GDC 2011: EMP Expert Supports Realism of Homefront

Thaluikhain

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cheywoodward said:
A nuclear strike on an American city would have a casualty rate far greater than the 90% Dr. Forstchen predicts would exist a year after an EMP strike mere hours after the nuclear missile hit said city.
Actually, no, a nuclear attack on a city wouldn't have anywhere near those level of casualties (Stuart Slade, one of the people whose jobs it is to decide where to initiate nuclear devices for the most damage (!) mentioned how a 1 megaton device being used on London would leave 85% of the people, and 90% of the property).

However, the EMP attack that kills 90% of the US's population in a year would only work if it can somehow blanket the entire US simultaneously. Hit one city with it, and it'd mess things up, but the rest of the US sends help before too many people die...I'd compare the situation to New Orleans after Katrina.
 

ObsessiveSketch

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I think the funniest thing is that they show that Japan is the first country to be annexed. I had myself a little chuckle at that. Go after the south eastern islands, south of china? It'll be more like Vietnam, with talk of the US 'not belonging there' or 'sticking their nose into other countries' business. If it's Japan, one of our closest allies? No way. The war won't even get to American soil, Kim Jong Il will have lost right there.
 

lowkey_jotunn

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The whole theory falls apart in the delivery. There's no feasible way to blanket the entire US with an EMP shock-wave at the same time.

And even if somehow their was; even in the crazy implausible scenario where they DO manage to EMP out the entire continental US... that's not all of us. Not by a long shot. We still have many many military bass in places like Japan, Europe, Hawaii, and others. And even those remote bases contain more than enough firepower to ensure the destruction of our enemies and return home to help stabilize the mainland

And, while yes, getting all of our infrastructure fried would be a mite inconvenient... how do you think it all got there in the first place? We built it. We would build it again. And for the stuff we didn't build, we'd just ask Japan to send us replacements ;)
 

instantbenz

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I love crazy people. They make me chuckle. Every weapon made will be used ... I put a match on a hammer one time ... Firehammer! ... I don't think the army's going to take me up on the offer
 

Mikeyfell

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I like that guy.
He knows how to market his game.
EA could take a few pointers from him.



[sub]You can all tell I'm being sarcastic right? Because if there's even one of you that doesn't think I'm being sarcastic I'm killing my self right now. [sub]Before the EMP goes off.[/sub][/sub]
 

Killerbunny001

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1. EMP weapons are far far away from being a reality.
2. Why do some Americans hate other nations so much ? And why the need to induce fear in their compatriots ? No trolling intended I just don`t get that. I`m from a eastern European country that has been through hell it`s entire history but we don`t have the same hate and fear inducing techniques. Where do those people draw this mentality from ?
 

JnRocco

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I'm not going to get into too much detail here, I just simply wanted to put this out there for those curious about the back story.

Here is the timeline pulled from the Homefront website. It helps fill in a lot of questions surrounding how all of this takes place.
http://www.homefront-game.com/#/timeline
 

mb16

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yay for living in England i guess. Also really really people? some of you are acting like the cold war is still on
 

Kruxs

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I was interested in this game, now I'm not. I respect developers taking on taboo and controversial subject matter, but if the message they're trying to get out is, "The only good communist is a DEAD COMMUNIST!", I will not indulge them with this jingoistic bullshit. Oddly enough, it was the two videos of the suicide bomber and the captured Korean soldier that had sparked my interest because it drew such obvious parallels to what has happen in the wars in the Middle East. It turns those wars on its ear and reverses the role of the Occupying Force that America so often finds itself and could change the way we Americans, who have never been through an occupation by a foreign military, look at war. But after watching this, I'm only filled with contempt and disgust.

As for Dr. Forstchen, I'll admit that I don't know enough about EMP's or electronics's to challenge his theories on a weaponize one. That said, his statement that all weapons are eventually used is just not true. There are lists of weapons that were developed, tested, and manufactured for war but were never actually used, like the Ekranoplan. People might say I'm picking apart words, but claiming to be such a "Military Historian" I would think he would choose his words a little more carefully. Otherwise, I assume he thinks people who play games aren't very bright. What really turned me off was his advocating the U.S. congress to impose a more aggressive foreign policy on a country we already put intense sanctions on to the point where the people living there have to eat grass to survive and have openly express going to war with said country.

This man may be an expert on a lot of things, but foreign policy is not one of them and making such claims without some hard facts is totally irresponsible. I'm no fan of the Korean Workers Party or the "Dear Leader"(who deserves a bullet in the brain), but using this or any other medium to entice fear and xenophobia is deplorable and boarders on propaganda. I only hope that Kaos studios puts little more class and consideration into their finale product and THQ won't bring out any more "experts" to promote their game.
 

farscythe

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lowkey_jotunn said:
The whole theory falls apart in the delivery. There's no feasible way to blanket the entire US with an EMP shock-wave at the same time.

And even if somehow their was; even in the crazy implausible scenario where they DO manage to EMP out the entire continental US... that's not all of us. Not by a long shot. We still have many many military bass in places like Japan, Europe, Hawaii, and others. And even those remote bases contain more than enough firepower to ensure the destruction of our enemies and return home to help stabilize the mainland

And, while yes, getting all of our infrastructure fried would be a mite inconvenient... how do you think it all got there in the first place? We built it. We would build it again. And for the stuff we didn't build, we'd just ask Japan to send us replacements ;)
but.. least in the story i got the us pulled all its outside forces back into the country.
and some how i doubt you'll get a lot of help from japan after its been annexed by korea :p
 

scw55

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Does scare mongering really have to be used to sell a video game? Isn't that why we have Politicians? They're the ones who are meant to make us shit scareless...

Btw, the sun will zap our electricity as well in a few years. Yes, the world seems grimmer than ever. Atleast we don't have the bubonic plague and life expecancy is the longest ever.
 

cheywoodward

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thaluikhain said:
cheywoodward said:
A nuclear strike on an American city would have a casualty rate far greater than the 90% Dr. Forstchen predicts would exist a year after an EMP strike mere hours after the nuclear missile hit said city.
Actually, no, a nuclear attack on a city wouldn't have anywhere near those level of casualties (Stuart Slade, one of the people whose jobs it is to decide where to initiate nuclear devices for the most damage (!) mentioned how a 1 megaton device being used on London would leave 85% of the people, and 90% of the property).

However, the EMP attack that kills 90% of the US's population in a year would only work if it can somehow blanket the entire US simultaneously. Hit one city with it, and it'd mess things up, but the rest of the US sends help before too many people die...I'd compare the situation to New Orleans after Katrina.
Is Mr. Slade talking about the immediate effect of the bomb or is he also including deaths from long term radiation poisoning?
 

Thaluikhain

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cheywoodward said:
Is Mr. Slade talking about the immediate effect of the bomb or is he also including deaths from long term radiation poisoning?
Immediate effects, I think, though apparently the most effective way of killing people immediately (initiating the device high above the ground) is also less effective at generating fallout.
 

Slycne

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lowkey_jotunn said:
The whole theory falls apart in the delivery. There's no feasible way to blanket the entire US with an EMP shock-wave at the same time.
According to these scientist [http://www.fas.org/nuke/intro/nuke/emp.htm], a single large nuclear device detonated 400-500km above Kansas would cover all of CONUS, contiguous United States. So it's quite the opposite of 'not feasible'.
 

lowkey_jotunn

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Slycne said:
According to these scientist [http://www.fas.org/nuke/intro/nuke/emp.htm], a single large nuclear device detonated 400-500km above Kansas would cover all of CONUS, contiguous United States. So it's quite the opposite of 'not feasible'.
The plausibility of such a weapon still leaves the problem of delivery. I.E. how is an enemy going to launch an ICBM over Kansas without us noticing and stopping them.

According to the speaker in the video, this is a very real possibility in our lifetime. Considering NK can barely muster a missile with range to hit Japan, I'm going to file that claim under "doubtful". Their best public test (and it's kinda hard to hide a missile test that covered several hundred miles) is about 400 kilometers, just under 250 miles. Launching one ~7500 miles to central US? Not exactly an eminent threat

Maybe a long long time in the future, NK or some other enemy might have that kind of range, but by then, our defenses will have improved significantly as well. And of course, you've gotta know that anything you or I have thought of, the military has thought of, tested, revised and perfected ;)
 

Feriluce

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Therumancer said:
Blayze2k said:
IT *WILL* HAPPEN AND EVERYONE WILL DIE!

-_-'

That's some pretty intense sensationalism, there. Not to mention propaganda.
Fear-based politics are disgusting.
And while the game seems like it could have an interesting premise, this crap makes me not want to buy it.

Well, as far as that part goes he's right to an extent. Truthfully the USA is not as assertive as it needs to be, in that we are allowing foreign space programs and such to go ahead unopposed, making it increasingly probable that nations like North Korea, China, and others are going to put things in space. We already have China using lasers to blind our spy satellites.
I'm sorry. Allowing foreign space programs? What exactly do you plan on doing? Invading every country with a space program? If you tried that, I'm quite certain you'd regret it very quickly.
That attitude of yours really does disgust me though. That americans eve think like that just make me dislike the country as a whole even more than I usually do.
 

Rad Party God

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Kalezian said:
I refuse to live in a world where we are pushed back into 1950's-1970's nuclear weapon fears, and if that is fear-based politics, then we are officially screwed.
I'd like to see, 30 or 40 years after this "EMP hysteria" if someone develops a new "Fallout" with a post apocalyptic world with it's new Pip-boy and everything. "EMPtiness" would be an appropriate name.

OT: Heh, fear invoking prapaganda to sell a game?, I can't see this going well, another reason for me to not buy this game.
 

Rad Party God

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Feriluce said:
That attitude of yours really does disgust me though. That americans eve think like that just make me dislike the country as a whole even more than I usually do.
Don't blame America, it's a great continent. Just Blame the US, not the continent.
 

ultrachicken

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What a lot of people don't seem to understand here is that Homefront takes place in a scenario where the U.S. has lost most of its wealth. America wouldn't have such a strong military, no bases around the world from which it could respond to hostility.