Geek-Filled College Has Required Social Skills Classes

Clemenstation

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Flionk said:
And this sort of behavior definitely transfers to the office. A friend of mine had a co-op (basically a paid internship) with IBM this past year, working on the Lotus Symphony program suite. He was assigned to work with another co-op on making a calculator plugin. Now this guy knew programming, and he really knew calculators (and would often brag that he owns more than 100 calculators). But whenever the project needed some sort of graphical work done, this guy would have to go to the graphics design people and tell them what he needs. From what I gather, he was completely incapable of clearly explaining what it was that he wanted, and when the graphic he received wasn't exactly what he had pictured in his head he would berate and insult the designer. On at least one occasion he made someone cry by shouting at them. It got to the point where the graphics designers outright refused to work with him. He was eventually fired for this.
Good anecdote. This is pretty much what I pictured when the article mentioned 'social skills', or lack thereof. I'm not 100% sure that working in a malleable fashion with other human beings is something that can necessarily be acquired via training seminar, however. I suppose at the very least it'll drive home the point that these things matter out in the Real World.

Social skills might also apply to written communication, by the way. I've met some pretty smart programmer types whose formal emails read like the first 100 posts under a Zero Punctuation video.
 

Uncompetative

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Susan Arendt said:
harhol said:
Lol, as if social skills are needed in a programming job.
To program, no, but to interact with the rest of the company that hired you, yes. Nobody is going to want to deal with the IT guy who stinks or can't look you in the eye when he talks to you.
There is a very simple remedy:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pair_programming

Also, anyone who is a fan of The Big Bang Theory should take at look at this:

 

Rogue of Hearts

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***SHITTY ANALOGY ALERT*** It's like playing without a mic.

Without efficient communication, you and your team will suffer for it. You must be able to work with your team so that the job can be done, and the only way to do this is to communicate with your team. While it is true you can use emails and text messages, vocal communication can be much more productive in most cases. E-mailing the guy in the cubicle next to yours to ask if he has a file you need can result in you sitting there all day until he reads your email. Large/growing problems can be avoided by simply using basic social skills.
 

crypt-creature

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Doc Theta Sigma said:
... Is it seriously that hard to look people in the eyes when you're talking to them and to remember to shower?
It really shouldn't be hard to shower.

Personally, I have a problem with looking people in the eyes. It's uncomfortable, since it's a lot easier for people to read my emotions that way. Sometimes if people don't like what they see, anger, rage, annoyance, resistance, thinking that the person is just a complete idiot, it causes problems and they'll just act like a complete prick.
I don't like that, so I'd rather not make eye contact for a prolonged period of time. It's better for everyone, and a discussion has never been a problem anyway. Eye contact shouldn't be such a big deal.
 

SageOfCalm

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Here's a key difference. Pretend I'm in the workforce and need help with something.

"Hey, can you help me with this problem I'm not sure if this is the best way to handle the project."

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Normal Person - "Oh, sure.....yeah you know what you need to do this and it'll be fine.'

"Wow, thanks."

Normal Person - "Don't mention it, I ran into the same problem myself a couple years ago."

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Geek[monotone voice] - "Why don't you just Google it, geez."

"I tried that, I'm not finding anything."

Geek - "Well maybe you shouldn't work here then. What are they paying you for?"

"I'm just asking for your opinion."

Geek[blank stare at monitor] - "....."

"Man, what is your damage?"

Geek - "Excuse me, let's see what the boss thinks of how you just insulted me."
 

Sewblon

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Social interaction is not something you learn in school, it is something you learn in the real world. They won't really learn how to interact with others like adults until after they graduate.
 

Jackpot

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I study games programming at Teesside uni. Let me tell you, a 99% male course statistic is in no fucking way, Geek heaven.
 

GothmogII

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SageOfCalm said:
Here's a key difference. Pretend I'm in the workforce and need help with something.

"Hey, can you help me with this problem I'm not sure if this is the best way to handle the project."

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Normal Person - "Oh, sure.....yeah you know what you need to do this and it'll be fine.'

"Wow, thanks."

Normal Person - "Don't mention it, I ran into the same problem myself a couple years ago."

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Geek[monotone voice] - "Why don't you just Google it, geez."

"I tried that, I'm not finding anything."

Geek - "Well maybe you shouldn't work here then. What are they paying you for?"

"I'm just asking for your opinion."

Geek[blank stare at monitor] - "....."

"Man, what is your damage?"

Geek - "Excuse me, let's see what the boss thinks of how you just insulted me."
Please, just call a jerk a jerk. I've met people like the second person who were in no way 'geeks' yet still possessed that nebbish irritating persona that just gets up your skin.
 

Elf Defiler Korgan

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If you want specialist min-maxers, there is always a cost. The bad hygiene, the absence of social skills beyond online communication leads me to conclude, sadly, the dump-stat was charisma.

Most of them are employed post-graduation, there is a niche they fill in the corporate world with their maxed out specialised programming skills, so since the companies are grumbling that they are not the perfect puppets I'm of the mind it is just too bad for the managers. These hyper-specialists, due to their skills, should be able to get away with eccentricity and unusual behaviour. Or, it is just one societal segment (managerial professionals) attempting to modify another (entering professional programmers) through the university which is capitulating to the requests of the former.
 

Pappa_Smurf

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of course a lack of social skills wouldn't even be a problem if school students didn't shun their intellectual superiors
 

SenseOfTumour

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Without wishing to make this thread feel like impending Armageddon, we're facing a larger threat, we NEED geeks, we need intelligent, technically and scientifically minded people to advance the human race and its understanding of the world.

If they're not doing the basic things required to get relationships, they'll die out and we'll be left with a world full of jocks banging each others skulls together, drinking kegs and watching sports TV all day.

I'm not saying you should have to deal with these no life weirdos, I'm saying they need to realise that social functionality is an important part of existence too, and can't be ignored in favor of killing more bugs.

You don't have to sacrifice much, just get hygiene and social skills up to the level of 'guy who lives in a house and knows some people'.
 

Woe Is You

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SenseOfTumour said:
If they're not doing the basic things required to get relationships, they'll die out and we'll be left with a world full of jocks banging each others skulls together, drinking kegs and watching sports TV all day.
...this is assuming that being a geek is a hereditary trait, which I have a hard time believing.
 

Zac_Dai

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Flionk said:
I have a good idea of what this is on about, and honestly I'm surprised it hasn't come up sooner. As a working software engineer and former president of my college's gaming club, I've seen some fairly atrocious examples of poor social awareness, and I'm talking about more than just failing to bathe regularly.
The gaming club holds weekly meetings that basically amount to a bunch of TVs set up with consoles and games for people to jump into. For a good 2 years, we had one kid who brought in his own PS2 with Capcom vs SNK 2, and spent the entire meeting sitting by himself playing on Training mode. Occasionally someone would come by and play a match with him, but most meetings he would sit on his own for the full 3 hours. Every week. For 2 years.
One time we had Guitar Hero 3 set up, and one guy got on it and failed the opening to "Through the Fire and Flames" a good 50 times in a row. Listening to the same opening bar of a song I never liked in the first place repeated over and over was extremely annoying. We told him this. He continued playing. A bit later we warned him that if didn't cut it out, we'd pull the plug and send him off. He didn't stop. We pulled the plug and told him to leave. He literally threw down the guitar controller (lucky for him it wasn't damaged) and started shouting, acting indignant, and overall throwing a tantrum.
We've had occasions of people demanding refunds for their tournament fees after being eliminated, claiming some complaint about our rules (which were clearly available for them to read before they entered).
And this sort of behavior definitely transfers to the office. A friend of mine had a co-op (basically a paid internship) with IBM this past year, working on the Lotus Symphony program suite. He was assigned to work with another co-op on making a calculator plugin. Now this guy knew programming, and he really knew calculators (and would often brag that he owns more than 100 calculators). But whenever the project needed some sort of graphical work done, this guy would have to go to the graphics design people and tell them what he needs. From what I gather, he was completely incapable of clearly explaining what it was that he wanted, and when the graphic he received wasn't exactly what he had pictured in his head he would berate and insult the designer. On at least one occasion he made someone cry by shouting at them. It got to the point where the graphics designers outright refused to work with him. He was eventually fired for this.

This is what they mean by 'basic social skills'. It's not a matter of whether they'll go out and get drunk with the guys; it's a matter of being able to understand the concept that other people have needs and emotions, and that ignoring or disregarding the needs and emotions of others is rude. Now by the time these folks are in college, this behavior will be fairly difficult to fix, but by forcing them to be lectured on it and grading them on their ability to play nice, it is possible to curb the more drastic problems.

On the other side, there are of course the people who are simply introverted who've never been good at speaking with others or expressing themselves clearly. I was like that back when I started college. Forcing myself to interact with the gaming club did wonders for my public speaking and overall ability to interact socially. I still wouldn't go out drinking with the guys, and I generally keep to myself at my cube, but now if someone approaches me at work to start a conversation, or to ask about something work-related, I'm perfectly able to respond to them in a way that they understand and we can get along just fine - and to a business, that means productivity, which is all they really want from you.

So in conclusion, these sort of classes are a good thing, and given the rise of online social networks I honestly feel that most schools would do good to require that students learn about proper real-world human interaction.
Very nice post.

I really don't its such a terribe thing to ask for better communication skills from people, its not like you're asking for the bloody world.

Also its a terrible excuse to say that you have to sacrifice social skills just to be at the top of your game.
 

SageOfCalm

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What they need to do is get an office bully. Geeks are inherently evil and the bullies are around to keep them in check. Without the bully geeks just do whatever evil things they want.
 

Woe Is You

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SageOfCalm said:
What they need to do is get an office bully. Geeks are inherently evil and the bullies are around to keep them in check. Without the bully geeks just do whatever evil things they want.
I'm not sure if you're joking but based on your previous post, you aren't, so I can assure you: hiring guys who pretty much turn your brainpower into a bunch of resentful crackers bent on causing harm really isn't the way to be doing these things.
 

Tharwen

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Susan Arendt said:
harhol said:
Lol, as if social skills are needed in a programming job.
To program, no, but to interact with the rest of the company that hired you, yes. Nobody is going to want to deal with the IT guy who stinks or can't look you in the eye when he talks to you.
Actually I know someone who hired a severely autistic man for his computing firm because he was amazing at what he had to do for the job.