GDC 2010: Sid Meier's: My Five Bads

[boholikeu]

Not all those were bad ideas. The randomness and Gold giving were great ideas I thought.

The randomness would help break up the monotony of the games and keep you on your toes.

Actually, high impact randomness like that is one of the biggest sins of game design. Like he mentioned in the speech, small level randomness can make a game more interesting if it's used correctly, but if you make it too big a factor in the game it completely ruins the point of interactivity.

And for the gold thing, people would give gold to others. They would probably just have to ask.

Yeah, I was surprised about the gold giving. It's a pretty important part of diplomacy in the single-player game, so it seems odd that it wouldn't work in multi-player. One would hope that at least the diplomatic trading options of the previous games would be available in newer versions.

My guess is the gold thing didn't work out because the players didn't have a clear idea of how it could benefit them. IE If you just have a "give gold to player X button" of course it's never going to be pressed. On the other hand, if you implement a diplomacy or trade interface people are going to be much more likely to give gold to each other.

 

[daishonato]

Do you know what your biggest mistake was, Sid?

Alpha Centauri 2. And the fact that it has not happened yet.

I'm sorry to sound like a broken record, but I WANT MORE CHARON!

Still playing that damn game, 11 years on, and still put Sister Miriam in every game just to wipe her off the face of Planet...

 

[Phantomxd]

i know you guys want a alpha centuri 2 and it might not happen ... for a while (think fallout series)

but how many of you played the x-pack alien crossfire 8 new fractiuons + more go check it out.

Now im off to play Sid Meier's Alien Crossfire SMAC ^^ laters foolz

 

[SpeechMan]

I'm disappointed that he skipped Covert Action rule, I would really have wanted to hear what it is. Covert Action is IMO a great game, one that would definitely deserve a remake, there are just so many aspects of the game that are already really good and with little work could be really great.

I just hope the Covert Action rule was not something that means there will never be a new Covert Action game.

edit:: Thought about it for a while, I think the Covert Action rule is something to the lines of "never mix several games into one". I hope it's not, cause that kind of mixing can work, it's hard to make it work, but it's possible.

 

[MadeinHell]

Not all those were bad ideas. The randomness and Gold giving were great ideas I thought.

The randomness would help break up the monotony of the games and keep you on your toes.

Actually, high impact randomness like that is one of the biggest sins of game design. Like he mentioned in the speech, small level randomness can make a game more interesting if it's used correctly, but if you make it too big a factor in the game it completely ruins the point of interactivity.

True. To say it in other words. For example in Diablo 2 you have a randomness system that works perfect. Since all it does is creating random corridors and random loot in the areas.
Now imagine yourself that the game is completely random along the storyline. So you get to a low level dungeon and since the game is random you end up getting killed by a high level monster who appeared there since he was allowed to. Full randomness while it might be a cool mechanic when you think about it usually ends up just as being annoying and frustrating. Some games (that names I sadly completely cant remember now >_<) had full randomness and for me they ended up completely unplayable.
+ I completely agree with Sid about the "paranoia" factor of such solution. I always start thinking "Hey! My computer did that on purpose!" when something unexpected that completely owns me happens. That includes random game crashes in most important moments xP.

PS. I would absolutely want to see the "rise and fall" mechanic in one of Civ games. I always like it when something like that happens in the game since it creates additional challenge in the phase of the game in which you can basically whale on everything. Your enemies, your economy (you are so rich you don't even care) etc. etc.
Plus it would force you to invest in those little cities you created in the late stage of the game and that basically got forgotten...

 

[MadeinHell]

I'm terribly sorry for double post :-<.
My internet is stupid...

 

[Michael Keating]

Wait, wasn't that six bads?

 

[TraderJimmy]

Not all those were bad ideas. The randomness and Gold giving were great ideas I thought.

The randomness would help break up the monotony of the games and keep you on your toes.

Actually, high impact randomness like that is one of the biggest sins of game design. Like he mentioned in the speech, small level randomness can make a game more interesting if it's used correctly, but if you make it too big a factor in the game it completely ruins the point of interactivity.

True. To say it in other words. For example in Diablo 2 you have a randomness system that works perfect. Since all it does is creating random corridors and random loot in the areas.
Now imagine yourself that the game is completely random along the storyline. So you get to a low level dungeon and since the game is random you end up getting killed by a high level monster who appeared there since he was allowed to. Full randomness while it might be a cool mechanic when you think about it usually ends up just as being annoying and frustrating. Some games (that names I sadly completely cant remember now >_<) had full randomness and for me they ended up completely unplayable.
+ I completely agree with Sid about the "paranoia" factor of such solution. I always start thinking "Hey! My computer did that on purpose!" when something unexpected that completely owns me happens. That includes random game crashes in most important moments xP.

PS. I would absolutely want to see the "rise and fall" mechanic in one of Civ games. I always like it when something like that happens in the game since it creates additional challenge in the phase of the game in which you can basically whale on everything. Your enemies, your economy (you are so rich you don't even care) etc. etc.
Plus it would force you to invest in those little cities you created in the late stage of the game and that basically got forgotten...

I love 'fully' random games (they're never totally fully random, anyway). But yeah, you can still learn ways to control and limit the randomness in any finished product. It makes games more difficult, more entertaining. I just like it.