Gender equality

[Dyme]

Ask yourself if there are ANY women stronger then ANY men. If the answer is no, you are lying to yourself in order to continue your sexist argument.

So if I say, a human being has 2 arms and 2 legs it is wrong because there might be individuals that have more or less? Do I really need to say the average men is stronger than the average women and an average human has 2 arms and 2 legs?

 

[Sarge034]

Ask yourself if there are ANY women stronger then ANY men. If the answer is no, you are lying to yourself in order to continue your sexist argument.

So if I say, a human being has 2 arms and 2 legs it is wrong because there might be individuals that have more or less? Do I really need to say the average men is stronger than the average women and an average human has 2 arms and 2 legs?

As a blanket statement it would be incorrect, just like saying that all men are stronger than all women. At least if you said most men have more upper body strength than women it would not have come across as completely sexist.

 

[Mr.Squishy]

Let me explain my attitude slowly, in a way that hopefully will not make feminists castrate me. I am for Equality. 50/50. Half and half. I am not sure if we're on the number one spot, but here in Norway we're touted as being very gender equal, and I am inclined to believe it. Women here can choose to be whatever they want, as can men (one of our biggest celebrities is a hairdressing guy who's apparently really good at it). Women are also free to join the army, although they can opt out. Men don't have that option, unless they don't pass the requirements to join. What bothers me a bit is how hard a hold Affirmative action has got here. If a man and a woman apply for the same job, and the man is genuinely better suited for the job, but the company has filled their "quota" of how many men they can have, the woman will get the job. I am not trying to be sexist, I swear to [Insert Non-denominational deity or pantheon], I merely think the one proven to be the most qualified to enter a position should do so. Or am I missing the point here? And I am also trying to keep in mind that men and women have differences both physically and mentally, but not judge based upon them. Still feminists would blast me as a male chauvinist with views tinted by male priveliege and patriarchy, or so experience tells me. Which I do not find to hold true; I love women - I love men too (yay for being bi =P) - some of my best friends are female, and I tend to write mostly about female main characters, albeit I do not try to make too much out of gender. I say like James Cameron, I think it was: I don't write men or women, I write people. I know men may be less qualified to write about women seeing as they have not experienced the mental patterns of the opposite gender, but that may very well be said for females writing males as well, and nobody's complaining there(I'm looking at you, fanfiction writers and Stephenie Meyer. There is no way in hell Edward, being a 117 years old or around there, could have just never heard of women's liberation, flappers, sufragettes or whatever.)
The point is, I advocate gender EQUALITY (albeit with a hint of practicality/pragmatism, as in letting the most qualified people fill open positions), not superiority, which many feminists have told me women deserve. One even advocated that 'women should rule society, to make up for being oppressed by men'. I'm sorry, but that idea don't fly with me.

I needed to get that out =P
I'd say, judging myself, that I'm at least trying to be a 1-2, but lo and behold, me being a white middle-class male I'm instantly sexist and racist and condescending towards the homeless, so I'd guess a 9 after adding in that I'm blinded by patriarchy.

 

[b3nn3tt]

The point is, I advocate gender EQUALITY (albeit with a hint of practicality/pragmatism, as in letting the most qualified people fill open positions),

To me, that is equality, through and through, I don't think you need the little disclaimer. Equality is all about equal opportunity, not about having equal numbers of men and women. As long as the best person for the job gets the job, I have no problem with it

not superiority, which many feminists have told me women deserve. One even advocated that 'women should rule society, to make up for being oppressed by men'. I'm sorry, but that idea don't fly with me.

I like to think that it is a very smal minority who believe this, because it is one of the stupidest positions I think anyone could hold, let alone a 'feminist'. "Well, we've been oppressed for years, we should fight for rights and then take them away from men. That makes a balanced and fair society".

No. No it doesn't

 

[TacticalAssassin1]

I know somebody's going to link me to some kickass story for saying this, but if you wanted to do that, good luck getting half the army to be chicks. You get all these feminists going on about equality, which is fine, but I don't think they'd be pleased to go to war.
Again, not saying there aren't women in the armed services who most likely help out a hell of a lot, but probably not the frontlines.

As for me being sexist, probably 3 to 4, but I'm not one for picking on girls.

Happens in East Asia, and they seem more than happy too. Vietnam for instance
My friend Jess complains less than my males friends about being military, too.

I'm not suprised. But just imagine the uproar if the united states tried to get mothers to fight on the front lines, that's all I'm saying.

 

[Deadman Walkin]

I firmly believe women would make good frontline soldiers, there is no convincing reason they should be prohibited... The UK Armed Forces recently reviewed the situation and declined.

Also... Women do make some pretty bitchin' sammiches...

I don't disagree that women have the right to be in the military, however I have heard (and this might be wrong) that abuse occurs over seas from the male soldiers. I don't really know how this could be fixed, but it is unfortunate.

 

[TacticalAssassin1]

Happens in East Asia, and they seem more than happy too. Vietnam for instance
My friend Jess complains less than my males friends about being military, too.

I'm not suprised. But just imagine the uproar if the united states tried to get mothers to fight on the front lines, that's all I'm saying.

There's a documentary I think is called 'war moms' or something about almost that. There would be outrage, but there's outrage at letting gay men fight, too. The public are fucking retarded. I honestly believe its plain common sense to let women who can reach the same heights of physical ability sign up.
Admittedly, cause the Y chromosome gives us extra height and muscle, they'd be a minority, but there's still a resource being ignored by the military.

Yeah but the whole 'not many chicks' thing and the 'guys being horny' thing may create a problem or two...

Just sayin'.

 

[kickyourass]

Do you think there is a reason you see mostly X gender in Y roles?
Yes I do, from my perspective at least, we see (For example) more men in construction jobs then women because that kind of manual labor appeals more to men then it does to women.

Why do you think there is job inequality?
Maybe a little, but most of the cases regarding job inequality I've come across getblown up to such cartoonish proportions that sometimes I find it hard to tell whether I should take them seriously or not.

I don't really have an answer for your final question, so I'm not going to give one.

 

[Exius Xavarus]

Gender equality? There never has, and never will be such a thing. I mean no offense to women, but from what I can tell, women want all the good things about equality, and let us keep the bad parts. They don't want to be equal. They want to have all the socially positive aspects of being a man, and retain the fact that they're women and MUST be treated like a super princess. Sexism will never cease to exist, and while discrimination lives, equality will never be within our grasp.

That's just my take on the situation. My apologies in advance to anyone that may or may not take offense.

 

[kickyourass]

Go tell this to one of thoes female weightlifters and see how much stronger then her you are... You'r a man and should have no problems right? You will obviously be more physically fit cus you are a man. Hell, I'm man enough to admit she would kick my ass. 10.0 on the sexism scale.

Here's a picture of an average man.

Clearly stronger than the woman.

You think that's average? Huh, I didn't know the internet extended all the way to fucking Krypton.

 

[Thaluikhain]

I don't disagree that women have the right to be in the military, however I have heard (and this might be wrong) that abuse occurs over seas from the male soldiers. I don't really know how this could be fixed, but it is unfortunate.

In Iraq, female US soldiers are more at risk of being raped by male US soldiers than killed by enemy action. It's a serious problem, which isn't helped that it makes for bad PR to acknowledge the problem and try to deal with it.

 

[InfiniteSingularity]

So this is the part where I ask what you think.
Do you think there is a reason you see mostly X gender in Y roles?
Why do you think there is job inequality?
On a scale of 1-10 (10 being highest) how sexist would you say you are?

I don't see any reason why there should be differences - i believe in absolute equality. So I don't believe any specific role for a specific gender; sure, sometimes I'll think that typically guys do certain jobs and girls do other jobs, but I don't believe or live by these ideals. It's only because i've been raised with media/misc influences on the typical male/female roles in society, but I don't believe any of that. Sometimes I'm surprised when a woman enjoys similar things to typical men (video games, for example), but again, it's because I've been raised under the impression that men and women are different. We're not different, not underneath our anatomical differences - our modern society imposes different ideals and perspectives on the different genders, so everyone think's we're different. But we're not - we're all people.

Job inequality I think is caused because women are not as interested in the jobs men are, for the reasons stated above. From early childhood, all children are raised to believe that women and men are different. So as children grow up, their ideas on their own roles in society are influenced by society's ideas on the roles of their gender. So women are/have been less likely to pursue careers because they have been raised to believe, and therefore believe themselves, that they have a separate role to men. The other factor is children - women give birth, and look after children, because of the biological attachment of both mother and child, and dependance of the child on the mother. So this can get in the way for women who are mothers.

I am 0 sexist - i believe in absolute equality.

 

[InfiniteSingularity]

Go tell this to one of thoes female weightlifters and see how much stronger then her you are... You'r a man and should have no problems right? You will obviously be more physically fit cus you are a man. Hell, I'm man enough to admit she would kick my ass. 10.0 on the sexism scale.

I'm not sexist, but that's so fucking unattractive

 

[TacticalAssassin1]

]

Yeah but the whole 'not many chicks' thing and the 'guys being horny' thing may create a problem or two...

Just sayin'.

That's pretty sexist, to assume that men are incapable of putting fighting for their lives above sex. (jokes)
No more problems than gay men serving. Separate sleeping quarters and it's even less of a problem.

Yeah true, I'm not saying it's not do-able (no pun intended) I'm just pointing out why most armed services haven't bothered to try.

 

[TacticalAssassin1]

Yeah true, I'm not saying it's not do-able (no pun intended) I'm just pointing out why most armed services haven't bothered to try.

Yeah it's true they haven't and probably won't in my lifetime.
I had a teacher once who insisted that men would all flip out if they ever saw a woman shot and that's why...
people are weird.

Huh.. That may be a factor, I mean that would probably fuck morale up pretty bad, but it's WAR! What are you expecting?!

 

[Thaluikhain]

I don't disagree that women have the right to be in the military, however I have heard (and this might be wrong) that abuse occurs over seas from the male soldiers. I don't really know how this could be fixed, but it is unfortunate.

In Iraq, female US soldiers are more at risk of being raped by male US soldiers than killed by enemy action. It's a serious problem, which isn't helped that it makes for bad PR to acknowledge the problem and try to deal with it.

That's more to do with the rampant acceptance of rape in the region than the fact that someone gave a woman a gun, tho.
(I'm not hating on Arabs or Islam, it's a real problem that results from societal norms developed in tribal societies with no simple solution.)

Hey? Why would the prevelance of rape in the area make US soldiers stationed there more likely to rape other US soldiers?

 

[Thaluikhain]

This shocks me. The forces really ought to do something about instead of sweeping it under the rug....

Well, yes, but how often does an organisation dealing with sex crimes amongst its own come out and publically deal with the issue, rather than try and keep it quiet?

 

[Thaluikhain]

This shocks me. The forces really ought to do something about instead of sweeping it under the rug....

Well, yes, but how often does an organisation dealing with sex crimes amongst its own come out and publically deal with the issue, rather than try and keep it quiet?

True true *cough* the Vatican *cough*
Guess it's still a social acceptance thing rather than anything else, then.

Boo for isolating the military from society.

Having said that, I don't know how the number of rapes compares to the general US population, whether the same amounts would occur if it was US accountants sent somewhere. Though, the military is rather male dominated, which is likely to be a factor.