook where customers are concerned.


Granted, that video applies more to when I was working at Blockbuster...

I think GameStop went beyond the last four digits of the card number. It looks like they record the entire card number. Which they have no need to do that I can see. When the swipe the card or enter it's number at the terminal connected to the card-issuer, all the information that the card-issuer needs to honor the debt on behalf on their cardholder is transmitted. Why does GameStop need my full card number and personal information in order for the transaction to be honored by my cardholder? They don't. They're just fishing for information they can use for their own personal purposes (mailing lists, complying customer demographic statistics, etc., etc.)

I agree, they deserve a slap on the wrist for this.

You have to agree that $1000 a person is absolutely bat fuck insane though

That depends on why GameStop wants the information and what they plan to do with it. If that use -- whatever it is -- is of great financial value to them (which I suspect it is or they wouldn't be doing it the first place), then the financial penalty for their wrongdoing needs to be greater than their financial gain from the wrongdoing or there's no incentive for them to cease doing wrong. They'll do the cost-benefit analysis and conclude that even with the slap on the wrist, there's still financial gain in continuing their illegal conduct.

If I steal $100 and get caught and fined $75, why should I stop stealing? I'm still $25 ahead of the game (no pun intended).

I wouldn't worry about that, they could be harvesting and selling the blood of each customer and they wouldn't come anywhere near $1000 a person.

How much do you think a name and phone number is worth anyway? They obviously aren't selling the credit card information to criminals otherwise this headline would look more like Angry Customers With Stolen Identities Burn Down Gamestop

I think they deserve some sort of penalty, but $1000 a person? Absolutely insane.

I dunno about that. If they're using the information to compile mailing lists and then selling or trading those mailing lists to or with other companies (which many businesses do), the financial benefit from that (either in terms of sales generated by mailing list campaigns or from the outright sale of lists) could be worth well in excess of $1000 a pop. A mailing list of consumers with credit cards who have been positively identified as willing to plop down their cards on a particular product or service can be worth its weight in gold.

No mailing list in the history of the world has ever been worth $1000 a person for a name and phone number, ever. It's clear they aren't selling the credit card numbers or else identity theft would be rampant among their customers.

If you can show any evidence otherwise I'll eat my own face.

Putting aside the fact that it isn't a mailing list if all you've got is a name and phone number and citing the following example:

A friend of mine is known to regularly lose more than $100,000 a time on his trips to Las Vegas. He's very well know by the Wynn folks, who regularly e-mail him invitations with offers of complimentary rooms, All-Star game tickets, etc., etc. They've shared his mailing information with the other casinos in town who also regularly mail him invites and comp offers. What do you think the value of a casino's mailing list of high-rollers could be?

A hell of a lot, how much do you think Gamestop could make per person though? They already shop at Gamestop after all, with the prices of videogames being more or less universally set as far as retail goes, how is an email or two going to change where they shop? Much less generate $1000 a head.

I'm not saying they shouldn't be penalized, but $1000 a person? Really?

Keep in mind that the $1000 is the maximum civil penalty allowed by the law ($250 being the minimum). Any attorney worth their salt is gonna ask for the maximum (whether or not they truly believe that's what their clients should fairly be compensated). You know the old saying: "Ask for steak. If all you get is hamburger, that ain't bad. You still got something to eat."

And think of the millions of dollars that GameStop spends on advertising every year. If the demographic information about their customers they illegally collect can help them focus the scope of that advertising and improve the dollar-spent-on-advertising to dollar-generated-by-advertising ratio by as little as 5%, that's pretty significant.

I understand that, and that's exactly my point. It's a ridiculous sum chosen out of greed, not out of a desire for a legitimate reasonable penalty.

It's not necessarily greed. It could just as likely be good horse trading. No good horse trader starts out by asking for what they actually want. If they do, they'll almost certainly end up getting traded down to a point below that which they actually wanted. For example, if they though the case was worth exactly $300 per client and they actually ask for $300 per client and then the court tells them to work out some kind of settlement, where's the room to bargain? There is none. There's nowhere to go but down from the initial $300 request (the "fair" price). That's just the way the horse trading game gets played. You gotta start out by requesting more than you actually think you deserve or you'll get less than you think you actually deserve. That's not "greed." That's "common sense."

"I go low, you go high. I know the game." - Tony Montana, "Scarface"

Yeah but there is such a thing as starting too high, if I was selling my old Xbox 360 and asked $1000 for it hoping to haggle down, most people would just say "Wow what a retard" and move on.

The sum they are seeking could seriously hurt their legitimacy in front of a judge.

Don't Gamestop's everywhere do this? And all I get asked when I pre-order something is my phone number... and my license to show I'm 18(actually 19, but old enough to buy M rated games). When I buy I just get asked for the ID.

Yep: If you're buying something with a credit card you need to present it so the last four numbers of it can be punched in. That's everywhere though, as far as I know, so long as the purchase is $15 - $25 or more.

At gamestop however (in Maryland at least) you now also need to provide two forms of ID, anything issued by the state (well...any state really) and anything else be it a credit card or something.

Anyway: This whole things sounds stupid. It could have either been easily avoided or, it's something the customer is blowing up for no good reason. I've had people get uppity about me asking for their phone number and/or, their e-mail while trying to sign them up for power-up rewards. Sorry, I've been working retail since about 09. I have kind of a Randal outlook where customers are concerned.


Granted, that video applies more to when I was working at Blockbuster...

I think GameStop went beyond the last four digits of the card number. It looks like they record the entire card number. Which they have no need to do that I can see. When the swipe the card or enter it's number at the terminal connected to the card-issuer, all the information that the card-issuer needs to honor the debt on behalf on their cardholder is transmitted. Why does GameStop need my full card number and personal information in order for the transaction to be honored by my cardholder? They don't. They're just fishing for information they can use for their own personal purposes (mailing lists, complying customer demographic statistics, etc., etc.)

I agree, they deserve a slap on the wrist for this.

You have to agree that $1000 a person is absolutely bat fuck insane though

That depends on why GameStop wants the information and what they plan to do with it. If that use -- whatever it is -- is of great financial value to them (which I suspect it is or they wouldn't be doing it the first place), then the financial penalty for their wrongdoing needs to be greater than their financial gain from the wrongdoing or there's no incentive for them to cease doing wrong. They'll do the cost-benefit analysis and conclude that even with the slap on the wrist, there's still financial gain in continuing their illegal conduct.

If I steal $100 and get caught and fined $75, why should I stop stealing? I'm still $25 ahead of the game (no pun intended).

I wouldn't worry about that, they could be harvesting and selling the blood of each customer and they wouldn't come anywhere near $1000 a person.

How much do you think a name and phone number is worth anyway? They obviously aren't selling the credit card information to criminals otherwise this headline would look more like Angry Customers With Stolen Identities Burn Down Gamestop

I think they deserve some sort of penalty, but $1000 a person? Absolutely insane.

I dunno about that. If they're using the information to compile mailing lists and then selling or trading those mailing lists to or with other companies (which many businesses do), the financial benefit from that (either in terms of sales generated by mailing list campaigns or from the outright sale of lists) could be worth well in excess of $1000 a pop. A mailing list of consumers with credit cards who have been positively identified as willing to plop down their cards on a particular product or service can be worth its weight in gold.

No mailing list in the history of the world has ever been worth $1000 a person for a name and phone number, ever. It's clear they aren't selling the credit card numbers or else identity theft would be rampant among their customers.

If you can show any evidence otherwise I'll eat my own face.

Putting aside the fact that it isn't a mailing list if all you've got is a name and phone number and citing the following example:

A friend of mine is known to regularly lose more than $100,000 a time on his trips to Las Vegas. He's very well know by the Wynn folks, who regularly e-mail him invitations with offers of complimentary rooms, All-Star game tickets, etc., etc. They've shared his mailing information with the other casinos in town who also regularly mail him invites and comp offers. What do you think the value of a casino's mailing list of high-rollers could be?

A hell of a lot, how much do you think Gamestop could make per person though? They already shop at Gamestop after all, with the prices of videogames being more or less universally set as far as retail goes, how is an email or two going to change where they shop? Much less generate $1000 a head.

I'm not saying they shouldn't be penalized, but $1000 a person? Really?

Keep in mind that the $1000 is the maximum civil penalty allowed by the law ($250 being the minimum). Any attorney worth their salt is gonna ask for the maximum (whether or not they truly believe that's what their clients should fairly be compensated). You know the old saying: "Ask for steak. If all you get is hamburger, that ain't bad. You still got something to eat."

And think of the millions of dollars that GameStop spends on advertising every year. If the demographic information about their customers they illegally collect can help them focus the scope of that advertising and improve the dollar-spent-on-advertising to dollar-generated-by-advertising ratio by as little as 5%, that's pretty significant.

I understand that, and that's exactly my point. It's a ridiculous sum chosen out of greed, not out of a desire for a legitimate reasonable penalty.

It's not necessarily greed. It could just as likely be good horse trading. No good horse trader starts out by asking for what they actually want. If they do, they'll almost certainly end up getting traded down to a point below that which they actually wanted. For example, if they though the case was worth exactly $300 per client and they actually ask for $300 per client and then the court tells them to work out some kind of settlement, where's the room to bargain? There is none. There's nowhere to go but down from the initial $300 request (the "fair" price). That's just the way the horse trading game gets played. You gotta start out by requesting more than you actually think you deserve or you'll get less than you think you actually deserve. That's not "greed." That's "common sense."

"I go low, you go high. I know the game." - Tony Montana, "Scarface"

Yeah but there is such a thing as starting too high, if I was selling my old Xbox 360 and asked $1000 for it hoping to haggle down, most people would just say "Wow what a retard" and move on.

The sum they are seeking could seriously hurt their legitimacy in front of a judge.

Well, if it is, as you claim, driven by "greed," you should take comfort in knowing that the range within which they can be "greedy" is limited between $250 and $1000, so, technically, they can't inflate their claim by any more than 400% or, put differently, by $750 per class member.

As to credibility, I'm willing to bet that if the judge presiding over the case has seen 100 of this type of case, all 100 of them start out with a request for the maximum $1000 penalty. And isn't seeing that fact as reflecting in any way on the merits of the case because, as the game's referee, the judge knows, just like the players do, how the game gets played. In fact, I'll bet if you started out by requesting the $250 minimum, he'd be sitting up on the bench, scratching his head, wondering WTF's up with that.

 

[Danpascooch]

Don't Gamestop's everywhere do this? And all I get asked when I pre-order something is my phone number... and my license to show I'm 18(actually 19, but old enough to buy M rated games). When I buy I just get asked for the ID.

Yep: If you're buying something with a credit card you need to present it so the last four numbers of it can be punched in. That's everywhere though, as far as I know, so long as the purchase is $15 - $25 or more.

At gamestop however (in Maryland at least) you now also need to provide two forms of ID, anything issued by the state (well...any state really) and anything else be it a credit card or something.

Anyway: This whole things sounds stupid. It could have either been easily avoided or, it's something the customer is blowing up for no good reason. I've had people get uppity about me asking for their phone number and/or, their e-mail while trying to sign them up for power-up rewards. Sorry, I've been working retail since about 09. I have kind of a Randal outlook where customers are concerned.


Granted, that video applies more to when I was working at Blockbuster...

I think GameStop went beyond the last four digits of the card number. It looks like they record the entire card number. Which they have no need to do that I can see. When the swipe the card or enter it's number at the terminal connected to the card-issuer, all the information that the card-issuer needs to honor the debt on behalf on their cardholder is transmitted. Why does GameStop need my full card number and personal information in order for the transaction to be honored by my cardholder? They don't. They're just fishing for information they can use for their own personal purposes (mailing lists, complying customer demographic statistics, etc., etc.)

I agree, they deserve a slap on the wrist for this.

You have to agree that $1000 a person is absolutely bat fuck insane though

That depends on why GameStop wants the information and what they plan to do with it. If that use -- whatever it is -- is of great financial value to them (which I suspect it is or they wouldn't be doing it the first place), then the financial penalty for their wrongdoing needs to be greater than their financial gain from the wrongdoing or there's no incentive for them to cease doing wrong. They'll do the cost-benefit analysis and conclude that even with the slap on the wrist, there's still financial gain in continuing their illegal conduct.

If I steal $100 and get caught and fined $75, why should I stop stealing? I'm still $25 ahead of the game (no pun intended).

I wouldn't worry about that, they could be harvesting and selling the blood of each customer and they wouldn't come anywhere near $1000 a person.

How much do you think a name and phone number is worth anyway? They obviously aren't selling the credit card information to criminals otherwise this headline would look more like Angry Customers With Stolen Identities Burn Down Gamestop

I think they deserve some sort of penalty, but $1000 a person? Absolutely insane.

I dunno about that. If they're using the information to compile mailing lists and then selling or trading those mailing lists to or with other companies (which many businesses do), the financial benefit from that (either in terms of sales generated by mailing list campaigns or from the outright sale of lists) could be worth well in excess of $1000 a pop. A mailing list of consumers with credit cards who have been positively identified as willing to plop down their cards on a particular product or service can be worth its weight in gold.

No mailing list in the history of the world has ever been worth $1000 a person for a name and phone number, ever. It's clear they aren't selling the credit card numbers or else identity theft would be rampant among their customers.

If you can show any evidence otherwise I'll eat my own face.

Putting aside the fact that it isn't a mailing list if all you've got is a name and phone number and citing the following example:

A friend of mine is known to regularly lose more than $100,000 a time on his trips to Las Vegas. He's very well know by the Wynn folks, who regularly e-mail him invitations with offers of complimentary rooms, All-Star game tickets, etc., etc. They've shared his mailing information with the other casinos in town who also regularly mail him invites and comp offers. What do you think the value of a casino's mailing list of high-rollers could be?

A hell of a lot, how much do you think Gamestop could make per person though? They already shop at Gamestop after all, with the prices of videogames being more or less universally set as far as retail goes, how is an email or two going to change where they shop? Much less generate $1000 a head.

I'm not saying they shouldn't be penalized, but $1000 a person? Really?

Keep in mind that the $1000 is the maximum civil penalty allowed by the law ($250 being the minimum). Any attorney worth their salt is gonna ask for the maximum (whether or not they truly believe that's what their clients should fairly be compensated). You know the old saying: "Ask for steak. If all you get is hamburger, that ain't bad. You still got something to eat."

And think of the millions of dollars that GameStop spends on advertising every year. If the demographic information about their customers they illegally collect can help them focus the scope of that advertising and improve the dollar-spent-on-advertising to dollar-generated-by-advertising ratio by as little as 5%, that's pretty significant.

I understand that, and that's exactly my point. It's a ridiculous sum chosen out of greed, not out of a desire for a legitimate reasonable penalty.

It's not necessarily greed. It could just as likely be good horse trading. No good horse trader starts out by asking for what they actually want. If they do, they'll almost certainly end up getting traded down to a point below that which they actually wanted. For example, if they though the case was worth exactly $300 per client and they actually ask for $300 per client and then the court tells them to work out some kind of settlement, where's the room to bargain? There is none. There's nowhere to go but down from the initial $300 request (the "fair" price). That's just the way the horse trading game gets played. You gotta start out by requesting more than you actually think you deserve or you'll get less than you think you actually deserve. That's not "greed." That's "common sense."

"I go low, you go high. I know the game." - Tony Montana, "Scarface"

Yeah but there is such a thing as starting too high, if I was selling my old Xbox 360 and asked $1000 for it hoping to haggle down, most people would just say "Wow what a retard" and move on.

The sum they are seeking could seriously hurt their legitimacy in front of a judge.

It is very common for civil suits to ask for extreme amounts because everyone, except you obviously, knows that you start high because you will likely be pushed down anyway. This isn't a garage sale and they aren't selling anything to Gamestop.

Why start so high if you know for a fact you will just be talked down? It looks illegitimate and greedy.