Gaming as a subculture
- Thread starter Icyshadow
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I made a similar thread about what defines a 'gamer' some months ago and the concensus was, "duh, a person that more or less regularly plays games". Not a lot of mystery to it. And there's no 'membership', either you think you belong to a culture or you don't. The King of Games isn't going to stamp your forehead with the Seal of Approval. You don't need to be accepted, you need to feel like you belong.
Stereotypes, I dunno... gamers are lazy, fat, sloppy and asocial virgins? I dunno, all of the 'gamers' I know are pretty physically fit and lead rich and productive lives. They're not Comic Book Guy.
Stereotypes, I dunno... gamers are lazy, fat, sloppy and asocial virgins? I dunno, all of the 'gamers' I know are pretty physically fit and lead rich and productive lives. They're not Comic Book Guy.
1) The willingness to play any types of games.
2) Well, we are a very angry bunch. I guess it's for good reason, considering all of the bullshit we put ourselves through.
I'm usually very accepting of who constitutes as a gamer as I know that I indulge in a bit of casual gaming sometimes, despite a good number of us going nuts over that. -.-
2) Well, we are a very angry bunch. I guess it's for good reason, considering all of the bullshit we put ourselves through.
I'm usually very accepting of who constitutes as a gamer as I know that I indulge in a bit of casual gaming sometimes, despite a good number of us going nuts over that. -.-
He's probably too busy dueling to bother with stamps anyway.Johnny Novgorod said:
OT: You're a part of any given subculture if you show a noted interest in that subculture.
As far as stereotypes are concerned, they're pretty well-known. Overweight, neckbeards, socially inept, childish, whatever. And as with any stereotype, some people will fit the bill, but they by no means represent the majority.
My answer is different than most. To first understand what it is, I must explain what it is not: it does not include fandom, how "hardcore" you label yourself, the kind of conventions you go to, the amount of hours you sink into a game, the people you hang out with, what you look like, nor the kind of games you play.
Instead, I believe if one gets the label of "gamer" it is the same as one who is labeled a "bookworm" or a "film buff". It means that one is well versed in the medium and frequently talks about theory; it means that one not only enjoys, but understands the experience given to the medium that they excel at. A gamer is someone who talks about interactive theory, such as the idea of avatar strength; a gamer talks about why Amnesia is scary and Resident Evil 5 isn't by talking about the core mechanics; a gamer analyses why the mechanics of a fighting game "feel" better than another's. A "gamer" may or may not want to work in the industry, but he/she at least understands it.
So... that's the "gamer" subculture in a nutshell. It's surpassing the passive role of a player. As a collective, everything else follows.
Instead, I believe if one gets the label of "gamer" it is the same as one who is labeled a "bookworm" or a "film buff". It means that one is well versed in the medium and frequently talks about theory; it means that one not only enjoys, but understands the experience given to the medium that they excel at. A gamer is someone who talks about interactive theory, such as the idea of avatar strength; a gamer talks about why Amnesia is scary and Resident Evil 5 isn't by talking about the core mechanics; a gamer analyses why the mechanics of a fighting game "feel" better than another's. A "gamer" may or may not want to work in the industry, but he/she at least understands it.
So... that's the "gamer" subculture in a nutshell. It's surpassing the passive role of a player. As a collective, everything else follows.
If one's hobby is gaming. Shock! Horror! Mass panic! Revelations of this magnitude are known to cause these and more.Icyshadow said:
Too many to easily recount, mostly negative ones, and none are universally true but at least partially. Then again, gamers are such a huge and diverse lot that it'd be hard to make a statement that isn't true for at least some of them (assuming the statement is based in reality). But for a shorter answer I'd go with "no".Icyshadow said:
Apparently, the answer is "being willing to put up with a shitty product that doesn't work on launch, and not being able to get a refund."
'cos anything else you buy, you aren't just entitled to a refund, you wouldn't think it's unusual to get an apology and restitution.
'cos anything else you buy, you aren't just entitled to a refund, you wouldn't think it's unusual to get an apology and restitution.
I was more or less asking, What does it mean to be a 'gamer'? Just because you play angry birds on your phone 4 hours a week, does that make you a gamer? I think there is a distinction to be made here. It takes more than participating in aspects of a subculture to be a part of it. Just because someone reads a few pieces of literature and enjoys them does not make them a 'bookworm'. There's a certain amount of dedication, at least to me there is. I've known friends who have logged hours into sims, but not once would they have considered themselves a gamer. It seems to me that we're just settling with, anyone who plays any type of videogame is a gamer. Am I wrong?
Is one's hobby gaming? They are a gamer. Is one's hobby literature? They are...into books ("bookworm" isn't really the same). Is one's hobby collecting stamps? They are tamp collectors. And so on and so forth. Nobody is claiming that just buying some stamps makes you a stamp collector, probably you wouldn't identify as one either. Unless that actually is your hobby. It's that simple - "is it your hobby?" - surely one can figure out what a hobby is and how it works, I wouldn't think I have to explain that.Icyshadow said:
DoPo said:
I would almost argue hobby gets just as convoluted, due to the fact that it is then utterly based off of how you view yourself. Two people could play exactly the same games, log the same amount of hours and have the exact same involvement in gaming, but one could say that they just play games to pass the time and the other could say that it is their hobby, and thus that would make the latter a gamer and the former not, even though they are identical in all other ways.
A member of the gaming subculture is largely someone who considers themselves a member of the gaming subculture. One does not simply say they're a gamer if they aren't, it's a very particular interest and not an enviable one.
If I had to give a more objective definition I'd say it's someone who involves themselves with gaming outside of the games themselves. Keeping up with news, participating in forums, reading/writing reviews, and has a general idea of the industry beyond the products.
As for stereotypes, the public generally thinks of antisocial shut-ins with no friends, who may or may not be fat and/or unshaven, whereas within gaming there are a great many stereotypes including self-proclaimed hardcore gamers, who take themselves too seriously and look down upon indie or mobile games, and may restrict themselves to certain series or genres by principle, casual gamers, to whom playing videogames isn't more enjoyable than a variety of other activities, or are only interested in simple or easy games, or do not make any effort to understand a game beyond the basics, and many more.
Are they true? Inevitably, to an extent. But not all the time.
If I had to give a more objective definition I'd say it's someone who involves themselves with gaming outside of the games themselves. Keeping up with news, participating in forums, reading/writing reviews, and has a general idea of the industry beyond the products.
As for stereotypes, the public generally thinks of antisocial shut-ins with no friends, who may or may not be fat and/or unshaven, whereas within gaming there are a great many stereotypes including self-proclaimed hardcore gamers, who take themselves too seriously and look down upon indie or mobile games, and may restrict themselves to certain series or genres by principle, casual gamers, to whom playing videogames isn't more enjoyable than a variety of other activities, or are only interested in simple or easy games, or do not make any effort to understand a game beyond the basics, and many more.
Are they true? Inevitably, to an extent. But not all the time.
If you play games, and associate yourself with games enough that you care to consider yourself a gamer, then you are one.
That's all there is to it. That's all there should be to it as far as I am concerned. It's all the criteria we need and anything beyond that just becomes condescending. It's something that you should dub yourself, not allow others to dub you.
As far as stereotypes. I would say they are not any more or less true than the stereotypes of any group. There are certainly grounds for their existence, but they are almost always blown out of proportion. Though it is difficult to firmly answer a question like this without going into specifics.
That's all there is to it. That's all there should be to it as far as I am concerned. It's all the criteria we need and anything beyond that just becomes condescending. It's something that you should dub yourself, not allow others to dub you.
As far as stereotypes. I would say they are not any more or less true than the stereotypes of any group. There are certainly grounds for their existence, but they are almost always blown out of proportion. Though it is difficult to firmly answer a question like this without going into specifics.
So? Do we need a checklist now? Who is going to go through it - the High Overlords of Gaming Society (a.k.a. HOGS)? No, both people can go thorough the same motions but they can feel differently towards what they do - if one believes it to be a hobby, then it is their hobby.Icyshadow said:
Or maybe I'm wrong - how does it work with other hobbies? Because so far, any hobby I've taken up has been on a pretty much voluntary basis and I haven't been visited by any hobby police or anything in order to formalise my involvement. So tell me, where does the hobby police go to? I'd like to avoid that - sounds like something I won't like.
There's really no reason to get snarky... However, there is a certain amount of dedication involved. I'm not for trying to push on softcore gamers that they aren't real gamers. But there is something more to being a member of the gaming subculture that has evolved around our beloved hobby. My nieces play the nintendo wii, they may log maybe 6 hours a week, the older one also plays some old gameboy games on her computer that I put there for her, but I wouldn't consider her a member of the gaming community. Am I the only one that feels this way?DoPo said:
I just wrote a 9 page paper on the Hells Angels for a subculture assignment.
I considered doing either gamers or hackers instead, but decided I was too close to those and I'd have a better time with the Angels.
I think what you have to realize is that Gamers and the Gamer Subculture are very big umbrella terms. A Gamer is basically anyone who plays video games on some regular basis and considers themself one. You see different Gamer Subcultures and communities sprout up around different genres, games, etc. I can guaruntee you that the kind of discussions going on here differ then those going on over at No Mutants Allowed, 4chan, or even the XBox forums. And to be appart of the subculture, it really all comes down to two questions: Do you consider yourself a member, and do others consider you a member. Of course, you can go on from those to define the kind of song-and-dance you have to have to pass as a member, but those two ideas stand as a firm basis.
As for the stereotypes? The idea of the "Gamer" has changed greatly over the last couple years. It's no longer The Comic Book Guy from The Simpsons. Just as anyone who plays games can consider themselves a gamer, the stereotype has changed to incorporate just about anyone.
I considered doing either gamers or hackers instead, but decided I was too close to those and I'd have a better time with the Angels.
I think what you have to realize is that Gamers and the Gamer Subculture are very big umbrella terms. A Gamer is basically anyone who plays video games on some regular basis and considers themself one. You see different Gamer Subcultures and communities sprout up around different genres, games, etc. I can guaruntee you that the kind of discussions going on here differ then those going on over at No Mutants Allowed, 4chan, or even the XBox forums. And to be appart of the subculture, it really all comes down to two questions: Do you consider yourself a member, and do others consider you a member. Of course, you can go on from those to define the kind of song-and-dance you have to have to pass as a member, but those two ideas stand as a firm basis.
As for the stereotypes? The idea of the "Gamer" has changed greatly over the last couple years. It's no longer The Comic Book Guy from The Simpsons. Just as anyone who plays games can consider themselves a gamer, the stereotype has changed to incorporate just about anyone.
Which is already covered under the term "hobby".Icyshadow said:
What is a "subculture"? And why is there only one of it? Surely you don't believe all gamers are the same, now do you - because that is really weird. I'd imagine strategy players form one subculture, RPG fans would form another, FPS ones another and so on. And there would be some overlaps, like, say, here on the Escapist. You'd find a people with different interests interacting but they aren't the same. Yet, there is a certain other similarities due to sharing the microcosm. There are many subcultures not just one. And as such, why wouldn't there be a subculture for certain type of people that like more casual games?Icyshadow said:
Well are they a part of the gaming community? I would have thought that to be part of the community you'd have to interact and so on with it. You know - be part of the community. My father plays games - FPSes and RTSes mainly. I think he is dedicated enough for even you to acknowledge him as a gamer - it is his hobby. He isn't part of the community however - he doesn't really interact with many other gamers. Similarly, to be part of the Escapist community you'd have to visit the forums and such.Icyshadow said:
But let me turn the tables again on you - how do other hobbies do it? How would you determine who belongs and doesn't belong to another hobby? And why is it different in gaming?
Subculture defined: an ethnic, regional, economic, or social group exhibiting characteristic patterns of behavior sufficient to distinguish it from others within an embracing culture or societyDoPo said:
Of course, there are subcultures within subcultures, naturally that makes sense. With books, there are little pocket subcultures formed around fiction and then the sff genre, additionally, there's a further break down of fantasy within that and even high or epic fantasy from there. I know, so very painful to follow. But there still remains a larger subculture overarching that of bibliophiles. That at least should make sense to you.
First, let's settle the distinction between hobby and subculture. They are in fact different things.
Hobby Defined: a pursuit outside one's regular occupation engaged in especially for relaxation.
As you can tell, these are two rather different definitions.
At no point did I argue that people couldn't consider something they themselves consider their hobby, their hobby. Anything can be anyone's hobby as long as they actually do said activity. I am, however, arguing that the gaming subculture holds itself apart from just anyone who plays videogames. Similarly, just because I go to the gym three or four times a week does not make me a member of the body builder subculture. And my friend rides his skateboard around campus, and he would consider it kind of a hobby, he goes in to the skateboard shop to get new stuff for it to make it run well, but he'd be the first to tell you he's not a member of the skating subculture.
Does this really not make sense to you?